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{
    "id": 263881,
    "url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/263881/?format=api",
    "text_counter": 245,
    "type": "speech",
    "speaker_name": "Mr. Orengo",
    "speaker_title": "The Minister for Lands",
    "speaker": {
        "id": 129,
        "legal_name": "Aggrey James Orengo",
        "slug": "james-orengo"
    },
    "content": "Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, Clause 18 deals with the issue of devolution. It provides that when the Commission deals with public land that lies within the counties in whatever way, there shall be what we are calling a “county land management board”, which shall consist of not more than nine members, which is a big number; to take care of diversity within the counties. This body shall essentially have ex-officio members but shall also have members who are nominated by the governor and approved by the county assembly. So, in managing public land in the counties, the National Land Commission will not be sitting in Nairobi and dealing with matters that affect public land out there. Such matters will be dealt with by the county land management boards. It will be this County Land Management Board. This has been a big criticism of how either the President, Minister or the Commissioner of Lands is dealing with land in Nairobi when the land is at the county level. However, at the county level, the people have no participation, or say in the manner in which that land is being given out. So, it cannot be said that there was no devolution. We also felt that we should go beyond the county level. In the Constitution we say the National Land Commission can organize and structure its work below the counties. They can go to the sub-counties and the wards. In many areas in this country, for example, in Siaya, you will find that what we may call public land is very minimal. In fact, in my location, there is no single piece of land that we can call public land. If you now replicate these boards up to the wards then you will be creating bodies that are there. However, the work will be minimal. On the other hand, the Exchequer at the national level or the county level will be burdened with payment of allowances and emoluments which are beyond the capacity of the counties. Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, the financial provisions in this Bill are standards. The way they conduct business and the way they appoint the secretary. This is all standard as has been with all the other Commissions. There are transitional provisions in Part 5 which are found on page 73. In fact, when this Act comes into force, what you are calling the Ministry of Lands which falls under the Commission of Lands will be completely abolished and cease to exist. The staff in that part of the Ministry of Lands will have to apply to the Commission and be vetted before they can be employed by the Commission. Again, this is to address the issues of past malpractices that relate to some of the injustices that people have suffered. The first Schedule is formation of a panel which will then appoint the members of the Commission. Again, that is basically standard. All in all, I recommend this Bill to the House. I think it is Bill that we can make better through amendments. I think that the National Land Commission Bill has been interrogated by the Commission on the Implementation of the Constitution (CIC), the Attorney-General and the Law Reform Commission who have put their minds as to whether or not there are any provisions that have breached the Constitution. I think that generally you will find that in this Bill there are no violations of the Constitution. Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, I beg to move and I ask Mr. Kimunya to second."
}