Mzalendo Mzalendo Eye on Kenyan Parliament
Menu
  • Home
  • Hansard
  • Home »
  • Hansard »
  • Sitting : National Assembly : 2013 06 05 09 00 00
  • search Hansard
  • Page 1 of Wednesday, 05th June, 2013 Morning
  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 1 NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
  • OFFICIAL REPORT

  • Wednesday, 5th June, 2013
  • The House met at 9.00 a.m.
  • [Hon. Deputy Speaker ((Dr. Laboso) in the Chair]
  • PRAYERS

  • PAPERS LAID

  • The following Paper was laid on the Table-:
  • The Second Report of the Select Committee on Appointments on the Vetting of the following Cabinet Secretary nominees:-
  • (i) Mr. Joseph J. Mpaa ole Lenku; Ministry of Interior and Co-ordination of National Government. (ii) Hon. Kazungu Kambi; Ministry of Labour, Social Security and Services.
  • (By hon. Nyenze)
  • NOTICES OF MOTIONS

  • ADOPTION OF REPORT ON VETTING OF CABINET SECRETARY NOMINEES

  • Francis Mwanzia Nyenze (Deceased)

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, I beg to give notice of the following Motion:- THAT, this House adopts the Second Report of the Select Committee on Appointments on the Vetting of the following Cabinet Secretary nominees laid on the Table today Wednesday 5th June, 2013:

  • Francis Mwanzia Nyenze (Deceased)

    1. Mr. Joseph J. Mpaa ole Lenku; Ministry of Interior and Coordination of National Government.

  • Francis Mwanzia Nyenze (Deceased)

    2. Hon. Kazungu Kambi; Ministry of Labour, Social Security and Services.

  • RECRUITMENT OF CLINICAL OFFICERS/NURSES IN THE COUNTRY

  • David Ouma Ochieng'

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, I beg to give notice of the following Motion:-

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 2
  • THAT, aware that there is an acute and gross shortage of clinical officers in hospitals, health centres and dispensaries which in turn is severely limiting access by Kenyans to basic health care; deeply concerned that most Kenyans continue losing their lives to curable and easily manageable ailments; further concerned that public resources especially the CDF have been used to develop a number of facilities which remain unoperational due to lack of personnel; taking into account the need to meet the constitutional right of every Kenyan citizen to adequate health care and further noting that public resources have been used to train more than 15,000 clinical officers and 13,000 nurses who remain idle and unemployed; aware that the Government has just adopted a policy on free maternity services and in order to promote the prevention and early detection of disease risks at household levels through closer and constant disease surveillance; knowing that clinical officers and the nurses are the ones that operate most health facilities in most parts of the country and due to the shortage of doctors; this House urges the Government to immediately recruit and deploy at least 4,000 clinical officers and 4,000 nurses and a further 3,000 clinical officers and 3,000 nurses annually and to deploy them equitably to the country to alleviate suffering of the citizens and help provide curative and preventive health care services to the people of Kenya.
  • Onesmus Muthomi Njuki

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, I beg to give notice of the following Motion:- THAT, aware that small holder farmers living in the buffer zones around Mt. Kenya National Park and Forest Reserve have struggled for years with the elephants that regularly invade their land and destroy their crops which is also a costly affair for these small holder farmers where livelihoods are often lost in a single night raid; further concerned that hardly a day goes without an incident occurring between the farmer and the elephants in Mt. Kenya area; noting that the elephants from the park easily stray outside the perimeter---

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Order, hon. Member! Did you get the approval?

  • Onesmus Muthomi Njuki

    Yes.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    And it was approved?

  • Onesmus Muthomi Njuki

    I did not get a written approval.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    It is not written “approved” on the one that you have? So that you may know we are a House of rules and procedures, I am informed it has not been seen by the Speaker.

  • Onesmus Muthomi Njuki

    Obliged, hon. Deputy Speaker.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    It is just a process of approving it. You can bring it back in the afternoon. But I do have another hon. member. Has yours been approved by the Speaker? Yours is a Statement, it is not a notice of motion.

  • Hon. Member

    Yes.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Right, I see no more requests for notice of motion so next Order please.

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 3 POINT OF ORDER
  • CHALLENGES FACING MEMBERSHIP OF TSC

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    The hon. Member, if you do not have a card you can either use the next or come to the Dispatch Box.

  • Ibrahim Abdi Saney

    Pursuant to Standing Order 44 (2)(c) I wish to request for a statement from the chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs regarding the challenges facing membership of the Teachers Service Commission. Hon. Deputy Speaker, TSC advertised to fill vacancies in its membership in September 2012. Consequently, 11 candidates for the position of member of Commission and five for chairperson were shortlisted and interviewed in October 2012. Thereafter, the selection panel forwarded five candidates for the Commission’s position and three candidates for chairperson to the Principals, for onward submission of one nominee for chairperson and three nominees to Parliament for consideration and approval. Hon. Deputy Speaker, the candidates were referred to the relevant Departmental Committee. In its first report dated 2nd January 2013, the Committee recommended the names be approved but the House rejected the nominees. The President submitted a second list of nominees for approval to Parliament however the list submitted contained the same names as were rejected by the House except for one, Mr. Cleopas Tirop. The relevant Committee made a second report recommending approval of the list and the House approved the nominees on 9th January 2013, this was in total contravention of the TSC Act which requires a fresh list to be resubmitted. Hon. Deputy Speaker, a petition was lodged in court on the appointment of the approved nominees for Commissioners and chairperson on 25th March, 2013 and the court ruled that the nomination was improper, null and void in law. The court further directed that the President picks the next set of candidates based on meritocracy, gender and regional balance from the list of shortlisted and interviewed candidates. Among the nominees, only Mr. Cleopas Tirop met the requirement of fresh nomination hence was appointed and sworn in as a Commissioner. Hon. Deputy Speaker, in his statement the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs should explain why the court ruling was not implemented in light of the remaining two vacancies for members of the Commission; why the State Law Office is not fulfilling its constitutional mandate of advising the President to submit the names of the remaining Commissioners as ruled by the High Court and duly guided by the TSC Act. And thirdly, why the Attorney General is allowing the TSC and constitutional Commission to face a potential crisis as the term of the remaining five Commissioners is coming to an end on 14th January 2013, leaving only one Commissioner in office from 15th June 2013. Thank you.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    How much time does the Chairman of that Committee require? Which committee did you say you wanted it to go to?

  • Ibrahim Abdi Saney

    Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    I think it is better directed to the Committee on Education, Research and Technology.

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 4 Hon. Saney

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, I got the guidance from the Speaker: it concerns the State Law Office.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    That is Okay. Is the Chair or Vice-Chair of Justice and Legal Affairs Committee here? None of them is present? The Leader of Majority Party, you can pass the information and let us know the time frame which they require to give us that statement. You still want to say something?

  • Ibrahim Abdi Saney

    Given the urgency of the statement required on 15th this month, the entire TSC, an institution, and in view of the already looming strike, I feel this statement should be in the House in the next three or four days, at most; I so request.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Okay; I think Leader of Majority Party, you have heard the urgency with which this matter needs to be prosecuted. We do not have any other statement; next Order?

  • MOTION

  • ESTABLISHMENT OF FERTILIZER BOARD

  • THAT, aware that the National Cereals and Produce Board (NCPB) is now procuring fertilizer, which is not its core mandate; cognizant of the fact that this had led to delays in the importation and procurement of the necessary inputs for the farmers in a timely manner; noting with concern that fertilizers are arriving after the planting season; deeply concerned that this is affecting food security in the country as fertilizers are key inputs in farming; also noting that this lack of inputs is affecting farm yields, and impoverishing farmers, this House urges the Government to set up a fertilizer board that manages issues of fertilizers and other farming inputs, while offering subsidized inputs to farmers and also fast track the process of setting up a factory to produce fertilizers and other farming inputs locally in the long-term.
  • (Hon. Wakhungu on 4.5.2013)
  • ( Resumption of Debate interrupted on 5.6.2013)
  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    We are resuming debate on the Motion by hon. Wakhungu and there is a balance of 48 minutes. The person who was on the Floor was hon Ng’ongo or had he finished? He had finished. So, anybody can contribute and we can start with hon. Injendi.

  • Moses Malulu Injendi

    Thank you hon. Deputy Speaker, I rise to support the Motion. I am supporting this Motion because majority of farmers in the country have been crying so much about fertilizer and seedlings. For example, where I come from, during planting season, most of these inputs have been arriving long after the planting season. Some farmers use fertilizers that are not appropriate for their farms or for the crops. So, I support what the hon. Member has come up with, because when we have this kind of

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 5
  • board, one, we shall produce these fertilizers and seedlings locally. In this case, we will be able to produce, through research, what is relevant for our farms. I also say that when it comes to the National Cereals and Produce Board, this body, in my understanding, is riddled with a lot of corruption, so that even the new responsibility it has, in my opinion, has given it more powers to continue with this kind of corruption. So, I would appeal that this suggested board comes up to control this. This is because even when it comes to performance by the National Cereals and Produce Board, in the case of Malava in Kakamega, where I come from, they have actually some structures which have been lying idle for the last 15 years. If we get another board, it would control this. I also want to support this Motion because majority of our farmers in western Kenya cannot afford these seeds and fertilizers because they are very expensive. I believe that when this board is set up and we start producing inputs locally, bearing in mind that the board can control the prices, we will improve production. Most of our people are small-scale farmers and need support. We can only be in control if we produce inputs locally and avoid a situation where we will need to import inputs. This will lower the very high prices. Hon. Deputy Speaker, I beg to support.
  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    How come his card is there and he is not there physically? Hon. David Bowen Kangogo, are you there?

  • David Kangongo Bowen

    Yes, hon. Deputy Speaker.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Okay, proceed.

  • David Kangongo Bowen

    Thank you, hon. Deputy Speaker for giving me the opportunity to support this Motion. The Motion is very good. We need to set up a new board to look into the fertilizer issue. However, I do not think the problem of fertilizers has been caused by the National Cereals and Produce Board (NCPB) because the Board just facilitates the buying of fertilizers. The whole problem lies with the Ministry of Agriculture and the Ministry of Finance. If no money is given to the Board, what will it use to buy the fertilizers? There is need for the Ministry of Finance to allocate more funds to the Ministry of Agriculture for the specific purpose of buying fertilizers in appropriate time. Otherwise, the core business of the NCPB has nothing to do with fertilizers. The core functions of the NCPB are storage of grains and management of the National Grain Reserve (NGR).

  • David Kangongo Bowen

    The idea in this Motion is very good because even as we speak, farmers in my constituency of Marakwet East do not have fertilizers. They are still using manure. Lack of fertilizers has become a very big problem to farmers. At the beginning of this year, we went to the NCPB with some Members of County Assembly from my county. We discussed the matter with the Managing Director with a view to convincing him to take fertilizers to either Kapsowar or Chesoi, in my constituency; but up to now, they have not. The Managing Director said that he was not given enough funds to enable him to distribute fertilizers. Therefore, this House, and especially the Committee on Agriculture, should come up with a proposal to set aside more funds for fertilizers, and especially for local production to enable farmers to access it in time.

  • David Kangongo Bowen

    With those remarks, I beg to support.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Yes, hon. Mwinga Chea.

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 6
  • Mwinga Gunga Chea

    Thank you, hon. Deputy Speaker, for giving me this opportunity. I rise to support the Motion.

  • Mwinga Gunga Chea

    First, I must command my brother, hon. Wamalwa for bringing this Motion quite in good time. The idea in the Motion is noble for we understand that food security is vital for the general development of this nation. Our own Constitution, in Article 43(1) (c), makes it a right for every person to be freed from hunger and, of course, have adequate food of good quality. Generally, agriculture has been said to be the backbone of our economy. If agriculture is well taken care of, it is expected that the issues of poverty and unemployment will be issues of the past. Hon. Deputy Speaker, it is equally important that once fertilizers are supplied, there is good human resource to train farmers on how to use them. As it is now, a good number of farmers in the country – specifically those in the rural areas – use what we might call ‘archaic’ methods of farming. They largely do subsistence farming. In most places, farmers plant on the same pieces of land for years on end. This must be discouraged. Proper mechanisms must be put in place to ensure that farmers are given an opportunity to grow enough crops, so that we can have sufficient food for this country. With those very few remarks, I beg to support.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Yes, hon. Joseph M’eruaki M'uthari.

  • Joseph M'eruaki M'uthari

    Thank you, hon. Deputy Speaker. I rise to support this very important and timely Motion. We are aware that agriculture is very important, and that fertilizer is also very important. We know that many times, the problem with crops is not so much of water stress but is related to fertilizers. We are aware that those countries which have low consumption fertilizers are food insecure. As a country, if we cannot feed our citizens, we cannot even claim to be independent. It is a shame that 50 years after Independence we still cannot feed ourselves. One of the problems we have is that we give functions to people who are not capable of performing them. The NCPB is already overwhelmed by the matter of handling grains. Therefore, they do not have time to think strategically as far as fertilizer is concerned. As a country, many times we complain about lack of money but the problem is not lack of money. The problem is how we spend the money that we already have. Where do we put our priorities? The amount of money that this country spends every year on purchase of relief food is enough to invest in the establishment of a fertilizer factory, so that the fertilizer can be accessed by farmers at affordable prices. Hon. Deputy Speaker, there has been debate about subsidy. We have to be truthful to ourselves. There is no country in the world that has developed because it has been supported by another country. Yesterday, some hon. Members made reference to countries like Malawi, which is dependent on external support. I do not think depending on external support is the way forward. The money that we spend on purchase of relief food can be used to subsidise the farmers. If farmers are subsidised to enable them acquire fertilisers and other farm inputs, we can be food secure. We can also process our agricultural produce, market them and get more money. So, after the passage of this Motion, the Mover should go ahead and come up with a Bill for the establishment of the proposed board, so that it can take up the function of supplying farm inputs to farmers. We have to do first things first. If we address the issue

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 7
  • of food security, we will also be addressing the issues of poverty and nutrition. There have been challenges in many of our regions, and those challenges have made our people very vulnerable. So, if this is not done, even if we come up with good ideas – like the idea of the Government putting a million acres of land under irrigation – they may not work if we do not have the necessary farm inputs. In this case, we are talking about fertilizers and other farm inputs. Hon. Deputy Speaker, therefore, this Motion is of great importance to food security. Some countries do not allow importation of their staple food but in this country, we import even some of our staple food. This is even connected to the question of food security. We sometimes put effort where it is not required. Some people in certain quarters may be facilitating importation of fertilizers. There may have been resistance to the idea of establishing a fertilizers factory because certain people may be benefiting from the challenges that we have. So, I request the Mover to come up with a Bill that will lead to the establishment of the proposed board to be responsible for manufacturing of fertilizers and supply of the fertilizers and other farm inputs to farmers, so that we can move away from a situation of food deficit and become a country with food surplus. With those remarks, I beg to support.
  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Hon. Jackson Sakaja, can you explain how come your card has been in use yet you were not physically present in the House?

  • Johnson Arthur Sakaja

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, I would like to apologise. I had to dash out to deal with an urgent matter but I was here. However, thank you for giving me the opportunity all the same.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Hon. Joseph, could you switch off your microphone please? Thank you.

  • Johnson Arthur Sakaja

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, I would first like to thank Mheshimiwa Wamalwa who also happens to be my neighbour in Trans Nzoia for bringing such a Motion to the House because indeed it is long overdue. I am reminded of the parable of the talents in the Bible where a master left his home and gave three servants some talents or some money. One received one talent; another received two and another received five. The one who had one multiplied it and got two. The one who had two multiplied and got four but the one who had five buried it because he was afraid that it would get lost. For the past many years, this country has behaved like the servant who received five talents because indeed this country has been blessed by God immensely in terms of land and the resources we have.

  • Dalmas Otieno

    On a point of order, hon. Deputy Speaker.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Hon. Dalmas, were you on a point of order?

  • Dalmas Otieno

    Yes, hon. Deputy Speaker. The hon. Member has misquoted the Bible and has grossly misled the House. It is the one talent that was buried and the five talent that multiplied. Thank you, hon. Deputy Speaker.

  • (Laughter)
  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    I can see who is more conversant with the Bible, hon. Sakaja.

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 8
  • Johnson Arthur Sakaja

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, I am glad the point has reached home. Either way, as a country, we have buried our talent. Kenya has the potential of being a net exporter of food. We can be Africa’s bread basket. Indeed, even my home country of Trans Nzoia alone can feed this entire country but for a long time we have been inefficient in terms of agriculture and production and we have not been serious. I am reminded of two or three years ago when we had some famine in this country and when there was the Kenya for Kenyans Programme, a country like Egypt donated food to this country. Now, Egypt has only 3 per cent of arable land. Donating food to a country like Kenya with more than 30 per cent arable land, indeed I think that was embarrassing to say the least.

  • Johnson Arthur Sakaja

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, in support of this Motion I would like to point out that within this country we have solutions and I am glad that as part of the manifesto of the Jubilee Government there are indeed plans not only to irrigate more than a million acres but also to set up agricultural investment trusts because part of the way we can mobilise agriculture as an economic sector and also to feed our country is by public private partnership because the Government cannot do it all. I am also pleased that three quarters of Kenyans are actually involved in agriculture. Sadly, most of the production has been subsistence and I think that is what we need to move and this, indeed, is a good beginning and a move towards that direction.

  • Johnson Arthur Sakaja

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, my comments will be brief and I just want to give an example of what Nigeria has done with respect to fertilizer and with respect to distribution of subsidies. In Nigeria, they have used technology. From May 2012 they came up with a system called the “Electronic Wallet Programme” and in that system farmers were getting credit on their phones to go and collect fertilizer subsidies and that cut out so many levels of corruption. The company that did it says that they disbursed 28 billion worth of agricultural subsidies and in addition to that, they made a saving of 16.3 billion. We know that even when the Government gives subsidies of agriculture, many times they do not reach the intended recipients and farmers. We know many times middlemen in between take the subsidies and sell them at higher costs to the farmers but we need to solve that issue. We need to ensure we have a Fertilizer Board that is efficient and you will be glad to know and the hon. Members will be pleased to note that, indeed, the company that did that in Nigeria is a Kenyan company called “Cellulant” and they made savings of more than Kshs.16.3 billion. We have these solutions in our country. We have the solutions of technology. I look forward, once we have set up the Fertilizer Board, to look at other avenues through which we can indeed make our country a food basket because a country that cannot feed itself cannot claim to be a sovereign country. We must ensure that no Kenyan goes hungry in this land. We must ensure that no Kenyan goes hungry in any part of this country, whether it is Turkana or North Eastern Province. Yesterday, I heard hon. Members from some dry areas saying that if only they had water, their counties could feed this country. Hon. Deputy Speaker, it is sad that in the 21st Century – in the digital age – we are depending on factors that we cannot control like the weather to feed our people. There are technological solutions that indeed can be effected. So, I want to thank Mheshimiwa Wamalwa for bringing this Motion. I want to fully support it and I urge this House,

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 9
  • indeed, to support this Motion and also to give a challenge to the Departmental Committee on Agriculture, Livestock and Cooperatives to look for these companies that have provided solutions to other countries like Nigeria. I challenge them to specifically look for Cellulant and to direct it even to the Ministry so that we can, indeed, save our farmers. I am a farmer and I know what it means to wait for fertilizer and not get it.
  • (Laughter)
  • I do not know why some hon. Members are laughing. I am a farmer in Kitale and I want to thank the hon. Member for bringing this Motion. I support and thank you.
  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Now, hon. Members, we only have 20 minutes more before I call the Mover to reply and I have a long list here. So, I do not know whether you would wish we reduce the time for each hon. Member so that they get an opportunity? Is that in order that we reduce to two minutes each?

  • Hon. Members

    Yes.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Okay. So, two minutes it shall be and it is starting with hon. Peter Safari Shehe.

  • Peter Safari Shehe

    Thank you, hon. Deputy Speaker. I stand to support this Motion. I come to the opinion that the National Cereals and Produce Board (NCPB) should not only be handling fertilizer but there should be a certain section for technical staff to actually train the farmers who have got less skills.

  • (An hon. Member crossed the Floor without going to the Bar)
  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Which hon. Member is that? I am sorry I need my glasses. You are almost three months into crossing the Floor without going to the Bar. I did not say that you leave the House altogether.

  • (Laughter)
  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Is it hon. Opiyo or which hon. Member is that? It is hon. Okoth. Yes, please, let us respect the rules of the House. We cannot cross to the other side without going to the Bar. Okay, hon. Shehe, you may continue.

  • Peter Safari Shehe

    Thank you, hon. Deputy Speaker. I stand to support this Motion. I think the NCPB should have a separate section with technical staff who can maybe equip the farmers with the relevant technical skills on how to apply fertilizer on crops. This is because you find instances whereby somebody can go and buy a certain chemical and maybe it is not really meant for that crop. In this matter, maybe the relevant technical knowhow will assist such farmers. It is not a bad idea that people are really informed before such a big factory is constructed to produce fertilizer. There is even zero grazing whereby you get the cow dung of the cows and use it for top dressing and it can do very well. Although, if it is a big piece of land we may need fertilizer to---

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Your time is up

  • .

  • Remember we are enforcing the two minutes. Next is hon. Benjamin Washiali.
  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 10
  • Benjamin Jomo Washiali

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, I also rise to support this Motion because yesterday afternoon, I was here and nobody has so far opposed this Motion. At the outset, I want to declare that I had the privilege of working at National Cereals and Produce Board (NCPB) and our core function then was to purchase cereals, stock, distribute and sell. After I left, NCPB was given the mandate of stocking the Strategic Grain Reserve (SGR). When I was there, there was no time that soil experts were employed. We did not have agricultural officers. Therefore, I am wondering whether there is the additional mandate of purchase of fertilizer. I know that is a very technical addition to the business of farming. But who has been advising the Board on what kind of fertilizer to buy, when to buy and when to supply? I know that the---

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Your two minutes are over! You must organize your points in such a way that the most important ones come first. It is because of time. I know that you have good information. You can always ask the Mover to give you an extra minute later.

  • James Kipkosgei Murgor

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, thank you for giving this opportunity to contribute to this very important Motion by hon. Wakhungu.

  • James Kipkosgei Murgor

    To achieve maximum output in the production of crops, there are various things that a farmer has to do. I will use maize as an example because I come from an area that grows maize. First, the farmer has to prepare his land early. Secondly, he or she has to plant on time. When maize is planted on time, it needs fertilizer. Thirdly, the farmer has to use herbicides or weed on time. Thereafter, the farmer needs to harvest his crop and store it well. What has been happening is that farmers prepare the land in good time but when it comes to planting - like what happened this year - there is no fertilizer. The planting season in that area this year was March and the fertilizer arrived in late April. As of now, it is time for what we call---

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Your two minutes are over; the same advice suffices.

  • James Kimaru Bett

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, I wish to take this opportunity to support the Motion on fertilizers. I do not need to over-emphasize the importance of fertilizer in farming. I wanted to recommend that the Ministry of Finance alongside the Ministry of Agriculture should work hand-in-hand so that Treasury can provide money in good time so that, that fertilizer can be availed to farmers in good time. I am not only talking about the availability of fertilizer. We want the fertilizer to be available in good prices so that farmers can afford to buy it. It is needless to provide fertilizer at prices beyond the reach of farmers. As a Member of Parliament coming from a maize producing area, we would like fertilizer to be in the range of Kshs1,500. I also want to give an opinion. The Ministry of Agriculture and Treasury should work on a long-term programme so that we can set up a plant to produce fertilizer within the country. Otherwise, with those few remarks, I beg to support and congratulate hon. Wakhungu for such an important topic.

  • Wilber Ottichilo Khasilwa

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I rise to support this Motion. My observations are three. First, before we talk about fertilizer, we must know what the fertilizer is going to do. So, the first thing to do is soil analysis. In most of our counties, we have no soil analysis. We do not know what our soil lacks. So, there is no need to just acquire fertilizer for the sake of it. The first important issue is soil analysis in the country to know what the soil lacks. The second issue is this: If this country needs to be food

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 11
  • sufficient, we need to adopt biotechnology. Adopting biotechnology will avoid the use of unnecessary fertilizers which lead to soil acidification. So, we need biotechnology and methods like zero tillage as soil conservation, including organic farming. This will improve our food security. Many people have talked a lot about GMOs. We need to look at the GMOs; how best we can adopt GMO growing foods because most of the countries in the world like India, Mexico and Brazil are food sufficient because they have adopted biotechnology. So, it is important that we look at that, rather than looking at fertilizer which is ruining our soils and making them infertile. With those few remarks, I beg to support.
  • Patrick Keturet Ole Ntutu

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, thank you for giving me this opportunity. First of all, I want to thank my brother, hon. Wakhungu for bringing this Motion to this House. It is long overdue. The setting up of a fertilizer board is a good idea. But I think we need a parastatal which deals with all the inputs, so that our farmers can get fertilizer on time. Many hon. Members have spoken about the Ministry of Agriculture and Ministry of Finance. I think that is where the problem is. It is not so much about NCPB. The Ministry is not giving out money on time so that we can import the fertilizer for farmers. I come from Narok County and we grow wheat and maize between November, December, January and February. But they bring the fertilizer when it is already too late. Most of the fertilizer is lying in our centers. But the issue is: How come they do not bring it between August and September, so that our farmers can plant? Another big issue is the supply centers. Yes, they may bring the fertilizer but, when it comes into the country, it is not taken to where farmers are. We need to do a Bill which will answer to the whole issue of supplying fertilizer. We now have a new Cabinet Secretary whom we need to take this problem to. He can sort out the problem of timing in the 47 counties.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Your time is up!

  • Wanjiku Muhia

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, as we speak of fertilizer not reaching some places in the country, I wish to confirm to this House that Nyandarua County, which can almost feed this country; does not even get the fertilizer, leave alone it reaching the town. So, this is a good Motion bearing in mind that agriculture is the backbone of our economy. Additionally, we know agriculture can create employment and, as per the Jubilee coalition’s manifesto, that can be resolved once and for all. I wish not to look at food security just like that. With food security in the country, education will definitely improve because when children go to school while well fed, their intellectual capacity will increase. They will be able to gather, learn, research and, at the end of the day, perform very well. Peace will prevail. That is because without food security, maybe, the fights that we find, particularly in North Eastern and the lower parts of the country, will be a thing of the past. People fight because they are idle and hungry, amongst other reasons. So, with food security, peace will prevail and security, in itself, will also prevail. The people will be engaged; they will be busy and all that. Hon. Deputy Speaker, investors will also come to our country, particularly in the agricultural sector. They will bring more revenue, improve our country’s economy through infrastructure and others sectors. The improvement of agriculture through the supply of fertilizer agenda, which hon. Chris Wakhungu has brought to this House, will

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 12
  • also be environmental friendly. I can foresee a situation where we can make organic fertilizer by converting the dump-sites like the one in Dandora where those youths will get employed---
  • Eric Arap Keter

    Thank you hon. Deputy Speaker, for giving me this opportunity. I stand to support the Motion and I want to congratulate hon. Chris Wakhungu for bringing this very timely Motion to this House. In fact, it is even too late. We have two problems in this country. A country that cannot feed its citizens is a very poor country. That has come about because of the inefficiency of NCPB to procure fertilizer in good time. So, the new fertilizer board, as proposed in this Motion, is going to be charged with the responsibility of ensuring that we get fertilizer on time. Hon. Deputy Speaker, this year in Belgut Constituency, fertilizer arrived almost two months ago when we had already planted. So, it was not of any relevance to the economy of this country. I would urge that we pass this Motion very swiftly so that we can have the board in place. Another issue is on the distribution of fertilizer, where some areas are given fertilizer on time and others are not---

  • Jackson Kipkorir Rop (The Member for Kipkelion West)

    Thank you, hon. Deputy Speaker. I am hon. Jackson Kipkorir Rop, Member of Parliament for Kipkelion West. I want to take this opportunity to thank my people and the Almighty God for giving me an opportunity to be in this House. First, I want to support the Motion which is before this House. Fertilizer is very essential in this country. We come from maize and coffee growing areas and to get better yields, you need to put a lot of inputs in those farms. I want to say that NCPB per se is not the problem. The main problem is the Treasury and the Ministry of Agriculture. There is a conflict in terms of release of resources. Funding NCPB is actually an issue that is causing delays in terms of supply of fertilizer. I also want to propose that, as we support this Motion, this country is endowed with a lot of animal waste and vegetables that we can use to make organic fertilizer, rather than thinking of having a fertilizer factory that might be costly. We can go for organic because the raw materials are readily available and it is cheaper. It will not affect our soil by making it acidic. So, I want to support the Motion and say we should have a factory that is producing organic fertilizers to supply to our farmers on time. So, I would like to support the Motion.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    I want to give hon. Wakhungu ten minutes. But if he is generous and wants to give a few hon. Members time, he can do so. But the list is too long. I do not know whether he is magnanimous. Hon. Chris Wakhungu, where are you?

  • Chrisantus Wamalwa Wakhungu

    Thank you, hon. Deputy Speaker. Indeed, I am very generous and I would like to donate a minute each to hon. (Dr.) Eseli, hon. Kisang from Marakwet West, hon. Shali, hon. Savula, the Chairman of the Departmental Committee on Agriculture, Livestock and Co-operatives and hon. Korir. Then, I will need a minute or so to respond.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Let us hear from those hon. Members in that order. So, each one of you will take a minute. Who is the first one? That is at the discretion of the Mover of the Motion. So, I do not know where you are. Hon. Shali, I do not see you on the screen. Dr. Eseli, you have the Floor.

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 13 Hon. (Dr.) Simiyu

    Thank you, hon. Deputy Speaker. I wish to thank hon. Chris Wakhungu for donating this brief moment to me. I rise to support the Motion and point out a few things. The importation of fertilizer has been a very haphazard programme, which has mainly been implemented by what we would call businessmen who are up to make astronomical profits at the expense of the farmer. Those people actually make a lot of money from the Government by the subsidy that the Government gives. So, this kind of thing is not sustainable and we need to organize it in a better way as hon. Wakhungu has proposed in his Motion. The idea of unplanned importation of fertilizers without knowing which fertilizers are required where, and the country become flooded with DAP, I think that trend needs to be controlled. Hon. Wakhungu’s Motion is very timely and we need to look at it very carefully and start doing things with evidence.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Your minute is gone. Who was the next one? Was it hon. Kisang? Where is your request? Can you see him on the screen?

  • William Kipkemoi Kisang

    Thank you, hon. Deputy Speaker. I want to rise and support this Motion. I want to take this opportunity to thank hon. Wakhungu for this Motion which is timely but long overdue. I am an ex-NCPB employee. I worked there 20 years ago. At that time, the mandate of NCPB was not to distribute fertilizer. I want to support the setting up of a fertilizer board for two or three reasons. One, it will help the farmers because we will have fertilizer on time and the prices will be affordable. I believe the price of fertilizer should not go beyond Kshs1, 500 as one of our colleagues has said. It will also create employment for our youth because we know that when we start a fertilizer factory, we will create opportunities for those who have skills in that field.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Yes, your minute is gone! Let us have the next hon. Member. Who is the next person? Please, Washiali, you had already spoken on this Motion. You cannot speak twice on a Motion. I am sure you are aware about that. It was hon. Korir. Have you made the request, hon. Korir?

  • Wesley Kipchumba Korir

    Thank you so much for the chance. First of all, I support the Motion. I think this Motion by Chris Wakhungu comes at the right time and we need to act fast. I was in Cherengany recently and farmers were asking about the top-dressing fertilizer which is needed about this time and it is not there. I think by setting up an independent body to deal with the fertilizer importation, first of all, it takes away the liability. I think the reason why we have been having delays is because fertilizer comes in through NCPB and because NCPB has somebody who has gone to court to fleece its assets, farmers suffer from that. So, we have to act fast, get an independent body so that the liabilities of NCPB are not carried by fertilizer importation. The second thing the Ministry should do is to encourage farmers to form co- operative societies and use them to distribute fertilizer to the farmers. That will enable the fertilizer to reach the local farmers who have new farms and cannot acquire fertilizer quickly. That will also help farmers by protecting them from middlemen. I think farmers in this country have suffered enough for a long time and it is our duty as a country to protect them from those middlemen who come in and make profits.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Hon. Korir, I think your minute is over. Who was the last one? Hon. Savula, have you requested?

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 14
  • Ayub Savula Angatia

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, as the Chairman of the Departmental Committee on Agriculture, Livestock and Cooperatives, I rise to support the Motion. As a Committee, we have noted the very sad affairs that are happening in this country. Fertilizer and Seed Fund has no allocation from the Treasury. What happens is that Executive orders are issued at the last minute to procure fertilizer and it delays.

  • Ayub Savula Angatia

    It is very sad to note that CAN fertilizer that is supposed to be in the country for top-dressing this season is yet to arrive in the country. It will arrive between 10th June and 15th June. That will be too late or past the top-dressing season. So, this Motion will help the economy of this country to grow. Agriculture is the backbone of this economy.

  • (Hon. Wakhungu interjected)
  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Hon. Wakhungu, unless you want to give him another minute because he is the Chairman of that Committee, you will be left with only one minute. Mr. Chairman, you may finish your last sentence.

  • Ayub Savula Angatia

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, I have said that CAN fertilizer is arriving in this country between 10th and 15th June for distribution. That is way past the top- dressing season.

  • Ayub Savula Angatia

    Actually, we are expecting a drop in food production this season.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    The Mover, if you want to prosecute this matter further, you can come up with a Bill and we will discuss it.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Yes, Hon. Wakhungu!

  • Chrisantus Wamalwa Wakhungu

    Thank you, hon. Deputy Speaker. I want to take this opportunity to thank all Members of Parliament who have supported this Motion overwhelmingly. Indeed, the Government has heard your request.

  • Chrisantus Wamalwa Wakhungu

    I would like to say that failure to plan is planning to fail. The Bill is in motion and I will forward it to the Chairman of the Departmental Committee on Agriculture, Livestock and Cooperatives so that whatever we have discussed can be implemented.

  • Chrisantus Wamalwa Wakhungu

    I beg to move. Thank you.

  • (Question put and agreed to)
  • UPGRADING OF HOSPITALS INTO CANCER/RENAL CENTRES IN COUNTIES

  • Joseph Gachoki Gitari

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, I beg to move the following Motion:-

  • Joseph Gachoki Gitari

    THAT aware that according to statistics released by the Government of Kenya in July, 2012, cancer and renal diseases are currently the highest killer in the country with at least 22,000 cancer related deaths; concerned that kidney-related deaths in Kenya have reached 2,912 or 0.92 per cent per year of total deaths according to World Health Organization (WHO) data released in April, 2011; noting that there is limited access to cancer screening, treatment, and affordable dialysis at county levels; further aware that the Government received a Kshs522 billion grant from the French Government to establish cancer and renal

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 15
  • centres with well equipped facilities; this House urges the Government to consider upgrading, at least, one (1) hospital in every county and supply necessary equipments to each of the facilities to enable them perform chemotherapy and dialysis procedures.
  • I would like to go on record that the figure that I have quoted in my Motion was given by the then Minister for Health. However, I have been challenged by a friend that I look at it further. But I believe that for purposes of this Motion, this will be possible with the grant which was given.
  • According to the latest World Health Organization (WHO) data published in April, 2011, the people who die out of kidney-related diseases are about 2,912. This has been adjusted to about 19.59 per cent per 100,000 population rank.
  • Kenya is ranked No.77 in the world when it comes to the people who die out of that disease. At least, 22,000 people died from various cancer-related ailments in Kenya last year. According to the Government, 23,000 cases were reported.
  • Kenyatta National Hospital (KNH) is the only public hospital with cancer infrastructure that serves both the Kenyan and East and Central Africa population. That hospital has only two cancer treatment machines to serve the entire population.
  • There is lack of manpower as the hospital has only four specialists who can handle those machines. They are called “oncologists”. KNH has one nuclear medicine personnel and 12 radiographers who do radiotherapy. The---
  • QUORUM

  • Moses Malulu Injendi

    On a point of order, hon. Deputy Speaker. I am just wondering whether we have quorum in the House.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    We do not have a quorum. Ring the Division Bell.

  • (The Division Bell was rung)
  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Hon. Members we now have a quorum. The Mover of the Motion may now continue.

  • Joseph Gachoki Gitari

    Thank you, hon. Deputy Speaker. I was saying that at KNH, there is lack of manpower. We have only four specialists who can handle those machines. They are called “oncologists”. KNH has only one nuclear medicine personnel and there are 12 radiographers and radiotherapists. There is need to support and build capacity for effective operations. There is patient overload at KNH bearing in mind that it is the only hospital handling such cases and, sometimes, patients have to wait for about four months to get the next appointment. Hon. Deputy Speaker, with regard to kidney ailments, there are only 12 machines at KNH. It requires about 30 machines. Dialysis is very expensive. As you are all aware, the National Hospital Insurance Fund (NHIF) does not cover dialysis consumables. The Kenya Kidney Patient and Friends Association was established in 1994 with the aim of assisting kidney patients in Kenya. The Association has written several letters to the Government calling for aid. Currently, there are about 4,500 people who are diagnosed

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 16
  • with kidney diseases annually and only about 400 people get the opportunity to undergo dialysis. A patient is supposed to go through a dialysis procedure for four hours twice or thrice a week. Currently, patients have only one day per week because of shortage of dialysis machines. Most of the patients camp at the hospital for up to three hours before they get to be attended. That takes a toll on their health. Hon. Deputy Speaker, without belaboring on this, I would like to call upon my colleagues to support this Motion. Since we have the grant from the French Government, we need to establish, at least, one hospital in every county to deal with those problems. For example, in Kirinyaga, we have got the Kerugoya District Hospital. Such hospitals will be tasked with handling such matters. Without taking a lot of time, I wish to call upon Dr. Ottichilo to second this Motion. I also ask hon. Members to support this Motion.
  • Wilber Ottichilo Khasilwa

    Thank you, hon. Deputy Speaker. I want to take this opportunity to thank my good friend, hon. Gitari, for bringing this important Motion before the House. This Motion is very timely. I hope this House will pass it so that we can move forward. Cancer and renal diseases are increasing everyday in this country. Those diseases are becoming a major killer. This is due to our changing lifestyle. Therefore, as a country, we must seize of this problem and find solutions. About 80 per cent of cancer and renal diseases in this country are diagnosed too late for anything to be done about them. Therefore, as my colleague has proposed in this Motion, it is important that we establish proper equipment in each county, so that people can be screened early enough for remedial measures to be taken.

  • Wilber Ottichilo Khasilwa

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, as I said, cancer and renal diseases are lifestyle-related diseases. Therefore, we need to come up with a fully-fledged programme to educate our people on how to live decently in terms of lifestyle, the types of food we eat and how we carry ourselves around, so that we are not exposed to those very dangerous diseases. As the Mover has clearly stated, we have extremely limited facilities for treatment of cancer and renal diseases in this country. In fact, Kenyatta National Hospital (KNH) is the only well known public health institution that deals with those diseases. The rest of the country has no such facilities. So, if one is hit with either of those diseases in the countryside, one has to travel all the way to KNH.

  • Wilber Ottichilo Khasilwa

    Other medical facilities that have such facilities are privately-owned hospitals such as MP Shah Hospital and Aga Khan University Hospital. As we all know, those hospitals are very expensive. For example, chemotherapy is extremely expensive. Therefore, very few people can afford it. I guess that even some of us seated in this House may afford the procedure for only a short while. Thereafter, we may be forced to call for harambees . Therefore, it is important that this proposal is given top priority. Drugs for those diseases are also extremely expensive. Dialysis machines are not available in most of the public hospitals. The machines are available in only a few hospitals. So, the proposal that the grant that has been received from the French Government should be used for the establishment of those facilities in each of the counties is laudable.

  • Wilber Ottichilo Khasilwa

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, apart from making those facilities available at the county- level, it is extremely important to note that we have very few people who are trained on how to deal with cancer and renal diseases. I am informed that in this country, we have

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 17
  • only four oncologists. Those are extremely few. Therefore, the Cabinet Secretary for Health must put in place mechanisms to ensure that training of oncologists and radiographers is fast-tracked because, as much as we may have those facilities in all the counties, we do not have the qualified personnel to deal with those very dangerous emerging trends.
  • Lastly, it is important that we put in place a public awareness programme for Kenyans to know the concerns that those diseases are causing to this country. Kenyans must be well informed on how to deal with cancer and renal diseases at the earliest stages so that they can prevent them rather than wait to be cured. So, the issue of public awareness is very important because, according to available medical records, if victims become aware of their status well in advance, the diseases can be treated. Most importantly, Kenyans’ lifestyle must change. Believing that eating in the best restaurants in the country is eating the best food and, therefore, you are the most advanced is not correct. I can assure you that you are actually courting those diseases. Kenyans’ behaviour of spending so much of their time in bars drinking alcohol actually accelerates the occurrence of those diseases in their body system. It is, therefore, important for Kenyans to understand what they are doing to their bodies as they indulgence in various enjoyment activities.
  • With those remarks, I beg to second the Motion.
  • (Question proposed)
  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Yes, hon. Helen Chepkwony.

  • Hellen Chelangat Chepkwony

    Thank you very much, hon. Deputy Speaker. I rise to support the Motion.

  • Hellen Chelangat Chepkwony

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, many people in this country die of cancer and renal diseases because they cannot afford treatment for those diseases. My family is a victim of one of those diseases and, therefore, I strongly support this Motion to facilitate early diagnosis of those diseases, so that treatment can start at the early stages.

  • Hellen Chelangat Chepkwony

    The Ministry of Health is trying to help women, especially in respect of cervical cancer, by encouraging early diagnosis, so that the disease can be treated at its early stages. However, the programme does not cover the whole country. Therefore, not everybody has been screened. One has to be screened for all types of cancer. We cannot deal with only one type of cancer, namely, cervical cancer for women and leave out other types like throat cancer, stomach cancer, pancreatic cancer, brain cancer, among other types of cancer.

  • Hellen Chelangat Chepkwony

    Therefore, I would like the Ministry concerned to make sure that in every year, they set aside some money for dialysis machines and cancer equipment. The machines should then be taken to the county-level medical facilities so that patients can access services at various centres.

  • Hellen Chelangat Chepkwony

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, it is a pity that 50 years after Independence, we have only four specialists in Kenya, when the Ministry of Health trains medical personnel every year. Where are the specialists being trained by the Ministry going? There is so much brain-drain of specialists from Kenya to other countries because our Government underpays them. The Jubilee Government has pledged to improve health services in this

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 18
  • country. Therefore, alongside this line, the Government should ensure that the welfare of doctors and nurses is catered for adequately, so that we do not continue to have brain- drain of our professionals to other countries.
  • Hon. Deputy Speaker, I support this Motion very much, and I would like things to be decentralised to the counties, so that people can reach there easily, especially for treatment of cancer; treatment of renal diseases should be subsidised like other diseases such as diabetes whose medicine cost has been subsidized. We would also like them to subsidise the treatment of kidney diseases and cancer. I support this Motion.
  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Is hon. John Waluke Koyi in the House? If he is not in, then let us have hon. Daniel Sitati. Hon. Members are resorting to interesting tricks like leaving their microphones on when they are not in the House.

  • Daniel Wanyama Sitati

    Thank you, hon. Deputy Speaker. I rise to support this Motion with a lot of passion. One of the fundamental issues that our forefathers, who struggled for Independence wanted to tackle was better health for the Kenyan citizens. It is important for this Jubilee Government to take this into consideration, because there are quite a number of people, particularly in the rural areas, who cannot access this facility; this is particularly so with men who suffer from prostate cancer. The facilities at the local hospitals are not available and, as the Motion says, the only place that this can be found is at the Kenyatta National Hospital (KNH). It is, therefore, important that the grant given by the French Government should go to all the counties in this country, and they should be able to get a referral hospital to deal with this issue. If this does not happen, given the numbers that have been estimated as suffering from these diseases, what we are looking for in terms of Vision 2030 may not be attained due to lack of human resources. It will only be attained if we have human resources. The specialists attending to these issues are very scarce; just as other hon. Members have mentioned, the Government should actually pull up its socks in terms of remuneration to this specific department. Our doctors should be well paid, so that we can remain with them for them to take care of our people suffering from this ailment. It is important that after apportionment of these funds they go to the specific counties. With immediate effect, the Government should take care of our people, so that we may have a very healthy nation.

  • Daniel Wanyama Sitati

    I support. Thank you.

  • .

  • Deputy Speaker

    I want to give the opportunity to hon. Anyango, who has an amendment.

  • Dalmas Otieno

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, thank you very much for giving me this opportunity. I wish to support this Motion because it is so important; it is actually urgent but I support it with an amendment to delete from the Motion the words “further aware that the Government received Kshs522 billion grant from the French Government to establish cancer and renal centres with well equipped facilities.”

  • Dalmas Otieno

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, I am aware we have not received such a huge sum of money from the French Government. I am also aware that we are negotiating not even with the French Government but with a private French foundation to see if they could be supportive of our cancer centre development policies in the country. Even the figure of Kshs522 billion would be on a very long term basis. So, I suspect the Mover received this

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 19
  • information from the media, but it is not accurate. The rest of the Motion is so good and needs the support of all of us; the amendment is just by deleting those words.
  • We have not received any such money from the French Government; if the Motion proceeds as it is, the French Government will be up in arms denying that they have given any such grant for cancer centre development to the Government of Kenya, and the Kenya Government will also be up in arms saying that they are not aware of ever receiving such money. The figure is so big and it would raise eyebrows. It is only a proposal under negotiations with a private French foundation; hopefully we will get something. This French foundation has not operated in Kenya before, but they are operating in the West African countries. Hon. Deputy Speaker, I have discussed with the Mover this neat job. We just delete that and then the rest of the Motion will be good enough for debate. I beg to move the amendment and ask hon. Wanyonyi to second. Thank you.
  • Ferdinard Kevin Wanyonyi

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, I second.

  • (Question, that the words to be left out be left out, proposed)
  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Do we have some contribution to this amendment before we continue with the main Motion?

  • Hon. Members

    Put the Question.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Some of you are saying that I put the Question?

  • Hon. Members

    Yes, hon. Deputy Speaker.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    Okay, I will then put the Question.

  • (Question, that the words to be left out be left out, put and agreed to)
  • (Question of the Motion as amended proposed)
  • .

  • David Gikaria

    On a point of order, hon. Deputy Speaker.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    I now see a point of order by hon. Gikaria. Are you on a point of order or do you want to contribute?

  • David Gikaria

    Hon

  • .

  • Deputy Speaker, I am on a point of order. I just want to talk about what hon. Anyango was saying. We want to understand something for the sake of the future because we are also in line to bring Motions to this House, which are supposed to pass through the office of the Clerk; of course they have to be signed by you, so that they can find their way to the Floor of the House. Assuming that we will be having these kinds of Motions with huge inaccuracies like this, what will happen? As hon. Anyango has put it, I beg to be advised whether the office of the Clerk needs to verify some of the information before it finds its way to the Floor of the House. I am saying this because I am little bit disturbed; when I saw Kshs522 billion, I thought then I should have a cancer centre in my area. Unfortunately, one of the nominees in my county to the health docket was actually thrown out by the County Speaker, just because he said that it was too expensive to put up a cancer centre within the county.
  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 20
  • Thank you, hon. Deputy Speaker.
  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    This is an issue of concern and I am informed that the hon. Member was informed that there may have been some inaccuracies. I hope you are also aware of Standing Order No.91, which clearly states that an hon. Member shall be responsible for the accuracy of any facts which the Member alleges to be true, and may be required to substantiate any such facts instantly. So, I think what hon. Anyango has done has saved us from holding the hon. Member responsible for facts which have been said not to be factual. If we have deleted it, we shall leave the matter to rest there, since it is no longer in our records. So, let us move on with the Motion minus the facts we have been told are not factual or true.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    We shall then move on to other hon. Members. There are too many points of order. Hon. Dawood, is it a point of order or do you want to contribute?

  • Abdul Rahim Dawood

    Hon. Deputy Speaker, I want to contribute as well as raise a point of order, because we are supposed to be in another Committee meeting dealing with finance.

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    I am sorry I cannot allow you to do both. Can I hear your point of order?

  • Abdul Rahim Dawood

    On a point of order, hon. Deputy Speaker. We can equip all hospitals but without personnel to run them---

  • Hon. Deputy Speaker

    That is not a point of order!

  • Joyce Wanjalah Lay

    Asante sana Mhe. Naibu Spika kwa kunipatia hii nafasi. Namshukuru Mhe. Gitari kwa kuleta hii Hoja Bungeni kwa sababu ugonjwa wa saratani umeangamiza watu wengi nchini Kenya. Vile vile ni kwamba watu wengi wanaoishi vijijini, hasa kina mama, wanapata shida sana na ugonjwa wa saratani, na hawawezi kufikia matibabu. Hospitali nyingi za mkoa hazina vifaa kama hivyo na pia hawapati kuhamishwa kwa sababu ya ugonjwa huu. Wakati ambapo tunasherehekea mwaka wa Jubilee, kuna mambo mengi ambayo tumejaribu kupigana nayo hapa Kenya, mojawapo ikiwa ni magonjwa na ugonjwa huu wa saratani umekuwa hatari kubwa. Kwa hivyo, ni lazima Serikali ichukue hatua na kutilia maanani kama itawezekana kuwa na vifaa vya kupima saratani na kuuguza. Zaidi ya hayo ni heri tuwafahamishe watu katika kila kaunti kuhusiana na ugonjwa wa saratani; kina mama wafundishwe jinsi gani wanaweza kujichunguza wenyewe kabla hawajakumbwa na saratani ya matiti. Pia, tuwahamasishe watoto kwa sababu si wazee peke yao wanaopata. Hata akina mama wa makamu na watoto wanapata saratani. Kwa hivyo, itakuwa jambo la maana kama Serikali itaweza kuwa na vifaa katika kila mkoa ama kaunti ili tuweze kuupiga vita ugonjwa huu au kuchunguza. Sana sana nitakuwa nasimamia upande wa kina mama kwa sababu wanapata saratani ya kizazi; wengi wanakosa kupata watoto kwa sababu ya ugonjwa huu. Kwa hivyo, hili litakuwa ni jambo la maana. Kwa hayo machache, naunga mkono.

  • [Hon. Deputy Speaker left the Chair]
  • [The Temporary Deputy Speaker (Hon. Cheboi) took the Chair]
  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 21
  • Shakila Abdalla

    Hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, I first want to thank hon. Gitari for this very timely Motion. Cancer is a killer disease and it should be declared a national disaster like Malaria and other diseases. Cancer, apart from being a killer disease, is very expensive to treat and before one realizes that they suffer from cancer, they suffer a lot simply because we do not have experts, medicine and equipment in place. Most patients waste a lot of money travelling even outside the country only for them to be told that they are suffering from cancer; this is because our hospitals do not have the facilities within this country to detect this kind of disease. It is high time the Government came up with a programme to put in place for this disease. I even disagree with the figure of 22,000. I know there are more deaths than that because most of the people who die of cancer have not been detected to have died of cancer. They do not even know that they are suffering from cancer. Some get to know it at the last point. I support this Motion and urge the Government to take serious action regarding cancer. We need to train our professionals to handle this disease. We need to have doctors who can detect diseases at an early stage. We also need to have medicine, which will be accessible to ordinary mwananchi. Initially diseases like cancer and kidney ailments were for the rich people, but you now realize that even the poorest of the poor suffer from these diseases. So, medicine has to be readily accessible and available for the poor mwananchi, who is suffering from this disease. With those few remarks, I beg to support.

  • Joseph Mburu Kahangara

    Thank you, hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker. I rise to support this Motion. First of all, I would like to thank hon. Gitari for bringing this Motion in time. I would like to say that hon. Members of this august House are aware that most of the issues and problems we face from our constituents are related to diseases and hospital bills. Some of them are, indeed, related to the diseases we are talking about, cancer and renal problems because they are normally diagnosed very late. When you go down to our constituencies, these diseases are considered to be--- When one is diagnosed with cancer, it is as if that person is already dead, because treatment takes a life time. Patients have to undergo dialysis or probably kidney transplant. In the case of cancer treatment there is the issue of chemotherapy, which is normally a life time process. Hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, this Motion has been brought before this House in good time; as the Mover of the Motion proposes, we urge the Government to upgrade one hospital in every county and have it equipped with the necessary machines. I would also want to imagine that when we talk about counties--- We have 47 counties in the country, and you will realize that when you have a hospital in a county like Mandera, a number of people will be very far away from the hospitals which are probably situated at the county headquarters. I am proposing that, as we urge the Government to upgrade and equip hospitals at the county level; we also need to have hospitals upgraded even at the constituency level. By the time people reach to the counties for treatment, they will have received treatment in other hospitals which are within the constituencies. The other thing which I want to talk about is distance. For example, Lari Constituency, where I come from, has about 440 square kilometers; it is, of course, not very big compared to other constituencies. You will realize that you do not have a single

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 22
  • hospital within the constituency. I would wish to say that we have only one health facility that gets drugs to supply to about 12 dispensaries. Even other diseases become a problem to manage because people have to travel long distances to access the health facility and medicine or treatment for that matter in various facilities within the constituency. I would also wish to tell the Government that the health facilities that we have at the constituency level should be upgraded to probably level four. This is because when you have level three health facility the kind of medicine that it receives is different. You will realize that they do not get medicine for diabetes, psychiatric problems, cancer and renal problems. When the facility is upgraded to level four, patients are able to get medicine for chronic diseases. So, as we urge the Government to upgrade one hospital in every county and also provide equipment, I would also urge the Government to train enough personnel and make sure that our facilities have enough drugs for patients. Hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, I support the Motion and urge the Government to consider upgrading other facilities in order for our people to access doctors and medicine closer to where they live.
  • Leonard Kipkosgei Sang

    Thank you, hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker for giving me this opportunity to contribute to this Motion, as amended by hon. Anyango. I want to support this Motion; it is very surprising that in the 21st Century we are seeing a good number of Kenyans dying of some of the conditions that can be managed. It is very surprising that 22,000 Kenyans have died of cancer and another 2,912 people of diabetes. Most of these conditions, as has been said by some hon. Members, are actually preventable. Types of cancer like the cervical, breast, stomach, esophagus and others can actually be diagnosed early. There are some steps that can be taken, so that we do not lose lives unnecessarily. Hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, I know the health seeking behavior of Kenya is somehow poor. I would like to take this opportunity to urge Kenyans to improve on health seeking behaviors so that they go to health facilities in good time so that these conditions can be diagnosed and patients get medicines as required. We are also supposed to improve on early education to the public so that the public is aware of some of the presentations that they see. This way, they can actually be able to identify problems in good time so that they can get assistance at an appropriate time; to avoid losing life unnecessarily. With regard to diabetes, I know most of the complications that I have seen in this country. I know these are some of the true conditions. Diabetes and hypertension contribute to kidney failure, or what is called renal failure in medical terms. I have seen patients suffering from diabetes in my constituency of Buret in Kericho County. These patients are taken to very far hospitals like Moi Teaching and Referral Hospital, Eldoret and some to Kenyatta National Hospital for dialysis. I know it is actually costly because a session of dialysis costs around Kshs5,000 plus cost of transportation; this makes it expensive. Dialysis is probably done on weekly basis. Most of these health complications can be prevented. What I can probably ask the Mover of this Motion as amended, hon. Gitari, is to urge the Government to procure and give patients some digital machines, which are available in the country, for example, machines for monitoring blood pressure and sugar level; one can use them at home to monitor the disease. We can actually curb most of these complications that destroy our kidneys.

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 23
  • Hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, I have seen a number of hospitals set up through the Constituencies Development Fund (CDF) in most constituencies. In Buret we have a good number of hospitals; I would urge the Government to employ more para- medics, those are the clinical officers, the nurses and the health care providers, like the laboratory technicians. These personnel may have to screen most of the patients who go to level one, two and three hospitals. We may avoid many deaths, if we do that. With those remarks, I support this Motion and urge the Mover to move with speed, so that we may avoid more deaths. Thank you.
  • Andrew Mwadime

    Thank you, hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker for giving me this opportunity to contribute to this Motion. Actually, this Motion is in line with the spirit, objectives and principles of devolution. Treatment of cancer, renal and kidney related diseases is directly proportional to the cost of living. At the moment, many people are suffering from kidney related diseases and the cost of treating them is very high; therefore, hon. Gitari has brought this Motion before this House at the right time. Hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, I support this Motion because dialysis is one of the most expensive procedures in disease management. Cancer is also the same. Therefore, I am supporting this Motion so that the necessary equipment is installed in dispensaries at the county and even constituency levels. Hospitals at the county level should be upgraded, so that they treat these diseases. In my constituency, Mwatate, people who are suffering from these diseases normally travel all the way to Nairobi for treatment, which is about 500 kilometers. At times they go to Tanzania for medical attention. Therefore, I am supporting this Motion and the Mover should move with speed, so that it is implemented. Thank you.

  • Yusuf Kifuma Chanzu

    Thank you, hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker for giving me this opportunity to support this very important Motion. I want, first of all, to congratulate hon. Gitari for bringing this Motion to this House. For those of us who have been in this Parliament for some time, there have been attempts, even by Parliament, to have this issue addressed but it has not been attended to by the Government. A few years back when the machines at Kenyatta National Hospital were not working for quite some time, the only place where patients would be attended to was Uganda. So, we are dealing with a very delicate situation. Even the machine that we are talking about at Kenyatta National Hospital cannot be relied on. So, it is very important that this issue is addressed very seriously. What hon. Gitari has proposed here is the responsibility of the Government; it should look for funds and have this proposal implemented. Hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, we have been talking about reforms, or changes in a number of areas. Some of the areas that have not been well attended to are those to do with health. I can see that we have done fairly well in some sectors. For example, the Constituencies Development Fund has worked very well. However, it did not address the issue that this Motion is urging action on. This is because this is a major issue which requires a lot of financial outlay.

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 24
  • Hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, we have done very well in roads infrastructure. You can see what we are doing because of devolution and getting constituencies or counties to be responsible for their own activities. We have also seen the same in the education sector. I am happy that the Ministry of Health - after a long time of politics and splitting into small units just to reward some people - is now one. So, the Cabinet Secretary and his team will be able to focus on this issue without politicizing it. They should allocate funds to this sector, so that we can accomplish some of the reforms we have talked about for a long time.
  • Hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, this goes hand in hand with what we have been talking about not only in the Constitution but also as the earlier leadership of the country and the manifestoes we had all the time. From 1963, we have been talking about bringing services closer to the people, but it has just been political rhetoric. However, this Motion is trying to push this issue on the basis of some kind of research, as it has been said by one of the contributors in this House. I think the number of deaths is more than 22,000, but it is good for a start that we have some information on which we are able to work.
  • The other thing which is very important here is the issue of cost. This is because one thing that happens with some of these diseases is that in the course of trying to diagnose, or find out what somebody is suffering from, or even before you complete the diagnosis, the patient dies. This happens even when you have spent a lot of money. You will go to a certain hospital in the rural areas and the disease cannot be detected. I know about a person who had a problem with the kidneys, but when she went to a hospital, she was treated for malaria. However, after some time, they discovered that it was a more serious case. It will be easier if medical equipment is brought closer to the people. We will also encourage our people that they should not only go for check-ups when they fall sick; medical facilities are available. It is good for people even to go for check-ups, so that they can detect these diseases early, and they get proper treatment, or address the condition when it is in its early stages.
  • Hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, the funding will be an issue. This Motion on cancer and renal diseases also tells the Government to wake up on a number of other aspects. It is important that with the new changes that we have now--- After talking too much, we have a new Constitution now which provides for all these. It is a wake-up call for the Government to ensure that services are delivered not only in relation to these diseases but also in other areas. I remember that during the other year’s Christmas time the Minister for Public Health visited a certain hospital and found that the doctors were not in the institution. She also found some patients lying on the floor. There was another time when we also had a problem with patients fetching water and taking it to the hospital when they went for treatment. So, this is a wake-up call to the Government now. It is good that we have separation of powers, so that we are able to see what the Executive, Parliament and the Judiciary are doing.
  • I support the Motion and congratulate the Mover. I hope that we shall pass it, and have it implemented by the Government.
  • Thank you, hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir.
  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 25
  • Alice Nyanchoka Chae

    Thank you, hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir. I rise to support the Motion that has been brought to this House by hon. Gitari. It is timely and it is very important to all of us who are representatives of our people and also law makers.

  • Alice Nyanchoka Chae

    This is a wake-up call, as the immediate speaker has said. The same thing is happening in other Ministries. It is high time that the Government made sure that we have structures and systems in all departments, which will ensure that the fundamental rights of our population, you and me included, are enjoyed. When our people are suffering, the country is suffering and we cannot move forward. A country with sick people, or people who are unable to work, cannot move forward.

  • Alice Nyanchoka Chae

    Yesterday, we talked about fertilizer; we do not even have a manufacturing factory. Now, we are saying that we do not even have specialists who can treat cancer. We only have four specialists. Where did the rain start beating us? Is it that the institutions that train doctors cannot train this category of people who can treat people with these diseases? Is it that they train and after training the specialists are not paid well in Kenya and they decide to go for greener pastures?

  • Alice Nyanchoka Chae

    It is high time Parliament woke up and assisted the State to ensure that the fundamental rights of our people, as stipulated in Article 21 of the Constitution of Kenya, are observed. Article 43 also guarantees the rights of everybody. Hon. Gitari has moved a good Motion and we should support him all of us. We must ensure that our population accesses the medical facilities. This Motion has awakened me. I now remember the many functions I have attended donating money to patients to go to India for transplants. There are people who come to the KNH, but they die because they do not get treatment. We need to act fast. Our Committee in charge of health needs to ensure that we start training specialists needed to treat cancer and renal diseases in our country. We have to be ready. With or without the grant, it is the duty of the Government of Kenya to ensure that Kenyans access medical services. We need public awareness also, so that people are sensitized on the benefits of screening for cancer. We cannot talk, however, of public awareness when the people who are supposed to treat the disease are not there. We will not be working. We need to go back to the drawing board and put in place systems and structures to ensure that we stand on our feet. I support the Motion and ask the whole House to do so.

  • Col (Rtd) Ali Rasso Dido

    Thank you, hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, for this opportunity. I wish to thank hon. Gitari for this very important Motion. I notice that had hon. Gitari not brought this Motion some of us would have done so; we support this Motion passionately. Our people are dying from cancer and renal diseases in large numbers. The adage that prevention is better than cure should apply in this case. However, we notice that it is not likely to happen very soon. The question we legislators should be asking is: What are the causes of these two diseases? Why are they killing our people so easily? Why are they killing so many people within a period of ten to 15 years? I come from Saku in Marsabit County. Currently, cancer is the main cause of deaths for people between the age of 35 years and 55 years. The mortality rate is such that between two and four people die every week. There is nothing in Marsabit Hospital, and so people are referred to Meru Hospital. There are no diagnostic units in Meru. They are, therefore, moved to KNH. What normally happens is that since many of these cases

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 26
  • are people with very little means, they are forced to go back to the rural areas to wait for their last days. That is the pathetic situation in which these two diseases are putting people in this country. It is high time that we declared these diseases a national disaster. In the old district hospitals, which are now going to be called county referral hospitals, there are no medical staff. They have run down infrastructure, and they lack basic essential drugs. You may find one doctor attending to 1,000 patients or thereabout. So, really we do not have the infrastructure, and resources should be taken to the county level. As legislators we must ask the Government to invest at least 16 per cent of its revenue in health. This is in accordance with the requirements of Millennium Development Goals. Are we really doing that through our national Budget? There could be help from outside, but what we must ask the Jubilee Government is what it is doing about this. When dealing with HIV/AIDS we need to undertake research in KEMRI and in other research institutions. When dealing with HIV/AIDS we established VCTs. We must come up with similar infrastructure to undertake studies on renal diseases and cancer, so that these diseases can be detected at very early stages. WHO must be brought on board, so that we establish the reason for high numbers of cases of these diseases at KNH; these diseases are particularly prevalent in the pastoralist areas, where many of the deaths are occurring. The other suggestion is that we should undertake regular checks on our population. A healthy nation is a wealthy nation. I beg to support this Motion.
  • Moses Malulu Injendi

    Thank you, hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir---

  • QUORUM

  • Paul Simba Arati

    On a point of order, hon. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir. I just wanted to know if we have the quorum to proceed with the sitting. Given that this is a House of order, we need to have the numbers. I have observed that we do not have a quorum.

  • Moses Kipkemboi Cheboi (The Temporary Deputy Speaker)

    Hon. Members, from the look of things there is no quorum. I order the Division Bell to be rung for ten minutes. As we do that, hon. Members who are inside here, unless you are a Whip you are actually supposed to stay in.

  • (The Division Bell was rung)
  • (Some hon. Members walked towards the Bar as the Quorum Bell rang)
  • Moses Kipkemboi Cheboi (The Temporary Deputy Speaker)

    Order! Order, hon. Members! It is against the rules of this House to walk out as the Quorum Bill rings.

  • ADJOURNMENT

  • Moses Kipkemboi Cheboi (The Temporary Deputy Speaker)

    Order! Order!

  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • June 05, 2013 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES 27
  • Hon. Members, there being no quorum, the House is adjourned until this afternoon, at 2.30 p.m.
  • The House rose 11.30 p.m.
  • Disclaimer

    The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

  • search Hansard

Mzalendo Mzalendo
  • Home
  • Hansard
  • Facebook – Share this page
  • Twitter – Share this page
  • Instagram
  • YouTube
  • Privacy
  • Give us feedback

Subscribe to our newsletter

Your weekly summary of what’s happening in parliament.

Or browse past issues

This site runs on open source code written by mySociety.