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"id": 47401,
"url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/47401/?format=api",
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"type": "speech",
"speaker_name": "Mrs. Odhiambo-Mabona",
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"speaker": {
"id": 376,
"legal_name": "Millie Grace Akoth Odhiambo Mabona",
"slug": "millie-odhiambo-mabona"
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"content": "Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, I beg to support this Bill. Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, in supporting this Bill, I want to say that I am happy that, as a country, we are looking at issues of inequality because if we do not equalize opportunities for all, then we will get the scenario that we had in 2007. We are witnessing many cases of violence as we speak now. Many of them are as a consequence of frustrations because we are in a country where inequalities are glaring. We have extremely rich and extremely poor people. I think we must find a balance as a country. We cannot have a society where all are equal, but if we have a society where there are persons who are completely without, then we are setting up ourselves for trouble. Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, in supporting this Bill, I want to make brief remarks in relation to some clauses. As we dealt with the Electoral Commission Bill, the issue of commissions and secretariats arose. I would want to suggest that when we are dealing with this Bill and other Bills, the Minister would guide the House so that a standard is established that applies across the board for all commissions. I know that we have had a problem where in a lot of commissions you have commissioners that are powerful and they get into a lot of conflict with the secretariat. There was an attempt when we were in Naivasha to deal with this issue by separating very clearly the roles of commissions and secretariats. I do not know if there is something else that we can do further by legislation to ensure that we do not have this conflict. It would not only affect the Independent Electoral and Boundaries Commission, but I think it is more glaring when you have the Commission because it does work that is very closely monitored by the country. Therefore, under Clause 4(2), maybe the Minister can think of a noble way of dealing with that issue because I know it keeps coming up. Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would also want to speak to another issue that has been running across most of the Bills that relates to commissions. I would want to also encourage the committee and the Minister that is looking into it, that when they will be dealing with these Bills that set up commissions, once they get a general trend, if they could establish it so that we do not speak to the same issue. One of the issues that keeps coming up is the issue of years of service. In this Bill and the others that we have dealt with, you will notice that we put 15 years for the chairman and 10 years for the members of the commission. It has come up in the IIEC Bill and on this one under Clause 15(1)(b) and others which I will not mention. So, if you could standardize all of them, we can enrich ourselves from the views that keep on coming from the Floor of this House. Even the other commissions that we have passed where they have reduced the time to take into account the youth who cannot be punished for excelling. There are people who have worked hard and they have excelled. They are committed and are doing excellent work. I keep giving the example of the CEO of Vision 2030 who has done an excellent job and is a young man. We have several such young men who have done excellent jobs in the past. We cannot punish somebody for excelling as a young person. Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, in Clause 7 on the issue of advertisement so that we do not want to find ourselves in the same problem that forced us to return a Bill for further amendment, it is good that now this Bill provides for advertisement using newspapers. But I think one of the things that we should be including is also advertisement through radios. I do not think there is anything that precludes us from advertising positions using radios. Sometimes people say if you are qualified, why would you not see newspapers? Surprisingly, the people who are qualified are the ones who sometimes do not read newspapers. Most Members of Parliament will tell you that they hardly read newspapers and that sometimes they read them when the deadlines have passed. Why? It is because they are very busy. Usually even if you are busy, if you are in a car, you will put on your radio and listen. So, let us also advertise. Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, I want to laud the inclusion of gender parity under Clause 7(2). Even though the Constitution provides, we must always indicate that because when we do not indicate, people forget. In that regard, I would want to encourage an amendment that very specifically indicates that there shall be gender parity in the panel. I want to talk about Clause 11. I want to make reference to Article 230(4) of the Constitution which indicates the powers and functions of the Salaries and Remuneration Commission. It says under âaâ the powers and functions shall be to: (a) set and regularly review the remuneration and benefits of all State officers. (b) advise the national and county governments on the remuneration and benefits of all other public officers. Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, when it comes to the issue of public officers, the Constitution is clear; it would be to advise. It shall not be to set and/or determine. So, the language should be amended to reflect the letter and spirit of the Constitution. I think that is the quarrel that the teachers have with that clause. When I looked at it, I realized that they have a point that we might actually be going beyond the constitutional mandate. A lot of people have spoken about the issue of independence of commissions. For me, I think we have a misconception about what independence constitutes. When we say that a commission is independent, it does not mean that it shall be a rogue commission. It basically means that it shall be able to exercise its mandate as provided in the Constitution without interference. It shall also exercise its mandate as provided by any written law. We, as Parliament, cannot be stopped from passing a law that would then allow a commission to exercise its mandate. But once we pass that law, we shall not then go to the commission and tell them how to exercise their mandate within it, especially if it is crafted within constitutional limits. I would also want to encourage that we need to include the aspect of public participation because it is weak in this Bill. Clause 16 talks about recruitment being competitive. I would want to encourage the Minister that, not only should the recruitment be competitive, but that it should be open. In the recruitment process of the Chief Justice and Deputy Chief Justice, for the first time, the country was able to witness transparency, honesty and openness in the interview. Through that process, the public had the opportunity to raise issues that are of concern to them. We do not want a situation where we say it is competitive, but it is behind closed doors; we do not know what goes on through that process. Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, one of the things that the Salaries and Remuneration Commission must do is to harmonize salaries in counties and in the national Government. The reason I am saying so, is that I noticed that when it was said that the nurses would be taken to devolved units, they were saying that they would not go there, because perhaps their salaries would not be the same as that of national Government. This notion that we have that devolved governments are local governments should not continue. I sat through the process of coming up with the Constitution in the Select Committee and I have been through the process of Bomas, really, there was never an intention of the drafters of the Constitution to give the local governments a new name. Devolved units are totally new government level. If you look at the Constitution, it says both the national and county level of governments shall be inter-dependent, but autonomous. Because of that, let us not have this notion that we are creating county councils. Devolved units are not county councils. They are superior and are meant to be new centres of economic growth for this country. Unless we get that clearly, then really we had no business coming up with a new Constitution. Why did people call for new devolved governments? They wanted new centres of growth. They wanted new centres of livelihood. They wanted new centres where people can get jobs. Their advice to county governments must be taken into account. Finally, I want to speak on the issue of vetting of public officers and State officers. I know this is one of the issues that has been bedeviled us, as a Parliament. The Constitution is very clear. It provides very standards in terms of some of those offices. Chapter 6 is also very clear in terms of what is required. However, we need to be clear between what is criminal and what is moral. The Constitution talks very largely to issues that are criminal in nature. Therefore, if somebody is involved in something that is criminal in nature, it is outlawed in the Constitution. But beyond that, those are matters of personal preferences. For instance, I, as a person, do not like men who wear suits and white socks. But I cannot, for instance, bar or challenge a person from coming to Parliament because they wear white socks with their suits. That is a matter of personal preference. Those who have white socks, I am sorry for you. With those few remarks, I beg to support."
}