HTTP 200 OK
Allow: GET, POST, HEAD, OPTIONS
Content-Type: application/json
Vary: Accept
{
"count": 1608389,
"next": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/?format=api&page=139226",
"previous": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/?format=api&page=139224",
"results": [
{
"id": 1408661,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1408661/?format=api",
"text_counter": 109,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Abdul Haji",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "Mr. Speaker, Sir, I also rise to make a contribution to the Bill. I came prepared to speak for 20 minutes. I am a bit saddened that we have reduced the time to seven minutes. I do not want to claim that I am an athlete. However, I came prepared like a long-distance runner. Sen. Cherarkey and Sen. Wakili Sigei might know that long-distance runners usually suffer from something known as runner’s diarrhoea. By the time you approach 20 kilometres, you have a problem holding your bowels. At this point, I am experiencing the exact opposite. I do not know what to talk about and what to leave. However, I will get to the point straight away. I support the position of the Committee on Finance and Budget. Last week, I had an opportunity to sit in during the contribution and submissions by the Chairperson of the Committee on Finance and Budget and I was convinced that the committee did a good job in coming up with a fair share of the counties. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
},
{
"id": 1408662,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1408662/?format=api",
"text_counter": 110,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Abdul Haji",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "The Chairperson talked about reasons why and the formula they came up with the figure that they had suggested in their report. He touched on issues such as lapsing of Managed Equipment Services (MES), national Government priority projects, Community Health Promoters (CHPs) programmes, the new National Social Security Fund (NSSF), the new Social Health Insurance Fund (SHIF) contributions, and annual salary increments. These are all reasons we, as Senators, should support the position of the committee. As the Senator who spoke before me mentioned, that is Sen. Methu, we are meant to protect and fight for devolution. I do not want to see a situation where we go to the same position that we were last financial year, where we agreed to a lesser amount for the counties. As per the Bill by the National Assembly, it is a bit sad that obvious mistakes were made in the Bill. In the Division of Revenue Bill (National Assembly Bills No.14 of 2024), there is a table where the National Assembly was trying to explain how they arrived to the adjusted equitable share base of Kshs374 billion. That was a mistake, to start with, because the amount of the equitable share base was Kshs385 billion that we passed last year. Based on this table, they attributed to the increment of Kshs16.6 billion in the budget for the counties which is not the truth. If we go by the base of the last financial year, they are only increasing a mere Kshs6.5 billion. We cannot support that. There is also another obvious lie that the NationalTreasury is trying to make. There is one thing that we have to make clear to the National Treasury that they are not meant to only fight for the national Government. They are there for both the national and county governments and they need to be fair in their representation. When they mislead Members of Parliament and the President, it is unfair. What our country Kenya has raised as revenue this year compared to the share that the Government is taking and the share they want to give county governments--- We have raised revenue of about Kshs387.4 billion in excess. Out of this Kshs387.4 billion in excess of revenue that was raised, a mere Kshs6.1 billion is what they want to share with county governments. I urge Senators that this time around, we need to have a bipartisan position. We should support the position of the committee and refuse any other persuasion from anybody so that we can say that we stood with county governments. The Senators that spoke before me and even last Thursday acknowledge that we have problems in the counties. There are problems in the counties, but that does not mean because of those problems we should not give them more money. We are going to sort those problems, and we are working as the Senate to do that. Mr. Speaker, Sir, as the Senate, we need to start giving proper feedback to the county governments. It is time we stop letting pollsters out there start ranking counties, governors and county assemblies. That should be the work of the Senate. We need to rank these governors so that they know nani alikuwa nambari moja and who became last, so that we can inspire other governors, other county governments, and other assemblies to improve. I would like to suggest to this House that from time to time, we need to bring The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
},
{
"id": 1408663,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1408663/?format=api",
"text_counter": 111,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Abdul Haji",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "good governors to this House and give them positive feedback so that the bad governors can look up to those and also feel ashamed. Also, when we do the rankings, we will be giving proper feedback to the citizens of those counties, and they will know how to vote next time. I submit."
},
{
"id": 1408664,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1408664/?format=api",
"text_counter": 112,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Hon. Kingi",
"speaker_title": "The Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " Sen. Thang’wa, you have the Floor."
},
{
"id": 1408665,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1408665/?format=api",
"text_counter": 113,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Thang’wa",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "Thank you, very much, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for the opportunity to also support the report by the Committee on the Division of Revenue Bill. I am, however, tied in between giving more money to the counties, just to give governors more money to misappropriate. I am tied in between sending more money to expect better hospitals, roads, and ECDEs, only for the governors to divert those funds, and to have things that look like handout kinds of projects. I am tied in between giving more money to the counties, just like all the other Senators would want to give more money to the counties, to have more money in the emergency funds for the county governments, while our people are suffering floods, and landslides, fires, accidents, and all that where the money for emergency funds is diverted right, left and center. I am tied in between sending more money to the counties to pay the pending bills, only for some governors to refuse to pay. Finally, I am still tied in between sending these monies to the counties, while the same governors refused to appear before the committees to account for how they have used these monies. With that, as much as we want to vote for more money to the counties, we should call upon two committees, that is the County Public Investments and Special Funds Committee (CPIC) and the County Public Accounts Committee (CPAC), to as well assist the Senators who pass this kind of legislation, or who support this kind of Revenue Bill, to do their oversight. They should not at any time become an impediment when it comes to oversight of these funds. Mr. Speaker, Sir, as much as I am saying that I am tied in between, I know sending monies to the counties is one thing and oversight of the same amount is another. I will support this report by this Committee to make sure that we send more money to the counties, that is Kshs415 billion, that is about Kshs24 billion more than what the National Assembly had suggested which I call a suggestion. The Members of Parliament in their NG-CDF, have increased their monies that go to CDF. We should also increase more monies to go to the counties. As do so we ask those county assemblies that are mandated to keep check of these governors, that they at least help this Senate to oversight those monies. If I give you an example, the other day as I send my condolences to the families of Mai Mahiu residents, those who lost so many of their loved ones through the flooding. The two counties, that is Kiambu and Nakuru have emergency funds, but when we ask the governors, they only make noise about the national Government, saying that it has not sent disaster money. As an example, Kiambu County Emergency Fund Act- “The County Assembly of Kiambu should appropriate 0.5 per cent of the whole budget of Kiambu County.” The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
},
{
"id": 1408666,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1408666/?format=api",
"text_counter": 114,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Thang’wa",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "The current budget of Kiambu County is Kshs21.5 billion. 0.5 per cent of that amount is Kshs107 million. That is enough money to help those people of Mai Mahiu and to help other people in Kiambu County who are moving from their homes, running away from landslides and the dams that are already filling up and these floods. I urge this House, as much as we want, to send more monies to the counties. Let us join hands to hold the governors to account. I agree with the Senate Standing Committee on Finance and Budget when they say that they are increasing these monies because you are giving more functions to the county governments. County governments have been given the task of matching up 1.5 per cent of the employees' deductions when it comes to Aaffordable housing. When the Affordable Housing Bill came to my Committee, as a Committee we noted that and said that 0.5 per cent of all the monies of the Affordable Housing Fund should also be subdivided to the county governments. We also have the Social Health Insurance Fund (SHIF) and the County Aggregation and Industrial Park, where the national Government gives Kshs250 million, and the county should match up with another Kshs250 million. That is why we are increasing this. However, we challenge the county governments, and especially my County of Kiambu, where we have simple-mind kind of projects, of handing out fish and chicken, manure and napier grass. We should use this amount to give major projects such as the Level 4 and 5 hospitals where there is no medicine. The Githunguri Level 4 hospital is complete, but it is a shell of a new hospital. No doctors, no staff. It is not equipped and has nothing. That is why we say, as we send more monies to the counties, let us make sure governors are held to account. When a Senator stands as I do here and mentions those issues that I have mentioned about my county, may it be counted that I am doing oversight, but not politics. This is because I know how much money I send to my county, and I must ask the governor how he spends that amount. So, I support."
},
{
"id": 1408667,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1408667/?format=api",
"text_counter": 115,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Hon. Kingi",
"speaker_title": "The Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " Sen. Maanzo, you have the Floor"
},
{
"id": 1408668,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1408668/?format=api",
"text_counter": 116,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Maanzo",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": {
"id": 13589,
"legal_name": "Maanzo Daniel Kitonga",
"slug": "maanzo-daniel-kitonga"
},
"content": "Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for allowing me to contribute to this very important Bill. The Division of Revenue Bill divides the monies to be budgeted and used for the national Government functions and also for devolved functions. The Senate is there to protect devolution and to make sure it works. There have been challenges. The Constitution devolves certain functions, such as agriculture and health. Especially in Health, there has been a lot of confusion. There are many projects that are done by the national government for devolved units, especially in the health sector. There have been issues with scanning machines, which were sent to all the counties. These machines were sent there, but they are not functioning. It was like buying a car without an engine and expect to use it. So, this very expensive equipment has been left lying in every single county, and yet that money was used by the national Government instead of it having devolved in the Division of Revenue Bill. Similarly, with agriculture, there are many things, even the big problem of fake fertilizers. If this agriculture function was devolved, probably we would not be having the sort of scandal that we have in the nation with many people calling for the resignation of The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
},
{
"id": 1408669,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1408669/?format=api",
"text_counter": 117,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Maanzo",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": {
"id": 13589,
"legal_name": "Maanzo Daniel Kitonga",
"slug": "maanzo-daniel-kitonga"
},
"content": "the Cabinet Secretary in charge of agriculture. If Agriculture was devolved, then the farmers would be questioning their governor as to what has happened. Therefore, while this Division of Revenue Bill is already set and has already been passed by the National Assembly, as we look forward, we need to see units that have been devolved in the Constitution, devolved to the counties. Mr. Speaker, Sir, a similar problem happens with disaster management. There is the National Disaster Management Unit (NDMU) in the Ministry of Interior and Coordination of National Government. Counties are supposed to have funds slated and slotted for disaster management. When the tragedy happened in Makueni County, the governor had to use his funds to rescue people in Sultan Hamud while we have a budget for disaster management. The NDMU stays put and seems to be doing nothing across the country while the counties suffer and seek help from the national Government, yet they are supposed to have sufficient devolved funds for when disaster strikes. This is a matter that needs to be relooked so that monies are available in the counties in the event of disaster. For example, you know what is happening in Tana River County, which is why Sen. Mungatana MGH is not here. You know what has happened in the counties of Makueni, Nakuru, and many other places. Disaster management involves surveillance to ensure that all dams likely to break down are reinforced in good time and houses that have been built on the river beds do not submerge as it has happened in Machakos County around Athi River in Athi River. In the future, we have to relook this to make sure devolution gets its fair share and devolved functions are handled at the counties. At the same time, money has to be accounted for properly. When there are audit queries, we summon governors here, and they should show up. On the 22nd, the Committee on Public Investment and Special Funds summoned the Governor of Makueni County. He came to give an account, and he has more questions to answer about different budgets. This should serve as an example to any other governor. When called by the Senate, show up to answer the questions. Finally, when this money is being accounted for by the governors, there are reports we give from the Senate Committees. There is a perpetual succession of Government and so we need to see the past governors being held accountable. If anybody has misappropriated county monies that we allocate, they must return the money, face jail, and all the consequences of misappropriation of funds devolved to counties to serve the people. I thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir and support the Bill."
},
{
"id": 1408670,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1408670/?format=api",
"text_counter": 118,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Hon. Kingi",
"speaker_title": "The Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " Senator for Nandi, proceed."
}
]
}