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{
    "id": 263129,
    "url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/263129/?format=api",
    "text_counter": 107,
    "type": "speech",
    "speaker_name": "Mr. Munya",
    "speaker_title": "The Assistant Minister for East African Community",
    "speaker": {
        "id": 279,
        "legal_name": "Joseph Konzolo Munyao",
        "slug": "joseph-munyao"
    },
    "content": " Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, it is not about the Government but about those individuals. They do not want to let go. They want to continue deciding what project goes where and which money goes where and who gets what contract. They will not allow that power to go just like that. That is why you can see bickering and delays but this is inevitable. The Constitution says that that must be done. It is a matter of time and it must happen. Clearly, this Bill and the other Bills, on devolution that will come have been structured in the right way and I do not see any major problem with them. The issues that some people are raising, for example, the two key fora that are being created in the Constitution, I do not see how they are increasing bureaucracy. They are facilitating fora. They are fora that are intended to facilitate inter-governmental relations. This is because we have created many governments in the country and Kenya must still continue functioning as a country. If we do not have fora where these governments can meet and resolve disputes when they arise as they carry out their duties; if we do not have fora where they can facilitate projects that run across counties, for example, if a road is being done and one county wants it to pass this place while the other county does not want it to pass there, where else will they resolve the dispute? This is because both counties must approve for the road to pass there. The road will be serving several counties. Where will you resolve those disputes? So, we must have fora that can facilitate the overall vision because Kenya is still one country. We must have a national development plan and a national development programme that must also fit into the county governments. That is why these fora are very critical. I do not understand what you mean when you say that they are bureaucratic. They are bureaucratic because they are there to help move---"
}