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"id": 1552592,
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"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Orwoba",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "Madam Temporary Speaker, I am aware that this Committee recommendation is a joint committee between the Senate Committee on Devolution and Intergovernmental Relations and JLAHRC. No one is arguing whether these recommendations are from JLAHRC or from wherever else. This is a joint recommendation, and the two players here are the JLAHRC and the Senate Committee on Devolution and Intergovernmental Relations."
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"id": 1552593,
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"text_counter": 570,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Orwoba",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "Madam Temporary Speaker, I wonder why there are so many points of orders, which are all culminating to “do not say what you are saying”. I have been mentored to understand that when I am standing on the floor of the House, I am addressing Kenyans who would like to understand what is happening in the House."
},
{
"id": 1552594,
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"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Veronica Maina",
"speaker_title": "The Temporary Speaker",
"speaker": null,
"content": " Sen. Gloria, let me guide you finally on this matter. All Senators are within their rights when they raise a point of order, and they can have a right to raise at every second, especially if the Senator who is giving their contribution is raising issues that are objectionable or they feel they ought to raise a point of order. So, they are within their rights, and you are also within your right to respond to those points of order as you continue to debate. You may proceed now, guided that when you refer to the resolutions of that Joint Committee, the reference is to the Joint Committee, not to one committee."
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{
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"text_counter": 572,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Orwoba",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I stand guided. However, I would like to first of all find out if my time has been frozen, and if I am going to get back my time."
},
{
"id": 1552596,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1552596/?format=api",
"text_counter": 573,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Orwoba",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "I would also like to say that as I am on the floor of the House, I am giving an opinion of what I think about this report, and based on how I understand things operate. So, I stand guided. I am not imputing any improper motive. I am stating facts, with the understanding that the Chair, that is the Speaker of the House, has all the powers to delegate or send a matter to certain committees. This one was sent to the Senate Committee on Devolution and Intergovernmental Relations and JLAHRC. However, the Speaker is a human being. I know that I am a first-timer and, therefore, sometimes, when you say I would like to advise someone, they say “You do not know anything.” However, if I had the opportunity to advise the Speaker prior to this being sent to JLAHRC, I would have advised him that “The JLAHRC is constituted of lawyers, and this matter is The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and AudioServices, Senate."
},
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"id": 1552597,
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"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Orwoba",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "touching on how lawyers are operating in counties. Therefore, perhaps, consider, even if you are going to put in lawyers because maybe they understand the technicalities and might be able to throw in and shed some light in terms of billing and such issues, you should definitely consider putting another Committee, for instance, one that touches on and safeguards human rights, like the Senate Standing Committee on Labour and Social Welfare, because we are touching on matters of the in-house legal counsel. I have seen that some of the recommendations that the Joint Committee have put is the capacity building of the in-house legal counsel, so that they can be able to carry out all these cases."
},
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"id": 1552598,
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"text_counter": 575,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Orwoba",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "My random and unsolicited advice to the Speaker is, in future, if a matter comes in and it touches particularly on a certain industry, and you notice that a committee, whether ad hoc or whichever committee that it is being delegated to, it should be wise enough, because of the issue of conflict of interest, to at least find a third and fourth party to be part of that joint committee."
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"id": 1552599,
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"text_counter": 576,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Orwoba",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "So, Madam Temporary Speaker, my point here being, if you look at the recommendations, which are not so many, coming from a Joint Committee of two committees, each committee has nine members, so 18 people. We have seven recommendations. In all these seven recommendations, in my opinion, and this is now where we talk about diversity in thoughts, the only relevant recommendation that is in this Joint Committee Report is the recommendation No. (6), which is-"
},
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"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Orwoba",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "“(6) The Salaries and Remuneration Commission should provide clear guidelines and advisories on salaries and allowances for legal counsels across the national and county governments to enhance legal representation of the counties.”"
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"id": 1552601,
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"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Sen. Orwoba",
"speaker_title": "",
"speaker": null,
"content": "Why do I say that? Everyone is quick to say that counties should not outsource legal services. That is fine. Some counties in a month have up to 15 cases from various sides. You will find, some counties have a lead counsel and maybe one assistant. When we are talking about “do not outsource the services”, what is the alternative? That is why I am saying, if there was someone outside who is not a lawyer, they would not be keen on structuring how the outsourced services are being outsourced. They would be thinking, if we are saying we do not outsource the services, what is the alternative? The alternative is that your in-house counsel is demotivated."
}
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}