{"count":1608389,"next":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/?format=json&page=150416","previous":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/?format=json&page=150414","results":[{"id":1522342,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1522342/?format=json","text_counter":118,"type":"speech","speaker_name":"Marakwet East, UDA","speaker_title":"Hon. Kangogo Bowen","speaker":null,"content":" Thank you, Hon. Speaker. Almost a week ago, you directed us, the chairpersons of departmental committees, to consider the Budget Policy Statement (BPS) which we are currently doing, and we are almost concluding. The Leader of the Majority Party has also given us business for the next week, including conclusion of the BPS. However, there is an issue that I want you to address. That matter also requires the attention of the leadership of the National Assembly led by Hon. Kimani Ichung’wah, and probably the leadership of the Senate. On Tuesday, we met the Ministry of Water, Sanitation and Irrigation to consider the BPS, and on the same Tuesday, the Senate also wrote to the Ministry asking them to appear before them on the same issue of the BPS."},{"id":1522343,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1522343/?format=json","text_counter":119,"type":"speech","speaker_name":"Marakwet East, UDA","speaker_title":"Hon. Kangogo Bowen","speaker":null,"content":"Articles 95 and 96 of the Constitution outline the roles of the National Assembly and Senate, but we do not see where the Senators fit into the budget-making process. As the departmental committees, once we are done, we present our reports to the Budget and Appropriations Committee, which is then transmitted to the National Treasury and Economic Planning. After interrogating the ministries on the BPS, I do not know where the Senate committees take their reports to. Do they send their reports to the Budget and Appropriations Committee of this House, or where do they submit them? There is confusion. If there are other laws that require Senators to ask the ministries to appear before them in the budget-making process, it is good that we harmonise them and involve the leadership of both Houses, National Assembly and the Senate, so that, where possible, we can do a joint sitting of the departmental committees of the National Assembly and the Senate. It is very confusing to call the same Ministry to appear before us on the BPS, and then the Senators call the same Ministry again. I do not know where they come in. So, I am seeking your direction as our Speaker and the Chairman of the Parliamentary Service Commission."},{"id":1522344,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1522344/?format=json","text_counter":120,"type":"speech","speaker_name":"Hon. Speaker","speaker_title":"","speaker":null,"content":"It seems like that is Hon. Kirima speaking though I cannot see you, properly."},{"id":1522345,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1522345/?format=json","text_counter":121,"type":"speech","speaker_name":"Central Imenti, UDA","speaker_title":"Hon. Moses Kirima","speaker":null,"content":" Thank you, Hon. Speaker. As a rejoinder to what has been said by my colleague, I want to state that Parliament is so much seized of the situation of Articles 95 and 96 of the Constitution. This is a matter that has come before this House several times. As a country, we are pursuing the policy of austerity measures to ensure we cut costs on unnecessary expenses. Can this House come out clearly and advise the Executive? I believe the problems we are undergoing are being entertained by the authorities and those with powers to execute and implement the Constitution as it is. The Senate has assumed the role of this House, duplicating committees, calling the agencies and departments that should not be appearing before them, and trying to create work that does not exist for themselves. They are supposed to meet only two times per year to deliberate on revenue allocation between the national Government and the county governments. Can it come out clearly? There is a lot of confusion in all aspects. Let us come to marking where we park cars. You find that it is marked, possibly through the advice of the Chairman of the Parliamentary Service Commission. The Senate has no role in even going to park down there, for they are supposed to be overseeing the county governments, and they should be seen there more than here. We brought them to live and work in Nairobi, yet their work is upcountry. So, my colleague is saying that someone is duplicating work, and it is upon us to cut costs. Are we cutting costs by doing double work in the same Parliament? I call upon the Executive and the Parliamentary Service Commission, led by the Speaker of this House, to ensure that we are not duplicating work anymore."},{"id":1522346,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1522346/?format=json","text_counter":122,"type":"speech","speaker_name":"Hon. Speaker","speaker_title":"","speaker":null,"content":"The Leader of the Majority Party."},{"id":1522347,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1522347/?format=json","text_counter":123,"type":"speech","speaker_name":"Kikuyu, UDA","speaker_title":"Hon. Kimani Ichung’wah","speaker":null,"content":" Hon. Speaker, the issue raised by Hon. Kangogo Bowen is quite important. To directly answer Hon. Bowen, the Senate’s role in the The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor."},{"id":1522348,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1522348/?format=json","text_counter":124,"type":"speech","speaker_name":"Kikuyu, UDA","speaker_title":"Hon. Kimani Ichung’wah","speaker":null,"content":"BPS is restricted to only one Ministry, the National Treasury and Economic Planning, because they have a role in the consideration of debt management, which affects counties. They also have a role on the BPS because the Division of Revenue Bill, as you are aware, goes to both this House and the Senate. Therefore, they have a role. Hon. Speaker, you are a former Senator, so I will be cautious with my words. I was just wondering: Has it taken the Senate too long to acclimatise themselves with the new Constitution and understand their role and mandate? We have no problem with the Senate calling or summoning the Cabinet Secretary for the National Treasury and Economic Planning to deal with the Debt Management Strategy Paper or the BPS, concerning the Division of Revenue Bill. However, I just received a copy from Hon. Kangogo Bowen, signed by the Clerk of the Senate, inviting the Cabinet Secretary for Water, Sanitation and Irrigation, Eng. Eric Muuga, to appear before the Committee on Tuesday, 4th March 2025 at 11.30 a.m. The agenda is to deliberate on the proposed policies, programs, and expenditure ceilings of the State departments under the Ministry's purview, not the county governments, and the implementation status of the 2024/2025 Budget as of 31st December 2024. The entire agenda is misplaced because this is work that should be done by the Departmental Committee on Blue Economy and Irrigation of the National Assembly. I agree with Hon. Kirima that it is not just a waste of public resources, but also a waste of the valuable time of the Senators and the Cabinet Secretary. I want to speak to the cabinet secretaries. If you are a cabinet secretary and receive two invitations; one from the departmental committee that oversees you and your Ministry and one from another House that oversees governors and county governments, you have the option to decide where to appear and know which side of your bread is buttered. You must know which House has the authority to impeach you and which one does not. That should make it easy for any cabinet secretary who has invitations from both the Senate and the National Assembly on matters of the BPS or any other matter. The key point is that the people who oversee you are the people’s representatives, not those who represent counties. When those who represent the people summon you, have your priorities right. I will advise this particular cabinet secretary. If he has an invitation from the Departmental Committee on Blue Economy and Irrigation of the National Assembly and he has another one from the Senate…"},{"id":1522349,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1522349/?format=json","text_counter":125,"type":"speech","speaker_name":"Hon. Members","speaker_title":"","speaker":null,"content":"Repeat that."},{"id":1522350,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1522350/?format=json","text_counter":126,"type":"scene","speaker_name":"","speaker_title":"","speaker":null,"content":"(Applause)"},{"id":1522351,"url":"http://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/1522351/?format=json","text_counter":127,"type":"speech","speaker_name":"Kikuyu, UDA","speaker_title":"Hon. Kimani Ichung’wah","speaker":null,"content":" Hon. Speaker, with your indulgence, I am being told to repeat. If a cabinet secretary of the national Government is not a Member of the county executive committee (CEC), particularly this one who has a letter dated 25th February, has an invitation from the departmental committee that oversees him, he should know which side of his bread is buttered. Appear before the House that oversees you. Give it priority over any other House. They can spend their time as they wish. We cannot dictate how they spend their time. To close it, we must tell the Executive to give priority to the National Assembly, especially on matters touching on the budget-making process. We do not want to fight our colleagues. As a former Senator, you and the Speaker of the Senate have led us well in having consultative processes to avoid squabbles between both Houses. Yesterday, Members raised issues concerning the Road Maintenance Levy Fund (RMLF). They do not control any funds. They do not want to control even a single shilling or cent of the RMLF. We are just protecting our constitutional mandate to oversee the national Government institutions like the Kenya Rural Roads Authority (KeRRA), the Kenya Urban Roads Authority (KURA) and the Kenya National Highways Authority (KeNHA). We have not asked for money to go to the Members of Parliament. I have never heard them asking for The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor."}]}