{"count":1608389,"next":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/?format=json&page=147651","previous":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/?format=json&page=147649","results":[{"id":1494692,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1494692/?format=json","text_counter":409,"type":"speech","speaker_name":"Sen. Wakili Sigei","speaker_title":"The Temporary Speaker","speaker":null,"content":" Senate Majority Leader, before the Senior Counsel seconds your Bill, I want to give you comfort that part of what you said in the process of moving your Bill, is an inquiry to a return or an exit report from the observation of the elections that have just been conducted in the United States of America (USA). The issue is about the trust which that Report will speak to and it will answer a number of the concerns which we are trying to cure in this particular Bill. I would like to give you the comfort that, the team indeed represented the House in doing what it was sent to do. Sen. Olekina has confirmed that he was in National Dialogue Committee (NADCO) 1, where yours truly was also a member and so, we participated in this process leading to the NADCO 2, where now I would like to ask Senior Counsel (SC) Okongo Omogeni to second the Bill. Senior Counsel Okongo Omogeni, please, proceed."},{"id":1494693,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1494693/?format=json","text_counter":410,"type":"speech","speaker_name":"Sen. Omogeni","speaker_title":"","speaker":{"id":13219,"legal_name":"Erick Okong'o Mogeni","slug":"erick-okongo-mogeni"},"content":"Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, for giving me an opportunity to second this Bill that has been moved by the Senator for Kericho County. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, for the record, I went to a school that is in a village where Sen. Cheruiyot comes from, in Kabianga. So, it is my pleasure to have served with him in NADCO. Without the spirit of give and take we would not have reached where we are today. I, therefore, would like to thank him and the Members that represented the United Democratic Alliance (UDA) coalition for coming with the spirit of give and take. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only.A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and Audio Services,Senate."},{"id":1494694,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1494694/?format=json","text_counter":411,"type":"speech","speaker_name":"Sen. Omogeni","speaker_title":"","speaker":{"id":13219,"legal_name":"Erick Okong'o Mogeni","slug":"erick-okongo-mogeni"},"content":"We did not get everything that we wanted as the Azimio la Umoja–One Kenya Coalition Party and I am also sure that there are positions that were not representing the UDA coalition, but they agreed to accommodate in the spirit of give and take. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the spirit in NADCO was to ensure that when we go to the next elections, the person who wins the confidence of Kenyans and garners the majority of votes does not face a contestation in the Supreme Court. We hope that we will reach a situation where we love the person losing an election conducting himself like Biden. In the United States of America (USA), last week, within two days, President Biden who was not a candidate, but whose party, the Democratic Party, had lost an election, placed a call to President Trump who had won through the Republican Party and said, in a democracy there must be a winner and a loser. He welcomed him to the White House so that he can assist in managing the transition. Hon. Senators, I hope that you will support these amendments to the elections laws, which are trying to make it easy, transparent and the path to declaration of a win in a presidential election much easier and more transparent. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, one of the issues that we really fought about was what is Clause 39 of the Bill. In the United States of America, you will start predicting the winner in a presidential election going by results coming from the states. This Bill is proposing that we allow polling stations to have returning officers so that if you are in Ikolomani, by the time we are done with counting and tallying of votes in that polling station, the Returning Officer will give final results and declare the winner from that polling station, so that by midnight, we should be getting results telling us, Sen. Boni Khalwale, if he will be a candidate in 2027 - I do not know whether he has presidential ambitions - has taken Ikolomani. If Sen. Cherarkey will be running for Gen Zs, we are told in Borabu Constituency, Sen. Cherarkey was number three or one. That is the spirit behind these proposed amendments, so that we do not need to wait for the commissioners in Nairobi to tell us who has won in Ikolomani. If in Borabu we have tallied votes from all the polling stations by the close of the day, we should see a 411 telling us that Candidate A has taken Borabu. By the time we wake up in the morning, we should be knowing from all our constituencies, 290 of them, who is leading in a particular constituency. That makes the voting, counting and tallying of results more transparent than what we have now, where you wait for returning officers to walk all the way to Nairobi before the Independent Electoral and Boundaries Commission (IEBC) can declare who is a winner. Hon. Senators, this is a game-changer in that, even if you want to contest a presidential election you can narrow down to the polling stations that are contested. You do not need to sue the Chairman of the IEBC. You can actually select the few polling stations which are contentious and move to court challenging results on those particular polling stations. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, because of the high stakes in presidential elections, we are making it mandatory that the first election that should be counted and tallied is the presidential election results. So, if we close the voting in a polling station, the first seat that The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only.A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and Audio Services,Senate."},{"id":1494695,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1494695/?format=json","text_counter":412,"type":"speech","speaker_name":"Sen. Omogeni","speaker_title":"","speaker":{"id":13219,"legal_name":"Erick Okong'o Mogeni","slug":"erick-okongo-mogeni"},"content":"should have votes counted is the seat of the President. Once it is done, you move to the County Governor, Senator, Member of National Assembly, County Women Representative, and then finish with Member of the County Assembly (MCA), in that order. That is what we are proposing in this Bill. It is all in the spirit of making it transparent, so that we adopt the system that we see in the USA, where at midnight, you will be told Trump or Harris has carried Florida and that becomes the end. Next, you will be told Texas has gone to Candidate X. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, secondly, we need to adopt technology. What makes the results to trickle in as quickly as we saw in the USA is because they are using technology. If you employ technology, you get your results faster. I do not know what the experience of my fellow hon. Senators is, but in my seat, Senator, Nyamira County, I waited for two nights. Since people are doing manual counting, you wait for two nights and if you are not sure about your victory you cannot even break to go and have a meal or bath. However, if we embrace the technology, we can do our tallying much faster and get our results the following day. Why should we vote on a Tuesday and you are being declared on a Thursday? That waiting is too long. So, I hope when we get new commissioners in IEBC, they will bring in technology that brings real change. In Brazil, you conclude elections and in the next three---"},{"id":1494696,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1494696/?format=json","text_counter":413,"type":"scene","speaker_name":"","speaker_title":"","speaker":null,"content":"(Sen. Cherarkey spoke off record"},{"id":1494697,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1494697/?format=json","text_counter":414,"type":"heading","speaker_name":"","speaker_title":"","speaker":null,"content":")"},{"id":1494698,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1494698/?format=json","text_counter":415,"type":"other","speaker_name":"","speaker_title":"","speaker":null,"content":"Sen. Cherarkey went to Brazil, I think in the company of Governor Mutula, who was then a Senator, SC, James Orengo and they saw real-time. The problem in this country is that once people get positions, like a commissioner in the IEBC, they think more of how they can make money from that technology, instead of looking at bringing in a technology that will make the running of elections more efficient. If Brazil can use technology and declare elections within three hours, why not Kenya? Are we cursed? Are we a cursed country, yet we use more money? If you follow, you will find that we are paying more money for that technology than those other countries. I have heard Sen. Asige telling me that even in the USA, it took few hours. I think within two hours after the close of elections, results were trickling in. When we get a chance to vet the new commissioners to the IEBC, we should vet and ensure that the people who are getting a chance to serve in that Commission are men and women of integrity, who can put public interest ahead of selfish interest or wanting to enrich themselves. We do not want to hear those scandals we read some times ago about the IEBC. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I fully support the proposed amendments that makes nomination of Members of County Assemblies as proposed in Clause 19, to be people who are registered in those wards. The only thing we did not agree on, and I hope we can come to an agreement, is that this should also be extended to our constituencies and our counties. If you are being nominated to represent a constituency in West Mugirango in Nyamira or Starehe Nairobi City County, you should ordinarily be a member who votes in The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only.A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and Audio Services,Senate."},{"id":1494699,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1494699/?format=json","text_counter":416,"type":"other","speaker_name":"","speaker_title":"","speaker":null,"content":"that constituency. If you are being nominated, you should be somebody registered in that constituency. I have had agitation. Yesterday, I was confronted by Sen. Crystal Asige here, pitching that a nominated Senator should have money for county operation offices. If you need that money, we should ensure that you come from that county. For instance, if you get money to run your office, it should be Sen. Tabitha Mutinda, Nairobi, running her office in Nairobi; Sen. Crystal Asige from Mombasa, running her office in Mombasa; Sen. Ogola from Homa Bay County, running a county office in Homa Bay. Ordinarily, you should be somebody who votes in that county, constituency or in that ward. Perhaps, I will be asking the hon. Senators to reconsider whether Clause 13 should be extended, so that we do not just say “Member of County Assembly (MCA) voting in that ward.” Let us extend that spirit and intent to be also applicable in constituencies and in our counties. I think it is a fair thing to do. The other point I want to make is appointing polling stations as proposed in Clause 20, which is amending Section 38A of the Act. I was privileged in 2017 to be one of the lawyers who was appearing for Hon. Raila Amolo Odinga, in a Presidential Election Petition. Some of the issues that cropped up in that Election Petition is a situation where returning officers would tell us that they decided to set up a polling station in a certain place because nomads had moved. There were no people in the designated polling station. We cannot do that. Polling station should be known by voters. This amendment to Section 38A is proposing that the Independent Electoral and Boundaries Commission (IEBC) must appoint a place that is publicized and known to the voters. If you are in Nairobi and they say the polling station is in Starehe, that should be what the voters in that constituency know and that is where they should go and vote. If you are in West Mugirango and you say one of the polling stations is Girigiri Primary School, that should be gazetted, publicized and known to the voters. We should not have a situation where capriciously Electoral Commission Officials can set up polling stations that are not known to anybody. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, you know you practice as a lawyer and we have had serious problems with time. You are doing a Presidential Election Petition and you know the time within which you must sit, sift through cartons of documents, prepare your petition and file. Thereafter, when you appear before the Supreme Court, they will tell you that you cannot do scrutiny in a polling station that you did not name in your Presidential Election Petition. Lawyers are also human beings. We are not machines. Thus, we are giving leeway to the Election Petition Courts to look at the issue of allowing scrutiny in polling stations beyond the time that is given. This is to ensure that you do not need to restrict a counsel and say if you did not name your polling stations where you need scrutiny within seven days, we will not allow you. We want to give our judges an opportunity to hear lawyers and exercise judicial discretion. If they think a basis has been laid, then they can extend time and allow scrutiny. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only.A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and Audio Services,Senate."},{"id":1494700,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1494700/?format=json","text_counter":417,"type":"other","speaker_name":"","speaker_title":"","speaker":null,"content":"The spirit of Article 159 of our Constitution is to do substantive justice and not to pay undue regard to technicalities of procedure. I know those who practice law in this House such as you Mr. Temporary Speaker, understand how important this amendment will be to lawyers. Additionally, they proposed amendments to Section 82, on access to information including technology used in an election. We are trying to cure the problems that we all saw during the Election Petition that was filed ensuing from the 2022 general election. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, if you can recall, in 2017 the Supreme Court issued an order for that technology to be released. We were told that the lawyers in France had not woken up. When the lawyers in France woke up, we were told the technology is also hosted in the United States of America (USA). The lawyers in USA were asleep. We waited till 8.00 p.m. which in US was about midday and still the technology was not availed. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, we are making a proposal here that the Commission should ensure that there is access of information including any technology that is used in an election. This is a public money. When we employ technology, we are using the taxpayer’s money. We want Kenyans to have easy access to information so that everything is transparent. The spirit in Articles 80, 81 and 82, is that our election should be transparent and verifiable. There is no way an election can be verifiable if we are not making technology available. That is in the spirit of making Kenyans to have faith and confidence in an electoral process. It was our prayer in the National Dialogue Committee (NADCO), that in the 2027 elections, we should not have a dispute. Everything should be so transparent that at the time we conclude the elections and a candidate is declared, every Kenyan should accept that truly that was the choice of the people. The other problem and I am sure most of us who are candidates have experienced is delay which is being addressed in Clause 39. The proposal there is that each polling station should have a returning officer and once you tally the votes you make a declaration. However, there has been a problem before. You are aware that you can have a polling station that is the closest to the constituency tallying centre. Nonetheless, there can be unreasonable delay in releasing results. You finish counting even at 8.00 p.m. but the presiding officer will tell you that they are unable to announce results utill the following day. In Clause 4, we are saying that the results should be tallied within two hours. Within two hours results should be released, everything fed into the electronic system and everybody has access to the results. If you unreasonably delay announcement of results, there should be consequences. In 2013, I did an Election Petition for a candidate in an election in Nyaribari Chache. While we were looking through the transmission of results to the tallying centre at Gusii, we discovered that the polling station that was closest to the tallying centre, was the last one to declare and transmit results. When we requested the court and the court ordered scrutiny, we found that there was a lot of tampering of results from that polling station. At times presiding officers delay The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only.A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Director, Hansard and Audio Services,Senate."},{"id":1494701,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1494701/?format=json","text_counter":418,"type":"other","speaker_name":"","speaker_title":"","speaker":null,"content":"release of results deliberately, so that they can manipulate the result and interfere with certain document before the results are announced. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, this idea of giving the presiding and returning officers time is to ensure that there is no opportunity given to the presiding or returning officers to manipulate the outcome. As I conclude, I know we have not prescribed in these amendments that the IEBC should assist political parties in carrying out nominations. However, time has come for political parties to allow IEBC to conduct their nominations. There are many regions where nominations mean everything. If you win, you are as good as a MP. Lawyers will tell you, including you and Cherarkey, that the Law Society of Kenya (LSK) conducts its elections using the IEBC. It is not prescribed in any law, but because they want transparency and build confidence in that process, they have invited IEBC to preside over and conduct elections on behalf of the LSK. Why should my party, the largest party in Kenya I believe, the Orange Democratic Movement (ODM), not allow the IEBC to conduct its nominations? Why should the United Democratic Alliance (UDA) not allow the IEBC to conduct its elections? In the same spirit, all other public bodies, including the Central Organization of Trade Unions (COTU) headed by my friend, Atwoli, should allow the IEBC to assist in conducting elections of officials of those bodies. Atwoli is a popular person. Why should you go to Tom Mboya Labour College, where people come and shout, and then you become the secretary general? Allow the IEBC to set up mechanisms in all counties. Our mzee Atwoli, who is very popular within the labour movement, will be elected in elections that enjoy the confidence of the workers of Kenya and any other person. I, therefore, urge my colleague Senators to support this Elections Offences (Amendment) (No.2) Bill (Senate Bills No. 28 of 2024) that was developed through a bipartisan spirit with the Majority and the Minority Sides trying to do a clean-up in our electoral process. It will also ensure that as we gear towards 2027 elections, we will create a legal regime that will have transparent, verifiable and uncontested elections. With those remarks, I second."}]}