Hon. Senators, I have a message from the County Assembly of Kiambu on the County Assembly Powers and Privileges Bill, Senate Bill No.11 of 2014. Hon. Senators, I wish to bring to the attention of the Senate that pursuant to Standing Order No.42(3) and (4), the Clerk has delivered to me the following Message from the County Assembly of Kiambu on the County Assembly Powers and Privileges Bill, Senate Bill No.11 of 2014. The message states as follows, and I quote:- “Pursuant to the provisions of Section No.38 of the Kiambu County Assembly Interim Standing Orders, I hereby convey the following message to the Senate. Whereas the County Assembly Powers and Privileges Bill, Senate Bill No.11 of 2014, a Bill concerning county governments, was introduced in the Senate on Tuesday, 10th of June, 2014, subsequent to which by way of a letter dated 29th of October, 2014, the Senate sought the views of the county assemblies on the said Bill; whereas the Kiambu County Assembly, having deliberated on the contents of the Bill as published by way of a resolution made on Thursday, 16th of October, 2014, adopted a position on the Bill for which a detailed memorandum is herein included. Therefore, in accordance with the provisions of Articles 96(1) 118(1)(b) of the Constitution and Section 38 of the Kiambu County Assembly Interim Standing Orders, I hereby convey the said decision of the Assembly, the effect of which is to beseech the Senate to reflect on the views of the Assembly in its consideration and passage of the Bill. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to lay the following Papers on the Table of the Senate, today, Thursday, 6th November, 2014. GRABBING OF KISII MUNICIPAL MARKET BY PRIVATE DEVELOPERS Report of the Commission on Administrative Justice on alleged irregular and illegal acquisition of Kisii Municipal Market by private developers. NATIONAL CONSTRUCTION AUTHORITY REGULATIONS 2014 Report of the Sessional Committee on Delegated Legislation on the National Construction Authority Regulations, 2014. ANNUAL REPORT (2012/2013) OF THE JUDICIARY AND STATE OF ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE Report of the Standing Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights on the Annual Report (2012/2013) of the Judiciary and State of Administration of Justice. REPORT OF SESSIONAL COMMITTEE ON LEGISLATION WITH CHAIRPERSONS OF COUNTERPART COMMITTEES OF COUNTY ASSEMBLIES The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to give notice of the following Motions:- ADOPTION OF REPORT OF COMMITTEE ON LEGAL AFFAIRS AND HUMAN RIGHTS WITH CHAIRPERSONS OF COUNTERPART COMMITTEES OF COUNTY ASSEMBLIES THAT, this House adopts the Report of the Standing Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights on the Retreats with chairpersons of counterpart committees of county assemblies held from 7th to 10th May, 2014, laid on the Table of the House today, Thursday, 6th November, 2014. ADOPTION OF ANNUAL REPORT (2012/2013) OF THE COMMISSION ON ADMINISTRATIVE JUSTICE THAT, this House adopts the Report of the Standing Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights on the Annual Report (2012/2013) of the Commission on Administrative Justice laid on the Table of the House today, Thursday, 6th November, 2014. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Thank you, Sen. Sang. Next Order.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, pursuant to the provisions of Standing Order No.45, I rise to present the business of the Senate for the coming week. On Tuesday, 11th November, 2014, the Rules and Business Committee (RBC) will meet on Tuesday, 11th November, 2014, at 12.00 noon to schedule business for the Senate for the week. Subject to the further directions by the RBC, the Senate will continue with business that will not be concluded in today’s Order Paper focusing on debate on Bills at the Second Reading and Committee of the Whole. On Wednesday, 12th November, 2014, the Senate will continue with business not concluded during Tuesday’s sitting and consider any other business scheduled by the RBC. The Senate will also deliberate on the following Motions. Resume debate on the Motion by the Chairperson of the Ad hoc Committee on Adoption of a Report on the Establishment of the Public Compensation Bureau; a Motion by Sen. Sammy Leshore on the Establishment of the National AIDS Control Council County Offices; a Motion by the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Agriculture, Livestock and Fisheries on the status of food security in Baringo County; Reports of the Kenyan Delegation to the ACP-EU Joint Parliamentary Assembly meetings held in 2013/2014 and a Motion by the Chairperson of the Ad hoc Committee on Adoption of a Report on Legislation on Harambees . On Thursday, 13th November, 2014, the Senate will continue with business not concluded on Tuesday and Wednesday, in particular deliberating on Bills at Second Reading and Committee of the Whole and any other business scheduled by the RBC. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
There are still other statements to be issued. Sen. Madzayo, are you issuing a statement? I can see your item on the Order Paper. COMPENSATION OF IDPS IN NYAMIRA AND KISII COUNTIES
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, this is a statement in relation to a request that was sought by Sen. Mong’are. The Statement is on the status of compensation for Internally Displaced Persons (IDPs) in Nyamira and Kisii counties as a result of the 2007/2008 post-election violence. The statement had four questions as follows: (i) Whether we are aware that various persons from Nyamira and Kisii counties, including businessmen, farmers and workers were displaced as a result of the violence and, if so, whether the list could be attached. (ii) Whether the Parliamentary Select Committee on Internally Displaced Persons which was appointed in 2012---
Order, Senator! I notice that the answer is quite long.
Does Sen. Mong’are have a copy?
Yes, he does.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the Committee recommended an ex-
payment of Kshs10,000 as well as Kshs25,000 for loss of property and homes to all IDPs. (i) Whether it can be confirmed that out of 6,000 households affected by violence in Kisii and Nyamira counties, only a few received ex-gratia payment and none received compensation for the loss of property and homes. (ii) Whether the action that was taken to ensure registration of IDPs, including those in Nyamira and Kisii counties ensured that they were protected and assisted under the fund set up by Section 15 of the Prevention, Protection and Assistance to IDPs and Affected Communities Act, 2012. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I wish to respond on issue No.1. We are aware that various persons from Nyamira and Kisii counties, including businessmen, farmers and workers were displaced as a result of the violence. I have managed to give my colleague, the Senator for Nyamira, the attached list of the IDPs. During the 2007/2008 post- The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Order, Senator! It was Kshs181 million.
Yes, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, it is Kshs181,200,000, which was sent to the Deputy County Commissioner (DCC) to pay 18,120 IDPs an amount of Kshs10,000 each as start-up capital. We have the tables, which we have explained below and I believe the distinguished Senator for Nyamira should go through it and find it adequate explanation. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, despite these efforts, the DCC is yet to account for the Kshs22,260,000 disbursed to them for payment of start-up capital of Kshs10,000 to 2,226 Kisii IDPs. It, therefore, means that only 15,160 IDPs are confirmed to have been paid whereas the payment to 2,225 IDPs cannot be confirmed until we receive returns from the DCC. The normal practice is for the Ministry to send funded authority to incur expenditure (AIE) to the DCC with an approved register of the IDPs to be paid. Once the DCC has finalized payments, the file is returned indicating how many IDPs were paid, how many were not paid and reasons for non-payment, if any. They also return copies of the Government of Kenya Support Payment Form duly signed by the recipient to show who was paid. It is these returns which enable the Ministry to update the records of those who have been paid. Any disbursement not supported by returns is considered as unaccounted funds. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, non-payment to IDPs is normally due to various reasons, including lack of necessary documents such as identity cards or the death of beneficiaries; non-availability of the beneficiaries for one reason or another or differences in particulars, amongst others. In the case of Kisii, the unaccounted funds are shown in The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Thank you, Senator. That was quite lengthy and detailed. I am sure Sen. Okong’o is satisfied.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I do not understand how I can be satisfied with a very lengthy statement which is full of contradictions and counter- contradictions.
Sen. Okong’o, remember that you are seeking clarifications.
Yes, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I want the Chairman to clarify when he says that IDPs did not provide identification cards whereas these are documents which were burnt. I would also like him to clarify that monies were sent to the DCCs who have not accounted for it. I would also like him to clarify why he brought an answer which is not complete. We have been told by the Chairman that the then Minister went to negotiate and see how they can arrest that situation but they failed. I also need a clarification from the Chair when he tells us that there were some reports sent to KACA but they have no file. That is why I am saying that this report is full of contradictions and I need a clarification on the same---
Senator, just seek clarification on what you want. I cannot give you too much time.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I think we are not here for purposes of raising issues for the sake of raising issues. I need sufficient time to respond---
Order! You are not going to direct me on how to conduct the House. You must get that very clearly in your mind.
That is very clear. Most obliged.
I am telling you for the last time that you do not have indefinite time to deal with statements. Therefore, seek your clarification and others who want to do the same must be given a chance. Remember, I asked at the beginning whether you had looked at the Statement and you accepted. So, seek a clarification.
Since this is my question, I will try to be as brief as possible. I had reached the fourth clarification. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, thank you for giving me a chance to seek a clarification. First, I want to state for the record that the handling of this matter by the Government and its agents particularly in Kisii and Nyamira counties has been very poor leaving many people dissatisfied. Why did the Government find it necessary to classify IDPs into several categories despite the fact that all of them suffered a similar fate namely; they were tortured, humiliated and displaced from their homes and residences? Is the Chair aware that this categorization has led to different levels of compensation resulting in some IDPs being paid less than others and consequently feeling discriminated against? I also want to seek a clarification from the Chair in respect to what he has said in this answer, particularly as relates to Kisii and Nyamira counties. He has stated that an amount of Kshs181,200,000 was paid as start-up capital and another Kshs800,025,000 for construction of burnt houses. Of this amount, Kshs22,260,000 plus a further Kshs55 million has not been accounted for by the DCC. Is the Government aware that the intended beneficiaries of the funds which have not been accounted for are still homeless and suffering, seven years after they were displaced from their farms and businesses? Is he also aware that these groups of Kenyans now feel that the Government is not sensitive to their plight? What action is the Government taking urgently to address the predicament of this group of Kenyans?
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I had two clarifications to seek but one of them has been adequately covered by Sen. Obure. Therefore, I will go straight to the second one. In the Statement, the Chairman has informed us that Kshs22 million that was meant to be paid to 2,200 IDPs has not been accounted for. This money was disbursed in the financial year of 2012/2013, and we are all aware that when the financial year comes to an end, monies that have not been spent are returned to the Treasury. We want to know where the Kshs22 million is. Is the money still there? If it is there, where is it? Is it earning interest? What is going to happen to the interest that is being earned on this money?
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I want to seek one clarification from the Chair. We know that there were IDPs in the North Rift region who were displaced and found themselves in other counties like Nakuru and the Government had to compensate them. If they owned land in Uasin Gishu, Nandi or any other place, because if they were compensated with pieces of land and other resources, who then took the land that these IDPs left in the other areas? Did the Government repossess that land or is it a state of a compensating people who have their original land, the one allocated under the compensation programme?
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would want to get further clarification on the following: Is the Government aware that there were two categories of people who The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I remember when this issue was raised, I added an addendum that the Statement should include IDPs in Migori County but as the Chair was reading it, I have heard nothing about the IDPs in Migori County. What informed the Government to pay Kshs10,000 as an ex- gratia payment and Kshs25,000 as compensation to the IDPs which I find as an insult to humanity and total disregard to the pain these Kenyans went through whereas as we have been told other IDPs in other areas were paid given Kshs470,000?
Thank you, Senators. Before we proceed with the answer from Sen. Madzayo, I wish to make a short Communication.
Hon. Senators, I wish to recognise in the first instance, the presence of students and teachers from AIC Chebisaas Boys Secondary School in Uasin Gishu County who are seated in the public gallery. On behalf of the Senate and on my own behalf, I extend a warm welcome to them and wish them a happy and fruitful visit. I also hope and trust that they will learn something important when they go back to their school. DELEGATION FROM MOMBASA COUNTY ASSEMBLY AT THE SPEAKER’S GALLERY Hon. Senators, I also wish to recognise in the Speaker’s Gallery Members of the Mombasa County Assembly, members of the Committee of Justice, Labour and Legal Affairs. This morning, there was a meeting between committees of five counties, the equivalent of a committee of justice and legal affairs. The ones from Mombasa have to come to see what we do here. I wish to recognise them in the usual manner. I will mention their names and when the name is mentioned, please, rise and bow and you will be acknowledged in the usual manner of the Senate. Hon. Jimmy Ondari - Chairman of the Committee Hon. Jabes M. Oduor - Member Hon. Lucy Chizi Chireli - Member Hon. Tom Ogalo - Member Hon. Patrick Simiyu - Member Mr. Abdallah Hamisi - Clerk Assistant. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Yours will be the last one.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I want to join my colleague by expressing our concerns as the Senate that matters of IDP in this country have not been dealt with in a manner that seeks to finalise it. Turkana County was also affected as per the database. There are so many IDPs who have not been compensated; those who were supposed to benefit from the shelter programme, four houses which were constructed in four locations have not been completed.
Sen. Munyes, I get the impression that you are raising a completely new issue. I am not sure whether when the answer was prepared, it was comprehensive and related to the specific area which you have raised. If you want to seek a clarification, please, do so but if you bring completely new issues, Sen. Madzayo may not be in a position to deal with them unless you want to seek a fresh statement.
I could seek the latter but I just wanted the Chair to enlight the House on the matter of compensation as far as housing is concerned. That is one area the Government has not done a good job. In Turkana, in five locations, IDPs are still staying in shelters while the houses are incomplete. I want to challenge the Chair, who is also my Chair in the Committee for Labour and Social Welfare, to get a comprehensive report for the whole country so that we can understand what is happening and when this matter will be dealt with finality.
Sen. Hassan, is it a point of order?
It is also a clarification.
It is further clarification on this issue.
I will make yours the last one so that we can get a response and go to the second round.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, first and foremost, I also seek to recognise Members of the Mombasa County Assembly.
I have already done that.
I just want to welcome them and appreciate their being here. That extends to the students, whom I believe, one day will be sitting in this Chair as Senators of this distinguished Republic. That said and done, I dealt enormously with matters of IDPs when I was with the KNHCR.
On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. Along the same lines with Sen. Hassan, for welcoming Members of the County Assembly of Mombasa, I am stepping in for Sen. Melly of Uasin Gishu. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Order. Take your seat. Your point of order is not even related to the issue before the House this afternoon. We are talking about IDPs. Sen. Hassan Omar, if it is on the issue of Internally Displaced Persons (IDPs), I will give you a chance to seek a clarification.
Move on to the Dispatch Box if the microphone is not coming on.
As I said, I did a lot of work around IDPs at the Kenya National Human Rights Commission (KNHCR). There is a group of IDPs who are totally lost in this regard. There are those IDPs who at the advent of the violence returned home, be it in central Kenya, Nyanza or wherever it is. They are no longer in camps and have not gone back to those areas that they were displaced from. They are living with their relatives and have been totally forgotten in terms of compensation. Is there any knowledge on the part of the Government on how many of these IDPs are there and whether there are any other reasonable measures to compensate them?
Sen. Madzayo, you may now deal with all those issues.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I appreciate the interest of the Senators on this matter. There are quite a number of questions that they have been asked. I need some two weeks to come up with a substantive answer.
Senator, you are seized of the answer from the Cabinet Secretary. Most of the issues that have been raised especially by Sen. Okong’o and Sen. Obure are questions emanating from the statement you issued. Why do you require two weeks?
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, you know the Government bureaucracy.
I mean the issues that have been raised that by Sen. Okong’o, Sen. Ndiema, Sen. Obure and even the one that was raised by Sen. Khaniri about the Kshs22.6 million are issues that are in your statement.
Exactly, but I want to seek instructions to be able to give a comprehensive answer to all of them.
Are you saying that you are not satisfied with the statement as it is right now?
Exactly, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.
That is reasonable. Sen. Okong’o, if it is reasonable, then we are going to make it beyond that. If you look at the HANSARD, there are Senators like Munyes who have raised issues which were not specific to the question raised. I would like you, in the interest of time, that you also consider from the Cabinet Secretary those other issues that have been raised. Take a copy of the HANSARD and in two weeks time, give us comprehensive answers.
Much obliged, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.
On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. Every supplementary question that is raised no matter how big or small it is, it will be in order to say that the chairperson of any committee will not have an answer unless he or she The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Sen. Muthama, are you saying that chairpersons have no capacity? Is that what I am getting you to say?
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, they do not lack the capacity. The capacity is based on what has been asked and the answer given. They have to consult on anything outside that written statement. That is the truth.
Sen. Muthama, I appreciate what you are saying. Of course, Cabinet Secretaries do not come to the Floor of the Senate to give the statements. Now that Sen. Madzayo has sought leave to come back in two weeks’ time, let it be two weeks. Let the Committee try and get the comprehensive answers.
Sen. (Dr.) Machage, are you on a point of order?
Yes, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. In view of the reaction of Sen. Madzayo to the many questions and the comment from the Senator from Machakos County, am I in order to remind this House that the political system operating in Kenya now has failed? We need a mongrel or a parliamentary system and, therefore, a referendum.
Order, Senator! You are completely out of order because that was not the issue before the House. Hon. Senators, that marks the end of the Order on Statements. Before we move on to the next Order, Sen. Mositet had sought the Floor. Proceed, Sen. Mositet.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I wanted to comment on something, but I have decided to defer it to next week.
You have changed your mind?
Yes, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.
That suits me. Hon. Senators, that brings us to the end of the Order on Statements. Let us move on to the next Order. Hon. Senators, before we proceed with the next Order on Committee of the Whole, may I request that I consult.
Order Members. Clerk, you may now call out the next Order. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, hon. Senators. We have a herculean task today. There is a lot of voting to be done. As you will recall, we had gone through all the processes on Order No.8(1), save for the division. I order that we complete that division and embark on the other Orders. We will ring the Bell once for all of them. However, we will finish the first one first because it had been dealt with completely and the procedure does not allow that we mix it with the others. Therefore, I order that the Division Bell be rung for only two minutes.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, hon. Senators. Let the Division Bell stop ringing first for some consultations. Order, hon. Senators, I will put the question later.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order. Hon. Senators, where is the Chairman of the Committee on Finance, Commerce and Budget? I think he has an amendment.
I am informed that the amendment was dealt with earlier.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Clerks-at-the-Table, do we have the threshold to vote? Please, let the bars be drawn. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): You are too late. You cannot go anywhere.
On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Chairman. I think you should deal firmly with Sen. Obure for trying to walk out when the bars are being drawn.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Do you doubt the firmness with which I dealt with Sen. Obure? We are dealing with the amendment on Clause 3. I just want to bring you at par with my thinking. Every Senator knows what it was about. Those who want to be assisted, I will deal with you later. You have 30 seconds to vote. We are trying to conserve time.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Senators! I wish to announce the results of the Division as follows:-
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Senators! I wish to announce the results of the division as follows:-
On a point of order Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): What is it, Sen. Hassan?
The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir. The reason I am raising a point of order is because the bars have not been drawn. So, that means that all of us are here. We are full House. In the first vote, we had 28 “Ayes” and in the second vote, we have 31 “Ayes”; an increment of three votes. There was a ruling in this House by the Speaker that once you are in the House, you must vote in one way or another; either you vote “yes”, “no” or you abstain. Those are the only three votes. It is a Standing Order. Therefore, if there are three voters who did not vote initially, that led to that increment. That is what I just want to point it out to the Chair for the purposes of him taking note.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): That is a valid point of order. However, the Chair does not want to be assisted at this time.
The Clerks-at-the-Table will look into the records and those who will be found not to have voted either way, and did not record their desire not to vote, believe it or not, there will be some reprimand. Let us proceed.
On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir. I will be excused because I just want to assist the Chair and say that some of us did not vote electronically because we thought that we had voted. However, when we checked later, we were told that our cards were defective. They could not be used to vote. So, we voted through assistance. I am one of those who did not vote but it is because I thought that my card was working while it was not working. I am sure there are two other Members.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Thank you for owning up. However, I cannot count your vote now.
On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir. The point raised by Sen. Hassan is very critical because we vote as delegations. This could be a Bill where whichever vote we throw in may not count much other than in winning the vote. However, we also have a contested matter where each vote counts. What happens if an illegible voter fraudulently casts a vote and tills the result of the vote? Will the Chair annul that vote and send us to back to vote? This is not just a question of delegations voting but legibility of the vote. Each county has only one vote and if Nominated or Members of Delegations vote when they are not supposed to vote because their principals are there, then those votes become invalid.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Thank you, the Senate Minority Leader. I draw your attention to Standing Order No. 75 which says: “In the event of a technical failure, confusion or error occurring in the course of voting which in the opinion of the Speaker cannot otherwise be corrected, the Speaker may direct the Senate to another round of electronic voting or proceed to a roll call vote.” The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
That is contemporaneous to the vote. What happens thereafter?
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Could you read that? The onus rests on the Speaker to make a decision. In this instance, I have not seen that kind of theoretical happening. I would do exactly as Standing order No. 75 says. I believe Members would alert the Chair in case there was a problem with voting by delegation. The Clerks-at-the-Table would also alert the Chair in case of such an eventuality. This has not been done to me now. So, let us proceed.
On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir. An attempt has been made to automate these machines so that they detect who should vote and who should not vote. For example, a few minutes ago, a Nominated Member who was trying to vote could not vote. You can only vote after you have been cleared by the Clerks-at- the-Table. The fear that a Nominated Member who is supposed to vote has not been given authority to vote may not be the case. I realised a few minutes ago that a system has been put into place to ensure that you cannot vote if the elected Member of the county is present in the House.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Actually, there are only three names that have been picked by the Clerks-at-the-Table that have problems that is; Sen. Musila’s, Sen. Murungi’s and Sen. Adan’s. We have already depicted that but as far as I am concerned; I have written notifications from the leaders of delegations authorising the Nominated Senators in the House to vote. So, everything is in order. Is there another point of order? What is it, Sen. Karaba? Mwalimu?
On a point of order Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir. In view of the very many problems which are arising from the use of these machines, could we go by the earlier roll call system which could be more effective? We are wasting a lot of time here queuing.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Yes. Sen. Ong’era.
Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir, I am surprised that the Chairman of the Committee on Education, who I highly respect, is actually suggesting that we go analogue when he has been singing that they are digital.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Sen. Janet Ong’era, some of Mwalimu’s students are Senators here. Are you surprised?
Anyway, that is on a light note. Let us have the Mover.
Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir, I beg to move that the Committee do report to the Senate its consideration of the Public Finance Management (Amendment) Bill, Senate Bill No.10 of 2014 and its approval thereof with amendments.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Hon. Senators, I will now proceed to put the question and the response will be by acclamation.
Hon. Senators, let us now move on to the next Bill. The doors are still closed and the bars still drawn. This is Order No.8(ii), the National Honours (Amendment) Bill, (Senate Bill No.16 of 2014). This is a Bill by Sen. Amos Wako. THE NATIONAL HONOURS (AMENDMENT) BILL, (SENATE BILL NO.16 OF 2014)
On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir. In this New Clause 1A, there is some wording there---
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order! We have not yet got there. Just hold your horses.
I will hold them, Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Hold them tight!
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Where is the Chairperson of the Committee on Labour and Social Welfare?
Do you have any problem? Do you want any assistance?
Yes, Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Okay, I give you only one minute to consult, exactly 60 seconds.
The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir. If the bars are drawn, it means that we cannot transact any other business other than business of voting. If somebody wants to move an amendment, then we have to draw the bars. This is there for a good reason.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Yes, that is quite in order. Can the bars be drawn and the doors opened?
Please, do not go because the doors are now opened. It is just for the purposes of moving this amendment in an orderly way. Sen. Madzayo, are you ready? Kuna microphone hapa or you prefer that one? Use the Dispatch Box if that one is not working.
Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir, I beg to move that the Bill be amended by inserting the following new clause immediately after clause 1- Amendment of Section 6 No.11 of 2013 1A Section 5 of the National Honours Act is amended in paragraph (d) by deleting the word “elected” appearing immediately after the words “two Governors” and substituting thereof the word “nominated.” The words “two Governors” are already in the Act. What we are dealing with here is that we are deleting the word “elected” appearing immediately thereafter the words. I hope I am understood.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Very well. Nobody has complained. You are very well understood.
Thank you, Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir.
On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): What is it, Sen. Muthama?
Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir, if you insert the word “nominated” immediately between the words “two governors”, it reads two governors. If you have nominated, you say “nominated two governors”. What is two governors? The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
(Sen. (Dr) Machage): Sen. Muthama, some people would read a small clause in the Bible which says “Carry my cross and follow me” and they will go and make a very big wooden cross and begin walking in the streets. You have to read the whole Act because if you want to amend the “two governors”, then you will have to move an amendment. The “two governors” are in the Act. Nobody has moved any amendment. If you so desire, then you should have done that earlier, with a notice to this Chair which you did not. There is nothing I can do about it now.
Mr. Temporary Chairman Sir, First of all, I am not sure whether we are operating the electronic way of pressing the button when you want to raise a point of order or whether we are shouting it. Secondly, it is only right and fair that the Mover of the amendment explains to the House what the impact of the amendment that he is proposing is.
(Sen. (Dr) Machage): You are quite in order on the second point but on the first one, you cannot compel the Chair to see you, I did not see you, that is all but it is noted. We are on the electronic system not a shouting match. Sen. Madzayo, Sen. Mutahi Kagwe’s request is quite in order. Why do you want that amendment? Can you enlighten the House? Senator for Marsabit, what is it?
Mr. Temporary Chairman Sir, my point of order is that, the particular amendment which the Senator is introducing is not part of this amendment to the Act. It is another clause within the parent Act that is not part of this amendment. Is it in order to amend another clause in the same Act which is not part of the amendment we are handling?
(Sen. (Dr) Machage): It is quite in order if someone so wished to amend a clause in an Act, but we do not have it today. What we have is a new clause. That is the explanation that Sen. Madzayo needed to tell the House. Since you have offered to give that explanation, which is very satisfactory, I see no need for Sen. Madzayo to give more unless you so desire to do. Do you?
No, Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir
(Sen. (Dr) Machage): Okay, I will now propose the question.
Somebody is requesting that Sen. Madzayo explains that amendment because we cannot vote if he has not clearly explained why he is amending it. He needs to explain to us.
(Sen. (Dr) Machage): Yes, I had addressed that issue. Instead the Senator for Marsabit explained but if you so desire that the Sen. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): I order that the doors be closed.
What are we voting on?
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): I will tell you what we are voting on. Draw the bars. Log in first. We are voting for the question that the New Clause 1A be read a Second Time.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Hon. Senators, I will now report the vote:- The “Ayes” who voted electronically are 19, plus 7 who voted manually. The total for the “Ayes” is 26 votes.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): You can now open the bars and the doors. Now, I propose the question that the New Clause 1A be part of the Bill. I see no intervention. I now put the question that the new Clause 1A be part of the Bill.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Ring the Division Bell for one minute.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): One minute is over. Can you close the door and draw the bar? Numbers sasa zimeenda wapi tena? Some people are just disturbing others. What is all this hell? Log in everybody. Start voting. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Hon. Senators, I want to announce the votes:- The “Ayes” who voted electronically are 17 plus 8 who voted manually. The total for the “Ayes” is 25 votes.
Sen. Abdirahman, Wajir County; Sen. Chelule, Nakuru County; Sen. Dullo, Isiolo County; Sen. Elachi, Nairobi County; Sen. Hargura, Marsabit County; Sen. Hassan, Mombasa County; Sen. Kagwe, Nyeri County; Sen. Kembi-Gitura, Murang’a County; Sen. Karaba, Kirinyaga County; Sen. Kivuti,Embu County; Sen. (Dr.) Machage, Migori County; Sen. Melly, Uasin Gishu County; Sen. Mositet, Kajiado County; Sen. Murkomen, Elgeyo-Marakwet County; Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr., Makueni County; Sen. Ndiema, Trans Nzoia County; Sen. Ntutu, Narok County; Sen. Okong’o, Nyamira County and Sen. Sang, Nandi County.
(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Senators! I wish to announce the results of the Division as follows:-
Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I beg to move that the Committee do report to the Senate its consideration of The National Honours (Amendment) Bill, (Senate Bill No.16 of 2014) and its approval thereof with amendments.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I beg to report that the Committee of the Whole has considered The Public Finance Management (Amendment) Bill, (Senate Bill No.10 of 2014) and approved the same with amendments.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the House doth agree with the Committee in the said Report.
seconded. THE NATIONAL HONOURS (AMENDMENT) BILL, (SENATE BILL NO.16 OF 2014)
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I beg to report that the Committee of the Whole has considered The National Honours (Amendment) Bill, (Senate Bill No.16 of 2014) and its approval thereof with amendments.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the House doth agree with the Committee in the said Report.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that The National Honours (Amendment) Bill, (Senate Bill No.16 of 2014) be now Read a Third Time.
Order! Yes, but you are not going to sit there and tell me how I am going to run the House. In my view, it is unbecoming conduct. I order that the bell be rung for two minutes and then we go to Division.
Do we have the threshold, Chief Whip?
Order Senators! It appears that we do not have the threshold. We can ring the bell for another two minutes. Ring the bell. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. Considering the precedence that has been set and the seriousness of this matter, am in order to request that the vote for the Third Reading for the two Bills be postponed to the next day, that is, Tuesday?
Right now we are dealing with only one Bill. We have gone up to the proposal. I have put the question on The National Honours (Amendment) Bill. We cannot be talking about two Bills.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, on behalf of Sen. Madzayo, am I in order to request that you use your discretionary powers and considering that precedence had already been set, that we postpone the voting on the Bill to the next day of our business which will be Tuesday, next week?
It looks like we have to do so because it would be futile to go to the vote without the requisite threshold. I know we can vote and lose the Bill. I think that is what we should do considering that some Members who were here have walked out in the middle of the voting. As I have always said, voting is either way; you can vote “yes,” “no” or “abstain.” Maybe walking out is a vote. In fairness to the Committee that came up with the Bill, it is imperative to defer the voting to Tuesday, 11th November, 2014 at 2.30 p.m. It is so ordered. We are now going to deal with The Public Procurement and Disposal (Amendment) Bill and we are going to pursue the same route. Hon. Senators, there is a Bill that we still have to deal with and which might go to voting. I would request that you give it a little bit more time. If you look at the Order Paper, Order No.8 on the Public Finance Management Bill, the National Honours (Amendment) Bill and also on the Public Procurement and Disposal (Amendment) Bill, it would be futile to go into voting now because even as I am talking, Members are walking out which means that we cannot sustain the numbers. So, I am going to defer Order No.8 until such time that the Rules and Business Committee (RBC) reinstates the same on the Order Paper.
This is an interrupted debate and when we adjourned, Sen. Omondi had eight minutes. I can see she is not here. Could the Clerk-at-the-Table open the screen so that I can follow what is going on? We resume debate now. I see no requests from the Floor.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, thank you very much----
There is a point of order from Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr.
On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. There is a school that has been watching us for the last one hour and we have not recognized them. Would I be in order to suggest that we recognise them?
From where I am sitting, I cannot see the school unless the Clerk’s desk gives me the details, I would not know, but that is an important point of order. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Hon. Senators, there is a short communication from the Chair before Sen. Kagwe proceeds with the date. I wish to recognise the presence of pupils and teachers from Moi Forces Academy from the County of Nairobi who are visiting the Senate. On behalf of the Senate and on my own behalf, I extend a warm welcome to the pupils and teachers from Moi Forces Academy and wish them a happy and fruitful visit. By fruitful, I mean that I hope that they will learn something from the Senate this afternoon. As somebody said earlier, we are moulding Senators for the future by having such young students and their teachers in our gallery this afternoon. Sen. Kagwe, you may proceed.
Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, from the outset, I rise to support the Bill and congratulate Sen. Elachi for bringing it to the Floor of the House. I also wish to take this opportunity to congratulate the Director of the National Youth Service, Dir. Githinji, for the work that he has introduced there and making it useful to the organization and the country. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, Kenya is a fairly indisciplined society. The issue of a disciplined society begins with building a conscience for oneself which makes you believe that it is always the right time to do the right thing. Even this Senate, when you look at us and see our behaviour, you can see we are indisciplined and we represent an indisciplined society. The reason why I am saying this is because we have just seen an example of indiscipline. It is good for us to criticize ourselves because the nation is watching us and seeing our performance. It is important for us to appreciate, as elected leaders in the National Assembly and elsewhere, we are not doing Kenyans a favour. We are being paid to be here by Kenyans. We are being paid to be in the National Assembly and to be in the county legislatures. Sometimes, elected leaders act as if we are nominated, volunteers to do work for Kenyans. From the outset, I would like to say that we are not volunteers, but employees of the society. If the National Youth Service (NYS) training can inculcate some sense of discipline in those people so that they can grow up to be different from this age that we today, I think it will help Kenyans very greatly. I want to encourage that the NYS be expanded. I also want to encourage and congratulate the President for his initiative to have this national youth training started in our nation. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, if you look at our disciplined forces like the military, it is, probably, one of the few disciplined and conscientious institution that exist in our The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I stand right from the beginning to support the National Youth Service (Amendment) Bill, Bill No.26 of 2014 and to congratulate Sen. Elachi for; one, thinking about the youth and; two, for agreeing that without a youth, a country cannot have a future. If we do not do something about our youth today and find ways of instilling discipline, a sense of life and direction now, it becomes very difficult for them to operate properly when they become adults. It was in 1980s that a programme was introduced in Kenya to allow people who were joining universities to attend the NYS programme. Many students who joined the universities around the late 1980s had to go through that programme. This programme was interesting because it linked two aspects. It linked the intellectual and the technical aspects. The programme which was for a specific group ended. However, many people remember that time with a lot of joy and realisation that there were certain values that they learnt. There were people, for instance, who came from elitist groups who had not had a chance to do manual work and to see what they were capable of. There were aspects of technical expertise that would be given to the recruits at that time so that they could learn different things in agriculture, sewing and about anything so that when they came out, they could do something for themselves. I think the most enjoyable part in that programme was the resilience that it built in the recruits. The young people; men and women, used to wake up at 5.00 a.m. and at times would run for long distances. Initially, they would run from Naivasha and they were expected to run all the way to Gilgil. At times, the run would be extended to Nakuru. They would start by climbing one hill, but they ended up climbing three hills. When they started, they thought that they would not do it. However, they did it and realised that they came out stronger and resilient. If such a programme is coupled with elements of patriotism and this is given in a context that makes these young people realise that they are doing it for the service of their country, then we will move on to a point where we can secure a future for Kenya. The way to secure a future for Kenya is to carry out these programmes at the level of the youth at a national context. That is why I am congratulating Sen. Elachi and support the amendment that seeks to have the NYS in each county. At present, the NYS is in much selected counties. We have it in Gilgil, Yala, Yatta and other specific places. However, if this was extended to all counties so that the The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Madam Temporary Speaker, this is a very good Bill. The author of the Bill must have researched and come to the conclusion that, as a country, there is need to take care of our youth. Everyone of us remembers the time the NYS was very effective. Graduates from the NYS were very productive people, very disciplined and respected. As the Government continues to strengthen the NYS in terms of financial and human resources, I see a very good future for our youth. I want to congratulate the Cabinet Secretary and her staff for having a focus on the NYS. The Government started taking students who were to join university to the NYS after the 1982 coup. The Government thought it wise to instill some discipline into students joining the universities so that they are more focused but after sometime, the training became militarized. They started becoming hardened and resisting Government rules. That is what led people like Mwandawiro Mganga to join other Kenyans in liberating other Kenyans from the one party rule. Madam Temporary Speaker, the graduates of the NYS, those people who had even trained as plant operators, drivers, painters, a good mechanic; when we talk of plant mechanics that is the big machines and even the small vehicles, these are people who have been tested. I can tell you that each and every employer who has tested those people are always asking where those people come from or where they went to school. Since we are now training our people, let us not just imagine that the only area they can go to after the NYS is to be police officers or to be employed in the security departments. There are other areas that they can equally contribute. On the issue of the plant or the mechanics, there are quite a lot of machineries with the NYS and new ones have been bought. Currently, they are doing a lot of water pans and small earth dams in the arid areas. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker, for giving me this opportunity to also rise to support this Bill. From the outset, I would like to applaud my sister, Sen. Elachi, for seeing it fit to bring this amendment to the NYS Act by amending Section 13 to devolve this unit to the counties. This will be a very good thing to do because we shall be devolving some of these services to what we think there are some security aspects of essential services like the police services and the national youth that should be taken to the counties. As we are aware, the NYS plays a very important role in this country, in vocational training for the youth and also in teaching some of these youth patriotisms and a sense of self-worth. I am sure that if this is devolved to the counties, we shall be empowering our youth out there, so, that they are not trained at just one place at a national level. We know that some of these youth have actually found themselves in the police forces, Administrative Police (AP) and also the armed forces. We know the number has not been sufficient, for example, in the year 2008, only 6,500 of the NYS members were recruited to join the armed forces. In the year 2010, only 2,550 were recruited. These are already trained youth and they should be given the first priority to get to the armed forces. Madam Temporary Speaker, I am an alumni of the NYS. I was there and I trained for one year in 1986. Some of the things that I learnt there up to today in terms of discipline, I actually apply them. It made me a more organised person. I hope that my friend Githinji, the new director, who I have a lot of respect and faith in, can actually revolutionise the NYS. He will look at the best practices that we have in the world. For example, in Israel, the NYS has been used by taking youths of between 18 and 22 years and conscripting them. They can work in the armed forces for two to three years. When they finish, they can go back into the Kibbutz system where they help in the farming or assisting farmers to learn best practices. Madam Temporary Speaker, Israel is not the only country where these best practices are applied. In the United States of America (USA), for example, the youth have been taught on how they can create new jobs for themselves, they have been taught new technologies and have been used for public education campaigns. I think that these best practices can also be brought here to Kenya so that we can have our youth participating in some these very best practices. However, as much as we are supporting that, the NYS should be devolved to the counties. I think that my sister Sen. Elachi will consider adding an amendment to this Bill that county governments, especially the governors, are involved in the recruitment of these youth and also that recruitment is not skewed by just the director deciding how they are going to recruit. Madam Temporary Speaker, I hope that in devolving these services, we are not going to devolve the youth service so that the Jubilee Government uses it as a way of scoring up against the CORD Coalition. I hope that this will not be used during the general elections by our opponents to score against us. I also hope that as we devolve these units, it will not be a way of encouraging corruption in this country. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Sen. Ong’era, do you wish to be informed by Sen. Elachi?
Temporary Madam Speaker, I always like being informed.
Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I just want to inform my dear, Senator, who is also the Minority Whip that, indeed, already the disabled and even the albinos were given forms in every county beginning this week. The NYS has ensured that they have been given an opportunity to apply. They have returned the forms. It is a better system where the directors themselves will look at the forms. This is a different NYS. We are trying to reform it. My sister should not get worried that the same young people will be used. They are being recruited all over the country.
Do you find that sufficient information for your contribution?
(Sen. Ongoro:) Yes, Senator, from Pokot, Prof. Lonyangapuo.
Madam Temporary Speaker, it is hon. Senator for West Pokot County. We do not have a county called Pokot.
Apologies, Senator for West Pokot County. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I rise to join my colleagues in supporting this Bill. In the same vein, I would like to congratulate the Mover, Sen. Elachi, for her thinking at the right time. There are a lot of innovative ways and changes taking place at the NYS. We need to come up with a Bill that can look at the country and the changes which are taking place there. It is four years since we got a new Constitution which created 47 counties out of the original central system. Therefore, we have 47 county governments in which the youth, as anticipated in this Bill, are growing in number. We have many youths that need to be considered and tapped. This Bill looks at introducing the amendment in Section 13 of the National Youth Service Act, where it is proposing to insert this new subsection which says that the NYS shall have a branch in each county. This is laudable. When the law comes into effect, it means that the NYS will have to budget, working in consultation with every county government to get land in every county for which sufficient land is going to be set aside for the purpose of building a proper branch for the NYS. We are not going to call it a county youth service; it is a branch of the NYS going by the names that will be identified from that county. There was a time in my county when we had a youth service camp called Lomut Youth Service, somehow it disappeared. I do not know what happened, yet they had come with a noble idea of planting fruits in Kerio Valley region. All the beautiful and nice mango fruits that were enjoyed those days and to date were introduced by the NYS at that time. In 1986, the Government came up with an idea of making the NYS commercially viable by introducing the Nyayo buses and so many other ventures that took place. There is nothing new that we are doing here. We are just improving on what had come at that time. My only worry is that as we are bringing the changes that we have seen being brought by Director Githinji who worked as an Under-Secretary in the Ministry of Tourism. The question is: Are the people working with him reformed? Are they the same people who brought down that brilliant idea that we are revisiting again several years later? It calls upon the implementers of the policies that have been introduced by the new Government in NYS that they must also reform. They have been given new buses and new machinery from China. I hope they went to China to train so that they can manage the machinery. It is important that a comprehensive syllabus is introduced to manage the system. In 1988 and before it was compulsory to go through NYS, there was no room for anybody to say no even if one was sick or had an accident. I am very happy to note that after three months of intensive training, almost everybody came out very healthy due to the rigorous training. Due to the challenges of sicknesses that Kenyans are going through because of our lifestyles, it is proper that we subject our bodies to rigorous training. Madam Temporary Speaker, there was also patriotic training during that time. Therefore, I am proposing that when they are preparing the syllabus they should look at 1965 documents that introduced NYS. They intended to make NYS a place where nationalism and patriotism was going to be imparted to the youth. As they mature and go to work, the youth became the model person we want. The kind of training at the NYS was of a disciplined nature. There is somebody who trained us at NYS and it was very The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Order, Senator. Use parliamentary language. Are they making noise or giving their opinion?
That opinion may not be very palatable and may almost look like noise.
Do not repeat unparliamentary language.
Madam Temporary Speaker, I withdraw and ask Sen. Ndiema that we should not touch Kitale Technical Institute. There is enough land in Trans Nzoia, including Agricultural Development Corporation (ADC) farms. You can appeal to the Head of State and be given a small portion of land to build a university from zero. I saw you have enough money to the extent that you have gone to buy a very tiny little hospital about one acre using a lot of money. Madam Temporary Speaker, I propose that we do a serious thinking on NYS to fill the gap where we have lost it. Look at our textile industries, we used to have 26 industries, but today we only have four. Where have the tailors gone to? We used to train them during the industrial training. The only hope we have now is the NYS. It is the only institution still offering these skills. We need to benchmark and work with India and China where we still have skilled labour. There are very many youths in this country and it would be proper if we put our mind into NYS. I was reading the Session No.1 of 1965, it says that since agriculture is the heart of the economy of Kenya, the NYS was supposed to go to some of the most remote areas to implement irrigation schemes. We had Bura Irrigation Scheme. I do not know what became of it. The Jubilee Government has come up with a very ambitious plan of irrigation one million acres between now and 2017, but who will be working in the canals? Who will be manning these big farms? These skills can only be found if individuals are properly trained. In my county, there are very many productive rivers. If we get the NYS to work with the Governor of West Pokot and other leaders, we can involve the youth actively. We have idle youth who have ended up in petty crime like the banditry in the north rift. We are asking the Government of Kenya to treat the idleness of the youth just like any other problem that has befallen Kenya in other part of the country. We should not use heavy force to the extent that we kill the youth whom we are supposed to renovate. I even proposed that since the NYS is recruiting tomorrow, the first people to be considered The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Senator, your time is up! Do you support?
Yes, Madam Temporary Speaker. I support.
Thank you, Madam, Temporary Speaker. I stand to support the amendment to this Bill because it is timely. The original idea of the NYS was very noble. Initially, the NYS did what it was supposed to do. We all remember the NYS in the 1960s and 1970s that constructed very many roads and bridges in this country. The NYS produced very many artisans and technicians for our young economy then. Some of us who had the opportunity to serve in Government remember very well the good products of the NYS in the form of very disciplined and hard working drivers, plant operators and even very good secretaries. If you got one from the NYS, you were very lucky. Over the last decade, something seems to have struck us. We do not put money or any emphasis in the NYS. Everything seems to have crumbled. Some of their properties were taken away and even the machinery has not been replaced and so forth. It is very good that we are now reviving this idea. As we are doing this, we should make sure that we do not fall into situations where we will digress again. I support the idea that with devolution, we should not only revamp the NYS as it was. but expand it to the counties. Indeed, this is in accordance with the Constitution which talks about equality, inclusivity and so forth. Therefore, I support this idea. However, we want this expansion, not only to be physical, but to impact on the quality of training that we will give to our youth. Today, there are many youth who are very energetic and patriotic. Some of them have completed Class Eight, but they cannot continue with their education in secondary school. We have others who have completed secondary schools, but cannot proceed for The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Not yet, Senator.
Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. We are talking about development; Vision 2030 and Millennium Development Goals (MDGs). We want to develop this country. However, we cannot talk about development if we are doing nothing about our youths, if we are not preparing our youth to face the challenges, if we are seeing our youths engaging in anti-social activities, if we are seeing our youths killing each other; whether in the name of illegal groups or cattle rustlers. I want to support the idea from my brother, Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo, that when it comes to recruitment, priority should be given to those communities that lag behind in terms of training and employment opportunities. In some countries, there is a policy that each and every family should have somebody working somewhere in the Government or in other organisation, so that not many employees are from one family and another family is starving. In that way, we will ensure that every family has at least somebody to support them. If we are going to recruit the youth, I would urge that the recruitment should be done right to the village level. Other arms of Government recruit at county level, perhaps, at the district level. However, I think that in this case, let us not complicate it very much because we are not looking for experts or scientists. Let us leave it to the village elders to identify because we now have structures in the devolved systems. We have the county, sub county, ward and village level. Let us allocate slots to the villages; let them be recruited and identified there, who is from a poor family, to be able to gain from this. When they graduate, let us follow up to ensure that they are at least in gain-full employment or they are self-employed, not only in Government, but in other sectors of our society. That is why I do not want it legislated that it will be for security forces. The NYS should be for all organizations that seek to recruit; whether they are private security companies, industries, construction firms or for security, but other jobs as well. I remember several years ago, there were a programmes called Kenyanization and Tripartite Agreements; where occasionally, perhaps, after three years, employers would be called and asked to recruit additional staff by consensus. They were able to take so many youths by agreement. We are not saying that we should force every company to take people, but we can persuade them to take our youth who currently have no jobs. Madam Temporary Speaker, this is a very good idea. We no longer have middle level colleges. They were all converted into universities. I have heard what my colleague from West Pokot said because he is benefiting from Kitale Technical Institute. This is a matter that we are currently debating and the county public participation will talk about it. We are looking at all options to ensure that we have a university in Trans Nzoia County. I do not know whether the Cabinet Secretary for Agriculture, Livestock and Fisheries together with the ADC can allocate some land to us to start a university. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.
Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker, for allowing me to contribute towards supporting this Bill. This is a type of Bill that should be coming to this House more often. There are some rules which are passed here, but they just go to the same custody where we put papers to gather dust. However, this one should be followed to the letter by the Mover to ensure that it is implemented. I am very particular when it comes to the youth because the NYS as it is now, developed from schools. Having been a teacher at one time; a headmaster for that matter, we used to teach skills of these kind of disciplines. However, what we get after that is after Form Four or Class Eight, majority of the standard eight pupils do not go to Form One. Next January, you will hear of 200,000 will not go to Form One. When the Kenya Certificate of Secondary Education (KCSE) results are out, you also hear the same story of about 200,000 students not joining universities. What happens to those who do not join institutions of higher learning? These are the ones who are supposed to be catered for by this Bill. This Bill is so significant to us that we should think as to how some of the countries in South East Asia, like China, feeds her population of 1.5 billion people when we cannot afford to feed 40 million Kenyans. I support.
Order Senator! Sen. Karaba, in case you had not concluded, you would have still remained with 13 minutes. However, you seem to have concluded. This Bill by Sen. Elachi seems to have generated a lot of interest from all Senators. Therefore, this is a Bill that is not timed. All Senators wishing to contribute will still have time to do so when it is next on the Order Paper.
Hon Senators, it is now time to adjourn the Senate. The business of the Senate stands adjourned until Tuesday, 11th November, 2014 at 2.30 p.m. The Senate rose at 6.30 p.m. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.