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{
"id": 1464082,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1464082/?format=api",
"text_counter": 417,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Hon. Peter Kaluma",
"speaker_title": "The Temporary Speaker",
"speaker": {
"id": 1565,
"legal_name": "George Peter Opondo Kaluma",
"slug": "george-peter-opondo-kaluma"
},
"content": " Hon. Florence Jematiah, your truthfulness has been appreciated and given back to you as information. Proceed."
},
{
"id": 1464083,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1464083/?format=api",
"text_counter": 418,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Baringo County, UDA",
"speaker_title": "Hon. Jematiah Sergon",
"speaker": null,
"content": " Thank you very much. I ask for, at least, two extra minutes. I am saying that because we have interacted with most of the problems in the counties. If you look at it keenly, it is not that Kenyans lack resources, but it is the mismanagement of the resources. For instance, the health sector in the counties is dead. Today, a pregnant mother going to deliver in a hospital walks into that place and cannot even find a painkiller. We should empower Community Health Promoters to take care of most of the populace. In this scenario, we will have a real conversation as a country through the county management. This is because, even if you have the best leader at the national level, but you have the kind of mismanagement going on in the counties, there is nothing this country will achieve in the future. Most likely, we might lose this country in terms of poverty levels and disparity in the society. This is because the poverty levels in the country today are as a result of mismanagement of resources. As much as we are channelling a lot of money to the counties, we cannot succeed unless we have a good manager to manage those The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor."
},
{
"id": 1464084,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1464084/?format=api",
"text_counter": 419,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Baringo County, UDA",
"speaker_title": "Hon. Jematiah Sergon",
"speaker": null,
"content": "resources. Look at the money that we are giving to the counties today. Even the Senate has a role as it oversees the counties, to give us reasons why the counties are always deteriorating. We have overstretching and many pending bills that are accrued in the counties. We sometimes do not know who will pay this money. We cannot just bury our heads as Members of Parliament. This is a House of representation and we have a duty…"
},
{
"id": 1464085,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1464085/?format=api",
"text_counter": 420,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Hon. Peter Kaluma",
"speaker_title": "The Temporary Speaker",
"speaker": {
"id": 1565,
"legal_name": "George Peter Opondo Kaluma",
"slug": "george-peter-opondo-kaluma"
},
"content": " Thank you. If you are done, I will go to the left. Hon. (Dr) Makali Mulu will be followed by Hon. Senior Counsel Naisula Lesuuda."
},
{
"id": 1464086,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1464086/?format=api",
"text_counter": 421,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Kitui Central, WDM",
"speaker_title": "Hon. (Dr) Makali Mulu",
"speaker": null,
"content": " Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker for giving me this opportunity to make my contribution to this important Senate Bill. This Bill is focusing on additional allocations to county governments. The main object of the Bill is to provide a framework in terms of additional allocations from proceeds of loans and grants and the transfers from the national Government. My opening remarks are that this Bill is coming at a time when we have gone through the initial budget. We had an Appropriations Act which we have now revised to come up with a Supplementary Appropriation Act. We are all aware that as a result of that revision, the initial allocation to counties was equitable share of Ksh400.01 billion. As a result of the downscaling, which was as a result of this Finance Bill 2024 not being approved, we have come down to Ksh380 billion equitable share. Having said that, you realise that even on the issue of additional resources, there has been a bit of scaling down for some areas. Since we have approved the Supplementary Appropriation Act 2024, automatically, some of the proposals in this Bill will also have to be amended downwards. We are debating the Bill as it is. We have no choice but to amend some sections and, more so, the schedules so that the figures are aligned to the already approved Supplementary Appropriation Act, 2024."
},
{
"id": 1464087,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1464087/?format=api",
"text_counter": 422,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Kitui Central, WDM",
"speaker_title": "Hon. (Dr) Makali Mulu",
"speaker": null,
"content": "Let me give a number of examples. If you look at the issue of the county aggregation industrial parks, the Schedule shows that we are expected to provide for 18 counties. Each of the county is supposed to be given about Ksh250 million. The expectation is that the counties will also allocate Ksh250 million from their resources to make it Ksh500 million and then do the parks. If you look at the Budget which has been approved through the Supplementary Appropriation Act, 2024, it is obvious that the money allocated there will not finance all the 18 counties. To some extent, it means that there will be scaling down of those figures. We might scale the number of counties or the amount of money. I do not think we have a way out because the Supplementary Appropriation Act, 2024 is already out."
},
{
"id": 1464088,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1464088/?format=api",
"text_counter": 423,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Kitui Central, WDM",
"speaker_title": "Hon. (Dr) Makali Mulu",
"speaker": null,
"content": "The other matter is the construction of county headquarters. You realise from the schedules that there was a provision for four counties to get some money. They are Isiolo, Lamu, Tana River and Tharaka Nithi. In the Supplementary Appropriation Act 2024, that figure has been reduced to zero. This means that unless another Supplementary Estimate is brought as we are debating this Bill, there is no allocation to the four county headquarters because this Schedule would need to be revised. We have to amend this Schedule so that it reflects the reality on the ground."
},
{
"id": 1464089,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1464089/?format=api",
"text_counter": 424,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Kitui Central, WDM",
"speaker_title": "Hon. (Dr) Makali Mulu",
"speaker": null,
"content": "There is money provided for Community Health Promoters. The initial plan was for the Government and the county governments to each give an allocation of Ksh2,500 to each. However, looking at what we have done at the supplementary level, the amount given cannot cater for all the Community Health Promoters. This means that to some extent, we have to look at the necessary amendments so that we factor them in. Unless we do that Hon. Temporary Speaker, we will not be helping the counties by having figures which cannot be financed from the Supplementary Appropriation Act, 2024. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor."
},
{
"id": 1464090,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1464090/?format=api",
"text_counter": 425,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Kitui Central, WDM",
"speaker_title": "Hon. (Dr) Makali Mulu",
"speaker": null,
"content": "Another issue I would like to comment on is about court fines and transfer of money to museums. The funds are provided for in the schedules. However, despite that fact, there is no framework in terms of how to get money from the Consolidated Fund to respective counties. Unless that framework is in place, we will continue budgeting for this money yet the money does not reach counties. As the House proceeds with debating this law, it is important that the docket of National Treasury and Economic Planning comes up with a clear framework. That way, when the Bill becomes an Act of Parliament, the proceeds from court fines and mineral royalties can be sent to the counties. By doing so, we will be encouraging counties which have not yet exploited their minerals to be proactive and exploit them since they will get royalties."
},
{
"id": 1464091,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1464091/?format=api",
"text_counter": 426,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Kitui Central, WDM",
"speaker_title": "Hon. (Dr) Makali Mulu",
"speaker": null,
"content": "It is important to observe that a county like Kitui, where I come from, is very rich in minerals but the amount it is getting is only Ksh114,000. That is a drop in the sea! Kitui should be getting billions of shillings! My Governor and his team can be more proactive if this framework is put in place. Once they taste the Ksh114,000, they will realise that exploiting more minerals will bring more money to the counties. In that case, we can have more resources to implement our programmes. The National Treasury needs to quickly come up with a framework in that area so that once we get the money, we are able to send it to the counties. On grants and loans, looking at these schedules, you will realise that a lot of money is being given by our development partners to support the counties, either through loans or grants. Unless the signing of the necessary or relevant agreements between the counties and some of the development partners is fast-tracked by the National Treasury, there is a likelihood of a delay in terms of implementation. This should be a concurrent kind of process so that even as we go through this Bill, the National Treasury also initiates the process of ensuring that counties are facilitated to access this money once the Bill becomes an Act of Parliament. It is very bad that we are complaining about having no resources, yet some of our development partners have given us grants and we are not able to access the money just because some simple documents have not been signed. So, as the Budget and Appropriations Committee, we also made an observation that the area of loans and grants is very slow-moving in terms of utilisation of the resources. As a House, we need to seriously oversee this area, so that we use any money given by our development partners. In my other Committee, the Public Debt and Privatisation Committee, we have realised that the Government is paying a lot of commitment fees for loans which have been signed for, and we are not drawing the resources. We should have a smooth way of implementing our projects as a result of getting resources in a timely manner. The other critical matter is the own-source revenue. Counties are getting some of these additional resources, but I do not think they are doing enough to maximise or optimise their own- source revenue. Counties need to come up with ways of optimising their own-source revenue so that they supplement the resources from the national Government. That will help them to have more resources to implement programmes and also pay for their pending bills. In that case, they will be able to do much better, and the complaints about governors not doing the right thing can be minimised. One of the ways which has proved to be quite effective in doing that is the digitisation of their revenue collection. If they digitise those processes, they are likely to collect more money. I support the Bill, but I think we will be amending some sections before we finalise it so that by the time it is approved, we factor..."
}
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}