Honourable Members, I have a Communication from the Chair on the passing on of the mother to the Deputy Speaker, hon. Dr. Joyce Laboso, MP. Yesterday evening, I learnt with deep sorrow that the Deputy Speaker, hon. Dr. Joyce Laboso, MP had lost her mother, the late Mrs. Rebecca Laboso who was born in 1936 in Kaminjeiwet Village in Bureti District, Kericho County. She was the wife to the late Fredrick Laboso. The late Mrs. Rebecca Laboso worked in various hospitals mainly in the then Kericho District before she retired to go into full time farming in Sotik alongside her husband. She was an ardent tea and dairy farmer and was one of the most successful farmers in Rift Valley. She won many prizes in the agricultural shows. She was respected in the community and served as a councillor in the Sotik Town Council in the 1970s. I am informed that she has been unwell since November 2012 and has been under medication. On the morning of 24th April 2013, her condition deteriorated and she was rushed to the Nairobi Hospital where she peacefully passed on at 1.00 p.m. We wish to visit the family of the Deputy Speaker on Monday 29th April 2013 from midday. The honourable Members who wish to condole with the family are requested to assemble at the main car park at 11. a.m. for transportation to the Deputy Speaker’s residence here in Nairobi. On behalf of Members of staff of the National Assembly, and on my own behalf, I wish to convey our heartfelt condolences to the family of the late Mrs. Rebecca Laboso. During this moment of sorrow, I wish them God’s comfort and strength. May the God Lord rest her soul in eternal peace.

Next Order!

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Next Order!

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I beg to give notice of the following Motion:-

THAT, this House approves the First Report of the Procedure and House Rules Committee on Amendments to the Standing Orders laid on the Table of the House on Thursday, 25th April 2013 and resolves that the amendments to the Standing Orders as approved by the House takes effect from 25th April 2013 and that an addendum be made to the Standing Orders to reflect the amendments.

Before the Leader of the Majority takes the Floor, I wish to draw the attention of the House to Standing Order No.44(2) which states: “During the Statements Hour –

(a) a member of the House Business Committee designated by the Committee for that purpose shall, every Thursday or on the last sitting day, for not more than ten minutes, present and lay on the Table, a statement informing the House of the business coming before the House in the following week;

(b) the Leader of the Majority Party, or the Leader of the Minority Party as the case may be, or their designees may make a statement relating to their responsibilities in the House or the activities of a Committee.” For today, if no Member has been designated, we request that the Leader of Majority will do the part in Paragraph (a) and further if he so desires present his report as provided in Paragraph (b).

Thank you, hon. Speaker, Sir. Pursuant to Standing Order No.44(1) and on behalf of the House Business Committee, I wish to present the business that will come before the House next week. The House Business Committee held a meeting on Tuesday 23rd April 2013 and agreed on various matters that are envisaged to appear on the Order Paper as business in the coming week. We had envisaged that the Committee on Selection would have completed the task of nominating hon. Members to serve on various committees that had not been formed. However, it is now apparent that in order for us to equitably and fairly participate in committee work, we have to increase the size of various committees. Without anticipating debate on this matter, I will be requesting hon. Members to support the Motion to approve the report of the Procedure and House Rules Committee that has just been raised on the Floor of the House.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Leader of the Minority Party, would you wish to make a statement?

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I do not wish to make a statement, but I rise to second.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move the following Motion:- THAT, this House approves the First Report of the Procedure and House Rules Committee on Amendments to the Standing Orders laid on the Table of the House on Thursday, 25th April, 2013 and resolves that the amendments to the Standing Orders as approved by the House takes effect from 25th April, 2013 and that an addendum be made to the Standing Orders to reflect the amendments.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, yesterday, this House appointed the Committee on Procedure and House Rules. Also, yesterday we received recommendations from the Committee on Selection that it will be extremely difficult for some hon. Members to belong to even one committee. Further, we also got information that many Members are quite interested and enthusiastic to at least serve in a departmental committee. We went through the work as a Committee and I want to thank the Committee because they sat until 9.30 p.m. in order to come up with the Report which we just tabled before the House. The Committee comprises 21 Members, six of them by virtue of the different offices that they hold. The Speaker is the Chairman. The Deputy Speaker, who was absent because of the issue we have been informed about, sent her apologies. We also have the first, second, third--- (Technical hitch) The Eleventh Parliament is different from any other Parliament that has been here before. We do not have the Executive in this House. We do not have Ministers and their Assistants. Therefore, all the committee positions that are available for Members are taken up by Members. Further, this House is larger than any other House that has been here before. We have 349 Members of Parliament. The slots are not enough for every one of the Members. We decided as a committee to pursue the recommendations by the Selections Committee to try and see ways of improving the numbers so that Members can participate effectively.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you, hon. Speaker. I rise to second this Motion and emphasize that the Committee on Procedure and House Rules considered the very important duty of each and every hon. Member seated in this House. Every hon. Member should get an opportunity to play an oversight role in all the activities that are conducted by different departments and ministries in this country. For that purpose, and knowing the large size of the House right now, the Committee felt that it is necessary to do recommendations in terms of the increase as was read by my good colleague who read the recommendations of the Committee. In addition to that, the Committee felt it necessary also to consider and bring before the hon. Members of this House the amendments to take care of the absence of our Speaker and Deputy Speaker. They might be away due to other public engagements out

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Hon. Members, if you look at the Order Paper page 18, it is good to remember that this is a Motion and debate on it is going to be limited in the following manner:- There will be a maximum of 60 minutes for the Mover to move the Motion; even though hon. Cheboi has said that he did not want to belabour the point, he explained sufficiently. There will be 30 minutes in replying, if need be. A maximum of ten minutes for any other hon. Member speaking, except the Leader of the Majority Party and the Leader of Minority Party, who shall be limited to a maximum of 15 minutes each and that priority be accorded to the Leader of Majority Party and the Leader of the Minority Party, in that order. I think the House is accordingly guided. I take it that the two leaders may not wish to speak to the Motion and, therefore, I give the first chance to hon. Peter Kaluma.

Thank you, hon. Speaker, Sir. I am Peter Kaluma, the Member for Homa Bay Town.

On the amendment to Standing Order No.18, strictly as a lawyer, I would like to suggest that instead of renumbering them as Standing Order No.18 (1) and Standing Order No.18(2), we adjoin the proposed amendment to the existing substantive paragraph by using the words “provided that”. That is the language we use in legal drafting.

Otherwise, I support the Motion.

But remember that we have a whole team of legislative drafters who are employed by the Parliamentary Service Commission. I would like to inform you that even that particular (Technical hitch). If you desire that, that should be the case you should propose an amendment. That is the procedure.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I am actually supporting that with a proposal that reads “all others subject to amendment”.

You should move an amendment so that the House can debate it in light of the Motion. Kindly approach the Table and you will be guided accordingly.

Most obliged, hon. Speaker, Sir.

Let me give this chance to Hon. Yusuf Chanzu.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I also rise to support this Motion. The new Constitution gave many responsibilities to all of us as a country including increasing the representation in the country. Although up to now I understand that some of the areas are not adequately represented, we should do what we can, including allowing representation by women and so on now. Because of that we should also prepare to accommodate it.

I thought that the Chairman or the Committee would have also considered ( Technical hitch) to 22 Ministries. When I compare what is in the Standing Orders with what has been coming out, I also thought of the fact that they should have thought of splitting these Departmental Committees. However, because we do not have time, that

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you, hon. Speaker, Sir. I rise to support this Motion. Within the limited time, we must congratulate the Procedure and House Rules Committee for having embarked on this important task of reviewing our Standing Orders. I am particularly happy that, at least, they have been able to pass necessary amendments so that we can have more membership in certain committees so that many of us find committees to serve in. But more importantly, I think Standing Order No.18 which has been violated in this House for quite some time, especially last Parliament because there was also a provision in the last Standing Orders, at least, will not be violated but we will live to its spirit. Since these Standing Orders were done towards the tail end of last Parliament, there is bound to be mistakes. I will only urge the Procedure and House Rules Committee, now that it has sufficient time, to do even much more to revise these Standing Orders.

I would like to point out that if you look at the finance section, especially the budget process of these Standing Orders I think it is contradicting the Constitution. It says that upon the House making a resolution on the Report of the Budget Committee, the recommendation for increase or reduction on any particular vote as resolved by the House will serve as notice of intention by the Chairperson of the Budget and Appropriations Committee to move the particular amendments on the concerned Vote in the Committee of Supply. This is contradicting what the Constitution says because it is very clear that once that report is passed in this House, then it should form part of the Appropriations Bill. Therefore, it should not just be an intention but it should be part of the Bill.

Standing Order No.241(2) also talks about documents but it should be explicit that the Finance Bill needs to be introduced in this House at the same time that the Cabinet Secretary for Finance will be giving us the Policy Statement highlights and revenue raising measures. So, the day that the Cabinet Secretary will be reading to us those tax measures, the law requires under the Public Finance Management Act that the Finance Bill is also introduced. This is not clear in our Standing Orders. Therefore, that clarity needs to be put because that is a very important provision of the law.

Finally, I think the Committee will also look at Standing Order No.242 among others so that all the provisions of our Standing Orders are in conformity not only with the Constitution but also with the Acts of Parliament which we have passed in this House. I know it is a task that requires commitment but I am sure that the Committee we put in place yesterday is up to the task.

Thank you, hon. Speaker, Sir. I support the Motion.

Thank you, hon. Mbadi. Given the fact that we have experts in some of those areas, we would also like to benefit from that as a Committee, if you initiated something under Standing Order No.263 which enables a Member with the support of 50 others to request the Procedure and House Rules Committee to consider an

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you, hon. Speaker, Sir. My names are Hon. (Dr.) Robert Pukose, the Member for Endebess. I want to thank the Procedure and House Rules Committee for the good work it has done. However, I want to point out a few issues. On the first paragraph of the proposed amendments to the Standing Orders, they are saying that, at least, each Member sits in, at least, two Committees; that is a Departmental Committee and the Public Accounts Committee or the Public Investments Committee. However, below the second paragraph, there are some exemptions and I think hon. Members sometimes when you get an opportunity to do some work, you should also avoid being a little bit selfish. This is because the Committee requested that the Committee on Selection takes cognizance of the fact that in allocating membership to committees such as the Committee on Selection, Appointments, House Business and Procedure and House Rules Committee, they are not as active as other Select Committees. Therefore, the Members who have been nominated to serve in such committees will not forfeit opportunity to be appointed to other committees. I think this is cleverly put in the whole amendment and it defeats the purpose for each of us belonging to, at least, two committees. If you are going to be in any of those committees, we said that each committee is as equally important as any other committee. So, when you bring in exemptions, it means that you are advancing a selfish agenda and, therefore, you want to belong to more than two committees for which amendment we brought. We could also model our Departmental Committees on the Ministries that have been created. So, instead of having 12 committees, we could have 18 so that we can work effectively. Otherwise, I rise to support the Motion. Thank you.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I rise to support the Motion and note that all this legislation that was passed before the new constitutional dispensation, as we speak now, is being amended to conform to the new constitutional dispensation. We also find that even though the Standing Orders have been drafted after the new Constitution, they did not take into account the fact that the House would have a wider membership. Now that we are 349 Members with different capacities that must be utilized in this House, it is important that these rules are amended so that each and every Member gets an opportunity to serve the people of Kenya whom we swore to serve when we sought the ticket to come to this House. I also find that the 15 men and women who sat in that Committee made a unanimous decision which is good. I commend them for working within a tight schedule and bringing these amendments to the House.

With those few remarks, I beg to support.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I rise to support the Motion and thank the Chairperson and Members of the Committee on Procedure and House Rules. I note with disappointment sections of the Press reporting that Members of this House wish to expand membership of committees in order to have avenues to further remunerations. This cannot be further from the truth.

This House represents only the fraction of the work of a parliamentarian’s civic and public duty. The public should be made aware and understand that this is just a tip of the iceberg of what a parliamentarians does in parliamentary duties. The work of committees as envisaged in the Constitution and the new Standing Orders is imperative

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, first, I rise to support this Motion but before that I wish to request for your guidance on an issue regarding the Standing Orders. Hon. Members of this House look excellent in the African wear, for instance, hon. Mwaura who is the Nominated Member for ODM. So I seek your guidance to know whether Standing Orders agree that hon. Members can appear in African wear in subsequent Sittings.

However, I rise to support this Motion requesting an increase in membership of committees. As most hon. Members have observed, we wish to take part in the proceedings of this country. When the President was reading the Cabinet Secretaries line up today, he noted that there are some key departments that many people wanted to be separate Ministries. One of them is the department of youth and women and the department of petroleum which people felt should not be part of the energy or mining. I would like to beg this House through the Committee of Procedure and House Rules that they should not only consider the Cabinet Secretaries but we can have departments that

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

The independent Member for Buuri, hon. Kinoti Gatobu, I suspect you have received a copy of the Speaker’s Rules, and you know where the issue of attire is; it is not part of this. I just invite you to go and read them. Since you are a young and energetic person, I am sure you will come and propose to the Speaker amendments, if you think they are necessary. I am sure we will look at them. I also want to invite you to consider that there is a Committee on East African Integration. It is in the Standing Orders. Hon. Eseli, when both of you are standing, it is difficult for me to give you a chance and also give it to the other hon. Member. So, please, let us allow the other hon. Members to also speak.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, Sir. First of all, I would like to thank the Committee for the hard work they put in at such a short notice. That should be a lesson to us as legislators to know that whatever legislation we put in should is for posterity and is not for expediency. That is why we are ending up amending our Standing Orders so often; this is very unusual in many parliaments of the world.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, the issue of the size of the committees should not worry the hon. Members because the committees are allowed to form sub-committees to deal with different departments in the various Ministries, if that is necessary. So, there is a way around it. I think that can be solved very easily. However, my main issue is on Standing Order No.205 and Standing Order 206, which provide for the Public Accounts Committee (PAC) and the Public Investments Committee (PIC) – the two oversight committees. You will notice that the Committee proposes to increase the numbers on those committees, which is all very good. However, these committees are oversight committees. I would have thought that the Committee on Procedure and House Rules would have looked at these particular Standing Orders. If the majority on those committees are going to be the ruling coalition members, then we are saying that they will be providing oversight to themselves, and that is not possible. Even if the chairman was to come from the minority, then such chairman would just be a figurehead. I think if we want to do justice to this country it would be wise, or prudent, for the committee to look at a way of amending that Standing Order, so that the coalition, or party, that is not in Government has the majority on that committee and the chairmanship. In that way, we would be able to provide proper oversight. This is important, and that is why I started by saying that when we make rules, or when we pass legislation, we should do so for posterity and not for expediency.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

On a point of order, Hon. Speaker, Sir. Is the hon. Member in order to mislead the House that if an oversight committee is dominated by the coalition that is in the Government will not be exercising oversight? I think it is only in order to inform the House that an oversight committee is a committee of the House and the oversight that, that committee provides is not oversight over the Legislature, but is oversight over the Executive; none of the hon. Members of this House is a member of the Executive. It is, therefore, in order for the ruling coalition to be dominant, and to actually have a majority; we really worked hard to be the ruling coalition; if they did not work hard, that should not be brought to us in this House. We are in order to dominate that committee, and, therefore, the hon. Member should not be misleading the House.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, as it is a point of order, I guess I have got a right of reply. I think as I started---

No! Dr. Eseli, you do not have a right of reply. On a point of order, it is for the Speaker to rule whether it is in order or not in order. You know that since you have been here long enough.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, with your indulgence---

Maybe, with the sympathy of Hon. Speaker, but I do not seem to sympathise with you.

I think it would have been good if you sympathized with me.

Let me hear the hon. Aluoch.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, while I congratulate my learned friend, hon. Cheboi and his committee for presenting this Motion, I think it is important for the House not just to say in general terms that our Standing Orders are grounded in the Constitution; it is for the House understand specifically that Article 124 of the Constitution gives this mandate to this House, so that the business of the House is conducted according to the Standing Orders.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, this is a right given by the Constitution, and I would urge all of us in this House to guard it with jealousy and ensure that nobody else outside this House takes away any part of this right. I say so because many of us should be aware that the Salaries and Remuneration Commission (SRC) has attempted, in their legal notice, to restrict the number of sittings this House can have. That is my view. It is illegal, unconstitutional and at the right time we are going to address it exhaustively. For now I wish to reiterate what hon. Dr. Eseli has said. In any modern society, or democracy, the majority cannot oversees itself. It is just logical and I wish to urge hon. Cheboi and the Committee on Procedure and House Rules to go back and look at these two oversight committees; let them find out if really there is any need to amend these rules so that the

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you so much, Hon. Speaker, Sir. Some people may wonder why my name means a goat, but it is mine. At least I have caught your eye. I wish to congratulate you very sincerely for being elected the Speaker of the National Assembly. I congratulate your deputy for making history by being the first lady to be Deputy Speaker of this House.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, besides that I should also thank the Tharaka people for allowing me to serve them in the two republics – the one before the promulgation of the Constitution and the second one after the promulgation it. It is a great honour that they have bestowed upon me. May I also congratulate the Procedure and House Rules Committee for the good job that they have done; they even sat into late at night. Of course, this shows that the Members of Parliament are able to work within very tight timelines and achieve what this country may want us to achieve.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, the idea of increasing the number of membership of the departmental committees is so crucial and nice. In this House there are so many professionals from different fields; for some of them, this is the first time the culture of Parliament has allowed to them to use their curriculum vitae to apply for membership of these committees. It is necessary that we tap the potential of professionals at the particular committees.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, but I have a suggestion. We know already we have the structure of the Government that has already been provided to us and. It is, therefore, my wish--- Let me request the Committee on Procedure and House Rules, that they, probably, try to align the departmental committees to the current structure of the Government, so that there are no problems when the committees are performing their duties. I will give an example. The Departmental Committee on Trade is grouped with Foreign Affairs, but in our committees it is grouped with finance, trade and commerce. Therefore, it is necessary they try to align these committees to the current structure of the Government. This will enable us to hold our Executive, or the Government, accountable.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, Sir. I support.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, Sir. I rise to support the work of this Committee. We reached a dead end and that is why we came to you and your Committee to bail us out. As you know the work of this House from now on will be dependent on committee reports. So, it will never be possible to have half of the House sitting in meaningful Committees and a majority really not being anywhere, or sitting in committees which are of no value. I want to appeal to our whips on both sides that we look, in order to engage Members, at committees in a way so that each Member gets an opportunity to serve on a busy Committee. This is because that will be work of a committee. Hon. Speaker, Sir, I have been talking to a lot of Members. I think an induction would have sufficed particularly in regard to the role of Committees. When many Members here the word “appointment” they think they will have an opportunity to

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

On a point of order, Hon. Speaker, Sir. I think the hon. Member is misquoting the Leader of the Majority Party who we know belongs to the Jubilee Government. He belongs to CORD! The Leader of the Majority Party has a right to say that the Jubilee Government is going to appoint the Cabinet because he is part of it. That is my understanding. So, Jubilee Government is going to appoint the Cabinet and for sure it did that this week.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, you can tell. I said from the onset that some induction is necessary because the role of Parliament is to oversight Government. So, when Parliament purports to have the power to appoint then it will be wrong particular if it is coming from the mouth of the Leader of the Majority Party. He is the person entrusted with the duty of oversighting Parliament in front and not from the back. We are going to be seeking your guidance with regard to three Committees of oversight because it is important for our role as people in the minority. The first one is Standing Order No.206 which has been alluded to by hon. Dr. Eseli and it is on PIC and PAC. We get the sense, arising from the point of order you just allowed--- She said that they have the majority. This is a tyranny of numbers. The tradition of this House is such that in the Seventh Parliament Jaramogi Oginga Odinga only had 31 Members of Parliament, but had one person majority when he chaired PAC. In the Eighth Parliament hon. Mwai Kibaki had less Members, but he chaired PAC with one person majority. In the Ninth Parliament, Uhuru Kenyatta chaired PAC. Hon. Speaker, Sir, you also chaired the Public Investments Committee on behalf of the Leader of---

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

On a point of order, Hon. Speaker, Sir. I think there is something wrong. The hon. Member who has just been contributing has been trying to go round issues which are clearly written in the Standing Orders. If you go to Standing Order No.206 and even 205, it states that when the Public Accounts Committee and the Public Investments Committee sit they are the ones to elect their own respective Chairpersons and Vice-Chairpersons. Unless these Standing Orders are amended, we cannot go against that. We have the House rules and procedures which should guide us in these things. Let us first read the Standing Orders before we argue. Is he in order to continue misleading us?

Hon. Speaker, Sir, hon. Capt. Wambugu who is also the MP for J.J. Kamotho is my friend, but he has not taken his time, or he has not been here long enough, or when he was here, probably, he was asleep. There is something called “the House being run by traditions.” That is why I mentioned Jaramogi, yours truly Hon. Speaker, and others. You need to guide this House because we seem to be threatened by the tyranny of numbers in a way that will guide this country in the wrong directions. I am talking about equal plus one. Hon. Speaker, Sir, you have chaired such a Committee. You were very effective when you chaired the Public Investments Committee. So, there is one other watchdog Committee which is very important. The Executive cannot do budget and approve its own budget. In any case, in the Committee if they do not get their way, they have the tyranny of numbers on the Floor. They can come and overturn the work of the Committee. We beseech you. I know you, Hon. Speaker, Sir. We have walked world over tryign to implement this Constitutin. Kenyans are looking upon you to give guidance. Hon. Marende did the other one. This is going to be your moment. What you need to help us with--- These three watchdog Committees, you must make---

I am looking for a person who has not spoken. Hon. Joel Onyancha! He must have been upstanding! The hon. Joel Onyancha. Let me point out this: The fact that I am saying I want pick out on a Member who has not spoken before, and then you have been relaxing on your seats--- There are others who have been up on their feet! We must have the equity with clean hands.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I want to associate myself with hon. Members who have spoken before on this Motion and congratulate the Committee for coming up with these proposals. Obviously, we are now going to be more in Committees. Being more in numbers affords us an opportunity to be matched properly in our professional abilities and competencies. This will also play into space for committee meetings. Hon. Speaker, Sir, given the fact that you are still doing some renovations in Parliament, we expect Members to have a place where they can work, given the enormity of work that is now bestowed in the Committees. I want to agree with one hon. Member who has said that Parliament makes laws. It is really the guardian of the Constitution on behalf of the Kenyan population. There has been a move to gag Parliament from sitting; when it can sit and what benefits can accrue from those sittings. I want to urge the House to be stern and protect its rights to legislate and come up with its sittings so that it can

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you hon. Speaker. My name is Patrick Wangamati, nominated Member. Many hon. Members here have heard me being referred to as one of the elders in this country. I want to take this opportunity to congratulate you and your Deputy for having been elected to lead this House. I did not vote for you hon. Speaker, but I voted for the Deputy Speaker.

I supported the Deputy Speaker because I believe in gender. I do not know how other hon. Members view you but to me, within a very short time, you have proved that you are the best choice for us. I rise to support this Motion because it is very important. I also want to commend the Committee for taking these timely measures. We have shown others that we are not slow. But we are catching up with time because our executive President is a time- conscious leader. Hon. Speaker, I want to be very brief. The House Committees are very important in this Eleventh Parliament. We want the Committees to be focused because there are very many things that have gone wrong in this country. This Parliament must get on its feet to correct them. We have income-generating projects in this country which have been mismanaged. Most of them have either stalled or collapsed. Those projects could be the life-line to jobseekers. Due to that mismanagement, some people who were employed have lost their jobs. The hon. Members who will be appointed to those committees should be focused. They should be able to punish corrupt officers and stop the mismanagement and wastage of resources in this country. Those who are involved in that menace should be punished heavily. Thank you, hon. Speaker, for giving me this opportunity to contribute.

Thank hon. Speaker, for giving me this chance. I am hon. Bett Bernard from Bomet East Constituency. I take this time to join my colleagues to congratulate you and the Deputy Speaker for having been elected to your positions in the Eleventh Parliament. I also take this opportunity to thank the great people of Bomet East for electing me to represent them in this honourable House. I want to give credit to the Procedure and House Rules Committee for the wonderful work it has done. It has factored in the number that we have in this House so that we can have as many of us as possible joining this Committee. That way, we can give our contributions in the Committees. I want to say that the Republic is looking up to us to ventilate through the variety of issues. We want to avoid guesswork and other problems. We should have as many hon. Members as possible in Committees. I believe in the diversity of hon. Members and having many of them in the Committees will lead to quality contributions.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, Sir. It was said here a day ago that some Members are trying to come to Parliament through the backdoor but I am lucky I do not see any backdoor here. My names are hon. Joe Mutambu from Mwingi Central.

I rise to support the Motion with some advice to my good friend, the Chairman. He said that they will appoint Members to various Committees according to their profession. I would like to inform him that we are here to make laws and all of us are not lawyers. The first person to invent a bicycle did not know how to ride it. So, you can appoint Members to any Committee provided that they are elected Members of Parliament and I can guarantee you that they will discharge their duties in those Committees irrespective of their level of education or their profession.

There are hon. Members who do not have my degree and you cannot say that you will not appoint them to this Committee. I urge him to look at Members of Parliament and not to professionals because we are all Members of Parliament.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, let me take this opportunity not only to congratulate you for being elected the Speaker of this House but also to thank the Members who elected you because they chose well. It was a good decision to choose you. I want to believe that you will show leadership in this House. I like the way you conduct yourself because running the House is not easy.

I also want to contribute to the problems facing the Members of Parliament. I did not get a chance to contribute to the Presidential Address but with your permission, I would like to say that we should be united when we are discussing matters of national unit.

Thank you very much, Hon. Speaker, Sir.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, Sir. First, I would like to congratulate you for being elected the Speaker of this House. Secondly, I would like to remind my colleagues in the CORD Coalition that all of us went to elections on 4th March. It is through the tyranny of numbers that you have found yourself here. You got that certificate because you had more numbers than your opponent. I would like to remind the House that you are Hon. Speaker because we had an election that involved two candidates and you won. So, we the Members of the Jubilee Coalition were given the mandate by Kenyans to implement the Manifesto that we campaigned on. We are all duty bound, being Members of the Jubilee Coalition, to make sure that we implement all that we promised Kenyans. This is because Kenyans decided that it is time for the Jubilee Coalition to move this country to the next level. Even in those Committees, we must be the majority to make sure that the Jubilee Manifesto is fully implemented. So, we have a responsibility as hon. Members to make sure that all that we promised Kenyans back at home is achieved through hook or crook.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

On a point of order, Hon. Speaker, Sir. In this House, you can be very emotional but very passionate and we are entitled to our ignorance. However, is it in order for the hon. Member to say that we can do things by hook or crook?

We may not do things by hook or crook because the House has rules and procedures!

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I apologise to the House. However, emanating from that, I would like to say that we have a responsibility. I took the oath before the Speaker and the House. I declared that there are some duties that my colleagues in the Jubilee Coalition and I must accomplish. I want to remind hon. Members that we are duty bound even if we go to the Committee. We will make sure that we work for Kenyans and not for a particular tribe. So, I urge the senior Members, with all due respect to note that, the slogan “tyranny of numbers” amounts to incitement and it should not happen.

What should happen is that we should ask our ladies back at home to put aside the family planning methods so that you have the numbers so that next time--- If we perform well, the first 10 years should be for Uhuru Kenyatta, then the next 10 years for his Deputy President and the next 20 years for the Jubilee Coalition.

Thank you very much.

What is wrong with this man? He should not speak like that!

Hon. Members, this is just for the guidance of the House. The Motion before the House reads “That, the House approves the Motion”. If you read the Standing Orders, you will see something about relevance. Please stick to that. Let me hear an hon. Member who has not spoken.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, Sir. My name is hon. Mustafa Idi. I am the Member for Parliament for Kilifi South. First of all, I would like to join other Members who have spoken before me in congratulating you and your Deputy for having been elected to your respective positions.

I would also like to take this opportunity to thank the people of Kilifi South for having bestowed their trust in me, and electing me as their first Member of Parliament in this new constituency.

On the Motion, I do not think that increasing the number of members in this Committee will add a lot of value to the work which we are supposed to do. Instead I think splitting the Committees and clustering Members of Parliament according to their profession and strength will work on our side.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I have also listened very keenly to contributions from hon. Members who, while contributing to various Motions, have said that part of our mandate as hon. Members of Parliament is to help the Executive to minimize the wage bill. I am very sure that increasing the number of members in this Committee will not in any way increase the wage bill, but we have proposed to reduce the number of Commissioners in

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Hon. Members, Hon. Mustafa had the sympathy of the Speaker and so we did not want to remind him about the rule of relevance when he delved into his area of specialization. However, I would like to plead with hon. Members that if we stick to--- Let us look at the Motion before us because we still have some more business. So if we think that we have exhausted this Motion then you can ask the Mover to reply.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, finally! I have been changing ties everyday and it looks like the black one has worked today. I bring you the greetings of the people of Nambale and my own on your election and your colleague’s. Since I had not spoken, allow me to indulge a bit as my Maiden Speech and protect me from any interruption. A very important thing is that when the President was in the House, he aimed to achieve a double digit growth during his term of Office. A double digit growth is going to require the role of the resources in this country wherever they are to be put to maximum use and for us the people of Busia and Nambale particularly, I was pleased to hear the increase of deepening the value chain. I pray that

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

On a point of order, Hon. Speaker, Sir. Given that we have prosecuted this Motion exhaustively and hon. Members are becoming repetitive, I beg that under Standing Order No.95(1) that the Mover be called upon to reply.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

It looks like there is still some interest; let us hear a few hon. Members. I would then urge that we stick to the Motion.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, Sir. As I rise to support this Motion, I would like to direct hon. Members to Article 94(4) of the Constitution of the Republic of Kenya that mandates Parliament to be the only state organ with the responsibility of protecting the Constitution, and also promoting democratic governance of this country. To that effect, the manner in which we conduct ourselves in the House and conduct the House business is very important. To me, it will be necessary not to overcrowd the committees but expand them in line with departments of the Government so as to provide the proper checks and balances.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, there is also a trend in the House by which we may abdicate our roles as one of the state organs in the belief that we belong to one coalition or the other. While in Parliament the oversight role we are going to play is going to help the Government of the day in conducting itself and serving the country. So, to us it does not matter whether we are in Jubilee or CORD, because at the end of day you will realize that I am in CORD, but I am closer to State House than you who is in Jubilee.

So, when we are contributing in this House, it is very important that as hon. Members we support the Government of the day where it is doing right. Where it is going wrong we should oppose it vigorously for the sake of the citizens of this country.

I beg to support.

Could you tell us your name please?

I am hon. Silvance Osele Onyango, Member of Parliament for Kasipul Kabondo Constituency.

Thank you. The hon. Member next to you.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, Sir. I have been here since we were sworn in and I have never had an opportunity. My names are David Gikaria. I am the Member of Parliament for Nakuru Town East Constituency. Allow me to take this opportunity to thank God and the people of Nakuru Town East Constituency for having given me an opportunity to come and serve them in this very honourable House. I also want to take this opportunity to thank you and your deputy on your election to the positions of Speaker and Deputy Speaker respectively.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I have heard you talking about relevance, but allow me, this being my maiden speech, to talk about something that was talked about during the debate on the Presidential Address. It is about the housing issue. I think the President made it very clear--- As you know, since the violence of 1992 the people of Nakuru have been migrating and housing has been a problem. I want to thank you for when you were making your speech upon your election you made it very clear that the Tenth Parliament passed very many governance laws that were supposed to check the Executive; I think it is our responsibility now to take your advice and concentrate on the socio-economic laws that are going to transform this country from where we are right now.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, secondly, my point is about the issue of the Internally Displaced Persons (IDPs). If you look at Nakuru County, we have almost four camps and

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

On a point of order, Hon. Speaker, Sir.

Give me a minute, please.

Proceed, hon. Gikaria..

Hon. Speaker, Sir, thank you for coming to my protection.

You can see how hon. Cheboi and his team, and through your able chairmanship as the Speaker, have come up with these amendments. In fact, I think the President must

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

No; it was the late hon. Achieng-Oneko.

Yes, hon. Achieng-Oneko; not Ochilo-Ayacko. I am sorry. Since then we have never had a Member of Parliament from the Opposition. We are asking the President to remember Nakuru County this time round, but---

Let us hear the Member for Nakuru Town East.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, Sir. The Motion is good. I want to thank the Chairman and his team for the good work. Hon. Speaker, Sir, you were advising that if a Member wants to bring an amendment he has an opportunity under the three options that we have been given by the Chairman of the Procedure and House Rules Committee. If you want to bring an amendment with regard to the two Committees, hon. Wambugu has made it very clear. The laws are clear. If they want they can bring an amendment and then mobilize their troops to have that amendment pass. As it stands now the rules are very clear. Hon. Speaker, Sir, when we came here first you told us that this is a House of rules. I never heard you telling us about traditions. If we have now to turn to traditions then as new Members we are going to get confused. I would like to support the Motion.

On a point of order, Hon. Speaker, Sir. As much as we are cognizant of the fact that we have very many new Members, and that is why those of us who are older are exercising a lot of restraint, especially when hon. Members are giving their maiden speeches, would I be in order that the Speaker do guide Members even in their maiden speeches, which, out of decorum and practice, we cannot interrupt. They are still obligated to follow the rules of the House. If they do not know them, the Hon. Speaker needs to guide them; they should not use the opportunity they have to make their maiden speeches to abuse the rules of this House.

Well, you have spoken in generalities, hon. Odhiambo-Mabona. We needed, perhaps, you to pinpoint the specific abuse. However, since the hon. Member has even completed speech---

On a point of order, Hon. Speaker, Sir.

Hon. Ababu, the Speaker is speaking. If the Speaker is going to be stopped by a Member claiming to be on a point of order then there will be no order in the House.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, my names are Junet Mohammed Nuh. I am the Member of Parliament for Suna East, Migori County. I rise to support the Motion, but before I get to that, having been a mayor for five years, I wish to request my fellow former councilors, who have come to this House, not to transfer the tragedies of the former councils to the National Assembly.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, Sir. I can actually say that finally I caught the Speaker’s eye. I have been standing for the last four days without getting an opportunity.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

I will give the last chance to a Member who represented this Country in the recently concluded Boston Marathon, the hon. Member for Cherangany Constituency.

Thank you hon. Speaker. First, of all, let me say I am honoured to have been given an opportunity by God, to first of all represent my constituency in this House, and secondly to be able to represent my country and you all, as members of Parliament, at the just concluded Boston Marathon.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Hon. Members, considering the mood in the House, I want to call upon the Mover to reply, so that we can go to the next business. There will be an opportunity for Members to contribute another day when this business will appear on the Order Paper.

Thank you hon. Speaker. I want to start by saying that to have hon. Aluoch, Ng’ongo, Dr. Eseli, all supporting a particular Motion, is not a mean task. I want to start by thanking hon. Members very sincerely for giving their input because, really, I

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

That is overtime!

Hon. Speaker, Sir, it is a sacrifice. So, this is basically good for the country. It is also good for Parliament as an institution. I think we must encourage Kenyans to look to Members of Parliament with some respect because they work extremely hard. Look at the Tenth Parliament, for example, which you and I were unlucky to be in. They really worked hard and passed many Bills into law. I think Kenyans must also learn to thank people when they work extremely hard. The Tenth Parliament did very well. Let us not look at the Tenth Parliament, for example, in terms of increase of salaries and allowances because there were none.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Hon. Members, hon. Cheboi has spoken.

There was a Member who was contributing to this Motion yesterday. He has a balance of three minutes.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, Sir. I made my maiden speech yesterday. I had introduced myself. My names are Humphrey Kimani Njuguna, for those who were not in this House yesterday. I am the Member for Gatanga and I welcome you to that constituency, so that you can see whether it is a model constituency or not.

I support the Motion I was contributing to on access to emergency healthcare. I would like to say that the Motion is anchored in Article 43(1)(a) of the Constitution. Article 43(1)(a) states that access to health is a constitutional right to every Kenyan. In fact, Article 43(1)(a) says that every Kenyan has a right to health, to the highest attainable standard. So, it is not negotiable. This is a right. I know some people might want to say that since we passed our Constitution in 2010, then this right should be applied progressively. However, I am of the contrary opinion because when we got our Independence, disease, poverty and ignorance were identified as the three major challenges facing our society. So, we cannot say that we now address this issue progressively because this is an issue that we should have handled during the 50 years of Independence. So, access to health is a mandatory right to all Kenyans now.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I want to move on to Article 43(2), which deals with emergency access to health. I had an opportunity to interrogate hon. Nyikal on what

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Your time is up!

Hon. Speaker, Sir, thank you for giving me this chance to contribute to this Motion, which is very dear to my heart as a medical doctor. First of all, let me thank Hon. Koinange for having come up with this Motion, and tell him that very soon we should get together and have this turned into a Bill. As we do that, there are certain areas that we shall have to relook at; what comes to mind immediately I look at the Motion is Article 43(2) of the Constitution, which is very clear. The operational words are “shall not be” – “shall not” means that there is no compromise. There is no debate; there is no halfway. But then the hon. Member says: “---this House urges”. Urging is like begging. I think we should be forthright and say that this House compels and not urges the Government. Let me go back a bit and talk about two or three things. One of them is the immediate hon. Member on the Floor who took a bit of time talking about emergency. Most of the time when you talk to people about emergency, many of them keep on thinking about it and what comes to mind immediately is accidents. But as a medical doctor, I know there are so many other emergencies that we need to keep in mind. I think one of the emergencies, or time bombs that we sit on, is pregnancy. Pregnancy in itself can very easily turn into an emergency, either at the time of delivery or during other times, when there are so many complications that can happen. For example, some of our ladies conceive and, unfortunately, the pregnancy lodges outside the uterus and that turns out to be a very big emergency. In our medical language we call it an “ectopic pregnancy”. Emergency can result from diseases like Malaria, which sometimes is cerebral. Emergency can result from poisons or snake bites. These days, with the changing lifestyles, you get people getting diseases that were more associated with the Western World like strokes or bleeding in the brain. Unfortunately, this happened recently with the wife of one of our IEBC commissioners, Mr. Letangule. Going through what was appearing in the papers, she had high blood pressure in pregnancy; I am made to understand that, that is what happened to the unfortunate lady. That sometimes can turn out to be a very serious emergency. I do not want to appear like I am lecturing, but let us look at the two health providers in this country. We have the public health or public hospitals. This is where most of our people go to. There is a problem, and I am waiting for the nominee Cabinet Secretary for Health to start work. We must, as a country, now look at our personnel.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Your time is up!

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I want to start by congratulating you for being elected and also the Deputy Speaker. I also want to take this opportunity to thank very sincerely the residents of Kieni for seeing it wise to elect me, so that I represent them in this Parliament. I have been trying to catch your eye but, unfortunately, that was not forthcoming. I think in this House we might change to catching your ear.

I rise to support very strongly this Motion by our good friend, Hon. Koinange. Since Independence, all the successive governments, whichever government that came to power, one of the things it talked about was healthcare. Even when we were campaigning, one of the major things that we used to talk about was health. This Eleventh Parliament should work on legislation that will make sure that we have universal healthcare for our people. Dr. Kibunguchy has pointed out that there are some very new diseases like hypertension. We also have other cases like accidents involving our boda bodas and our young people, whom we have tried as much as possible to create employment for. When I was born, I found a dispensary called Endarasha and it is still in the same state which I found it in; there are no doctors, laboratories or medicines. For example, in Nyeri, all emergency cases are referred to the Nyeri Provincial General Hospital. As we talk about providing health care services, we should also equip our hospitals and dispensaries, so that we can reduce the backlog that we have.

Many workers do not have a calling, but there is something that we share with the medical fraternity. Ours is a calling to duty. It is a calling for a Member of Parliament to work for the people. It is also a calling for doctors and nurses. It is very important that they are well remunerated. If we remunerate our medics and equip our medical institutions, we can talk about achieving the Vision 2030. All over the world, one of the basic needs that we should not even argue about is health care. If we deal with health and education issues, we will make some strides. We need to move a notch higher and make sure that as we talk about education and the laptops, our people are healthy. A nation that is not heavy cannot move forward.

With those few remarks, I support.

Thank you, hon. Speaker, Sir. My name is Manson Nyamweya, the Member for South Mugirango. Before I say anything, I want to let the country know that in my constituency, we are having

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Hon. Members, after the lady, the Mover will be called upon to reply. These are the rules.

(Hon. (Ms.) Korere): Hon. Speaker, Sir, I am Sara Paulata Korere. I take this opportunity to congratulate you on your election as the Speaker. I also congratulate Dr. Laboso, the Deputy Speaker, for a record first round win. I also wish to congratulate the Members of the Jubilee Coalition, specifically the URP Members, for

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

It is now time for the Mover to reply.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, if you allow me, I will donate one minute to my brother there and another to him.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I thank my brother for donating that one minute to me. Let me congratulate you and the Deputy Speaker for being elected in your respective positions. I also want to thank my constituents for having elected me to serve them a second time. This Motion is timely especially for those of us who come from rural constituencies. We have a disturbing experience with regard to medical attention given to our people. We have fewer medical facilities. We have no drugs. We have inadequate medical staff and there is rampant lack of transport. I appeal to the Government to improve health services. I know it is possible. With the creation of the CDF, many health facilities have been constructed. However, due to Government bureaucracy of registering and absorbing the facilities, most of them are not really working.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you, hon. Speaker, Sir. May I thank the hon. Member for giving me this opportunity to contribute. What he has cited is really true. What Kenyans are going through is actually true. It is exactly what goes on in the area I represent. We need to improve on legislation so that we allow paramedics to help people in the rural areas. We need to upgrade facilities so that they can absorb patients. We also need to ensure that patients are not sent home for lack of money to pay medical fees, which are higher. Lastly, we have the capacity to prevent diseases that are preventable. We also have the capacity to treat conditions that are treatable. This will help us improve our welfare as Kenyans.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I want to thank you for the diligent manner in which you have continued to handle the business of this House. I am very thankful to all the hon. Members. The spirit in this House reflects oneness. I believe that if we go on like this for the next three years, we will be able to achieve a lot. I pray that we go down the history of this country as the House that brought a big change to this nation. I want to thank all the hon. Members who have contributed to this Motion. If we support our people to get access to facilities of health and especially in the area of emergency treatment, we will move very far. Like one hon. Member said, any ailment of whatever nature is actually an emergency because nobody plans for that. The people who are most affected are the poor. This Motion calls for an urgent action to be taken to ensure that no Kenyan is denied emergency medical treatment for lack of money. Hon. Members have shown disappointment and they said that we should not be talking about medical care for this country 50 years after Independence. Allow me to emphasize that medical care costs money. Poverty is experienced by many people in the country, but that does not mean that our people should be denied health care. Hon. Speaker, Sir, I agree with hon. Members that we need to work towards a Bill that will ensure comprehensive treatment for all Kenyans. We need to place everyone under an insurance cover. There is a committee on health and we believe it will come up with a Bill that will cater for this particular issue. Social health insurance is the way, the world over, to cater for people who need this kind of facility. It, of course, needs sacrifice. The rich can subsidize for the poor. The single can subsidize for the married. The healthy can subsidize for the unhealthy. The young can subsidize for the old. The draft of Kenya Health Policy, 2012 – 2030 is very clear about availability of free treatment to our people when they visit health facilities. Since it is clear in the Constitution, we are not doing a favour to our people; rather it is their right to have this service. I know this idea calls for pooling of resources in order to manage financial requirements of providing quality health care. This can only be done in-house by the committee in charge of health. The committee should draw a Bill that will cater for this. However, in the meantime, there are things which should be done urgently in order to help our people, given their inability to pay for their medical bills. Some of them are transportation to hospitals.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Hon. Opiyo, you can now rise on your point of order.

On a point of Order, hon. Speaker. My name is hon. Opiyo Wandayi, hon. Member for Ugunja Constituency. I rise to seek your guidance. We are all aware that this is the last sitting of Parliament this week and we are also aware that the President is currently in the process of unveiling his Cabinet list and hopefully next week, the Cabinet nominees will be presented to Parliament for vetting. Early this week, when the Committee on Appointments was formed, an impression was created that the Committee would vet both the Cabinet Secretaries and the Principal Secretaries. When you look at Standing Order 204, which creates this Committee, you will realize---

Hon. Opiyo, what is this that you are seeking? Is it a resolution?

Just some guidance, hon. Speaker.

You should wait until the list of nominees is brought before the House and then you will hear the directions that the Chair will give. If it is with regard to the Cabinet Secretaries, they will be referred to the Committee on Appointments. If it is with regard to those other appointees, like the ones you have mentioned, because they are not covered under Article 152 of the Constitution, the provisions relating to their approvals will be as contained in Articles 153, 154, 155 and so forth. Therefore, it will be a matter that the Chair will direct appropriately and almost invariably to the relevant Departmental Committees, to which their mandates relates.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you hon. Speaker.

Hon. Members, we are in the other Motion, but once again, just to remind ourselves; debate in this Motion will be limited to a maximum of three hours with not more than 20 minutes for the Mover and ten minutes for the other hon. Members speaking, except the Leader of the Majority Party and Leader of the Minority Party who shall be limited to a maximum of 15 minutes each; and that ten minutes before the expiry of the time, the Mover shall be called upon to reply and that priority is strictly accorded to the Leader of Majority Party, Leader of Minority Party and Chairperson of the relevant Departmental Committees, in that order. I am reminding the House because, perhaps, by the time this Motion comes to an end, we may not be having the Chairpersons of the Committees. But, again you can take a maximum of ten minutes. So, do not feel constrained to speak for three or five minutes, like you were doing during the debate on the President’s Speech. This one you have a maximum of ten minutes to contribute. So, prepare yourselves to speak. I now call upon the Mover of this Motion, hon. Joseph Gitari. Please take the microphone.

Hon. Speaker, I beg to move the following Motion:- THAT, aware that the National Hospital Insurance Fund (NHIF) defaulters continue to be surcharged a penalty of 500% of the outstanding amount; and further aware that the penalty is barely affordable to majority of Kenyans, this House urges the Government to consider reducing the NHIF penalty surcharge to defaulters from the current 500% to 25%. Thank you hon. Speaker, for giving me this chance to move this Motion. Before I do anything else, I would like to take this chance to congratulate you on your election as the Speaker of this august House. My interaction with you showed me that you are up to the task. Let me also take this opportunity to congratulate my sister, hon. Dr. Joyce Laboso for being elected the Deputy Speaker of this august House and register my condolences to the family; now that we have heard that she lost her mother. Hon. Speaker, if you allow me, I would like to take this opportunity to sincerely thank the people of Kirinyaga Central for giving me a chance to serve them for a second term; having been in this Parliament during the Tenth Parliament. Hon. Speaker, I am excited by how fast this Eleventh Parliament is working and I know that we will pass enough Motions because we are up to the task. I am comparing this House to the last one that I served. I think we will go to a higher notch. Hon. Speaker, my Motion today is related to the Motion which was moved by my colleague, hon. Koinange. I would like to say that it is in the same spirit because health care is important to all Kenyans. Having dealt with health matters, I believe, by the closure of the day, this Motion might see the light of the day. Hon. Speaker, this is a very basic Motion which affects Kenyans, especially those that we represent. It is talking about penalties surcharged by National Hospital Insurance Fund (NHIF). We, hon. Members or people who work in different companies might not

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

(Hon. C.M. Nyamai

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Your time is up!

Hon. Members, I think you have forgotten the rules again. The Motion must be proposed so that then it is open to any other person to contribute.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, thank you for giving me this opportunity to address the House this afternoon. Let me take the first opportunity to congratulate you for your successful election as the Speaker of this National Assembly. I again take the opportunity to congratulate my fellow colleagues,

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, Sir. My name is Colonel Dido Rasso, the Member of Parliament for Saku. Let me on the onset congratulate you and your deputy for a resounding approval by this House and also at the same time, I wish to thank the people of Saku for electing me to the august House.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, I wish to contribute to the two Motions. Although there are two Motions, there is a lot of relevance in them in that what they reflect shows abrogation of responsibility somewhere within the Government in terms of discipline and superintendence within our healthcare system. What it also shows is death of healthcare and “privatisation of life” because if within a population you do not have things like district hospitals and clinics--- The National Health Insurance Fund (NHIF) charges 500 per cent for defaulters. This simply means that this is a system that actually lacks the basic conforms. If we have to ask ourselves: Who are the people in the first place who contribute to NHIF or who are members of NHIF? Predominantly, those are the fellows who are in the rural areas and the jua kali people. Because of their income, they find that this is where they are able to contribute so that at the end of the day, they will get medical attention. I come from a constituency where 80 per cent of the population is relatively poor and if we equate that with the Millennium Development Goals (MDGs), actually we do not meet all the basic six standards and healthcare is one of them.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

On a point of order, Hon. Speaker, Sir. Again, I am Hon. Weru, the Member of Parliament for Mathira. I just need clarification concerning Standing Order No.35 concerning the quorum of this House. I am afraid that we do not have a quorum or what mechanism is used to determine the same? I stand to be guided by you.

Yes. All you are required to do is to draw the attention of the Speaker to the possibility of there not being a quorum. Let me have somebody take a count so that we can determine that. Do not stand because the Clerks have to determine whether there is quorum. Yes, I confirm that there is no quorum. The quorum for the House is 50 hon. Members. You know, this is not just in the Standing Orders but it is in the Constitution, Article 121 and, therefore, I direct that the quorum bell be rung.

I know there are many new hon. Members. Do not worry. You are not going to be ruled out of order, but when the Speaker is on the Chair, if you are coming in or you are in the pathways, or you are at any other place, you are supposed to freeze. To freeze means you stand still. The hon. Member for Kibra, I can see you are walking all over. Please, take your seat. We now have the quorum and so the hon. Member who was on the Floor may proceed.

He has completed!

Hon. Speaker, Sir, let me take this opportunity to thank you and your Deputy for your election as Speaker and Deputy Speaker of this honorable House. Secondly, let me pass my condolences to our Deputy Speaker for her bereavement. Without any reservations I want to thank the people of

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, Sir. My names are Korei Lemein, MP for Narok South. May I join the rest of my colleagues in congratulating you and the Deputy Speaker. May I also take this opportunity to thank God and the people of Narok South for giving me an opportunity to represent them in this House. With regard to this Motion, I would like to thank hon. Gitari for bringing this Motion before us. The NHIF has a mission and a vision. I believe that their work is to cushion Kenyans in terms of cost when it comes to medical care. I join my colleagues in saying that this Motion together with that one of hon. Koinange should be fast-tracked for the benefit of the people of Kenya. Majority of Kenyans and especially those in the rural areas do not understand the need of NHIF. Where I come from, there is no NHIF office. Narok County, as you know, is one of the largest counties in this country. There are areas that do not understand what

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, my name is Silverse Anami. I am the hon. Member for Shinyalu. I rise to support the Motion, but first allow me to congratulate you on your election as Speaker. I also want to thank you for your sensitivity and management of the proceedings in the House. This is a very important Motion. Usually the people who default in these NHIF payments are people who have challenges as a result of poverty. This is something they do not choose for themselves. As a result, we have instances where they are not only penalized, but they are denied services. I have experienced in private hospitals, and even to an extent in public hospitals, where patients are denied services. Sometimes when they are given those services, they are not discharged. We have this terminologies, “discharge- in” and “discharge-out”. The former means that the patient has been discharged, but he will not be allowed to go home. The patient is forced to stay in hospital. In that instance, the patient is denied access to facilities like water and beddings. This is dehumanizing. It is important that we take this Motion seriously. The authorities responsible for managing this Fund should take interest in how the administration of this fund is conducted in hospitals. I would like to suggest that the NHIF should have agents within the hospitals to ensure that people are benefitting from the opportunities provided by this Fund. We also have situations where money provided in that Fund is used by people who do not deserve it. It is very important that coastal facilities that benefit from that Fund are able to account for the money publicly. That way, we will be able to know how many people have benefited from NHIF in the various medical facilities. Hon. Speaker, the productivity of a nation like Kenya depends on the physical, mental and even spiritual health of its citizens. So, it is important that we improve the Government. We demand from the Government authorities responsible that accountability for that Fund is made public. The accountability should be done frequently, so that people can know what is happening. Here, I am underlining the service of sensitizing the public on the availability of the Fund. Hon. Speaker, Sir, when some of the defaulters are discharged, and that is in quotes, they are asked to leave their identity cards behind. When they leave their identity cards behind, they do not access other services. Everyone needs his or her identity card every time. When you go to the bank, you need your identity card. When you want to enter into an agreement or apply for a loan, you need an identity card. But when hospital authorities retain identity cards belonging to patients, how do they expect the patient to access other services?

This Member. I am sorry I am trying to make sure I see as many as those who have not spoken in my presence up to today.

Gender!

Even them. I am looking out for those who have not spoken.

Thank you, hon. Speaker, Sir. My name is Lati Lelelit Jonathan. I am the Member of Parliament for Samburu West. I think I

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Let me recognize the gentleman with grey hair on his head like mine.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, Sir, for having noticed me at long last. I was wondering why you have not managed to notice me and yet, wherever I walk in my constituency, people identify me with my grey hair. I was wondering whether my hair is not grey in this honourable House. My names are Kamoti Mwamkale, the Member for Rabai which is in Kilifi County.

Hon. Speaker, Sir, allow me to join my colleagues in congratulating you and your Deputy for being elected to that hot seat. First, I would like to congratulate the people of Rabai for electing me to this honourable House to serve them as their first Member of Parliament. I am saying “first” because Rabai is a new constituency.

I sincerely support the Motion before the House. I congratulate the hon. Member who has brought this Motion to this House. He is hon. Joseph Gitari. Indeed, the spirit and intention of the National Hospital Insurance Fund (NHIF) is to serve as the saviour of the people when it comes to health insurance provider. There are many insurance companies that provide that service but I believe it is NHIF that targets the common man. A penalty of 500 per cent is prohibitive. I believe that this is unconstitutional in our new dispensation. Article 47(1) of our Constitution on fair administrative action, clearly says that every person has a right to administrative action; that is experience, efficient, lawful, reasonable and procedural fair. I do not believe that the administrative action of overcharging people can be said to be fair.

Thank you very much, Hon. Speaker, Sir. Let me take this opportunity, first, to thank you and your Deputy for being elected to steer the business of this House. I would like to tell you that you are doing a very commendable job. Having said that, let me also take this opportunity to thank the people of Ndia for electing me to represent them in this House. I assure them that I will do my level best to represent them.

I support the Motion. I will start by saying that the primary duty of NHIF is to facilitate the provision of health services. However, surcharging 500 per cent is punitive and cannot go towards helping the Jubilee Government in achieving the commitment to provide health services to all people by 2020. This is a high percentage.

My constituency consists of farmers and people with small business and they can contribute some money and join the NHIF. However, you will realise that the Fund does not do a lot of marketing and, therefore, those people are not aware of what is happening. I call upon the NHIF to go to the rural areas and do a lot of marketing so that many people can join it. As the Member for Parliament for Ndia, I am called upon virtually every month to go harambees because somebody is detained in hospital or because he or she is unable to settle the medical bill. So, I call upon that Fund to perform that duty so that it can help Kenyans.

Many road accidents happen in this country. Kenya is listed as one of those countries with the highest rate. I call upon the Ministry of Transport and Infrastructure to move fast and make the Authority that deals with accidents effective. At the moment, they are embroiled in a tussle over the appointment of the Director-General. I call upon

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

There are people who have been here consistently. Let the gentleman there take the Floor.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, Sir. My name is Johnson Manya Naicca, the Member for Mumias West. You are all welcome to my constituency where the biggest sugar industry is situated, although the residents of that place are the poorest.

I rise to, first, thank you and congratulate you for having been elected to that position even though I did not vote for you. However, if there was another voting, I could vote for you because you have articulated issues here very amicably. I also rise to support this Motion together with the previous Motion by hon. Koinange. They are very well put subjects. However, I have a small issue that could be looked into regarding the NHIF. It seems we do not understand the issue of penalty. It is okay for the people in the informal sector like the boda boda operators and self-employed people not to be fined or penalized at all. Those are just groups that came together and raised money to pay NHIF for say two or three months. Sometimes, they do not get that money for another three months or six months until some of us come to their rescue. So, it is very unreasonable for them to be penalized. I have a feeling that this should not apply to the informal sector and the self-employed people.

However, when we talk generally that defaulters should not be penalized, we are making a big mistake because suppose my colleague, hon. Johnson Sakaja has employed me for one year and he remits my NHIF---

Order! The Hon. Member contributing will continue when the House next sits because he has a balance of time. Hon. Members, we have come to the end of today’s Sitting. Therefore, the House stands adjourned until Tuesday, 30th April, 2013, at 2.30 p.m.

The House rose at 6.30 p.m.

The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.