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{
"id": 1524982,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1524982/?format=api",
"text_counter": 919,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Endebess, UDA",
"speaker_title": "Hon. (Dr) Robert Pukose",
"speaker": null,
"content": " On a point of order, Hon. Temporary Speaker."
},
{
"id": 1524983,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1524983/?format=api",
"text_counter": 920,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Hon. David Ochieng’",
"speaker_title": "The Temporary Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " Hon. (Dr) Pukose, what is out of order?"
},
{
"id": 1524984,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1524984/?format=api",
"text_counter": 921,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Endebess, UDA",
"speaker_title": "Hon. (Dr) Robert Pukose",
"speaker": null,
"content": " Hon. Temporary Speaker, we are discussing the Medium-Term Debt Management Strategy, which is before the House. I think the Hon. Member is digressing and is out of order by bringing matters that are irrelevant. I do not know whether he understands what we are discussing because what he is actually saying is completely out of order. It is not relevant to the discussion that is before the House. Could the Member be declared to be out of order, Hon. Temporary Speaker?"
},
{
"id": 1524985,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1524985/?format=api",
"text_counter": 922,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Hon. David Ochieng’",
"speaker_title": "The Temporary Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " Hon. Robert, your namesake is Hon. (Dr) Robert Pukose. The younger Hon. Robert, could you relate to us what you are saying with the debt strategy?"
},
{
"id": 1524986,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1524986/?format=api",
"text_counter": 923,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Yatta, WDM",
"speaker_title": "Hon. Robert Basil",
"speaker": null,
"content": " You know, Hon. Temporary Speaker, I respect my namesake Hon. (Dr) Pukose. But what I want to remind him is that we are talking about Medium-Term Debt Management Strategy and we are talking about a public debt management system. So, when I talk about wastage, that is part of public debt management. It is within the public debt."
},
{
"id": 1524987,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1524987/?format=api",
"text_counter": 924,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Hon. David Ochieng’",
"speaker_title": "The Temporary Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " No! No! The rules say that a Member who contributes must be relevant. He is asking how harambee contributions are relevant to the Medium-Term Debt Management Strategy. That is the issue."
},
{
"id": 1524988,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1524988/?format=api",
"text_counter": 925,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Yatta, WDM",
"speaker_title": "Hon. Robert Basil",
"speaker": null,
"content": " That is why I am trying to explain to him. When you see the Head of State contributing, we are trying to see or explain whether this money could be coming from public debt. Remember we borrow money for the public. No! Wait a minute."
},
{
"id": 1524989,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1524989/?format=api",
"text_counter": 926,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Hon. David Ochieng’",
"speaker_title": "The Temporary Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " You are completely out of order on that. Please, proceed and prosecute your point."
},
{
"id": 1524990,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1524990/?format=api",
"text_counter": 927,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Yatta, WDM",
"speaker_title": "Hon. Robert Basil",
"speaker": null,
"content": " I was trying to emphasise or put across something. I think the Member needs to listen to me carefully because whatever we do is for generations to come and not just now. We need to use our money prudently when we talk about public debt management systems. Why borrow money to misuse? Our budget is never itemised. That is why accountability is required. We recommend digitising public debt management systems to promote accountability and transparency in the usage of borrowed money or public debt. The debt to GDP ratio of countries like Japan stands at over 200 per cent. The debt to GDP ratio of countries like the United States of America stands at 98 per cent. Our debt to GDP ratio is at 68 per cent. The only challenge we have is that the money we borrow is never used prudently. That is the point I am trying to underscore to Members and the country at large. As Members just mentioned, look at the IMF that has put the threshold of borrowing money at 55 per cent. That is the public debt for developing countries. We are recommending The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor."
},
{
"id": 1524991,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1524991/?format=api",
"text_counter": 928,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Yatta, WDM",
"speaker_title": "Hon. Robert Basil",
"speaker": null,
"content": "ours at over 55 per cent. We need to be careful. Otherwise, we are going to burden Kenyans with debt. That will be extremely unacceptable considering that the cost of living is already through the roof. In a nutshell, going forward and as a way of ensuring prudent use of our public resources or public debt management, I recommend that we invest in production to generate raw materials and finished products to mitigate importation and reverse our balance of trade that is currently negative. Importantly, we need to have a proper system such as having one account within the Treasury. That is so that we seal loopholes through which our resources disappear hence causing an increase in debt due to unaccounted money. Kenyans continue to feel the pinch. I am not trying to attack or dilute the discussion by referring to some accusations where Kenyans would be agitated to say their resources are not being used prudently. That is the reason the Gen Z called for austerity measures. With that, I submit."
}
]
}