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{
"id": 196047,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/196047/?format=api",
"text_counter": 100,
"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Mr. Kajwang",
"speaker_title": "The Minister of State for Immigration and Registration of Persons",
"speaker": {
"id": 164,
"legal_name": "Gerald Otieno Kajwang",
"slug": "otieno-kajwang"
},
"content": " Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, first of all, I want to thank my brothers, Messrs. Ethuro and C. Kilonzo, who moved and seconded this Motion respectively. From the onset, I support this Motion. I have listened carefully to what our brothers and sisters have said in this House today. I will later ask the Speaker of the National Assembly to give me the complete HANSARD of this debate, so that we may use it as a basis of the feelings that Kenyans have about the reforms that they need in the registration exercise, so that my Ministry and the other connected Ministries may look at this matter wholesomely and deal with it conclusively for the interest of all Kenyans. Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, I thought that my brother, Mr. Ethuro was going to be much more imaginative and look at some of the limitations that we have in the current registration exercise. When the Registration of Persons Act was amended in this House in 1982, I happened to have come to this House as a listener. One of the salient points that were raised by the then Attorney-General (AG) was that the age of majority in Kenya is 16 years. That is the age at which an individual can make decisions. He can acquire property or sell your property. April 23, 2008 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 607 However, the age at which you acquire the Identity Card is 18 years. In fact, the age of majority is 16 years to the extent that you can decide to marry at 16 years old. At that age, for purposes of marriage, you will not be considered a child, but the age at which you take the identity card is 18 years. So, one of the hon. Members in this House rose from the other side, which was the Opposition. It was during the one party era, anyway, but he rose from the other side and asked: \"Why is there distinction between the age of majority and the age at which you acquire the identity card and the age at which you can vote? Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, the AG then gave an answer, which was not very satisfactory, to me, at that time. He said he thought that at the age of 16, although you can make certain decisions, you cannot quite make a decision to vote this way or that way. So, I was expecting my brother to bring something more radical to this House - maybe, he will do so, at another time - to say that we should actually register our people when they acquire the age of majority, which is the age of 16. At this age, they can do whatever they want to do; whether they wan to marry or acquire property, vote or travel. In fact, you acquire a passport at an earlier age, if you want to travel. At the age of 16 years, you can travel to any country. I do not know why a person who can go to a foreign country unaccompanied by his or her mother cannot make a decision whether it is Mr. Kajwang or Mr. Ethuro, he will elect. So, that is one of the things I thought we could bring up, but because it was not the subject matter of this Motion, I will leave it at that. I can see that the Motion has now made us talk about many other things that were not specifically in the Motion, but which I think are good. Maybe, we will not have another time to debate this subject, in a long time, until another Motion is brought here. Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, another thing has been raised, which to me, is very revolutionary. It has been brought by brother Shakeel. It is provided under Section 5(d) of the Act that some of the information you must give to the Registration Officer, when you are registering, are the following: Name in full, sex and the declared tribe or race. Note that the tribe is the \"declared\", and not necessarily the real tribe. Some people, like my children, happen to be both Luo and Luhya. They can decide which tribe they want to declare. But, really, why do you need somebody to say he is a Luo or a Luhya or Kikuyu? Why do you force him to choose between the mother's and the father's tribe? This is something which we can also debate in the larger context. What I have heard here seems to suggest to me that we need to get some committee to call people, listen to them and, really, come up with some of the issues that affect Kenyans on registration, so that we have a policy paper that can then guide us in bringing certain amendments to the Act. Another thing was brought up by one of our debaters, I am not sure which one, but he said that, first of all, if you register at home, your chief would know you. They always sign your application papers. Maybe, an assistant chief or pastor who knows you better, will sign your application papers and then you are registered. The application form is brought to the National Registration Bureau in Nairobi, where it takes ages to be returned to the district. In fact, last time, my district had a bigger problem. People had to wait for their identity cards for one year. Some people could not travel because they were still waiting for their identity cards. They could not apply for jobs because they did not have identity cards; for a whole year. When we were doing the system that we now have, which is computerised, we thought that we were computerising, so that ID cards can come out quickly. Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, I remember that when I lost my first generation ID card, which I took when I was at the university, I went down to Jogoo House, where there was a registration centre, and said: \"I have lost my ID card\". They asked me: \"Where did you take it?\" I did not even have the number of my ID card. I said: \"I took it at the University of Nairobi.\" They asked: \"Which year?\", and I mentioned the year. They looked at the black book. They found my name. Within a minute, I was told: \"Stand here. Take a photo. Sign here\", and at the corner, I got 608 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES April 23, 2008 another ID card. Officers were so efficient when we were doing it manually. However, now that we have computerised, it has become a big problem. In fact, if you were to go to the Registrar of Persons and ask for a replacement of an ID card, and they wanted to give you, they would just press a button. Your ID card, including your face, will be displayed on the computer screen. They can also press another button to print the ID card. So, they can give you the ID card in a minute or two. However, if you want to replace your ID, you will wait for one year. One of my brothers had to wait for one year and missed a chance to go to India. He was still waiting for his ID card. He lost one year of study. So, these are some of the bottle-necks that have been brought about by bureaucracy and centralisation. I think an hon. Member was right when he said that we should decentralise the issuing of ID cards. What is so wrong with issuing the ID cards there, anyway. I got my first ID card in Mbita High School. I got it within 30 minutes. The registration officials just came. They knew that I was Otieno Kajwang. They knew my father. They gave me the ID card. Within 30 minutes, I had my clean red pass. I pocketed it. I was happy to have that ID card until it was replaced. Now, it has become a little more difficult. Why? Because of centralisation and bureaucracy. They say it is because of security considerations. I do not think so. The chiefs represent the Government at the lowest level.They are officers of the Government and if you were to say you are a Kenyan and you are not, they know they can lose their jobs because their job is security related. Sometimes, I wonder why we have not appointed our chiefs because, as the Act provides, the Principal Registrar can appoint certain people as registrars or as registration officials. I do not know why he cannot appoint all our chiefs to be registration officials."
}