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"id": 1483742,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1483742/?format=api",
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"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Cheruiyot",
"speaker_title": "The Senate Majority Leader",
"speaker": {
"id": 13165,
"legal_name": "Aaron Kipkirui Cheruiyot",
"slug": "aaron-cheruiyot"
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"content": " Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I join my colleagues in appreciating the very diligent work of our Budget and Finance Committee. I have not hidden from this House my admiration of the work done by this Committee that I served in my formative years as a legislator. I continue to appreciate the diligence with which they execute the various critical responsibilities bestowed upon them by the Constitution and our Standing Orders. This Committee has proven over the last few sessions of this Senate, that when called upon to stand up for devolution, they do so with much zest. I appreciate the members of this Committee and all those that make the Committee sittings while Sen. Sifuna was a bit more generous with his platitudes, celebrating the Committee. As the Senate Majority Leader, I am always keen to see the Members who sign the reports and I always look through the Committee on Budget and Finance. It gives you an idea of who is present in those meetings. You will consistently note that it is almost all or about the same people, about five or six out of the nine that are members of this Committee that do this work. I celebrate those members under the leadership of Capt. Ali Roba. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I will go straight to the recommendations because I do not need to repeat many of the brilliant things that have been said by colleagues who have spoken ahead of me. I can only appreciate the findings of this Committee, which are quite impressive and they have been able to pinpoint the exact pressure points for our counties. You know, even without the fight of saying we need to add money here and there, you need to first identify allocations that are already set out in law and are already specified that X amount of money go to our counties; like the mineral royalties defined in law. Therefore, there is nothing to fight about. Mr. Speaker, Sir, sometimes you look at the Bills that come from the National Assembly and wonder. I know that for a fact because I served as Chair of the Staff Welfare Committee, that Parliament is made up of the most competent personnel and human resource you can find in this Republic and even beyond. So, what happens when you serve in the National Assembly because I know our staff are diligent? When I served in committees, there were many things we would wish to insert into the Bills, but our clerks and the legal personnel that served with us in those committees would expressly guide us; helping us appreciate that this was outright unconstitutional or against the provisions of the law. Therefore, you find a reduction to royalties that have already been collected, Kshs1.06 billion, proposed, and it passes, and that Committee that considered this Bill has a lawyer, a legislative drafter and a clerk, who understand all these things. I am not focused on the political class because I know what happens in committees sometimes, but I am thinking through provisions of law that are already set out. It is important that Members appreciate the County Government's Additional Allocations Bill is the brainchild of this House, about two years ago. Previously we used to do one Division of Revenue Act (DORA) and you would have separate divisions for additional allocation. However, we felt that it was important because some of these allocations come midway through the year, that we have a stand-alone Bill that helps Senate and institutions of oversight to have a clearer view of both conditional and The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
},
{
"id": 1483743,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1483743/?format=api",
"text_counter": 101,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Cheruiyot",
"speaker_title": "The Senate Majority Leader",
"speaker": {
"id": 13165,
"legal_name": "Aaron Kipkirui Cheruiyot",
"slug": "aaron-cheruiyot"
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"content": "unconditional grants to our counties that we felt were getting lost in between the other broad county governments’ allocation to our counties, where there was a better focus. Mr. Speaker, Sir, pointing out the very glaring errors in this Bill, like the one I have spoken to, justifies the thinking that went into doing a separate Bill by the Senate. This is because, if we were still doing one DORA that has both the shareable revenue and the conditional and unconditional allocation, as was the case previously, then it would be difficult to pinpoint some of these errors. However, the Senate made a wise decision, and reading through this Report, you will appreciate actually why it was important for us to have this separate distinction between shareable revenue and this conditional and unconditional grants to our counties. It is only when we begin to deal with this item by item that you can pinpoint the shortfalls and point out specifically that we pass a law that will, for instance, set out that once we have made a decision, we are setting up these Community Health Promoters, it is defined and known that this is a human resource. These are human beings. They are people with families. They have genuine expectations. They believe that they have a job. They go around our villages treating. Much as we do not remunerate the Community Health Promoters as well as we should, I can give testimony that those I know in various villages in our communities do more work than some of the medical professionals since they are visiting the hundred households that were allocated to them. Therefore, because their salary is already known and the numbers of the Community Health Promoters per county are well defined, their allocation should be rather obvious after factoring in all the other additional costs that come with having them at their place of work. This is part of the lack of fluency in the drafting of some of these Bills. I will continue to point out and challenge staffers and Members of Parliament, like yours truly, who serve in these Committees not to make our work so difficult. These are things that are already specified, and they are known. Therefore, they should not form a basis for argument because we know the exact number of these people, and we should conclude them. It has taken this Committee to point out and remind the whole country that when we made the decision in 2015 to build county headquarters for five counties, I think Isiolo, Lamu, Nyandarua, and two others, we were clear about how much we were going to give them. At that particular time, there was a general understanding amongst all of us who served in the Budget and Finance Committee that because these counties did not have provincial, divisional, or district headquarters at that particular time, we were going to give them a boost. However, we were not going to turn the whole country into sponsors for them as such if you are unable to conclude on building this project, like I have seen a case in a county which I do not want to mention, because as Senate Majority Leader, people may interpret that I have something against that specific county. However, that county is listed here, and I like that the Committee has pointed out that this county has taken more than their projected share, and we cannot give them the Kshs78 million that is being projected. Let them find within their resources because the rest of the other four counties, that is, Lamu, Isiolo, and the rest, have concluded with the The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
},
{
"id": 1483744,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1483744/?format=api",
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"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Cheruiyot",
"speaker_title": "The Senate Majority Leader",
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"id": 13165,
"legal_name": "Aaron Kipkirui Cheruiyot",
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"content": "allocation that we gave to them at that particular time and that we should avoid this temptation. It points out to even the drafters and the people that go into drafting some of this legislation, that perhaps either out of corruption or because of the fact that you come from a particular county, we just want to obviously violate the law. If you read the Report of the Budget and Finance Committee of 2015, I know what we appended and the allocation that was given to each county. If you have exhausted your quota, that is it. There is no reason why we should be burdening the rest of the country to complete our headquarters for you more than 10 years down the line after the advent of devolution. Therefore, I agree with the proposal that this Committee is making to deny that allocation to that particular county. For these specific programmes, I wish Sen. M. Kajwang’ was here, but I know Members of the Public Accounts Committee are here. Sen. Osotsi, your committee looks into these special funds. These so-called donor-funded projects in our counties, the Danish International Development Agency (DANIDA) Financing Locally-Led Climate Action (FLOCA) Program and the Kenya Climate Smart Agriculture Project (KCSAP) are increasing by the day. If there is an avenue where public finances are being lost, in our counties, it is these particular projects. Therefore, Sen. Osotsi, if you and Sen. M. Kajwang’ do not lead us into establishing a mechanism through which we can ensure that citizens get value for money out of these loans, then we need to disband those committees of yours. I do not know of a Senator who cannot go back to their county today and point out - under these funds of either FLOCA, DANIDA, and funds for counties that have urban settings - where this money is not wasted. You find a kilometre of the road is being built for more than Kshs50 million or Kshs60 million by a county government. What nonsense are we allowing as a country? I really hope that by the time we get to the next session of the Senate, Sen. Osotsi, Sen. M. Kajwang’, your committees will lead us into ensuring that we have specific ways through which we ensure that these donor-funded projects in our county, citizens get value for money."
},
{
"id": 1483745,
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"speaker_name": "",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "(Sen. (Prof.) Tom Ojienda consulted loudly)"
},
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"id": 1483746,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1483746/?format=api",
"text_counter": 104,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Hon. Kingi",
"speaker_title": "The Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " Order, hon. Senators. Sen. (Prof.) Tom Ojienda, may the Senate Majority Leader be heard in silence, please."
},
{
"id": 1483747,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1483747/?format=api",
"text_counter": 105,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Cheruiyot",
"speaker_title": "The Senate Majority Leader",
"speaker": {
"id": 13165,
"legal_name": "Aaron Kipkirui Cheruiyot",
"slug": "aaron-cheruiyot"
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"content": " Mr. Speaker, Sir, I like what the Finance and Budget Committee is pointing us towards. The latest project is the Kenya Agricultural Business Development project. The one for putting together community projects for young people in agriculture. These things have been there since I was a youth. I do not think I am a good example. The project has probably been there since Sen. (Dr.) Oburu was a young person. If these interventions in agriculture achieved the desired results, we would carry on. The problem is that, as a Senate, we are not involved in the design of this project. Yet, we are brought in as rubber stamps at the tail end of the programme, where we are The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
},
{
"id": 1483748,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1483748/?format=api",
"text_counter": 106,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Cheruiyot",
"speaker_title": "The Senate Majority Leader",
"speaker": {
"id": 13165,
"legal_name": "Aaron Kipkirui Cheruiyot",
"slug": "aaron-cheruiyot"
},
"content": "supposed to append our signatures to indicate that a programme has been put together so that we could send funds to the counties. If you ask many of the Senators here to give an account of their experience of these projects, the way they have been conceptualized and designed, there would be more value for money in some of these grants despite the fact that they are specific to the projects they are supposed to do. You will find the climate funds are part of the money that many of our governors continue to run projects, similar to what used to be known in the national Government as"
},
{
"id": 1483749,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1483749/?format=api",
"text_counter": 107,
"type": "scene",
"speaker_name": "",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "kazi kwa vijana,"
},
{
"id": 1483750,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1483750/?format=api",
"text_counter": 108,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Cheruiyot",
"speaker_title": "The Senate Majority Leader",
"speaker": {
"id": 13165,
"legal_name": "Aaron Kipkirui Cheruiyot",
"slug": "aaron-cheruiyot"
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"content": "where they get their supporters and bloggers. The people used to insult Senators, walk with a slasher for two or three days, and disappear with Kshs5,000 or Kshs10,000 per day; open blatant corruption, yet we account for these funds, colleague Senators. It is time we become cautious about donor-funded projects. The so-called Treasury mandarins are intelligent. They know when to splash catchphrases like “World Bank, International Monetary Fund (IMF) funded projects.” I do not know why they do this. Is it because of neocolonialism or whatever the issue is? We get easily excited and say, “if it is the World Bank, perhaps this project would have been properly thought about, and we should approve the funds.” I believe that it is possible for the Senate of the Republic of Kenya first to put a stop to these conditional and unconditional grants until we see a feasibility report for these projects across our counties. These are the monies we will pay for. This is not free lunch, but billions of shillings that eventually accumulate and stockpile as part of our national debt, yet if you compare how that money is being used, you know for a fact that the money is wasted. Sen. Ali Roba, while I agree with the proposal to top up the funds, there must be better accountability mechanisms for these projects. Up to and including not just necessarily the amounts of money that are being disbursed, but also the conceptualization of the projects. I know what is best for the people of Kericho County. This is why they elected me to represent them here as their Senator, and this applies to all the Senators that are here. I do not see how somebody can sit in Washington and design a project that we are supposed to implement as a turnkey project and expect it will work miracles for my people. The Senate of the Republic of Kenya must have a better voice on this project, including its conceptualization and costing. Lastly, I have a concern. I will proceed to the specific Clause. This is part (h) of the Committee’s recommendation of the Report, where the Committee is proposing that we amend Clauses 5 and 6 to provide that all additional allocations to county governments under Clauses 5(1)(2)(3) and (4) shall be transferred to the respective County Revenue Fund (CRF) per the disbursement schedule approved according to Section 17 of the Public Finance Management (PFM) Act, CAP 412A. I was curious about this because I thought that this is already provided for in law. However, I have been in this House long enough to know that there is nothing that makes its way into legislation out of idle venture. Are there, perhaps, specific counties where these funds or these additional allocations are directed to without benefit to the rest of all The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
},
{
"id": 1483751,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1483751/?format=api",
"text_counter": 109,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Cheruiyot",
"speaker_title": "The Senate Majority Leader",
"speaker": {
"id": 13165,
"legal_name": "Aaron Kipkirui Cheruiyot",
"slug": "aaron-cheruiyot"
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"content": "the 47 county governments? Is that the reason why Sen. Ali Roba and his team would wish that we provide this amendment to Clauses 5 and 6 to ensure that there is a direct transfer to the specific CRF of a particular county? I thought there was a general application. Maybe, I should have asked the Chairperson of this Committee in private but help me to wonder aloud with the rest of the Senators so that they appreciate it also. It will be important for Senators to know that before the advent of this particular Bill, it was the National Treasury that was to determine the counties that were to benefit from the Conditional Grants and we only had specific counties benefitting from this particular project. We felt that it was unfair to the rest of the devolution family because we believe in the principle of equity. We believe that all 47 distinct county governments are equal before the law. That is why we moved the House and it agreed with us that this House should be the principal organ that does the distribution of resources. Today, if we are to run a project in five counties, we can justify to the rest of our colleagues that the other 42 have missed out, but somehow, they will be beneficiaries in the next Financial Year. That never used to be the case. It is for that reason that I get concerned when we have this amendment. I hope Sen. Ali Roba can convince me before we take the vote on why it has to be specified into the CRF account of the specific counties without listing those particular counties. With those very many remarks, I beg to support our Committee and appreciate them for the very good work that they have done. Thank you."
}
]
}