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"id": 1399581,
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"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Olekina",
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"id": 407,
"legal_name": "Ledama Olekina",
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"content": "back to you because you made a complaint? You are a consumer of this Bill, you have complained to the commission, how does the commission write back to you? We need to be able to expand and amend that section because I know this is going to pass. There is a provision which I think is very dangerous and all of us must really pay attention to it. Still on No.7, it says “delegate to another person or body by notice in the Gazette, any of its powers or functions under this act in respect to classes of public officers specified by the commission and that persons or bodies shall be deemed to be responsible for the administration and management of conflict of interest”. That is a very dangerous clause. We are already seeing what is panning out there if you read Article 156 of the Constitution of Kenya where it gives the powers to protect public interest to the Attorney-General. Then when you go to the Attorney-General's Act, you will see that he is now given the powers to delegate and in most cases, he will delegate to the Solicitor General. Mr. Temporary Speaker, a very mischievous government will bypass the Attorney-General and goes to the Solicitor General because the Act gives that person the power to delegate. Who is this person to whom the Commission shall delegate the powers if we have set up a Commission under an Act of Parliament? Why not then either amend that Act of Parliament or do away with it? I would propose that this very dangerous clause be deleted. The independence of a body and everybody out there will, therefore, not be confused with the powers of that commission. Allow that commission to perform its function, but not restrictively. We should not create room for it to be abused by setting up another agency that has delegated powers. Hypothetically, if the powers that be are not happy with the independence of the Commission, then they will just go to the other person who is delegated. It creates room for corruption, which is what we are trying to deal with here. If you read Clause 7 (d) it states- “The Commission shall, in performance of its function under this Act, have the powers to cooperate and collaborate with any public entities or agencies, any foreign governments and international or regional organizations in the management of conflict of interest and enforcement of this Act.” What is it that we do in this House? We have two and, hopefully soon, we will get a third committee on oversight. We have the County Public Accounts Committee (CPAC) and the County Public Investments and Special Funds Committee (CPISF). I would have hoped that now that we are trying to deal with the issue of corruption, incorporate the aspect of these two committees to work there. Why leave out the Senate, yet sometimes we have the Ethics and Anticorruption Commission (EACC) people sitting with us in our committees? Why not then say that even the Senate, so that you can deal with the corruption in the counties? Later on, I hope we will have time, I will be moving my Motion on pending bills. However, if you want to deal with the matter decisively, you have got to create room for this oversight House to work directly with the Commission, to punish these governors and these people who are stealing all this money that belongs to the public. In my view,"
},
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"id": 1399582,
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"text_counter": 286,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Olekina",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": {
"id": 407,
"legal_name": "Ledama Olekina",
"slug": "ledama-olekina"
},
"content": "The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
},
{
"id": 1399583,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1399583/?format=api",
"text_counter": 287,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Olekina",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": {
"id": 407,
"legal_name": "Ledama Olekina",
"slug": "ledama-olekina"
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"content": "this is not an Act that has been thought out clearly. It is a Bill that is being rushed to please other agencies like the World Bank. If you read Section 13(1), which I do not know whether it is the one that you are saying you are going to amend, it says that- “A public officer shall not, directly or indirectly, use or allow any person under the office authority to use any information that is obtained in the course of performing official duties and is not available to the public to improperly further or seek to a further the interest of the officer or the interest of another person.” I was looking at it and I said they should limit it to strictly private and personal interests. You know, when I was born and you will allow me to use a phrase in Maasai, when I was coming out of the womb of my mother, my mother said “Bung’a oltao lino,maibung’a olalai .” “Hold your life and I hold mine.” We should never be penalized."
},
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"id": 1399584,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1399584/?format=api",
"text_counter": 288,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Wakili Sigei",
"speaker_title": "The Temporary Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " You should qualify that to say you were told."
},
{
"id": 1399585,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1399585/?format=api",
"text_counter": 289,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Olekina",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": {
"id": 407,
"legal_name": "Ledama Olekina",
"slug": "ledama-olekina"
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"content": "I paraphrased it. I did. Let me tell you, some of these things we grew up knowing."
},
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"id": 1399586,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1399586/?format=api",
"text_counter": 290,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Wakili Sigei",
"speaker_title": "The Temporary Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " It is a good one although I am saying you should have qualified that to say, ‘I was told.’ This is what my mother said."
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"id": 1399587,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1399587/?format=api",
"text_counter": 291,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Olekina",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": {
"id": 407,
"legal_name": "Ledama Olekina",
"slug": "ledama-olekina"
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"content": "Yes. Oh, I like what you just said. I wish I had more time. How many minutes do I have?"
},
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"id": 1399588,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1399588/?format=api",
"text_counter": 292,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Wakili Sigei",
"speaker_title": "The Temporary Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " Five minutes."
},
{
"id": 1399589,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1399589/?format=api",
"text_counter": 293,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Olekina",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": {
"id": 407,
"legal_name": "Ledama Olekina",
"slug": "ledama-olekina"
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"content": "I hope that five minutes will drag and maybe you can give me some additional time. This is something that I believe we need to be very diligent. We need to take our time. What I was saying is that in Section 13, it must be limited to an individual. You know, my brother has got no business dealing with my issues. Clause 19 states- “A public officer shall not be a party to or a beneficiary of a contract for the supply of goods, works or services with any reporting entity.” Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, it is wrong to deny Kenyans an opportunity to perform certain functions. If, hypothetically, you own a company that trades with the Senate, it does not say that Sen. Wakili Sigei, the Senator of Bomet County, is trading with us. I just want us to put this thing into perspective. It should only be limited to an individual. If it is coming under your name, by all means, I agree you should not benefit. So, this issue indirectly ought to be removed. I can dare say that if you go to these developed countries, you will not find such draconian laws. They are so quick to impose them on us, but they do not have them. I am a firm believer that Clause 27 ought to be deleted completely in its entirety. I know the Committee was probably recommending for it to be amended, but in my reading of this Bill, where it says- “A former public officer shall not- (a) act for or on behalf of any person in connection with any specific proceeding, transaction, negotiation or case in which the State is a party and with respect to which the former public officer had acted for, or provided advice to the State”"
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"text_counter": 294,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Olekina",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": {
"id": 407,
"legal_name": "Ledama Olekina",
"slug": "ledama-olekina"
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"content": "The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
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