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"id": 223464,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/223464/?format=api",
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"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Prof. Kibwana",
"speaker_title": "The Minister for Environment and Natural Resources",
"speaker": {
"id": 277,
"legal_name": "Kibwana Kivutha",
"slug": "kibwana-kivutha"
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"content": " Thank you, Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir. From the outset, I want to thank my colleagues who have, very eloquently, supported this Motion. I also want to thank Mr. Ochilo-Ayacko for bringing this Motion before the House. I also want to admit, as a matter of public record, that from the Ministry of Lands, where I also sit, I know that public land, over the years, has been encroached upon by undeserving people. This Motion, therefore, is important because its spirit is to protect public land. I am in complete agreement with all my colleagues who have contributed without an exception and said that public land; whether it belongs to primary or secondary schools, village polytechnics, hospitals, health centre, religious institutions, et cetera, should be sacred, so that people do not go beyond owning private land and privatize public land. As an Acting Minister for Lands, I must emphasize that we must reverse privatized public land, so that it is used for the purposes that it was intended for, initially. Indeed, we have reversed the privatization of land, especially in settled schemes. We have ensured that those who took public land within settlement schemes, do not own it. That land must go back to the appropriate users, because one cannot use the law to illegally take over public land and then say that the law has vested to him or her a legitimate right, because in the first instance, private land cannot be enjoyed if it is not supported by public utilities. Therefore, I want to say today to all Kenyans, that where there is public land that has been taken over by certain people and made private, it will not matter that those people have title deeds, because public land is intended for the public and it supports those who have private land in a particular given area. Therefore, I am giving notice that public utilities can be reclaimed by communities in any part of Kenya, because they belong to the public and no individual can go beyond what has been allocated as private land. My Ministry is going to enforce this directive, because it is decent for people to know that they must have public utilities, so that we do not stay in places where there are no schools or health facilities. Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, I listened to hon. Khamisi and hon. Kaindi as they gave a chronology of episodes of public land which was taken away from a primary school or a university in Mlolongo. In the same spirit, like my foregoing remarks, all the people who took land belonging to the public university will be told that they acquired it irregularly, because it is public land. The same applies to the land grabbed from primary schools. In my constituency, for example, some people stopped a primary school from being built in a place called Nguu. Actually, they demolished it because they claimed that it was their land, yet, initially it was public land. So, we can see how daring land grabbers are. Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, the reason for the Government also charging public entities before they can get titles is because this same august House, has told us that the Ministry must collect monies by way of Appropriations-in-Aid. These are in the Printed Estimates. For example, this year we have to collect Kshs141,664,908. Parliament agreed that we should collect that money from the public, including levying appropriate fees on public utilities, particularly, when we are doing planning, registration, survey, conveyance and approval. So, I hope that Parliament, itself, will give us this money, so that we do not have to get it May 2, 2007 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 1043 from Appropriations-in-Aid. If Parliament does that, we will have no problem, whatsoever, in terms of implementing a Motion of this kind. But I want to plead with this august House, to know that currently we have been asked to raise money through Appropriations-in-Aid, so that we can provide certain services within the Ministry. If this money is not available, then we will not be able to do this kind of work. But this does not mean that we are not going to address the issue of plundering of public land by unscrupulous individuals. I will attempt to offer the solution, which I have discussed with hon. Ochilo-Ayacko. Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, because of the rampant nature of theft of public land, the Ministry is in the process of establishing an in situ Criminal Investigations Department (CID) unit, within the Ministry, so that it helps us in terms investigating issues of theft of land, which happens in many forms. This unit will help us identify cases of double registration of land and those who are involved. I must say that my Ministry officials have not been weaned from the culture that used to exist before, of aiding and abetting those who steal land. This is something that we are trying to resolve. That is why often we sack such officials who are part and parcel of this bad habit. Secondly, we also have the national symposium on land policy. Many of the issues to do with land problems are going to be resolved through that policy. When the proposed land policy is brought to Parliament for debate, I will seek the support of the hon. Members. Even if there are some issues that they are not happy with, they should be amended because we are very open, as a Ministry. The proposed land policy does not say that certain things must happen. It is open to debate, negotiation and compromise, so that for the first time since Independence, we can have a land policy that will assist us. Hon. Omingo talked about the university land at Kibwezi. The history of that, is that the natives or local people were removed from an area of over 12,000 hectares, so that, that land would be reserved for the university. The truth of the matter is that 12,000 hectares is a huge piece of land. During the past regime, land would be set aside for public purposes and then there would be change of users, and hence, some of the land would go into private ownership. That is why it has been seen that if 6,000 hectares are reserved for the university, then the people who were originally landless in that region can occupy 6,000. So, there is no insensitivity to the fact that a university is being established and having 6,000 hectares. There is no university so far which has that kind of land within Kenya. So, we are very sensitive when we balance the interest of a university and that of our people. This matter is being politicised because it is being seen as a way of courting voters and not promoting the welfare of the squatters. We are used to politicisation of many things. I do promise that in my watch in the Ministry we will make sure that public utilities are protected. That is why I would like to propose an amendment to this Motion that I have discussed with the hon. Member who graciously brought this Motion before the august House. The amendment reads as follows---"
}