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{
    "id": 555525,
    "url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/555525/?format=api",
    "text_counter": 282,
    "type": "speech",
    "speaker_name": "Hon. Ng’ongo",
    "speaker_title": "",
    "speaker": {
        "id": 110,
        "legal_name": "John Mbadi Ng'ong'o",
        "slug": "john-mbadi"
    },
    "content": "we believe are undesirable in our country. It is important that we are providing a law that will allow the Attorney-General (AG) to request other countries where foreign prisoners originate for transfer of the burden of keeping these prisoners and correcting them in their countries. Also, we will have an opportunity, as a country, to allow Kenyans who are imprisoned elsewhere in the world to be transferred back home, so that even their relatives--- Even if you are a prisoner, you still have a society; you still have connections with your family members whom you would like to meet once in a while when they come to see you in the prison. Therefore, looking at this Bill, and given that we are actualising the provisions of the Bill of Rights in the Constitution – these rights encompass the rights of even those arrested and imprisoned – we want to allow Kenyans to enjoy their rights even in prison. I am particularly concerned about the provisions in the Bill which give the AG too much power, in my view. We need to relook into this matter and determine whether we really want the AG to have these powers. Yes, a prisoner can ask to be transferred whether in Kenya or outside there. Parents, guardians or anybody connected to the prisoner can also request on the prisoner’s behalf. The State, that is the AG, can also request. However, the AG has got so much power to the extent of determining certain aspects of the procedure on transfer as an individual. Despite the fact that the AG is a legal adviser to the Government, still as an individual, he can easily abuse excess powers that are given to him. But I am happy that reference is made in the Bill to the fact that the AG has to refer also to the Cabinet Secretaries (CSs) responsible for various aspects; this will connect the prisoner to those Ministries. I am also concerned about the provision in the Bill that says that you can only be transferred if your case is not subject to appeal. For me, this transfer should not be conditioned on the possibility of appeal or otherwise. If the appeal succeeds, then wherever you have been transferred, you will still be released to enjoy your freedom, or you will still face a fresh sentence. We need to provide in law something that will still allow appeal to proceed; the moment you limit it, you deny these individuals their rights which are enshrined in the Constitution. Therefore, it is my wish that we relook into the provision that only those whose cases are not subject to appeal will be transferred. The other thing that I wanted to speak to, and which my colleagues have spoken to--- I want to also emphasise that for us, as a country, to even succeed in signing agreements with other countries to actualise the transfer of prisoners provisions, we must continue to improve and reform our prisons. Prison reforms have somehow stalled, in my view. We remember those days when His Excellency Moody Awori was in charge of prisons. We saw the prisons changing the way in which our prisoners were handled. Of late, we have started hearing of cases where prisoners even lose their lives; because of carelessness in the prisons an inmate kills other inmates. That to me is a clear case of carelessness in our prisons. We need to be careful about our prisons. Prisons are not death dens; they are places where we are supposed to correct bad habits. People change. There are people who have changed in this world. People who, initially, were not very good people have changed. Some people have gone through approved schools. I would not be surprised if I found someone in this House, an hon. Member who went through an approved school. That indicates that at one point that person did not have a very good character, but now that person is an hon. Member; I The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor."
}