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{
    "id": 603476,
    "url": "https://info.mzalendo.com/api/v0.1/hansard/entries/603476/?format=api",
    "text_counter": 107,
    "type": "speech",
    "speaker_name": "Hon. Ng’ongo",
    "speaker_title": "",
    "speaker": {
        "id": 110,
        "legal_name": "John Mbadi Ng'ong'o",
        "slug": "john-mbadi"
    },
    "content": "be understood that we seek information in trust. We do it based on delegated power by the people of Kenya. If Kenyans need information, they should get it. Hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, there are so many good provisions in this Bill. I do not want to go to the details because this Bill is literally allowing us to access information. There are instances where it has been very difficult to access information. The Waki Commission Report, which we debated the other day, is an example. It is a shame that we took several hours in this House debating whether a report of a Commission should be made public or not. That should be automatic. The passage of this Bill will make it automatic that if you have done anything using public funds, or you interact with the public as you run a private entity, you make any information in your possession accessible to Kenyans. This Bill will discourage people who are still living in the olden days like, for example, the Cabinet Secretary for Interior and Coordination of National Government, who wakes up one morning and feels that certain information needs to be classified as secret and, therefore, order the arrest of people who merely made public information that was already in the public domain. This Bill will help such people to understand that this country now allows for automatic access to information. If you want to deny anybody some information, the responsibility of demonstrating that it should be withheld rests with you. I have a problem with Clause 6. I know that Hon. (Ms.) Nyokabi had very good intentions in including this clause. As a matter of fact, there is need to exempt certain information from being disclosed to the public. I want to remind Hon. (Ms.) Nyokabi about the many problems that Kenyans went through – torture and other forms of atrocities committed against Kenyans in the early 1980s and 1990s – were not because there was no legal framework or laws, but because certain individuals in this country, who were dictators and autocrats by nature, felt that they could twist those provisions to their satisfaction. They used lack of clarity in order to frustrate Kenyans. Exempting certain information from being made public because its disclosure is likely to undermine the national security of Kenya looks noble, but the implementers and State public officers are likely to misuse it. An attempt has been made under Sub-clause 2 to clarify the disclosures that are likely to undermine the national security of Kenya. We have provisions for availing information relating to national security, including foreign relations and activities. I am aware that we have misused a Standing Order in this House which restrains us from adversely mentioning a country that is friendly to us, even if it is infringing on us. When we had issues with Uganda on the Migingo Island – issues which still persist – we raised that matter in the House. We were told that Uganda is a friendly country. I do not know how friendly a country is when its authorities are torturing your people. It cannot be a friendly country. It could have been a friendly country yesterday, but it is not today. I am afraid that if we leave those definitions the way they are, they may be misused. I am also looking at Part (e) which is the scientific, technology or economic matters relating to national security. When you zero in on economic matters, you might be told that even talking about corruption is talking about an economic matter that is likely to affect the national security. When you talk about the Euro Bond, for example, you may be told not to talk about it because it is going to compromise our national security."
}