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{
"id": 1589602,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1589602/?format=api",
"text_counter": 138,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Mr. Boniface Mawira",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "So, much as the court order says that the proceedings before the County Assembly were a nullity in law, the court order itself is a nullity in law. There is no further order of court that is required to set aside that order, because that order itself is nullity in law; it cannot stand. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I urge you, as I conclude, not to accede to the request by the Governor's lawyers to take away the jurisdiction of this honourable House on this important question that is before you for determination. I will give the remaining minutes to my colleague, Mr. Muriuki."
},
{
"id": 1589603,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1589603/?format=api",
"text_counter": 139,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Mr. Erick Muriuki",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "Mr. Speaker, Sir, and esteemed Members of this House, my name is Mr. Erick Muriuki. I am privileged to appear before you once again. I represent the County Assembly of Isiolo. Mr. Speaker, Sir, to continue with our submissions where my colleague has left off, the question that should seize this House and the Hon. Speaker when you go to make your determination is this: On a balance of conveniences, what ought to happen? We submit that this House ought to proceed with these proceedings because, as has been held in numerous court decisions, the Governor will have the opportunity to challenge these proceedings in court. However, neither the court nor this House can freeze the statutory and constitutional timelines that are set for impeachment proceedings. So, allowing the preliminary objection in the way that the Governor's team asks this House to do would irreparably prejudice the County Assembly. This is because there is a chance for the Governor to challenge these proceedings, but there is no chance for the County Assembly to reinstate or to pause this process and then come back. The proper time to question the validity of impeachment proceedings, as has been ably submitted by my senior, Mr. Nyamodi, is after the process is complete. This is what the court held in the case of Hon. Kawira Mwangaza versus the County Assembly of Meru. Mr. Speaker, Sir, this position had been earlier held in the Justus Kariuki Mate matter. Allow me to read an excerpt from the decision of the Court of Appeal Mwangaza versus County Assembly of Meru and Another, 2023 KECA - “We observe that the applicant’s right to be heard and to defend herself on the allegations made against her in the impeachment debate at the County Assembly of Meru are provided under the Standing Orders of the County Assembly. If she is impeached [emphasis on this part Mr. Speaker, Sir] she will have another opportunity to present, her case before the Senate during the hearing of the impeachment Motion. [Further emphasis] Even after the Senate makes its decision the applicant still has the avenue of petitioning the court for an appropriate relief if the decisions were to go against her. We are, therefore, of the considered view that the applicant’s right to be heard will not be circumscribed. Enough said, this court lacks jurisdiction to consider the application before it for the reasons stated in the ruling.”"
},
{
"id": 1589604,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1589604/?format=api",
"text_counter": 140,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Mr. Erick Muriuki",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "Mr. Speaker, Sir, that is the Court of Appeal speaking."
},
{
"id": 1589605,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1589605/?format=api",
"text_counter": 141,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Mr. Erick Muriuki",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "The second question that this House should ponder is where the public interest is in this matter of the preliminary objection. This is an important question. The impeachment process has commenced. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
},
{
"id": 1589606,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1589606/?format=api",
"text_counter": 142,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Mr. Erick Muriuki",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "The Supreme Court of Kenya and the Court of Appeal have in very clear and no uncertain terms forbidden lower courts from granting the kind of order the Governor has brought here today claiming to rely on to scuttle these proceedings. Even where such orders are issued, what does the Supreme Court of Kenya say? It says should those orders be issued in error, then the Court Assembly is entitled to not immediately comply with them. Mr. Speaker, Sir, these are not my words, but of the Supreme Court of Kenya in the Mate decision. Paragraph 95 of that decision found on page eight of our submissions, the Supreme Court says – “It is our understanding that the exceptional circumstances of this case with a complex scenario of justicabilities from contracted standpoints would lend justification to the non-effectuation of contempt orders at the beginning and consequently we would accommodate the reality of there not having been immediately compliance as would otherwise be required.” The Supreme Court is recognizing that sometimes court orders are issued in error and where the effect of those orders is to encumber a legislative House from performing its duties, the Supreme Court is accommodating the reality that those order do not have to be immediately complied with. Mr. Speaker, Sir, on this basis we, therefore, submit that it in the public interest that this House dismisses this view and proceeds to hearing bearing in mind what the Supreme Court and the Court of Appeal have said. I want to touch on the issue of forgery that has been alleged in the Governor’s preliminary objection. The only submission I will add to what my colleagues have said-- -"
},
{
"id": 1589607,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1589607/?format=api",
"text_counter": 143,
"type": "scene",
"speaker_name": "",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "(Interruption of submissions on preliminary objections by the County Assembly team)"
},
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"id": 1589608,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1589608/?format=api",
"text_counter": 144,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Hon. Kingi",
"speaker_title": "The Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " Counsel for the County Assembly, just take your seat I have a communication to make."
},
{
"id": 1589609,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1589609/?format=api",
"text_counter": 145,
"type": "heading",
"speaker_name": "",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "COMMUNICATION FROM THE CHAIR"
},
{
"id": 1589610,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1589610/?format=api",
"text_counter": 146,
"type": "heading",
"speaker_name": "",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "EXTENSION OF SITTING TIME"
},
{
"id": 1589611,
"url": "http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1589611/?format=api",
"text_counter": 147,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Hon. Kingi",
"speaker_title": "The Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " Now, hon. Senators, ladies and gentlemen, the time now is 1.00 p.m., and in terms of our programme as set out in the Order Paper, we are set to adjourn at this time. I note, however, that the County Assembly still has 10 minutes of their time. I, therefore, wish to invoke Standing Order No.34 (2) and 2A of the Standing Orders, which permit the Speaker, for the convenience of the Senate, to direct later interruption of the business for a period of not more than 15 minutes. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
}
]
}