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"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Mumma",
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"content": "Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, for giving me an opportunity to contribute to this Motion by the Senate Majority Leader. I will not be long on this issue. This matter was decided in court. I wish to bring it to the attention of the The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
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"speaker_name": "Sen. Mumma",
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"content": "Senate just in case it is not aware that another case on this matter is still pending before the courts. My suggestion is that before we make a decision because this involves a matter that might fall within character assassination of an individual, I do not know whether the Senate has the capacity to forgive on a matter on behalf of someone who is not before the Senate to express themselves. My suggestion is that we get the Standing Committee on Justice, Legal Affairs and Human Rights to give us a view on what this means. I pick the committee instead of the Directorate of Legal Services because it is a matter between a Senator and a member of staff. I am suggesting that a committee of the Senate be the one to look at these issues and advise on whether we have the capability of giving the reprieve we want to give as we are proposing. I also suggest that we need a policy in Parliament on matters relating to sexual harassment that touches on Members of Parliament (MP). I have read the policy on sexual harassment following what has happened in this House. That policy only covers members of staff. We need to move the Parliamentary Service Commission (PSC) to put in place a policy and procedures on how to handle matters similar to this. This is because part of the challenge by the affected Senator was that they did not have confidence in whatever process that we had. However, having gone to court, they were not able to persuade the court in the manner of this procedure. My view is that it would be unfair for us to step in the shoe of the affected person and purport to make a decision on their behalf on this matter having decided. We can revisit it. I personally have no problem in forgiving anybody. However, we need the Standing Committee on Justice, Legal Affairs and Human Rights to give us a view on how we should handle this matter. Thank you."
},
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"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Abdul Haji",
"speaker_title": "The Temporary Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " May the Senate Majority Leader reply."
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"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Cheruiyot",
"speaker_title": "The Senate Majority Leader",
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"legal_name": "Aaron Kipkirui Cheruiyot",
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"content": " Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I thank colleagues who have taken time to speak to this matter. Indeed, it is an interesting matter because it is not one that I would have very strong feelings on how a member decides. At the end of the day, I believe an apology has been rendered. The punishment that this House rendered on the offences that were committed by Sen. Gloria Orwoba are personal. Therefore, if a Member feels that indeed that Member has owned up their mistakes and has requested the House to be given a lighter punishment, it is on that basis that I moved the House to reduce the sentence and the Senate to vary its resolution. There are a few things that have come up, which I will attempt to respond to. First is what Sen. Sifuna raised with reference to the Motion coming back to the House within a period less than six months. This Motion was moved on 20th September, 2023. Therefore, it is far more beyond the six-month period upon which you can bring a Motion separate to the one that had earlier been resolved. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
},
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"id": 1521686,
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"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Cheruiyot",
"speaker_title": "The Senate Majority Leader",
"speaker": {
"id": 13165,
"legal_name": "Aaron Kipkirui Cheruiyot",
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"content": "Secondly, Sen. Sifuna also enquired on the provisions cited; Section 17 (3) (d) and (g) of the Parliamentary Powers and Privileges Act. The reference to them was on the punishment, not that the House has powers to do. The punishment that was meted to Sen. Gloria by this House is with reference to that specific Section. That she be asked to leave the House for a certain period and also apologise. That is why in the final part of the Motion, I have stated that when Sen. Gloria Orwoba returns should Members agree with this Motion, she will be admitted to this House on terms resolved by the Senate on 20th September, 2023. You have to ask yourself, what were the terms? If you have observed what happened previously when a Member has been kicked out of this House, it is a very difficult experience. It is not as easy as walking back to the House. When she comes back, it is almost similar to the first day we came to this House, where you have the rostrum placed at the door. They formally apologise to all the people they have wronged before the House finally agrees that they be admitted back. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, it is not like we are making this sentence lighter. I have listened to Sen. Catherine Mumma and there are two things that you may need to remember. There were two cases on this matter. One is where she contested the decision of the Senate, which a full determination has been made. The courts agreed with the decision of the Senate that we acted rightfully within the law to suspend her. That is why the sentence now holds. The second matter is the issue you are referring to where Members are saying that there is an individual who was maligned and name tarnished. That matter is still active before the court. There is no way that matter before the court can be ruled this way or the other. Sen. Mumma, what we are resolving as a House is on the issue of the number of the days that she serves the suspension. Is it 79 or 30 days? After consulting with colleagues, I felt that she will serve the punishment anyway because it needs to serve as a lesson. I sometimes see us disrespect our own authority as a House. Every time I do something that is disrespectful in this House, I am disrespecting the collective standing of this House before colleague Senators and the country. Therefore, I agree with the decision that was made by the Powers and Privilege Committee that Sen. Gloria Orwoba’s conduct must be punished. The only thing that I referenced is the fact that when granted an opportunity by the Speaker, she apologised to the House. This means that she has admitted before all of us that there is a way in which she behaved that was not up to the standing of a Senator. If that be the case, I request the House that we review the punishment from 79 to 30 calendar days, which I find to be a fair ask of us. They say, “To err is human”. That we can all sometimes mess. Sen. Eddy, this does not in any way take away the rights of the individual you are speaking about; the Clerk of the Senate. I am sure that matter is before the court. I would not wish to speak long on the issue of the dispute between them so as not to appear as if I am in support of this or the other person. He strongly feels that his rights were violated and that matter is before the court. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
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"id": 1521687,
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"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Cheruiyot",
"speaker_title": "The Senate Majority Leader",
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"id": 13165,
"legal_name": "Aaron Kipkirui Cheruiyot",
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"content": "What is before us is a review of the punishment that this House passed on her. Remember, there is a case between the person who is accusing her that she maligned him and a case between her and Senators. The Senators felt that she had behaved inappropriately and, therefore, punished her. This request concerns the Senators and the Senate of the Republic of Kenya versus our colleague. We are saying that since our colleague has publicly come before us and said, \"I apologise,\" let us review that particular sentence. I thought that would be clear and not prejudice the other matter that is in the courts. With those many remarks, I beg to reply. In accordance with Standing Order No. 66, I beg that we defer the putting of the question, given that I can see the number of people that are in the House would not be sufficient to take a vote. This is one such matter where I would wish that we had as many Senators as possible in the House when we take the vote. Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir."
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"speaker_name": "Sen. Abdul Haji",
"speaker_title": "The Temporary Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " Hon. Senators, we will defer putting the question until tomorrow when we have quorum. We will go to the next order."
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"speaker": null,
"content": "(Putting of the Question on the Motion deferred)"
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"speaker": null,
"content": "MOTION"
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"content": "ADOPTION OF REPORT ON THE CONFLICT OF INTEREST BILL (NATIONAL ASSEMBLY BILLS NO.12 OF 2023)"
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