Serjeant-at-Arms, can you ring the Quorum Bell?

Hon. Members, we now have quorum to transact business. Clerk-at-the-Table.

Order, Hon. Members. I have two Petitions to present. You know that after a Petition is presented, you have 30 minutes to make any comments. I will combine both and give you 30 minutes to make any comments that you may wish to make.

Hon. Members, there is a Petition regarding the amendment to the Kenya Information and Communications Act. Article 119 of the Constitution accords any person the right to petition Parliament to consider any matter within its authority. Further, Standing Order 225(2)(b) requires the Speaker to report to the House any Petitions, other than those presented by a Member. In this regard, I wish to report to the House that my Office has received a Petition from one Patrick Kaberia, Director of PAWA Africa - a civil society organisation engaging in civic leadership, social justice, social-economic development, sustainability and governance – regarding the amendment to the Kenya Information and Communications Act. The Petitioner observes that due to rapid growth of Information and Communications Technology (ICT) and digital economy, there is an urgent need to amend the Kenya Information and Communications Act to align it with the current and emerging realities of a connected digital world to enhance growth and expansion of both economic and social sectors of the nation. He further highlights the emerging issues in the digital economy such as information and cyber security threats, copyright issues, content creation, broadcast and communication, misinformation, online and mobile transactions in a global competition and digital transformation that need to be regulated. This will enable the deriving of maximum benefits while averting possible threats caused by trends in IT and digital economy and to help maintain better internet governance. The Petitioner, therefore, prays that the National Assembly introduces amendments to the Kenya Information and Communications Act to better govern the digital economy. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Having established that the matter raised in the Petition is well within the authority of this House, and further that the matters raised in this Petition are not pending before any court of law, constitutional or legal body, I hereby commit the Petition to the Public Petitions Committee for consideration pursuant to Standing Order 208A. The Committee is required to consider the Petition and report its findings to the House and the Petitioner in accordance with Standing Order 227(2). Thank you.

Hon. Members, can you take the nearest seats? Take the nearest seat, Hon. Pkosing. Hon. Members, the second Petition is regarding gazettement of Rachuonyo North as a hardship area.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. I rise to comment on one of the petitions, specifically the one by Fredrick Gaya on the gazettement of Rachuonyo The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

North Sub-County as a hardship area. This hardship area debate has not begun now. It is time the Teachers Service Commission (TSC) provides this House with the information on its classification of hardship areas. I remember in the 11th Parliament, we spoke about Gilgil. I also spoke about it in the 12th Parliament. I know you have committed it to the Public Petitions Committee but, at the end of the day, so many other areas are affected. The issue is that they usually look at an area like Nakuru and say that it is not a hardship area. There are pockets in Nakuru that are hardship areas. My proposal would be that, as the Committee looks at the Petition, it should also look at historical data provided in terms of hardships. I know the issue of Gilgil and Ndaragwa has been in this House. Let the Committee give us a way forward. We end up bringing petitions but there is usually no way forward. As the Committee looks at the Petition on Rachuonyo North, let it also look at it wholesomely so that we know the parameters that the TSC uses so that we can retain the teachers we have. Many areas like those in my constituency are semi-arid, and we are suffering because schools are not able to retain teachers. Areas like Thugunui and Washati are hard-hit by drought and are not able to retain teachers. I hope the Committee can look at the global issue to ensure that we have a way forward in terms of how the classification is done by the TSC. I thank you.

Hon. Emmanuel Wangwe, three minutes.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. I want to comment on the Petition by one Mr Patrick on power, and the issue of the digital economy. The world is now a global village, and we need to align Kenya to the global village. Whereas Patrick has mentioned the issue of amending the law to align it with existing infrastructure, it is also important that we look at the institutions that are empowered to provide the support. How are they charging customers? Are we going to give them power to continue over-charging customers? Look at an instance where a telecommunications company gives instructions on how much is supposed to be spent and if you do not spend it, it is neither an unclaimed financial asset and it ends up in the books of the company. Therefore, this is an issue that the departmental committee needs to look at in totality. It is not just about looking at enacting laws for the establishment of those institutions, but also how to cushion Kenyans from expenses on that. On the Petition on Rachuonyo North, all of us seem to be in the same shoe, wondering what is happening with the TSC. In a constituency like Navakholo where I come from, teachers are not retained simply because the nearest town is 40 kilometres away. How do you decide an area is a hardship area or not? Whereas we support the Petition, we also need the TSC to clearly tell us how it classifies hardship areas. Does my constituency qualify? If not, how do we retain teachers in such sub-counties? Thank you, Hon. Speaker. I support the two petitions.

Hon. Dido Raso.

Thank you very much, Hon. Speaker. I wish to comment on the two petitions. I think it is satisfying to see citizens participating in the making of the law. On the Petition on ICT, I think it is not just about the new frontier. It is the frontier of our times and of the next many generations. We need to look at what is happening around the world. All communication superhighways are not roads. It is about the ICT conurbation. For that reason, although we will give the Petition to a particular Committee, the Departmental Committee on Information, Communication and Innovation is best placed to handle it. On the issue of hardship areas, I think we will allow the person from Rachuonyo to visit Marsabit, take him to Laisamis, North Horr, Moyale and Mandera East to see first-hand for himself what hardship areas look like. I do not disregard his thought of having his area gazetted as a hardship area.

I support the Petition. Thank you, Hon Speaker. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Hon. Waweru.

Dagoretti South, UDA): Thank you very much, Hon. Speaker. I will limit my comments to the Petitioner who has petitioned this House on matters to do with ICT. In the last Parliament, this House, in its own wisdom, decided that petitions should go to the Public Petitions Committee. Hon. Speaker, Standing Order No.1 gives you discretion, as the Chair, to decide what is fit to do. The point I want to make is that this Petition is extremely technical. Maybe, you can use your discretion and decide that, instead of it going to the Public Petitions Committee, it should go to the Departmental Committee on Information, Communication and Innovation. Without divulging too much information, the Kenya Information and Communications Act (KICA) is lined up for review by this Committee. The matters that are being raised in this Petition will form very good grounds for public participation, as we consider this Bill.

Hon. Speaker, at this point, matters to do with ICT are so important for two reasons. First, it is because, globally, the move is towards technology, which is a cutting edge for specialised sub-sectors. Second, in this era, we are talking about artificial intelligence, robotics, internet of things, data and data protection, cybercrime and its effects in the society. These are very technical issues that may not be handled by the Public Petitions Committee. We beg this comes to the Departmental Committee on Information, Communication and Innovation. I can see both Hon. Kivasu and Hon. Kimaiyo agreeing that this belongs…

Your time is up. Hon. Okuome.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. I want to comment on the Petition regarding the hardship areas. Karachuonyo or Rachuonyo North is my constituency, and I represent it. I am very happy that one of my constituents has written what you have read to us. What he has said is, indeed, true. Karachuonyo has been going through a very difficult time for many years. It is one of the oldest constituencies in independent Kenya. In fact, it became a constituency in 1963 and since that time, we have never managed to have enough teachers in our schools. The enrolment of students is always very high, but the teachers are always less than the number of classes in each school. This means at any given time, some children are just seated in class without a teacher.

Hon. Speaker, Karachuonyo is a very dry area, the cost of living is very high and our people are suffering. Many teachers do not even want to teach in Karachuonyo, and many people do not want to work there because life is very difficult. Due to those reasons, I support this Petition. I hope the Committee to which it will be assigned considers it favourably.

Wanyonyi Tim, Member for Westlands.

Thank you Hon. Speaker. I wish to comment on the Petition on ICT. As a country, we need to move with currency. Recently, when we were in Mombasa, we interacted with the Kenya Broadcasting Corporation (KBC), the national broadcaster. They commented that they are grappling with obsolete equipment in their studios and, as a result, they are unable to compete effectively with other media houses because of that.

Hon. Speaker, another thing is that even our mainstream media houses are unable to compete with online platforms because the later have snatched business from them, especially advertisements. So, until we move and position ourselves with the current trends the way the world is moving, most of those media houses will collapse and have issues. In fact, some of them have not paid their workers for many months. So, the amendment of this Act will position Kenya with the currency in the world.

Hon. Speaker, I support this Petition. Thank you.

Mulyungi Gideon, Mwingi Central.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. I rise to support the two petitions. Starting with the one by Patrick Kaberia on the amendment of the Kenya Information and Communications Act, we are in the digital era and things have turned The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

high-tech. Therefore, we are faced with a lot of threats through technology which come in different forms like theft, mobile technology, hacking, abusive and indecent behaviour, ethnicity, insecurity of the country and digital gender violence. Therefore, I support this Petition.

On the hardship areas, Karachuonyo is not alone. Even Mwingi Central in Kitui County is also a semi-arid area where people and livestock are dying of hunger. Therefore, in order to attract teachers, this Petition should be considered.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker.

Hon. Milemba Omboko, Emuhaya.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. The reason why teachers really suffer because of hardship allowance is because civil servants wanted to align themselves to areas gazetted by the Teacher Service Commission (TSC). They forgot that teachers go deep inside, while civil servants stay in commercial centres.

Karachuonyo has really suffered since the time of Okiki Amayo, as the Hon. Member has put it. Several petitions have come on this Floor regarding Karachuonyo North, which is surrounded by neighbours who enjoy this facility - like both Subas and the two Kurias. So, workers tend to move. Teachers who are posted to Karachuonyo who like to go to either Suba or Kuria, where they can enjoy the hardship allowance. The Petition is well put by that particular person. I beg that after it is listened to, we have a comprehensive look at the tenets that are used to classify hardship areas. Karachuonyo missed out simply because there was a tarmac road going to Homa Bay, and they thought this had solved its problems.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker.

Ochieng’ David, Ugenya.

Thank you so much, Hon. Speaker. I wish to comment on both petitions. In the first one, for the last five or six years, we have responded to developments in ICT, with a lot of laws criminalising cybersecurity and trying to almost muzzle that sector. In the last few years, we have seen many young people get employed on Tik Tok and WhatsApp. As you know, content creators earn a living in this sector. The law has not changed in tandem with those developments, and that is why I agree with the Petitioner that we should look at this law holistically to make sure Kenyans can earn a living and do their things in this area without being limited by the law.

Secondly, my parents were teachers and are now both retired. There is a time when they were transferred to a very far-flung area in the constituency where I come from. They could not access it and yet they were being paid the same salary they were earning when they lived in an accessible area. That is why I agree with the Petitioner and the Members. They have said that we look at the classification of hardship areas holistically, not just based on one area or the other. Let us have a broader policy and very objective criteria on how to classify a hardship area for teaching and any other public service and government officers. Thank you.

Hon. Murugara Gitonga of Tharaka Constituency.

Thank you very much, Hon. Speaker. My comment on the first Petition is to associate myself with Hon. John Kiarie. I believe the Departmental Committee on Communication, Information and Innovation, where Hon. John Kiarie is the Chair, would most certainly be the best to handle the issues raised in that Petition regarding the proposed amendments. Thus, you may exercise your discretion and make such a direction. As regards the second Petition, it is important that we start seriously considering which areas are to be hardship and which ones are not. Especially with the climate change that is prevailing in the country, many areas that used to be extremely productive are becoming less and less productive to the detriment of our country. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

I brought a Petition here and we successfully prosecuted it, praying that my Tharaka Constituency becomes a hardship area. However, there have been bottlenecks from the Government, the Ministry of Labour and the Office of the President. Up to now, that declaration has not been made. It is a high time the Government moved with speed to implement even some of the resolutions we make here. I support the petitions.

Hon. Marwa Kitayama of Kuria East.

Thank you for giving me this opportunity. Kuria has been mentioned adversely and wrongly. Kuria has four sub-counties, and only one sub-county is designated as a hardship area. It is not true. However, I support that the area in question, Rachuonyo North, be accorded this status because we understand the problems that obtain in that area. Secondly, with all due respect, I think the committees of this House are well represented holistically. I sit in the Committee on Public Petitions. In the last Parliament, I was also a Member of the Departmental Committee on Information, Communication and Technology. Therefore, I am aware and well-endowed with information that can assist that Committee to also prosecute matters on ICT. That goes for a few other Members. I think they are about four or five who have similar, if not more, experience on matters ICT. I do not think it is enough because if we take that route, every Petition has a place that it should sit. If we take that trajectory, we will then end up not having a Committee on Public Petitions. Thank you very much, Hon. Speaker.

Hon. Atandi Samuel of Alego Usonga.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. I would like to comment on the second Petition on the gazettement of Rachuonyo North Sub- County as a hardship area. This is a very viable Petition. However, I urge the Committee that is going to handle this matter to benefit from the work that has been done by the Commission on Revenue Allocation (CRA). It has done a very good Report on hardship areas in the country. The Report was supposed to be used for distribution or sharing of the Equalisation Fund. That Report captures hardship areas up to sub-location levels. That is a Report that this House and the Committee should benefit from. Otherwise, I support the Petition. Hardship zones are very many in the country, including my own Alego Usonga. This Report should be adopted even by Government agencies for the sake of policy formulation and the distribution and sharing of the national cake.

Thank you, Hon. Atandi. Hon. Gichimu Githinji of Gichugu.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. I have not been to North Karachuonyo and, therefore, I believe I am not best placed to comment on that Petition at this time. I will wait until the relevant Committee brings its report. This is a matter that can also be picked by the Departmental Committee on Education. I believe the Petition is because of the benefits that teachers derive from the areas gazetted as hardship areas. On the Petition in respect of amending the ICT Act, I believe there are two sets of Petitions: general investigative petitions, and petitions that provoke amendments of the law. In this case, since there is a committee mandated by the Standing Orders as the Departmental Committee on Communication, Information and Innovation, I believe your wisdom will find that this Petition is best placed under the relevant Committee that is supposed to deal with amendments of the law. Otherwise, all those other general investigative petitions would be best placed before the Committee on Public Petitions. I support because the ICT area is dynamic. There is always some confusion arising in the digital space. It would be proper for the Committee to be reviewing the Act annually for the purposes of amendments that may be necessary.

The last, Amb. Benjamin Lang'at of Ainamoi. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. I thank the Member who has brought the Petition on hardship areas for teachers. Although he has mentioned his constituency, this matter that needs to be looked at nationally as it affects all teachers within our Republic. The criteria and parameters initially used were limited. It is time we revisited the parameters so that we bring on board many other places that seem to be doing well and yet, they are hardship areas. I encourage the Committee that will be looking into that matter to look at it as a national issue as opposed to a Rachuonyo North issue. Perhaps, the Committee should consider proposing some areas on a graduated scale so that we can bring on board all areas of our constituencies. I support the Petition. As I said, I request that we look at it as a national issue as opposed to a one-area issue.

Thank you. We will close there on petitions. The petitions are committed to the Committee on Public Petitions. On the issue raised by the Member for Dagoretti South, you know you are not, as a committee, limited to do your work because there is a petition. You can, on your own volition and motion, pick up any statute within your jurisdiction, scan through it, propose amendments, and bring them to Parliament as Committee amendments. You do not need to glide or ride on any petition to do your work. You are so advised. Before I call the next Order, I acknowledge the presence, in the Public Gallery, of Mwiki Primary School from Ruiru in Kiambu. On your behalf and mine, we welcome the students and their teachers to the House of Parliament. Next Order! Leader of the Majority Party.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. With your indulgence, also allow me to welcome in a very special way, Mwiki Primary School. I visited the primary school way back in 2018 with His Excellency the President when he was the Deputy President. It is among the most populous primary schools in this country. It took the President’s intervention to build at least five new classrooms for them. Therefore, I welcome them to the National Assembly. Hon. Speaker. I beg to lay the following Papers on the Table: 1. Reports of the Auditor-General and the Financial Statements in respect of the following institutions for the Financial Year ended 30th June 2020, and the certificates therein: (a) Rangwe Technical and Vocational College; (b) Omuga Technical and Vocational College; (c) Kericho Township Technical and Vocational College; (d) Seme Township Technical and Vocational College; and, (e) Institute of Human Resource Management. 2. Reports of the Auditor-General and the Financial Statements in respect of the following institutions for the Financial Year ended 30th June 2021, and the certificates therein: (a) Godoma Technical Training Institute; (b) Bondo Technical Training Institute; (c) Siala Technical Training Institute;

(d) Seme Technical and Vocational College; (e) Ugenya Technical and Vocational College; (f) Kericho Township Technical and Vocational College; (g) Taveta Technical and Vocational College; The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

(h) Asumbi Teachers Training College; (i) Jaramogi Oginga Odinga University of Science and Technology; (j) Maseno University; (k) Kisumu National Polytechnic; and, (l) Kenya Forest Service.

Hon. Leader of Majority Party, you have skipped one; Mabera.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. (m) Mabera Technical and Vocational College. 3. Reports of the Auditor-General and the Financial Statements in respect of the following institutions for the Financial Year ended 30th June 2022, and the certificates therein…

Hon. Leader of the Majority Party, you have switched off.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. (a) Infrastructure Finance and Public Private Partnerships Project – Additional Financing (IDA Credit No.6121-KE); (b) The Kenya Off-Grid Solar Access Project for underserved counties (IDA Credit No.6135-KE - Rural Electrification and Renewable Energy Corporation; (c) Mombasa-Nairobi-Addis Ababa Road Corridor Development Project: (Isiolo/Merille/Moyale Road); (d) Capital Markets Authority; and, (e) State Department for East African Community. I thank you, Hon. Speaker.

Thank you, Hon. Leader of the Majority Party. Next is the Member of Parliament for Dagoretti South, Hon. John Kiarie.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. I beg to lay the following Paper on the Table: Report of the Kenya Delegation to the 145th Assembly of the Inter- Parliamentary Union (IPU) and related meetings held in Kigali, Rwanda from 11th to 15th October, 2022.

Hon. Speaker as you would know, IPU is the Parliament of Parliaments. Thank you very much.

Thank you, Hon. Kiarie. Next Order!

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. I beg to give notice of the following Motion: THAT, this House notes the Report of the Kenya Delegation to the 145th Assembly of the Inter-Parliamentary Union and related meetings which were held in Kigali Rwanda from the 11th to 15th October 2022, laid on the Table of the House on Thursday, 2nd March 2023. I thank you, Hon. Speaker.

Hon. Cecilia Ngitit, Member for Turkana County.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. I rise under Standing Order 33(1) to discuss rising insecurity cases in the North Rift Counties. Pursuant to Standing Order No.33(1), I rise to seek leave for the Adjournment of this House in order to discuss a definite matter of urgent national importance regarding the rising insecurity in the North Rift counties. There is great concern over the rising insecurity cases in the counties of Turkana, Samburu, Laikipia, Baringo and Elgeyo Marakwet, where hundreds of lives and a lot of property has been lost, leading to economic deterioration in the region and massive displacement of people. Regrettably, the security apparatus in the region, particularly the National Police Service (NPS), seems to have either been overpowered by the heavily armed bandits, or there is a general lack of goodwill and determination by the National Government to end the spiralling insecurity. In addition, close to 50 police officers, Non-Governmental Organization (NGO) officers and hundreds of locals have lost their lives in the hands of the cattle rustlers who are heavily armed and appear well trained. In the recent past, over 10,000 livestock have also been stolen. It is further regrettable that schools and other public utilities have been shut down due to this perennial insecurity. Hon Speaker, in addition to the internal security issues, Turkana County has been experiencing instances of incursions from across international borders. Turkana County borders three countries; that is, Uganda, South Sudan and Ethiopia. There have been deadly raids against the Turkana people and encroachment of the Kenyan territory leading to loss of lives, livestock and grazing areas over the years. Hon Speaker, it is against this background that I seek your leave for the Adjournment of the House to discuss this matter of national concern on insecurity in the North Rift counties and the international borders, which has destroyed the economic development and social amenities in the region. I call upon the national Government to intervene through a deliberate decisive and permanent action to end insecurity in the region. I thank you, Hon. Speaker.

Hon. Cecilia, you need 20 Members to stand in support of your request before I accede to it.

The support is overwhelming. I thank you Members. You may take your seats. Order, Hon. Members. You have given the effect already. Hon. Cecilia, your Motion will be slated under Order No.10 or at one hour to the end of time, whichever comes first. Next Order.

Hon. Abdirahman Mohammed. We will start with Questions. There are two Questions today. The first one is by Hon Peter Masara, Member for Suna West.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. Pursuant to Standing Order No. 42(a)(5), I rise to ask the following Question to the Teachers Service Commission. (a) What measures has the Commission taken to enable the career progression of P1 Teachers who have attained qualifications of bachelor’s degrees in education and are still teaching in primary schools? (b) Could the Commission consider posting the P1 teachers with bachelor’s degrees in education to teach in Junior Secondary Schools and enhance their remuneration and benefits to be commensurate with their academic qualifications? (c) State the measures the Commission has put in place, if any, to compensate graduate teachers serving under P1 Grade for the years they have worked as graduate teachers and if not, are there any plans to compensate them and how long would it take for the teachers to be compensated? I thank you, Hon. Speaker.

Thank you, Hon. Member. The Question goes to the Departmental Committee on Education. Hon. Members, the next Question is by Hon. Ruweida Obo. She has requested that she has an emergency in her constituency and so, the Question will be deferred to Tuesday afternoon.

Next is Hon. Abdirahman Mohamed Abdi, Member for Lafey.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. Pursuant to the provisions of Standing Order 44(2)(c), I rise to request for a statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Social Protection regarding the implementation status of the cash transfer programme for older persons in the country. It is of great concern that the number of older persons from vulnerable backgrounds, particularly in Lafey Constituency and across the country, who are in need of financial support for their sustainability and regards to their well-being, is tremendously high. Coverage of the older persons cash transfer programme is very low. At the national level, nearly 90 per cent of potential eligible poor households with at least one older person aged 65 and above are not receiving the older person cash transfer programme benefits, indicating a very high under-coverage rate. However, the value of this programme is not sufficient to lift people out of poverty and issues of adequacy remain unsettled. It is against this background that I seek a statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Social Protection on the following: 1. Could the Chairperson request for a status report and a list from the Ministry of those who benefit from this programme in Lafey Constituency and the exact amount they receive? The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

2. Could the Chairperson provide information on the criterion used in the process of selecting the beneficiaries for the older persons cash transfer programme? 3. Could the Chairperson explain the measures and mechanisms the Government put in place for identifying and reaching vulnerable persons such as disabled elders and those who are incapacitated? Thank you, Hon. Speaker.

Next is the Leader of the Majority Party.

Hon. Speaker, pursuant to the provisions of Standing Order 44 (2)(a), I rise to give the following Statement on behalf of the House Business Committee, which met on Thursday, 28th February 2023, to prioritise the business for consideration during the week. As Members are aware, the House approved the Report of the Budget and Appropriations Committee on the First Supplementary Estimates for the Financial Year 2022/2023 on Tuesday, 28th February 2023. This paved way for the publication of the Supplementary Appropriation Bill of 2023. In line with our Standing Orders, all stages of the Bill were considered yesterday and the Bill was passed. Allow me to commend the Budget and Appropriations Committee, the Public Debt and Privatisation Committee and all Members of the House, including all Chairpersons of Departmental Committees that were involved in this process. I commend all Members for their steadfast commitment during this process that saw the successful conclusion of that important business yesterday. With the conclusion of the Supplementary Appropriation Bill, the focus of the House now shifts to the consideration of the Budget Policy Statement (BPS) and the Debt Management Strategy Paper. In this regard, in line with what is listed as Orders Nos. 8 and 9, I expect that we will pass two Procedural Motions this afternoon to allow for extension of the period for consideration of the BPS and the Debt Management Strategy. This will ensure that Committees and the House have enough time to engage all the stakeholders, noting that the resolutions that will emanate from the work around the BPS and the Debt Management Strategy will form the basis for the vertical distribution of national revenue through the Division of Revenue Bill and the Annual Estimates for the next financial year. It is also expected that the House will today consider the Report of the Departmental Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs on the vetting of Hon. Shadrack John Mose for appointment as the Solicitor-General of the Republic of Kenya. I urge Members to be present and to actively participate in this important business of the House this afternoon. Members will note that the House Business Committee resolved to commence the processing of Members’ Questions pending the conclusion of the Report of the Procedure and House Rules Committee on the matter. Several Members have already asked Questions in the House this week. Consultations are ongoing with the Executive as we endeavour to schedule the answering of those Questions in the coming weeks. For the information of the House, business for next week includes resumption of general debate on proposals to amend the Constitution and the Standing Orders, debate on the Report of the 42nd Session of the Organisation of the African, Caribbean and Pacific Group of States and the European Union (ACP-EU) Joint Parliamentary Assembly and the Second The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Reading of the Statute Law (Miscellaneous Amendments) Bill (National Assembly Bill No.60 of 2022), should any of that business not be concluded today. Finally, the House Business Committee will reconvene again on Tuesday, 7th March 2023 to schedule business for the rest of the week. I now wish to lay this Statement on the Table of the House.

Thank you, Leader of the Majority Party. Hon. Members, before I go to the next Order, I wish to acknowledge the presence, in the Speaker’s Gallery, of Kanjalu Girls High School from Tigania West in Meru.

On my behalf and that of Members, I wish to welcome the school, students and their teachers to this House of Parliament. Thank you.

Next Order!

Chairman of the Budget and Appropriations Committee.

Hon. Speaker, I beg to move the following Procedural Motion: THAT, notwithstanding the provisions of Standing Order 232(7) relating to presentation of the Budget Policy Statement, this House resolves to extend the period for consideration of the Budget Policy Statement, 2023 by a period of 14 days from 1st March 2023. In brief, the reason for this prayer is that the law was made for man, and not man for the law. We are in a different period from other years because last year was a transition year. We had a new Government coming into place and, in the process, a lot of time was lost along the way as stipulated in the Public Finance Management Act and in our Standing Orders. The budget-making process primarily starts with something called sector working groups, where 10 sectors that have been compartmentalised in the country meet to discuss their priorities and limits. That ordinarily happens in September. Unfortunately, because of what happened after the elections, that could only be done in November. Therefore, it affected the calendar for the consideration of the BPS. Secondly, budget-making is a consultative process where we need to hear as many voices as possible. In this regard, many Ministries, Departments and Agencies (MDAs) present their issues to various Departmental Committees. Thereafter, the Departmental Committee Chairs appear before the Budget and Appropriations Committee (BAC). As we were considering the Supplementary Estimates, we realised that we have been limiting Chairs when they are presenting issues within their MDAs. First of all, we need to give them time to interrogate their MDAs in a more comprehensive manner. Also, when they appear before the Budget and Appropriation Committee, we do not need to rush them a lot.

Lastly, we are seeking to consider this BPS in a very comprehensive manner. We do not want to do it as a routine where we give Chairs only 10 to 20 minutes. The enormity of this exercise transcends the set time. Later, I will implore this House to make adjustments to the The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Public Finance Management (PFM) Act. We will bring recommendations that instead of the 14 days to report to this House after the tabling of the BPS, we should extend this to 28 days. This is so that we can have these considerations done in ample time because this is a very important exercise.

Hon. Speaker, I move and call upon Hon. Gabriel Kagombe, the Member for Gatundu South to second this Procedural Motion.

Hon. Kagombe.

Hon. Speaker, I stand to second this Procedural Motion because of the seriousness of the timelines in place. Having looked at the Budget Estimates that came to Parliament from the National Treasury, the timeline is not sufficient and I, therefore, second the Motion. Thank you, Hon. Speaker.

Put the question.

There being no interest in contributing to the debate, I will put the Question.

Next Order.

Hon. Speaker, I beg to move the following Motion: THAT, notwithstanding the provisions of Standing Order 232A(4) relating to presentation of the Debt Management Strategy, this House resolves to extend the period for consideration of the Debt Management Strategy, 2023, by a period of 10 days from 1st March 2023.

Hon. Speaker, this House is aware that Kenya’s public debt stock has reached Ksh9.15 trillion and presently accounts for 67 per cent of the Gross Domestic Product (GDP). The 2023 Medium-Term Debt Management Strategy (MDMS) intends to provide a financing strategy that will minimise the cost and risk of public debt. This year, unlike previous years, this House has a dedicated Committee to review the Debt Management Strategy. This is a new level of policy specialisation that this House can count on. We thank the House for the continued support. Based on these factors, I beg to move and ask the Member for Gatanga to Second. I thank you.

The Member for Gatanga.

Hon. Speaker, I wish to take this opportunity to second this Motion, bearing in mind the importance of this Motion and, in particular, the debt management in this country. Our public debt stands at over Ksh9.1 trillion, and Ksh1.3 trillion of our national revenue goes to service that debt. It is appropriate and important that we give each and every Member of this Parliament an opportunity to ventilate on this debt management issue. Therefore, I second this Motion. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you, Hon. Member.

There being no interest in debating the Motion, I now put the question.

Next Order.

Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs.

Hon. Speaker, I beg to move the following Motion:

THAT, taking into consideration the findings of the Departmental Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs in its Report on the vetting of a nominee for the appointment as the Solicitor-General of the Republic of Kenya, laid on the Table of the House on Wednesday, 1st March 2023, and pursuant to the provisions of Section 9 of the Office of Attorney-General Act, 2012 and Section 8 of the Public Appointments (Parliamentary Approval) Act, 2011, this House approves the appointment of Hon. Shadrack John Mose as the Solicitor-General of the Republic of Kenya.

Hon. Speaker, allow me to inform this House that the Departmental Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs has produced a vetting Report after hearing the candidate. This is a detailed Report which each Member ought to have a copy. It contains all the relevant material necessary for approval of that candidate. We began by establishing that the background information was in order, including how the position was advertised. He was interviewed by the Public Service Commission (PSC). Eventually, he was appointed by His Excellency the President, who communicated to the House and the matter was referred to the Departmental Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs. From there, we had approval hearings on 23rd February 2023. It clearly emerged that Hon. Shadrack John Mose, a former Member of Parliament, is qualified to become the Solicitor- General of the Republic of Kenya. We established his educational background, which is straight. We also established his own ethics and he passed very well. He had all the documents. We established his capacity to the be Solicitor-General, and as a renowned lawyer and former Member of Parliament in this Republic, he is qualified. The two blend very well because this is a public office that requires both the professional qualification and public service experience for one to deliver and discharge their duties. We had various findings and observations which are contained in this Report. At the end of it all, we made a recommendation to the House that Hon. Shadrack John Mose be approved. Vetting is not an examination; it is like a peer review where Members of Parliament question the candidate on his or her suitability.

Here, the Solicitor-General is the Deputy Attorney-General in the country. He is also like the Principal Secretary in the Office of the Attorney-General being the Accounting Officer. Most of it, he is a lawyer. In this Departmental Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs, there The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

sits well-known advocates and lawyers who had a peer review of Hon. Shadrack John Mose. They are: Member of Parliament for Kibwezi West and Vice-Chairperson, Hon John Mutuse; Hon. Farah Maalim of Dadaab; Hon. Francis TJ Kajwang’ of Ruaraka; Hon. Otiende Amolo who is senior counsel; Hon. Onyiego Silvanus Osoro; Hon. Makali John Okwisia of Kanduyi; Hon. Wakili Edward Muriu of Gatanga; and, Hon. Maina Jane Njeri of Kirinyaga County. We also had Gichohi Kaguchia John Phillip of Mukurweini, Hon. Mogaka Stephen of West Mugirango and Hon. Mohammed Daudi of Wajir East Constituency. All these are advocates who had a peer review and all of us were of unanimous decision that Hon. Shadrack John Mose be approved. Therefore, with those remarks and having considered the suitability, and integrity of the nominee and pursuant to the laws we have quoted and relied upon, that is, Section 9 of The Office of the Attorney-General Act,2012 and Section 8(2) of the Public Appointments (Parliamentary Approval Act) 2011, the Departmental Committee on Justice Legal Affairs recommends that the National Assembly – which is this House this afternoon – approves the appointment of Hon. Shadrack John Mose to the position of Solicitor-General of the Republic of Kenya.

With those many remarks, I beg to move and request Hon. Sylvanus Onyiego Osoro, the Chief Whip and a Member of the Committee to second. Thank you.

Hon. Osoro, proceed.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. We found out during the vetting that the nominee was admitted in 1992. He has vast experience in legal practice of over 30 years with no single disciplinary case lodged against him with the Law Society of Kenya. He has also run his private practice successfully for about 25 years or so and several young legal practitioners have gone through his law firm. He has also served as a Member of Parliament, of course, for five years and he has created huge networks within this House and across the country with good relationship with several members of high standing in the society. What to note is that even the Member that succeeded him came to offer him moral support. That clearly shows that the gentleman has really had good relationship with the people. With those few remarks, I beg to second.

Thank you, Hon. Osoro.

My request list is full. I do not know if it is full for this matter or earlier Orders. I will start with Hon. Eckomas Mutuse, Member for Kibwezi West.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. I sit in the Departmental Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs as a Vice-Chairperson. I participated in the vetting of Hon. John Mose and I confirm from my own observation that he is suitable to hold the Office of the Solicitor-General. Members are aware that this Parliament is considering the Budget Policy Statement for next year’s Budget, and the Solicitor-General is the Accounting Officer of the State Law Office. Therefore, there is urgency in having a substantive Solicitor-General so as to give policy and accounting direction to the Office of the Attorney- General. For those reasons, I urge this House to approve the appointment having been a former colleague and a professional lawyer of many years’ standing so that we can move forward as a country and have the right people in office. Thank you.

Hon. Jared Okello, Member for Nyando.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker, for the opportunity. On the same breath, I want to also support the appointment of our brother, Hon. Shadrack The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Mose. He was a colleague here. He was such a humble guy. I did not even know that he was a lawyer because of his humility.

Are you saying that lawyers are not humble? You are totally out of order.

I take that back, Hon. Speaker. Suffice to say, Hon. Shadrack coming from the Gusii Community where we have had lots of complaints about alienation when they were giving out the positions of Principal Secretaries, this will feed into helping the Gusii Community come to the realisation that at least they have been remembered. Again, we have had lots of pending bills at the Attorney-General’s office and the Solicitor-General plays an important role in respecting payments when it comes to cases that have been lost by Government in our superior courts. Therefore, I believe that once he settles in office, he will move a little faster to make sure that we do not pile up these pending bills especially for the lowly in society who are feeding not from hand to mouth but finger to tooth. We hope that these payments will be respected and they will have their monies and their lives will improve. Thank you for the opportunity. I support.

Hon. John Kaguchia

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. I belong to the Departmental Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs which vetted Hon. Shadrack Mose. I also stand to support this Motion. When we were interviewing this gentleman, one of the things I appreciated is that he is an honourable Member who has served the people of this country with dedication and commitment and he has shown interest in ensuring that public good is upheld. One of the things that made me consider this candidate positively is because when we asked him whether he is going to assist the Government by giving the correct and right advice, he answered in the affirmative. The Government has had challenges by losing landmark cases. We remember how the Government lost the Building Bridges Initiative (BBI) case and many other cases. What Hon. Shadrack Mose said is that he will give the right advice to the Attorney- General and to the Government to ensure that it wins cases. There are contracts that have been signed by the Government but it ends up losing. The people of this country have ended up losing immensely because of carelessness and sometimes wrong advice. For example, in a situation where we sign a contract in which we cede our sovereignty as a country, that is definitely a wrong contract.

One of the things that Shadrack Mose assured the Committee about is that he is going to be keen to ensure that in future there are no contracts in which the public loses. For example, in the Standard Gauge Railway (SGR) contract, the Government has lost immensely. Those are some of the reasons that made us to recommend approval of the nomination of this gentleman. We believe he is going to be keen, alert, committed and dedicated to his work so that we can have nothing but the best contracts signed by this Government. Lastly, he promised The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

that he is going to fast-track all pending bills at the Attorney-General’s office and ensure that they find their way to this House for approval for the benefit of the people.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Thank you very much. Hon. James Wandayi, Leader of the Minority Party.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, let me make a few comments about this Report on the nominee, Hon. Shadrack Mose, whom I know very well. He joined us in the last Parliament. I have got no doubt that he is a good lawyer. He was not known to be controversial, so his demeanour should help him steer this critical docket. But let me also say that Shadrack Mose is seeking to fill very big shoes. The person he is set to succeed, Mr Ken Ogeto, was a very competent jurist and administrator. I had the occasion to interact with him when I was chairing the Public Accounts Committee in the last Parliament, before which he used to appear as the Accounting Officer of the State Law Office. Ken was able to address issues efficiently, effectively and in a timely manner. I suppose that Shadrack will be able to carry along the work that Ken was doing in that important office. It also comes as a coincidence—I do not know whether it is a coincidence or by design—that both Hon. Mose and his predecessor come from the same region. I am not sure if what Hon. Okello was saying is true—that the Gusii community should see this as a reward. It is not. Shadrack is simply replacing one of their own, so there is no gain for the Gusii Community in this. There is no gain whatsoever for the Gusii Community. In fact, I feel for the Abagusii Community. They have got a very raw deal in this regime. Can you imagine that out of over 50 Principal Secretaries, the Abagusii have not got a single one? That has never happened in the independence history of this country. I am not just talking for the sake of it. That is a requirement of the Constitution. It is in the Constitution that as you make appointments, you put into consideration regional, ethnic and all other balances. Therefore, as we debate the nomination of Hon. Mose, we must feel for the Abagusii Community. This House has got the mandate—in fact the power—to right those kinds of wrongs. Such wrongs must be righted by this House. Otherwise if we let such wrongs take root, this country will go in the wrong direction to the detriment of all of us and future generations. I stand here not to oppose this proposed appointment. I cannot oppose it. It would be wrong for me to oppose it. I would be an accomplice to the injustice being meted on the Abagusii Community if I oppose this nomination. Therefore, I rest my case. Thank you.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Thank you, Leader of the Minority Party. Is there anything out of order, Leader of the Majority Party?

No. I have not contributed.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): You may proceed, Leader of the Majority Party.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I am a little mesmerised by the defence that the Leader of the Minority Party has put up. The only unfortunate thing is that he is trying to incite or excite ethnic feelings, but the people of Kenya are more intelligent than that today. The people of Kenya know that people are appointed and elected to offices on merit. The people of Kenya elected a President on merit and on the basis of his ability and the manifesto he sold and his vision for the people of Kenya. It was not on the basis of his ethnicity. Therefore, I encourage the Leader of the Minority Party to acquaint himself and bring himself up to speed to where the majority of Kenyans are. The majority of Kenyans do not look at us on the basis of our ethnicities but by the content of our heads and how we can apply that to serve them. I support the appointment of Hon. Shadrack Mose not on the basis of his ethnicity. If anything, if I listened to what the Leader of the Minority Party was saying, Hon. Shadrack Mose will be a Principal Secretary per se because he will be the Accounting Officer in the The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Office of the Attorney-General of Kenya. Therefore, you cannot say that there is a community that does not have an accounting officer. Principal Secretaries are accounting officers. Hon. Shadrack Mose is not representing the Abagusii Community. He has been vetted by a Committee. Many Members who spoke ahead of me agree that he merits to serve as an Accounting Officer in the Office of the Attorney-General. He warrants that position. Having served with him in the 12th Parliament, I can confirm to the country that Hon. Shadrack Mose is not just a humble servant of the people but a diligent worker. Those who worked with him in the House Business Committee and in the Departmental Committee on Transport and Public Works in the last Assembly can bear me witness on that. I also worked with him as he ran for a parliamentary seat on a United Democratic Alliance (UDA) ticket. As we formed UDA, we worked very closely with him. He is not a man you can intimidate. He withstood a lot of intimidation and coercion by those who believed they had what they called the deep state and the system and that they had all the powers to indicate to people in parts of Nyanza, where he comes from, where to go to politically. Hon. Shadrack Mose stood firm for what he believed in. I encourage him, as he settles down in the State Law Office to ensure that, as he promised during his vetting, he professionalises the State Law Office. We must not again see many cases being lost in court by the Government. We must work with and support him, as he sought during his vetting to enhance the budget for the State Law Office to ensure that it has good professionals and can retain the best brains in the country. With those many remarks, Hon. Temporary Speaker, I beg to support.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Thank you very much, Leader of the Majority Party. Hon. Lilian Gogo, Member for Rangwe.

Thank you so much, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I also rise to support matters that concern a colleague. Hon. Shadrack is not only a colleague but an astute lawyer, a Kenyan of good standing and well-meaning to the people of Kenya. I want to thank the Departmental Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs for taking its time to vet this particular candidate for this office. There are people out there who think that Members of Parliament or Senate are not well read.

However, from what has been presented here in the name of Hon. Shadrack John Mose who is being proposed to be vetted for the position of the Solicitor-General… Hon. Temporary Speaker, please protect me from loud discussions because I am disrupted.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Order, Hon. Members. I request that you consult in lower tones so that the Member for Rangwe can be heard.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. There are some Members here who think that once they have spoken, then a Question should be put. I am supporting the nomination of this particular candidate. It is a good show that Parliament has content and people who can also be charged with other national responsibilities.

I thank the Committee for doing a good job. I support the proposal that Hon. Shadrack Mose be the Solicitor-General. Thank you. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): What is out of order? Hon. Kagombe, what is out of order?

Hon. Temporary Speaker, I rise on Standing Order 95(1). I have listened to the debate about the appointment of the Solicitor-General in this House and I am convinced that what has been put and the mood of the House is that you put the Question because the debate has been exhaustively discussed. Kindly, call the Mover of the Debate. Thank you.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Order, Hon. Members. I would like to find out whether it is the mood of the House that I put the Question. Hon. Members, is it the mood of the House that I put the Question?

Hon. Members, before I put the Question I am obliged to give an opportunity to the Mover to reply. Mover.

Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I beg to reply. Thank you.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Hon. Members, I, therefore, put the Question.

The Member for Turkana County, you may now move the Adjournment Motion.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I rise to table this Motion of Adjournment of the House under Standing Order 33(1) to discuss the rising insecurity cases in the North Rift counties. I had read the Notice of Motion and all I want to do now is mention a few things then invite my colleagues to elaborate on the same. Hon. Temporary Speaker, it cannot be business as usual; we cannot afford to sit here comfortably when people in some other parts of Kenya are not living well as it should. As we sit here, some families have been displaced from their ancestral land due to banditry. Some schools have been burnt down and Kenyan children are not going to school because the bandits burnt down their schools. Some roads that are linking Kenya to international businesses are not passable. For instance, A1 Road linking Kenya to South Sudan is impassable as we speak. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Many people have lost lives and property. As we sit here, many families in the Turkana Region and I believe in the other regions too that I mentioned, have been rendered poor. They have lost their livestock to this banditry menace. As you know, in those regions, livestock is the main livelihood. Hon. Temporary Speaker, we have lost many properties to the banditry menace. We have lost schools and facilities like hospitals which have been burnt down. It is no longer cattle rustling as people say. The conflict in the North Rift has become a land issue. As you can observe, when these people are raided and killed, the perpetrators of this heinous acts move to settle in those places. This means that their main aim is to chase away people from their ancestral land in search of enlarging their territories. We have lost Government officials to this menace. The former President gave a directive after Kenya lost over 20 General Service Unit (GSU) officers in Kapedo. The perpetrators would just go on and say sorry to the President and that they thought they were Turkanas – and that was on record. The bandits went ahead and donned uniform, took away the guns and killed more Kenyans using our own ammunition. There are instances where when you go to the war scene, you get to know that some of the cartridges of war are our own and made with Kenya labels. This means that these bandits are accessing ammunition from Government factories. Today, I want to thank the President of the Republic of Kenya. As the head of Kenya Defence Forces (KDF) in this country, he ordered that the KDF be deployed in these areas that have recorded high numbers of attacks. As we speak, although we do not have clear information; this is the august House and we are not allowed to share rumours here but we can share what we have heard out there. Word has it that some leaders in this House are on record for financing this menace and they have gone ahead to contribute money to compromise the KDF commanders so that they do not carry on with their duties as directed by the Commander- in-Chief. As we speak, there is an ongoing operation in those regions but there are still attacks and raids. There are students who are not going to school. Their schools have been burnt down yet the operation is still ongoing. We do not understand the distance between the KDF camps and the location that the bandits are operating from. There are video clips making rounds in the social media showing drones that belong to KDF. They have seen where the bandits are hiding, cooking and even taking their breakfast. The bandits are even attempting to shoot the drones yet nothing is being done. We just want to know this person that is above the President that these bandits depend on. We have seen leaders making inciting statements and nothing has been done about them. We have even seen a leader threaten the Government that if they bring them anarchy, they will serve them anarchy in huge doses. The Government has not done anything to them. Hon. Temporary Speaker, the financiers of banditry in the North are in this House. They are sitting pretty and the Government is just looking at them. We want the Government to smell the coffee. It is no longer business as usual. Banditry has now gone to the level of terrorism.

On a point of order, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Hon. (Amb.) Benjamin Lang’at, Member for Ainamoi, what is out of order?

Hon. Temporary Speaker, while I did not want to interrupt the Member, I want to state that this House is entitled to factual information. Casting aspersions on Members of this House and the defence forces is completely out of order. I heard the Member saying that some members of the defence forces have been compromised. I have also heard her say that some Members of this House are financing banditry. Can she name the Members and substantiate the information she is giving to this House? Otherwise, I am afraid that this Motion is not heading in the right direction. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Member for Turkana, what is your comment on the matter that has been raised by the Member for Ainamoi?

Hon. Temporary Speaker, the Member’s comment has shocked me. You know he is not affected. He is speaking from his comfort zone. He has never lost a relative or property to this menace. He is just commenting from his comfort zone. Hon. Member, you do not need rocket science to understand that the sponsors of banditry are in this House. Hon. Temporary Speaker, recently, the bandits were airlifted.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Order, Member for Turkana. There is a matter that has been raised by the Member for Ainamoi, Hon. Benjamin Lang’at, concerning two allegations that you have made. First, you have said that the members of the defence forces have been compromised. Secondly, that some Members of this House are financing banditry attacks. These are very strong allegations. I would like to give you an opportunity to either withdraw and proceed or substantiate what you have said.

I will not withdraw.

On a point of order, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Member for Turkana, I would like to give you guidance based on Standing Order No. 87 on the content of speeches. I will go to 87(4) and I quote: ‘‘No Member shall impute improper motive on any other Member or to a Senator except upon a specific substantive Motion of which at least three days’ notice has been given calling in question the conduct of that Member or that Senator.’’ Hon. Ngitit, I would like to give you an opportunity to decide whether you want to withdraw your statement or continue. If you want to continue, we can give you an opportunity to table the names.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, someone keeps on switching me from one microphone to another. What is happening?

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): The microphone that you had has a problem. Kindly move to the microphone on your left.

I had moved to this microphone and I am being moved to this other one again. Msilete banditry hata hapa hivi . Hon. Temporary Speaker, I am being switched from one microphone to another. What is happening?

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Member for Turkana, you have the Floor and the microphone. Please proceed.

Protect me so that no one switches me to the other microphone again. Hon. Temporary Speaker, you have read to me the Standing Order on facts in this House. Whatever is happening in the social media and in our mainstream media watched by all Kenyans can be said to be facts. What do you want me to say about a Member of this House who owns a chopper airlifting bandits who has a case in court on banditry? Secondly, on the compromise of the defence forces…

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): I would like to exhaust the initial point of order by the Member for Ainamoi.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, please protect me from Members like Hon. Wanjala who do not know what we are going through in the North Rift. Please, Hon. Wanjala, stop bullying me. I have to make my points. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Member for Turkana, you have a very important Motion that you are supposed to prosecute. Remember that you rose on the Floor of the House this afternoon and you got the requisite quorum of 20 Members. You have a very important business that you need to do. You have the protection that you need. I can assure you that I did not notice the shouting that you are talking about by Hon. Wanjala. It was not loud enough to distract what you were saying. I would like to give you an opportunity based on Standing Order No. 87 to decide what you would like to do. Would you like to withdraw and proceed with your Motion or do you want to substantiate what you have just said? Remember that you have still made further allegations.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, I am a Christian. There is information with our Directorate of Criminal Investigations about these matters. We cannot be gagged from saying what we know. If at all anyone thinks I am lying, why then would you think a “primitive” community like mine, Turkana, a pastoralist community, the Pokots and the Marakwets can sustain a war with the Government without sponsorship? How do you want us to understand that? Whenever some members from these communities are brought to book, there are people who come right away to the media to protect and airlift them. Hon. Temporary Speaker, in Kainuk, there is an Occurrence Book (OB) in our police stations indicating vehicles coming from our neighbouring counties carrying ammunition to be supplied to those kraals which are in Turkana County at the moment. You still do not want us to say all that? I will not withdraw that statement. About the compromise of the KDF, even when our KDF are working on Al Shabaab… Let me substantiate the last one.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Hon. Member, you can take your seat. First of all, you have withdrawn and I take notice of that so that you can proceed with your Motion. You have withdrawn your statement. I would like to also give you guidance on Standing Order No. 87(6) and I quote: ‘‘Except as the Speaker may otherwise allow, it shall be out of order for a Member to refer to an extract from print or electronic media as an authority in a Member’s speech.” I would like to encourage you to proceed. You are doing very well. Please proceed and move your Motion.

Okay, Hon. Temporary Speaker…

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): I took notice that the Member for Turkana County withdrew.

On a point of order, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, I stand guided.

I choose to continue tabling my Motion.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Member for Turkana County, I would like to give you an opportunity to withdraw and proceed.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, if the word “withdraw” will make me table my Motion, I withdraw and I am going on to table my Motion.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): You may proceed. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, the main reason for a Motion of Adjournment is to stir emotions within this House. It tells us that we are sitting pretty here when things are going wrong on the ground. Children are going to school in some constituencies but ours are not. This is simply because their schools were burnt down and teachers cannot be posted there because there is a community that has trained terrorists who cannot allow teachers to carry out their duties. If we are told not to put things as they are, it will be an injustice.

As we sit here, there are people in Lomelo, in Kapedo/Napeitom Ward, in Turkana East who have no homes. They were burnt down two nights before the attack. However, you just want us to sit here and table Motions that are not of any importance to this country. As we sit here, the lives of Kenyans are endangered. The people we represent have no homes. All of us will be under a roof tonight. There are people who are seated under trees waiting for their death, because they are surrounded by bandits in Lomelo, Kapedo/Napeitom Ward, in Turkana East. As we sit here, we will travel safely to our houses and then come back next week to this House. There are people who cannot access their homes because those roads are impassable due to this banditry menace.

The highest intervention is the one that has been done by the President who is the Commander-in-Chief of the Kenya Defence Forces of this country. He has deployed KDF to those areas. Surprisingly, the raids are still going on. So, what do you want us to deduce from that? The KDF are on the ground but raids are still happening. Vehicles are not passing the A1 Road. Children are not going to school. Schools and homes keep on being burnt. Some people are burnt alive in their houses in Kapedo/Napeitom Ward but you say this is a country we all belong to. It is so unfair. As we face internal aggression, we still lose lives within external boundaries. We are still being raided by people from South Sudan, Ethiopia and Uganda. Do we belong to this country during this freedom era? It is so unfortunate. Some of us have been sent here to represent our people. When we bring the issue on the Floor of the House to explain what they go through in their daily lives, people take it as a joke. It is so unfortunate.

I, therefore, call upon this House to give consideration to this Motion. Discuss and try to put your feet into our shoes. We are not sure of being elected next time because our numbers are reducing daily. We lose electorates every day. Even registration of persons to get identification documents is frustrated efforts in our county. Which country are we in? I am not secure. I do not know if I will be elected by the numbers that elected me in the last elections because we are losing a huge number of people.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): I will give you another two minutes so that you may finalise.

I am becoming a bit emotional because I am a victim of banditry. I am one woman who was married traditionally in Turkana, and you know what it means. Herds of cattle were given to my kinsmen but none can be traced in our yards. They went to West Pokot County. If people of our stature are victims, you can imagine what happens to that Turkana person down there. I want to donate this time to Hon. Members to support this Motion. Because I have all my kinsmen here, let me donate my time to nearby counties first.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): You are out of order, Member for Turkana County.

There is time for them to speak. First of all, the rules do not allow you to do that. However, I want to assure you that they will have their time to contribute to this Motion. Hon. Members, I would like to give this chance to Hon. Mark Nyamita, Member for Uriri. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. First of all, I want to say that I do not come from a pastoral community. I know the Mover of this Motion has said that she would donate the time to her neighbours first. We have heard you and your emotions. I do not know how it feels when dowry that was paid for you is not there now because it has been taken.

I know there is a crisis. Yesterday, I watched the Cabinet Secretary for Interior and National Administration who is leading the operation in this area. His sentiments tie with what my colleague, Member for Turkana County, has talked about. It has moved from cattle rustling to terrorism. I just want to urge the Government that we cannot continue to sit pretty when lives are being lost. I also want to urge our people, the pastoral community, to slightly elevate the value of human life over cattle. In fact, I am a bit disappointed. The hon. Member was proceeding very well. However, she said that she is more worried about the number of votes that she got and whether she would get them which belittles the issue at hand. There is drought that is ravaging the country. I was watching television yesterday. Leave alone livestock, people are dying. I read in the newspaper today that someone has chased away students from a school and occupied it with his two wives. It is a very sad situation. The Government needs to give it a bit more attention.

In my county, one time, one of my colleagues was on record for having married with the highest number of cattle. He carried almost 500 head of cattle to marry a lady in our village. In fact, it was trouble. If you want to marry in my community, you must take cattle. Maybe, we can adopt other means of payment. We need to detach value from cattle and give more value to human life. What is the dispute? It is because someone’s cattle were taken. It is because of cattle that we are losing lives. That is one thing that we need to change. This country at large is facing a very serious crisis in the near future because of the drought that we are currently experiencing. These guys will have double tragedy. If there is anything that we can do, I urge my colleagues to do it. If they can take the whole of the military to that particular area to wipe out all those people… The allegations that my colleague has talked about are serious. It is very sad. We will call out those particular Members if they are sitting amongst us as we debate serious issues of national importance, yet they are the ones funding the killings and are messing with people’s livelihood. It is sad especially now that Kenyans look up to this House.

If indeed what the Cabinet Secretary spoke about is true, that this thing has moved to terrorism, I urge the Government to upgrade the response from cattle rustling and the force that has been deployed in that region should match the force that is combating terrorism so that we can deal with this menace. It is almost two weeks going to a month since the President spoke about it. People are still crying. The cries are louder. Let them increase the force to deal with issues in that area.

I feel your pain my sister. I urge my colleagues in the House to forget about our areas for once and consider our sister and other Members who come from the cattle rustling areas. Let us see what can be done. Can the Government begin to look at other economic activities for communities in those areas that can prevent people from killing each other? This has been going on since independence. I am here to support you, my sister. Let us support our sister.

I support the Motion. Thank you.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Thank you, Hon. Member for Uriri. Hon. Florence Jematiah, County Woman Representative for Baringo County.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. First, I thank my sister Hon. Cecilia for the good work and for the Motion that is before us. I am with you 100 per cent. This is something that we, Members from the affected region have been crying about for long. I also thank the House in general for taking time to consider this Motion and the support they have given us in the Kerio Valley Region. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

I come from Baringo. I consider Baringo to be one of the hotspots for bandits. I speak with authority that Baringo is where most of these problems have been emanating from. We have a constituency called Tiaty that has been a common denominator for bandits. I am not apologetic in saying this because it is the truth. When I was doing my campaigns, I saw these communities and their leaders not taking keen interest to stop this behaviour.

When terrorism was associated with Somalis who are mostly Muslim, they stood firm and condemned it. When Mungiki was terrorising everyone, the Kikuyu Community stood firm and said it was enough because it was associated with them.

Today we have a community called Pokot who have vehemently refused to condemn this menace. They are terrorising everyone. Every community neighbouring the Pokot is complaining. The Samburus are crying, Laikipia is crying, Turkanas are crying, the Tugens and Elgeyo Marakwets are also crying. They did not choose to be neighbours of the Pokot. I speak with authority because I am speaking for the next generations. We must deal with this menace today. I am also speaking as a Member of Parliament and a Member of the current Government. I voted for the Kenya Kwanza Government. Every time I stand on the Floor to defend the Government, I am reminded that I participated in creating it and it should therefore solve the problem that is at hand. One of the problems in Baringo County today is, children are not going to school. I thank the President for commanding the KDF and other military and security agencies to deal with the bandits.

I support my sister because we are all asking ourselves, what is happening? We have been using the Government coffers. Members of Parliament should take note that the money being spent belongs to the citizens of Kenya. We should see the results. We cannot at any moment stand by and watch when schools have not been opened. There are more than seven schools that were closed because of the raids from the bandits. Yesterday the Cabinet Secretary, Prof. Kindiki gave a horror story on television. In Baringo South, a bandit raided Ng’elecha Primary School in Baringo South. He has several wives. The first wife is in Class Eight. He has put all his children in Class Seven and Class Six. The school compound has become a

for his cows. This is Kenya.

I am a victim of bandits. Whenever I speak, it is from experience. It is painful because I have lost relatives. I condemn this menace with all the power that has been given to me. This is the only time we can stand up as Members of Parliament and say no to these bandits. It is true that some of us sitting in this House are the perpetrators and beneficiaries of this menace. I might not substantiate that now, but when you need me to substantiate, I will do it. I am speaking from a point of information and knowledge.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Hon. Jared Okello. Member for Nyando.

Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker for the opportunity. I align myself with the quest by the Turkana Woman Representative raising these pertinent issues. Banditry is not a new phenomenon in this country. It began many years ago and it has refused to dissipate. The Government seems to be only doing lip service. I have said that because when there was something akin to a prayer in Nakuru, where leaders implored upon the administration to send the military to these bandit prone areas, the following day without the approval of this House, we saw tankers getting into Turkana and Samburu areas. That was a mere public relations exercise. I believe that when people who are indoctrinated into banditry see real intervention by the military, they run to the Republic of South Sudan or Somalia. They will not stage additional protests and carry out cattle rustling within this country. What we saw was a mere public relations exercise. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

People are losing lives as our Government is busy carrying out public relations exercises. This process has metamorphosed into something similar to a cultish movement. Yesterday a video went viral. I know you have read something around it. Young girls’ private parts are being chopped off in addition to what they have been subjected to. It is said that insecurity anywhere within our territorial boundaries is insecurity everywhere; the epicentre and the periphery alike. We cannot sit pretty in this House listening to lamentations from Members from North Rift every time about insecurity. If we have a Government that cannot tame a bandit, just a bandit, it is a Government that should have gone home yesterday to allow a proactive Government that is responsive to the plight of the people to be put into office. It is upon all of us to rally behind our colleagues from Baringo, Turkana and Samburu when they speak. If bandits defeat the Government in the areas where they live, they will come to Nyando Constituency tomorrow.

We cannot leave this problem in the hands of those who are suffering. Our country must be rallied behind this course universally. We have to tackle it on land, air and sea if possible so that these bandits can be subjected to justice.

I know that even the military carried out a public relations stunt. Immediately they landed in those areas, some of the machines and trucks they are using are so rickety that they became demobilised on the same day they arrived. At one time, the Cabinet Secretary for Interior – a man we have a lot of respect for – was addressing a public baraza at some place and bandits were burning people’s house less than a kilometre away. This is the Cabinet Secretary in-charge of security. If I were a Cabinet Secretary, nothing like that would ever happen. That I am addressing a public baraza and they are burning homes in the neighbourhood? I would personally eradicate and neutralise all of them. Therefore, I am challenging these people, because it is not a laughing matter. As leaders in this House, let us all rally behind our people so that this menace can be resolved once and for all. If this Government has failed, can they step aside so that Azimio can get into office and correct all the wrongs that have been perpetuated for way to long?

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Hon. Timothy Toroitich, Member for Marakwet West.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, please, protect me from Hon. Wanjala. Thank you for giving me an opportunity to contribute to this very important Motion. I want to thank my sister for bringing it to this House.

Governments are elected into office to protect property and people’s lives. It is unfortunate that in this country, since Independence, the people of Kerio Valley and other conflict-prone zones have been neglected by successive regimes. As we speak, the entire Kerio Valley and other conflict-prone areas are under the command of militia. People in Tiaty, Turkana, parts of Marakwet, Samburu and Laikipia areas are living in medieval times. Those areas do not have infrastructure. There are no roads, schools or hospitals. People are living in the dark ages. Military intervention is good but that is a short- term measure. In fact, in my opinion, we need deliberate civilisation efforts in those areas. People in those areas still lead a life of pre-colonial era in modern Kenya. We laud the recent intervention by the President but, again, we need proper military intervention as envisaged under Article 241 (3) of the Constitution. In the current intervention, we are being told that Kenya Defence Forces (KDF) troops are under the command of the police. In my opinion, it is very unfortunate. We need a proper military intervention as was witnessed when KDF intervened to reign in the defunct Sabaot Land Defence Force (SLDF). The KDF alone managed to wipe out Matakwei and his team. The North Rift problem is not so easy a matter to imagine that we can just solve through military intervention. The Government should form a serious commission of inquiry to The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

investigate the problem facing the people of Kerio Valley and the entire conflict zones of this country. This is because the problem is historical. It is no longer about banditry and cattle rustling. It is mutating to territorial expansionism. That is the biggest problem we have as we speak. I agree with my colleague, Mhe . Jematiah, Member for Baringo County, who said that these people need to be classified as terrorists. They are not bandits. The President should convene a National Security Council meeting and have the bandits declared terrorists and dealt with as such in accordance with the laws of this country. In short, in as much as we have KDF troops in that region to solve the conflict, we need a long-term solution in Kerio Valley. The reason why a certain community is blamed for initiating this problem is due to lack of exposure. They need to be exposed and that area developed in its totality because it has been left out by Governments for quite a long time. Therefore, we need a commission of inquiry to properly investigate the matters affecting the people of Kerio Valley. We also need proper disarmament. Can you image people wielding guns yet we have legislations in this country protecting our people from being killed. With those remarks, I beg to support this Motion and pray that, in the fulness of time, we shall get a lasting solution in Kerio Valley.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Hon. Fatuma Mohamed, Member for Migori County.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker for giving me an opportunity to contribute to this Motion. First, I want to start by congratulating my sister. I know the pain she feels. Bringing this Motion here already exposes her to risk. I pray that Allah protects her so that they do not get her. I know that the perpetrators of these heinous acts are watching and saying that she is interfering with their business. I am very sure that as, a woman, she cannot come here and tell us what is not true. There must be some truth in what she has said about who is financing the bandits. I may not know who the person is but I beg that we listen to her. I believe that this Government has an opportunity to do something. They should consider her statement, protect her and find the truth. This is a woman, a mother and daughter speaking. Honestly, it is painful. I was born many years back but I remember when the late Daniel arap Moi was the President, there were some people called shifta . He made an order and within 40 minutes there was no human being left called shifta . What government do we have to day? The Pokot population is merely 621,000. You can interview each one of them and get to know who is a bandit. Either the Government is not concerned or it is not serious about solving this problem. If it cannot take up this matter, we, as women, wives, daughters and mothers are the ones who will get affected the most. We will take to the streets and find a solution to this matter. This is because the Government is not taking the matter seriously. It is taking this major issue for granted. When my sister talked about her voters, she did not mean that she wanted them to vote her back. She merely meant that she is losing a big part of the population that voted for her. This is exactly what she meant. She is here to speak on behalf of the people who voted for her as a mother in this country. So am I. This Government needs to tell us if it is unable to protect its own people from fighting within and outside like the Al Shabaab . These terrorists are watching and wondering what kind of a country we are. This is because we cannot handle a war amongst ourselves. They are seeing this country as weak, and we are becoming a target. We are showing them that we are unable to take care of our people. So, the bad people out there are soon coming for us. Sometime back, I saw a joke from Uganda about a certain person who wanted to take over this country within three minutes. I am seeing the bad people will take us within a second, if we cannot take care of such a small community. This does not affect me in Migori County. I sleep with my doors open because we do not have bandits there. We do not know these kinds of things in Migori. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

The only thing that worries me is if at all my fish will cross to Uganda. I am feeling what she is feeling. The country can do something about this matter. I have seen it happening since I was a small girl. I am growing old, I have grey hair, and I am still seeing this happening. Clearly, this has nothing to do with cattle rustling. If the leadership of this country is serious, they will get to the root of this matter. We know that those people have been marginalised for long. We know that they are still behind in education, and they are not taken care of. I do not know if their voting pattern has anything to do with this problem. At the end of the day, I believe that these people are Kenyans who pay taxes and they deserve security just like the people of Migori enjoy their security.

Please, Government, listen to women. Listen to this woman and feel her pain. Do something about this community. It is not only for the women but also men are losing their daughters. They are losing their wives and the future generation is at stake. I beg that if there is anything, even if it means donating our salaries if the country does not have money; take our salaries and do something to help the people who are suffering. It pains me as a woman. It pains me as a mother. It pains me as a taxpayer. I am speaking to the Government to do something or we, as women, find a way and do something. Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Hon. Phyllis Bartoo, Member for Moiben Constituency.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I also rise to join my colleagues in the debate on banditry in Turkana. I support my colleague, the County Women Representative (CWR) from Turkana, for raising this very emotive issue. Article 238 of Chapter 14 of the Constitution of Kenya talks about national security. It is the duty of the Government to protect its people internally and from external threats. Insecurity in the regions mentioned—Turkana, Samburu, Laikipia, Baringo and Elgeyo/Marakwet—have become a perennial problem. Until now, we do not understand when this problem is going to be put to rest. I listened to the CWR for Turkana presenting this issue very emotionally. Some of our colleagues were trying to make fun and even telling her not to say what she was saying. An MP represents people in a constituency and county. When she brings an issue to Parliament, she knows where the shoe pinches. She has talked about schools being closed down in her constituency. We are implementing the Competency Based Curriculum (CBC) in Kenya and we have just introduced junior secondary school. Every part of Kenya is busy trying to see that we get it right. When we close schools in some parts of Kenya, what are we trying to say? What will happen to children in those regions? Who will fight for them? They are part of Kenya. Something has to be done. She has talked about police officers. She has mentioned over 50 who have lost their lives yet they are supposed to be protecting Kenyans. When those who are supposed to be protecting the people are under threat, who will fight for the people in those regions? I am a neighbour of this county. Moiben borders Elgeyo/Marakwet, Baringo, Turkana and Samburu. In 2007, during the post-election violence, I happened to be in that region. That was in Uasin Gishu. I was in South Africa at one time when war broke out. It was the Kwerekwere war, during which the Africans in that country were fighting fellow Africans from other African countries. It is not something nice. War is bad. Especially, when a woman speaks about war, it is very painful. When war breaks out, it affects mothers and children the most. Something has to be done. We need to address this issue in totality. Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Thank you. Hon. Joseph Emathe, Member for Turkana Central. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you very much for giving me this opportunity. I thank my Women Representative for Turkana County. This debate is very handy and has come at the right time. Time has come for us to listen to each other as a country. Time has come when we must call a spade a spade. Some Members here were asking a Member to substantiate a comment he made. It is as if they live in their own world and yet they are Kenyans. The history of cattle rustling or cattle theft and all that has been happening in the North Rift has been documented. It is on record. Kenyans across the country are aware that Kerio Valley and Suguta Valley are places you can enter but you may not come out alive. That is where bandits stay. They have turned themselves into terrorists and another “i ndependent electoral and boundaries commission .” They are trying to do some forceful delineation of boundaries by themselves. I once worked….

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Hon. Emathe, there is a small problem with the microphone. Nobody is interfering with what you are saying. You may proceed.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I once worked in Kuria East, where Hon. Kitayama comes from. I took the County Commissioner of that area to Turkana County. That man became a Regional Commissioner later on. I took that man, together with the District Peace Committee, all the way from Kuria East. We took a route that took us to Tot. We crossed to Kolowal, we went to Tiaty and slept in Kapedo, and then we went to Lomelo. Hon. Temporary Speaker, the horrible situation in Lomelo made the County Commissioner cry because the area chief had not collected his salary for three months. Also, the food he was surviving on was not fit for human consumption, especially as an employee of the Government. Everyone felt sorry and we left that place with broken hearts. That was in 2010. We went to Kainuk, where we held a meeting with a peace committee. I will need more time, Hon. Temporary Speaker, as a result of what I have because this is the moment to tell the truth for Kenyans to know that there are areas where people are suffering.

An area between Kapedo and Lokori, a distance of 105 kilometres, is not inhabited. It is “No Man’s Land.” That is a whole area inside Turkana East. It is an area where the Pokot do their thing of cattle theft and rustling. I have lost relatives. I lost my first uncle and my sisters from cattle rustling and theft. These are my close relatives. As of now, the issue of vulnerability is coupled with the rate at which we are losing cattle. Today you wake up you are rich, in the next one minute or hour you are poor. Now there is drought and the rate at which we absorb the shocks of vulnerability is too high. Some schools have been closed down while others have been burnt down by the Pokot. When we talk about illiteracy rates and poverty indices, those areas are among the highest in the country.

I want to applaud our President, Dr. William Samoei Ruto, for initiating the security operation. As it is now, we are convinced that it is going to take long, and that the security personal who have been deployed are going to stay in those areas. However, there are continued reports that banditry is still going on. Yesterday, a place near Kainuk was raided. The other day Lomelo was set ablaze by the Pokot. We hear of other thefts in Samburu that are going on. In fact, only this week we had more than four raids. In the recent past, Kainuk was a no-go-zone because Pokot bandits had engaged the KDF troops who are carrying out the security operation in a fierce gunfire exchange. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

(Hon. (Dr) Racheal Nyamai): Thank you, Hon. Emathe. You may have noticed that you got extra two minutes because of the disruption with the microphone. So, your time is up. Let us hear Hon. Ariko.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I stand here as the Member representing the great people of Turkana South. This is the most affected sub-county. Hon. Temporary Speaker, please, protect me from my colleagues who are making a lot of noise. I just want to echo the Motion by my County Woman Representative that cattle rustling has become a problem in Kenya. This phenomenon involves both inter and intra-ethnic as well as cross-border raids for livestock. We need to realise that cattle rustling has evolved. It has evolved from being a cultural practice to being modernised to become a strategy for engaging in territorial expansionism. Let me just state very clearly that in the last three consecutive days, my constituency has been raided by bandits from our Pokot neighbours. For three consecutive days, Pokot bandits raided Kaakong, Lokwar and Nakwamoru. All the livestock were driven to Kesses – a place that, we, as the Turkana people, call “Kang’ilokitai.” The stolen livestock were divided into three groups. One group was driven to Kang’ilokitai, which they call Kesses. The second team went to Kadeng’oi, which is the current settlement for the Pokot inside Turkana South. The third group went to Omboliong’, a place I consider my grandfather’s home. Whatever the Government has done, I believe is something that His Excellency the President, Dr William Ruto, stated in Khale, where I hosted him when he was launching the drought relief. During that time, the President was explicit when he stated very clearly that he wanted to end cattle rustling. Unfortunately, on that same day, the Pokot bandits raided Turkana East and Marakwet West at the same time. I want to believe that the previous Government was not serious about handling this serious menace of cattle rustling. The previous Government was either ignoring the matter or compromising the situation. Hon. Temporary Speaker, we have been having too many investments by peace actors in addressing the issue of conflict in North-Western Kenya. They have invested a lot of money but I believe these are the smooth strategies to address issues of insecurity. It is a smooth strategy in the sense that it does not address the actual problem we are experiencing as banditry- prone zones. As a representative of the people of Turkana South, I have the authority to request the Government that before we have any discussion on peace between the Pokot and the Turkana, I need the Pokot to move back to their territory so that we can have a conversation. You cannot end a conflict when the person who is in conflict with you is inside your house. It cannot happen. To finalise this, you cannot graze in Uganda ….

(Hon. (Dr) Racheal Nyamai): I will give you one extra minute, Member for Turkana South.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, our colleagues, the Pokot, have dual citizenship. They do not need permission to graze their livestock in Uganda. The moment the Government gave an ultimatum of three days for bandits to surrender firearms, they moved to Uganda. Currently, the Pokot are in Kadeng’oi with too many guns. Unfortunately, the KDF stationed in Kainuk are not doing anything. The Pokot are shooting the KDF. Just yesterday, the KDF tried to follow the stolen animals but, unfortunately, they could not get all of them. They got only 20 per cent of the stolen animals. The Government has to do something different.

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Thank you very much. Hon. Marwa, Member for Kuria East. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker. Many Members of Parliament who have served in Kuria in the past, and any other public servant who has served in Kuria, will tell you that cattle rustling was a big problem for many years in that area. We were fighting and engaging in cattle rustling with the Kipsigis and different sub-tribes of the Maasai. There were probably five different sub-tribes of the Maasai that we were engaging with as well as the Kipsigis. On this other end, the four Kuria clans were engaging within themselves as well as with those in Tanzania. So, it used to be an extremely complex problem. It took the resolve of the people of Kuria themselves to deal with the issue. That was not an easy matter. In 2007, when this matter was very hot, I lost an election because I thought that speaking out against cattle rustling would earn me more points. I lost that election. In 2013, I lost another election because I was the only candidate who was speaking out against cattle rustling. In 2017, we had lost enough lives. More people now thought that maybe this young man had a point and that they should listen to him. I got elected in 2017. I thank the current President because when he came to Kuria in 2017 after the elections and I told him that cattle rustling must end, he supported us when he was the Deputy President at that time. Our leaders must get involved. Leaders of the Pokot, the Turkana and all the people involved in this matter must gain courage to put an end to this menace. If you do not do it – I assure you that I am a living example – forget about getting votes. If you do not tell your people that you do not support cattle rustling, it will continue. My brothers and sisters, that matter will not be solved by external forces. It will not be solved by the Government through the Ministry of Interior and National Administration. You cannot bring tanks to solve it. It will not end. It must come from you. You must reject cattle rustling. Leaders who fear being voted out encourage this siege mentality and get compromised by the very thugs who have no business with peace. They do not want peace. Hon. Temporary Speaker, it may shock you that a raider probably gets only Ksh500 or Ksh1,000 on a cow that would ordinarily fetch Ksh40,000 or Ksh50,000 or Ksh100,000 in the open market. Somebody in-between makes the markup. At the end of it all, the loser is the person who has been raided and lost their cattle. This chain of activities benefits no one. That is why I implore my colleagues to just stand up and say “No” to cattle rustling. It will go away. You must do it yourselves. Whether you are from Pokot or Turkana, just say “No.” Whoever you are, just say “No” to cattle rustling. Those that want to vote for you will do so. You will be surprised to know that in the last five years, many children have been born in my constituency. This is because our mothers can now sleep in Kuria. I have experienced this and I know that if all of us were to take that trajectory, it would solve the problems that we are all going through. I support you, my sister. We should not be experiencing these kinds of problems in this era. In conclusion, the Government should also develop those areas. You cannot withhold development…

(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Thank you very much. Hon. Lillian Gogo, Member for Rangwe.

Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker. Allow me to also add my voice and that of the people of Rangwe to this matter of national concern. I appreciate the Member from Turkana, who has brought this matter to the Floor of the House. Women leaders look at cattle rustling differently. They look at it in terms of loss of lives, displacement of persons and general instability and insecurity in places where they are domiciled. I would not say that there is cattle rustling in the county I come from, but anything that happens to one Kenyan happens to all of us. It is unfortunate that some of the perpetrators who encourage cattle rustling come from this very respected institution – the august House. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

There are people who are grumbling. Leaders give direction on what happens in their areas. The Member for Kuria East said that when they made a bold decision to bring to an end to cattle rustling, it happened. Leaders at times encourage evils to happen in their areas so as to feel important and for those who depend on them to view them as gods. That must be condemned in the strongest terms. We should be custodians of life. We should be custodians of peaceful coexistence with our neighbours. As I listened to Members of Parliament who come from those areas painfully narrate what is happening there, it is heart-breaking that such things can still happen in this country at this time. What kind of country is this where KDF troops are deployed but people still dare them? We need to do some soul-searching in this country. Whenever there is war and lack of peace, those who suffer are women, children and persons with disabilities. I encourage leaders from those areas to sit down and speak to their communities. What is a cow? What is wealth? Why should we lose lives to gain more wealth? What will we carry to our graves? Why should we cause other Kenyans to suffer? Is it because we want to own cattle, goats and sheep? What is happening to this country? We are grappling with Gender- Based Violence, teenage pregnancies and HIV and AIDS and yet others are causing more deaths through fighting over grazing grounds for cattle and how much cattle one owns. I am told that within Kenya, there is no man’s land for practising evil in this century. I emphasise that it is time Kenya became serious. Kenya has for the longest time been the “big brother” in the African region, especially in East Africa. In this plenary of the National Assembly, we discuss disgusting things that tarnish the name of Kenya. As a mother and a Member of this august House, we need to embarrass ourselves and call ourselves dishonourable if we propagate these things. I want to add my voice to it and I want to say that it is high time this matter is discussed and looked into with the seriousness it deserves and brought to a complete halt. Such are the times I remember the late Hon. John Michuki when Mungiki was a menace in this country. He brought it to a halt once and for all. I thank you.

(Hon. (Dr) Racheal Nyamai): Very well. Next is Hon. Kangogo Bowen, Member for Marakwet East.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker for giving me this opportunity to air my voice on this issue of insecurity. I want to thank the Member for Turkana County for bringing this issue. I am serving my third term in this House. The issue of insecurity has been discussed since I came to this House. Insecurity in Kerio Valley and the entire North Rift is something which has been ongoing for many years. The Kenya Kwanza Government, led by His Excellency the President, went out seeking votes from the people of North Rift on one issue only. The pastoralists of North Rift, Elgeyo Marakwet, the Pokot and the Turkana do not know about bottom-up economic model. Those are people who are seeking the top-down approach to the issue of insecurity. These are people who are crying that police officers on the ground are unable to provide them with security. They are seeking the intervention of the President from the top to sort out these issues on the ground. The issue of bottom-up cannot apply here. Some weeks ago, this House was informed about KDF going to help the police officers in Kerio Valley. It is a very good idea which all of us as leaders support, but it is too late because we have lost too many people. I have too many widows and orphans in my constituency. I said at one time in this House, and in many other forums, that we have taken our KDF to Somali, to DR Congo and elsewhere outside this country to provide peace when we do not have peace in our country. It is high time we said, as Members of Parliament from North Rift; The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

that all the police officers who are currently in the North Rift should be removed and KDF be deployed permanently. The people who are killing our women and children in Kerio Valley are Police Officers. Spent cartridges of bullets used in raids are marked “GoK” or Government of Kenya. Banditry in the Kerio Valley is escalated by police officers who sell bullets to bandits. Police officers are collaborators in this problem. We are no longer talking about normal bandits. We are talking about criminal enterprises where there is a commercialisation part of it. There are people who benefit from cattle rustling. Where do these animals go? That is the question we are seeking answers for. Hon. Temporary Speaker, in the Kerio Valley, there are people who are not interested with livestock but are interested in the business of arms and ammunitions. Those are the people the Government should be looking for. Why is it that the Government, with all its intelligence officers, is not able to track these people? We must stop calling these people rustlers. These are criminals who must be treated like those who rob other people. Hon. Temporary Speaker, we are seeking to amend some sections of the security laws to have these people treated as terrorists. They are robbers and criminals and they should be punished. I want to support my colleague and say that we are going to unite against all bandits in the Kerio Valley.

(Hon. (Dr) Racheal Nyamai): Thank you. Next is Hon. Nanok, the Member for Turkana West. Please trace the Member for Turkana West and give him the microphone.

I am here. Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I rise to join my colleagues who have already debated this Motion. As a point of information, looking at the attendance of the membership of this House, one understands the seriousness of the matters affecting the North Rift as a big problem. The number of Hon. Members who are debating this Motion, who are present, listening and contributing makes a statement. This is how the North of this country has been relegated and that is why matters that touch this part of the country cannot receive the due attention. I thank those who are here. I also want to thank profusely our brothers and sisters who do not come from the North Rift but have taken their time to listen and understand the challenges that we go through.

We must condemn banditry and cattle rustling in the strongest terms possible. What we are dealing with has gone beyond banditry. I was a friend to the Departmental Committee on Defence, Intelligence and Foreign Relations who were having a joint sitting with their counter- parts in the Departmental Committee on Administration and Internal Affairs. They had invited the Cabinet Secretary forInterior and National Administration, and the one for Defence, to discuss this matter. I went to that meeting desiring to hear the progress report of the operation that is going on in the North Rift. I did not get a report and there was no feedback that was given. Instead, matters of law were being canvassed in that discussion. It cannot be that way. We cannot play with lives of people. We cannot play with the livelihoods of the people in the North Rift by law or by arguments as I have heard some Hon. Members argue here. Hon. Temporary Speaker, the crux of the matter in the North Rift is land. It is an expansionist agenda. In the name of seeking pastures and water for animals, something else has cropped up. I appreciate that the Cabinet Secretary for Interior and National Administration The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

has come to grips with this issue. It has gone beyond all the terminologies that we are using here. It is not cattle rustling, it is not banditry, it is going into terrorism. We know what “terror” does. It means that we are kept on our toes permanently. The issue here is about displacing the people who live in those areas – to keep them disturbed and ensure that they lack peace as it is now. I ask my fellow leaders in this House to embrace progressive lifestyle that is accorded to us by education by allowing interaction between Kenyans and by being peaceful. Let us preach the gospel of peace amongst our people. When we hear community leaders using words like “we will deal with you.” When we hear leaders commenting, “We are going to give you a double dose of what you are giving or receiving”, we should have reason to fear. The security operation must succeed. We support the operation. The Cabinet Secretaries for Interior and Defence must not look back. They must succeed. That is the order of the President and that is what we wish to see for the people of the North Rift. The operation must be driven by intelligence. Let us not conduct this operation in the same way we did others. It is not the first time this kind of operation is being carried out.

Very well. Thank you for your contribution. Next is Hon. Caroline Ng’elechei, Member for Elgeyo Marakwet.

Shukrani, Mhe. Spika wa Muda. Naomba kuongea kwa Kiswahili ijapokuwa Kiswahili changu ni “kuku mkia” yaani cocktail . Kuna Kiswahili mufti, Kiswahili sanifu, Kiswahili fasaha na hata Kiswahili

. Nitaongea hivi ili watu wangu wa Elgeyo Marakwet waelewe nitakachochangia. Naunga mkono dada yangu Cecilia kutoka Kaunti ya Turkana. Huu wizi wa mifugo katika bonde la Kerio umeleta maafa mengi. Kwa mfano, mwaka huu Elgeyo Marakwet, tangu Januari tarehe ishirini watu zaidi ya ishirini wamezikwa wakiwemo watoto, akina mama na hata wakongwe. Ni aibu tunapoendelea kuliongelea janga hili kwa sababu dunia imeendelea. Watu hawauwani na kunyang’anyana mifugo – emaciated animals tena. Watu sasa hivi wanaongea maneno ya climate change, technology, cybercrime na vitu vingine ambavyo vinaendelea katika dunia. Sisi bado tunalia sana. Mimi ni Women Representative wa Elgeyo Marakwet County. Tuko na baraka Kaunti ya Elgeyo Marakwet. Ardhi yetu ni nzuri na inaweza kuzalisha mazao ya kutulisha. Lakini kila kuchao, nikutanapo na Rais mimi humwomba atusaidie na relief food. Sababu ni kuwa kwa miaka mitano iloyopita, watu wa bonde la Kerio hawajaweza kupanda na kuvuna kwa kuwa majangili huwa wana cross River Kerio na kuwavamia wanapo fanya kazi zao. Wakati mwingine, majangili ambao wamemea pembe hungoja watu wapande watermelon na nyanya kisha walete mifugo yao. Mara nyingi wanapokuja kulisha mifugo yao mimi huwauliza kwa nini wanachunga mifugo na bunduki na wao husema ng’ombe hawawezi kuchungwa na fimbo. Sisi tunasononeka Elgeyo Marakwet. Kuna shule ambazo hazina wanafunzi. Mfano ni shule ya upili ya Kerio Valley. Wanafunzi walihama kwa sababu ya shida ya insecurity . Sasa hivi tunavyo ongea, watu wengi wamekuwa wagonjwa wa akili kutokana na mawazo. Huwezi kushinda ukiwaza kama Mkenya wa kawaida ilhali hujui ni kipi kitakufanyikia wewe na watoto wako kesho. Mara nyingi tunaongea kuhusu vijana kuandikwa kazi. Vijana wa Kerio hawajapata nafasi ya kuja Nairobi kuhustle kwa sababu wanahofia kuwa watakapo toka makwao, majangili wataenda kuwavamia mama zao, mabibi zao na watoto. Kwa hivyo, wamebaki makwao ili wawaangalie wakingoja wanalolijua. Haya manaeno tumeyaongea sana na wakati mwingine hakuna goodwill ama ari ya kuhakikisha kwamba hili jambo limeisha. Juzi nilimsikia Mbunge wa Sigor, Lochakapong, akiuliza wale ng’ombe waliouwawa na polisi watafidiwa lini. Heri yeye. Sisi ni nani ataturudishia maisha ya binadamu? Kwake, ng’ombe ni muhimu kuliko maisha ya wasichana wadogo na mzee mkongwe waliouwawa juzi. Yeye anaweza kusimama Bungeni kutaka fidia The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

ya ng’ombe ambao hawakuwa na afya. Ni ng’ombe ambao hata mimi naweza fidia. Hiyo ina maana kuwa ubinadamu umewatoka wengine wetu. Mara nyingi Mhe. wa Baringo, Jematiah apigapo kelele mimi humuelewa kwa sababu sisi hulia mara nyingi. Ni uchungu kumwona mtu akihama kwake. Wanakoishi watu Tiaty na Sigor hakuna nyasi. Watu wa Elgeyo Marakwet hawafugi kwao kwa sababu hakuna lishe ya mifugo. Wao ndio huja kwa ardhi yetu na kutusongesha. Tuwaulizapo, wao hutupiga risasi. Serikali iangalie swala hili. Sisi ni Wakenya kama Wakenya wengine. Tuna haki ya kuishi kama wengine. Hatutaendelea kimasomo hata tukipewa free secondary education, free barabara na free maji ikiwa hakutakuwa na security . Hali hii imefika kiwango ambacho sisi tutaomba tuhamishwe na tupelekwe kwa kambi ya wakimbizi ili tuwe wakimbizi kwa ardhi yetu. Hatuwezi tolerate any more . Imekuwa uchungu sana.

Very well. You have delivered. We had to give you that chance because you had a challenge with your card. The interest on this Motion is high. I will follow the list of requests. Members, I am sure if you spare sometime for your colleagues it will be easy and everybody will get a chance. Next on the request list is Hon. Abdul Haro, Member for Mandera South.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. First of all, I am saddened that we are discussing this matter at a time when the entire country is going through a very difficult time. We are facing one of the worst droughts in this country. It is also unfortunate that we are discussing this matter when the regions that are affected are also going through very serious economic hardships.

Order! Hon. Peter Lochakapong, just stay in the House. I am sure this will interest you. Do not go away. Proceed Hon. Member.

We are discussing this matter at a time when we are facing serious economic hardship in a region where there is a security menace. It is unfortunate that after schools opened, parents are still grappling with how to pay school fees. As a nation, we are supposed to be discussing the chaos we are facing with the Junior Secondary Schools. However, all the attention of the nation, and the important time of the membership of this House, is being drawn to this insecurity issue. I am a pastoralist and what happens in other pastoralist areas affects me deeply. When we talk about security or insecurity in this region, what are we talking about and whose security or insecurity are we talking about? It is security by who and for who? Those are some of the questions that we need to ask ourselves. What we are facing in this region, apart from it being a national and a community security matter, is also a serious economic security issue. Livestock keeping, which is the most important economic activity of the people in that region, is at the centre of this phenomenon. I want to draw the attention of Kenyans to the importance of the livestock industry because it is the industry that is being battered here. The livelihoods of the people in this region, which is livestock keeping, is suffering as a consequence of physical deaths from insecurity and issues that affect the people because of lack of food security that is centred around livestock. The Livestock industry in this country contributes 13 per cent to our Gross Domestic Product (GDP). It also contributes 50 per cent of our agriculture labour force. The livestock industry supports 10 million Kenyans. All the pastoralists in the 25 ASAL counties make up 10 million Kenyans, which is one fifth of this country. So, it is a very important industry. Anybody who targets the livestock industry and the pastoralists living in the pastoral regions that depend on livestock is not committing the traditional banditry as we know it but is The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

committing what I may call “economic banditry” on the people of that region. It is time we put our act together, as a country, and deal with this banditry menace. I do not want to call it banditry. This is economic terrorism and it should be brought to a halt. If that region continues ailing because of insecurity, the entire nation will be ailing. Nobody is at peace if Kerio Valley, Turkana, Samburu, Pokot and Baringo are not safe. I can assure you that the entire country will be ailing. I urge the security apparatus that has been deployed in that region to be stern so that we have a solution to that problem once and for all. The insecurity cycle or conflict has reached a crisis point where usual discussion does not work anymore. It is only the coercive power of the state that can resolve some of these issues. The military should take this conflict very seriously. We pray for our people in those regions. Anyone found culpable in this matter should be dealt with, whether one is a leader or a government official or a military officer.

Hon. Protus Akujah.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I rise to support the adjournment Motion. Insecurity in the North Rift region has been pathetic. I wonder whether we are in Kenya. As someone said, the situation has been there for many years and it looks like nothing is being done. Insecurity in the North Rift has caused a lot of problems in the affected areas. We have lost a lot of people due to banditry activities. We have also lost property. So much property have been lost. Displacement of people has taken place. People have been moved from their ancestral land to areas they are not familiar with. It is a way of displacing people so that they cannot continue with their normal livelihoods. Livelihoods have been destroyed because the livestock that these people depend on are being taken away and they are not being recovered. To add to that, destitution has been witnessed in these areas. People lose their parents and siblings and they become orphans with nobody to help them. I want to be told why we are suffering like this yet the Government is supposed to protect people’s lives and property? Some of the livestock we lose in banditry activities cannot be traced. Mark you, we are in Kenya. In fact, the banditry we experience at our international borders with South Sudan, Ethiopia and Uganda is not like this. We recover livestock taken by the Karamoja but not livestock taken by people from areas being mentioned here. What does that tell you? It means that cattle rustling is a big business involving high-level Government officials, the police and some business cartels. That is why you are not able to trace any single livestock that is stolen. If your livestock are stolen, you will never get them even if you do a rounding up of livestock within the area. It means the livestock are ready for transportation. The moment they are stolen, they are driven to a specific place where trucks are waiting for loading. You will never get them. That is why Governor Natembeya was saying Nairobi people are the ones benefitting from the proceeds of cattle rustling or banditry. The livestock are taken to Nairobi and other outlets. Police stations in Turkana, West Pokot and Samburu counties are empty. They are called police stations but there are only five police officers. A police station should have between 30 and 50 officers. Those police stations hardly have 10 police officers. It means that the police officers cannot secure the lives and properties of people in those areas. Secondly, most of the police officers sent to those areas are incapacitated. Some of them have been sent there because of disciplinary cases. Some of them have been sent there because they are alcoholics or drug addicts. These are people who cannot act even if your livestock are stolen. They will never get out of camps. The operation that was started the other day has even escalated banditry activities. Three days ago, a coordinated attack happened in three counties at the same time. That means the bandits have a command centre. I do not know what the operation officers are doing there. They are doing nothing. We need to know exactly what the officers are doing. You gazette five counties as curfew areas but the number of officers deployed is small and thinly spread. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Very well. Let us hear from Hon. (Dr) Christine Ombaka.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I have a cold but I hope you will hear me. Thank you very much for giving me this opportunity. I thank my sister for bringing this Motion. I want to tell you that when you cry, we also cry because you are crying for your people, who are also our people. When we see people being killed in the North Rift, do not think that we, who do not come from that region, are happy to watch. We feel sad. That is why we must fight banditry in this country. Banditry has a very long history. It has been here for many years. That also shows you that the Government has never done anything all those years. When children, women and men are killed and livestock driven away, the Government does nothing. Successive regimes have performed zero work. They have never protected the people or supported them. They are simply talking and watching. We are together. Kenya is supposed to be a peacekeeping nation. It normally takes care of other countries. Kenyans are known for peacekeeping and they do it so well but when it comes to securing our own country, we are not able to do so. We just watch so helplessly yet we have a system that is supposed to protect our people. What is the Government doing? I am not very good at dealing with wars and insecurity, but I can tell you that one thing that the government needs to do is to impose curfew at night. Let people not move. Police officers should be everywhere at night. Anybody who moves at night should be arrested. That can bring insecurity down. That is my knowledge about ensuring that there is protection. Banditry mostly takes place at night. That is my contribution. The last point is that it is very sad to see education going down in the North Rift. It has never been up anyway. People in that region do not go to school. People do not have hospitals. People do not have proper food. People are just busy fighting and stealing. It is a backward area that has never known development since the colonial times. For how long are we going to see the North Rift remaining behind instead of advancing? A time has come when curfew must be implemented immediately. I am happy that the President the other day instructed the Cabinet Secretary for Interior and National Administration, Prof Kindiki, to go to the North Rift and ensure that there is a stop to night fights and banditry. I saw it on television. He wanted him to go there and stop night fights and banditry. I hope that is going to work even though for the time being curfew can work. Thank you for giving me this opportunity. Otherwise, we will lament, fight and bring it down. I support this Motion. Asante sana.

Thank you. Let us have a contribution from the veteran Member, Hon. Samwel Moroto representing Kapenguria.

Asante sana Mhe. Spika wa Muda kwa kunipa nafasi ya kuchangia. Nimesikia yale wenzangu wamesema hapa na ninataka niwaeleze jambo. Wengine wetu tulikuwa tunaongea mnavyoongea hapa tukifikiri italeta faida na eti watu wakikuona, wanakupigia makofi. Ukweli ni kwamba kesho bado wataumia. Nataka tuunge mkono yale Mjumbe wa Kuria amesema. Ninatoka Kapenguria. Tulikuwa tunapigana upande wa Trans Nzoia, Uganda, Marakwet na Turkana lakini kwa sasa hutasikia watu kutoka maeneo hayo, haswa Kapenguria Kaskazini, wakipigana. Tulikuwa na clashes mwaka wa 1992 tulipoanza multipartism lakini ile vita ingine yote kuanzia mwaka wa 1997 mpaka ile yenu iliyokuwa kubwa zaidi haikuingia kwetu. Hii ni kwa sababu tuliketi chini na tukaongea. Marehemu Rais Moi alileta kitu kilichokuwa kinaitwa Operesheni Nyundo. Mhe. Nkaiserry ndiye aliyeongoza operesheni hiyo. Marehemu Kibaki akakuja na yake iliyoitwa Operesheni Dumisha Amani . Wale wanajeshi waliokuwa wanagonga watu nyundo ndio walikuwa wanakaa chini na watu kuwauliza shida ni gani. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Mhe. Spika wa Muda, umesikia kwamba hiyo sehemu ni ile iliyokuwa wilaya ya kitambo . Hata wale wamishonari waliokuja kutusaidia kiroho walitoka Uganda. Walipitia mahali panaitwa Modat kuja kwetu. Walichukua muda kabla ya kufika kwenye Kanisa la Kikatoliki. Walifika mahali panaitwa Tartar kwanza. Hii leo, mahali hapo ni shule ya wasichana ya kitaifa. Haya yote ni kwa sababu ya kanisa. Wafuata dini waprotestanti wa kanisa la Kianglikana wakapitia Uganda mahali panaitwa Nasokol. Kwa sasa kuna shule ya upili mahali hapo na neno la Mungu linaendelea. Kwa ile hali ya watu kuchangana, Marehemu Rais. Kibaki alikuja akawauliza ni ipi shida yao. Wanajeshi ndio waliketi chini na watu. Waliwauliza kilichokuwa kinawasumbua hadi kufikia kuvamia Trans Nzoia. Natumai kuna watu kutoka Trans Nzoia walioshuhudia. Walipoulizwa, walisema kuwa maji ndio chanzo kikuu cha vurugu. Wakati wa kiangazi, iliwalazimu kuingia Trans Nzoia. Hapo ndipo wahandisi wanajeshi walitumwa kuchimba maji pale. Aidha walijengea watu barabara na hema kubwa zilizotumika kama hospitali za kutibia wananchi. Matendo hayo yalileta uhusiano mwema kati ya jamii zilizokuwa zikipigana awali ikawa wanajeshi wamewaweza. Haya yote yaliwaleta watu karibu. Watu kutoka West Pokot hawakuwa na sababu ya kwenda Trans Nzoia kwa sababu maji na barabara vilikuwa vinapatikana pande zote. Isitoshe, hospitali zilikuwa zimeanza kujengwa. Namshukuru Rais wa sasa hivi. Wakati alikuwa Naibu wa Rais alituita sote kama jamii ya North Rift na tukawa na Peace Caravan. Aliyekuwa Inspector General (IG) wakati huo, Bw. Joseph Boinett aliungana nasi pamoja na askari wake. Tulizunguka mkutano mmoja hadi mwingine tukiongea kuhusu amani. Ni juzi tu ndiyo hiyo Peace Caravan ilianguka kwa sababu watu wapya, wasioelewa shida ilikuwa wapi, waliingililia. Utapata mtu akiongea hapa akifikiri atajulikana na mambo anayosema yatafanyika. Acha tuketi chini! Ninashukuru hii Serikali maana imesema wanajeshi hawatatoka mahali hapo mpaka wafanye maendeleo. Ukiangalia eneo la Baringo… Ninataka waketi chini ili waone ni nani alisababisha Tiaty iwe ilivyo. Maendeleo kama vile barabara ya lami, masomo, na stima yanapelekwa hadi mahali panaitwa Loruk kisha yanakomea hapo. Wamejenga kanisa la African Inland Church (AIC) hapo. Mimi pamoja na aliyekuwa Rais Moi, tulikuwa washirika wa kanisa hilo. Upande wa chini hakuna kanisa. Ninamshukuru marehemu Rais Kibaki kwa sababu ni wakati wa utawala wake ndiyo barabara za lami, na shule zilijengwa. Jeshi lilifika huko ndani wakati marehemu Michuki alikuwa Waziri. Hatutaki kurudi huko nyuma. Kapenguria hatuna shida. Ni eneo ambalo ni

Kila mtu yuko huko. Mkisema mtafukuza Pokot upande ule mwingine, Waturkana ndio wako wengi. Kwa hivyo, msituambukize ugonjwa wenu. Tunafaa kuketi chini tumalize hilo jambo sisi kwa sisi. Niko na imani tutaweza kutatua shida tuliyonayo. Mwanzo hii shida ya saa hii iko tu kwenye maeneo machache; haiku kila mahali. Asante Mhe. Spika wa Muda.

Haiya. Tumepata mawaidha na uzoefu mkubwa. Members as you key in your cards, make sure you do it well because I can see Members who have been here for the longest time yet they do not appear on the list. Let us have Hon. Benjamin Lang’at, Member for Ainamoi.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker for giving me this opportunity that I have been waiting for a very long time. When we began this debate, there was a bit of commotion. The Member for Turkana may think I do not support this Motion but mine was just a procedural matter because this is a House of rules and procedures. I, however, want to tell the Member that I strongly support this Motion. That is why I have been sitting here from the beginning. Having said that, I thank the Member for bringing this matter to us. Where we sit, we have been waiting to hear the results of the operations that were ordered by the President. It The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

looks like it is not working the way it was supposed to. That is why the Member has brought the matter to the Floor of the House. We want to have one Kenya where Turkana, Pokots, Kikuyus and everybody else are equal because we are one country. When I hear of the Kerio Valley and the North Rift stories, it is clearly historical injustice. This is because the governments that have been in place look like they marginalised those areas. When we hear both sides of the divide… We have been listening to Members from North Rift talking about the Pokots, but when you listen to the Pokots themselves, the way my friend has spoken, you really see that they have a point. I, therefore, want to call out all the successive governments that neglected those regions. It is sad that 60 years after our independence, when in other regions we are building super highways, a single road in some places has not been done. I want to encourage our current President because he seems to understand the problem. We must give the North Rift closer attention in terms of development. We must open up roads there and even build better ones. We must build schools, hospitals and provide people with water. That way, we will be solving the problem. I know it might take many years, but we must start solving the problem now. In future, we must see Turkana with highways and water. I know it is possible to supply water to Turkana and other places. Condolences to all the families whose relatives have been killed. We want this thing to stop. There is a point which has been raised here. We are Members of this House. Leaders from that region must talk. There are Members of this House from those regions but most of them are quiet. We want them to talk. We may say someone is bad but before we conclude that way, let us talk. I read somewhere in the Bible that Jesus and Satan were talking. They were discussing and Satan was asking Jesus: “Can you turn these stones into bread?” Therefore, I think there is nothing that stops the leaders from Turkana, Pokot, and Marakwet from talking. This is because peace must start from them as it was mentioned here by one Member. They must initiate the peace process. They should continue talking and also dialogue with their churches. I request the President to plan for a meeting where these leaders will be in one room talking. We must end insecurity in the North Rift Region. I support the Motion and state that we must develop…

Very well, Hon. Lang’at but remember even the Bible has verses and chapters. Let us hear from Hon. Omar Mwinyi, Member for Changamwe. Is he in the House?

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for giving me this opportunity. We are here this evening waiting patiently to contribute to a very important Motion. Kenya is counted as one of the countries in Africa that is somehow developed and civilised. However, the events that are happening in the North Rift do not augur very well for this country. This is because if we are to develop as a country competing with the rest of the countries in Africa, then we must, first and foremost, consider peace. The peace should be followed by certain things which contribute towards its existence. You have heard various speakers in this House talk about marginalisation. This is something that needs to be addressed in this country and this House must stand very firm. We are in the budget session and we need to do something about areas that have been marginalised since independence. The most unfortunate part is that Baringo and the areas that have been mentioned here are regions where the second President of this country who ruled for 24 years hailed from. Right now, the fifth President of this Republic also hails from that area. Therefore, I think we need to do something to make sure that cattle rustling is redefined as “ wizi wa kutumia mabavu ”, that is, robbery with violence. It is supposed to be equated to that. The North Rift is supposed to be contributing towards the development of this country. They are supposed to pay taxes, but if they are not empowered, then there is no way they can contribute towards the taxes in this country. That means they cannot help to develop this country. When a country, or, maybe, a region is at war, there is nothing that is enjoyed in that The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

area. I remember back in the days when there was civil war in Ireland and Lebanon and women there would have machine guns even in their kitchens. That was not a very good feature but they long decided that enough was enough and stopped all that nonsense. They are now living in peace. East Germany and West Germany have now reunited: they are one nation that is marching towards leading the world in terms of development. There are various areas that are marginalized in Kenya. The reason for marginalisation is the bad politics by those who are in power. They tend to serve only the areas where they have interest, most likely where they come from. If I may elaborate this, we have areas in Meru that normally farm a plant known as miraa or muguka . This plant has been categorised as a drug in all the laboratories of the world but because we want their votes, we have even brought a law in this House to make miraa a cash crop. We are big hypocrites. Today, miraa is doing a lot of harm in the coastal region of this country. It has made the people of the coast region not to be contributors towards the economy of this country. I think it is high time this Government decided to pay Meru farmers…

Order! Order, Hon. Mwinyi! Your time is up. Let us now have Hon. Brighton Yegon, Member for Konoin. You have been waiting and I thank you for your patience.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I rise to contribute to this Motion of rising cases of insecurity in the North Rift Region. It is high time the Government declared these perpetrators, terrorists. Why do I say so? The other day, I heard the Cabinet Secretary saying that some of the bandits had taken hostage a school. They converted the school into their homes such that one of the terrorists had turned one of the classrooms into his bedroom and another into his sitting room. He even had a children’s bedroom. This should be condemned with the contempt that it deserves. Banditry has denied children the right to education because the kids in these areas have actually failed to go to school. Article 53 of the 2010 Constitution recognises the right of all the children to be protected from abuse, neglect, all forms of violence, and inhuman treatment. It is a shame that in the 21st Century, banditry still exists. Life expectancy in the banditry areas is actually low and there is high propensity to be killed any time. Humans in these areas are predisposed to murder and death. Many people have actually died as a result of banditry in Kerio Valley. The genesis of this banditry should be investigated. Further, the Government should take time to build relevant infrastructure in these areas such as water, roads, schools, hospitals and other social amenities. I support the current operations of Government whose aim is to end banditry in this country. We call for the end of insecurity in the North Rift. Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

Hon. Peter Lochakapong.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for this opportunity to contribute to this Adjournment Motion. From the outset, I support this Adjournment Motion by the Member for Turkana County. We need to discuss the insecurity situation in the North Rift as a matter of urgent national importance. When she was reading the Adjournment Motion, I do not know whether it was by design or default that she mentioned the counties in North Rift and left out West Pokot.

In my thinking, this created a perception or attitude that probably West Pokot was left out deliberately so as people debate this Motion, it will look like West Pokot is the problem. This is not true. We all want peace and West Pokot, by virtue of its geographical location, has neighbours. Around Mt. Elgon we have Sebei, Karamojong, Turkana, Samburu, Marakwet and others. Most of them, if not all, are pastoralists. We know the behaviour and nature of pastoralists. These are people who move from one place to another looking for pasture and water. This should not be construed to mean they are expansionists because that is not true. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Counties, sub-counties, wards and locations have what we call administrative boundaries for administration. The people living around these boundaries have co-existed for a long time. During drought they move from one region to another. Therefore, I want to dispel and clear the perception that this community is expansionist. Cattle rustling has a historical background. When we were born, we found it and it is still going on. We can help to reduce or curb it but this will take time. Like Hon. Moroto said, this has been with us for some time. When we do things the same way, we should not expect different results. I know we have an operation going on and this time I think the Government will adopt a different approach so that they get desired results. We must distinguish between cattle rustlers and bandits. These days it is emerging that banditry is being done for commercial purposes. There are very few bandits in communities so this should not be treated as a community problem. Cattle rustling has been there for some time but we want to eradicate it. The only way to do it is by speaking and addressing the issue of marginalisation in the affected areas. Some of these places were closed and successive Governments marginalised them. There should be a deliberate effort and attempt by Government to bring these places as closer as possible to the rest of Kenya. Leaders must check their utterances because they fuel insecurity. When somebody stands and says, ‘We cannot discuss peace unless the Pokot move away’, surely, that is not good and cannot work because people have lived here all this time. Therefore, as leaders, we should know that our people will either enjoy moments of peace or be in constant conflict depending on how we lead them. It is important to check the utterances we make and how we talk to them. Hon. Temporary Speaker, I want you to add me one minute because I want to say something. We had managed to some extent to….

Okay, let us hear him. Add him one minute.

On a point of order, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

What is your point of order? Please, proceed.

Thank you Hon. Temporary Speaker. As we contribute on how to bring peace in the affected area, is it in order for the Member of Parliament to say that the Pokot should not move yet they are occupying people’s farms? He is inciting them in Parliament because they are listening. So, they will not move. Is he in order?

Very well. As you have heard we have to promote peace. Proceed, Hon. Peter. You have one minute.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I have not said the Pokot should not move. I said that leaders must check their utterances. When you say you have a condition before you discuss anything that will not promote peace. It is possible for us to pursue this together through dialogue. The Member for Marakwet has asked why I come to the National Assembly…

Hon. Peter, you can contribute very well without mentioning other Members’ names. It is very easy to make a good contribution without doing that. So, finish your one minute, please.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. When, we, as leaders come together and talk, we can guide our communities well. This is possible but when we make noise and…

Thank you, you have been heard. Let us have Hon. Kiborek. He has been waiting for quite some time because he did not have a card. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Proceed, Hon. Kiborek.

Thank you Hon. Temporary Speaker for this opportunity. Cattle rustling and banditry are very emotive issues. They have a historical background of marginalisation and other things by previous governments. Before and after independence there were deliberate measures by pre-colonial and post-colonial governments to develop high potential areas and highlands around the railway lines like Mombasa, Nairobi, Nakuru, Kisumu and Eldoret where there were white settlers and others. The marginalised and hardship areas were deliberately left out. I want to implore upon this House, because it makes the Budget of this country, to deliberately put resources into these hardship areas. They are part of this country and we need to move together and not have two countries in one nation. We do not want to have Kenya “A” and Kenya “B”. I want to ask Members of Parliament, in their committees, to ensure they deliberately give money to marginalised and arid areas that have been left behind for many years. We have heard Members debate in this House the problem of cattle rustling and banditry. Everybody is pulling to his or her side. If you come from Turkana, you pull from that side; if you come from Marakwet or Pokot, you pull from that angle and so are those from Tugen, Samburu and other communities around there. To get a solution to this problem we need to remove emotions from it and stop pulling tags in different directions to get publicity or support back home. To be honest, when you disarm Turkana today, tomorrow they will be raided by Toposa from Sudan. When you disarm Pokot, they will be raided by Turkana. When you disarm Samburu today, they will be raided by Pokot tomorrow. When you disarm Marakwet they will be raided by Pokot and vice-versa. Those in Baringo are naturally disarmed so they have become the punching bag for everyone. To get a solution to this problem the Government should first protect and guard our borders with Sudan and Uganda. They should not leave their business of protecting this nation to civilians. The Government should protect Kenyans from bandits from Somalia, Ethiopia and Uganda. It should disarm everyone, take all the guns away and make sure the National Police Reservists (NPR) is done away with because the Government should protect its own people. Hon. Temporary Speaker, Tiaty in Baringo County has been a source of insecurity. There is only one police station in Tiaty. When you want to get the bandits, you transport police 100 kilometers to Nginyang - it is a 4000 square kilometers area in terms of land mass. I applaud the work done by Kindiki. The first thing we should do is total disarmament of all these communities. We need to disarm all communities that are fighting all the way from Borana to Isiolo, Turkana, Baringo, Elgeyo Marakwet, West Pokot and Samburu for this country to have law and order.

Second is development. If you check the universities in this country today, none of them is in those areas. Similar to Government institutions like referral hospitals, there are none in that area. My question is: why can we not take the recruits training school to, say, Pokot, so that they conduct training there? Why can they not train practically with the bandits? When they have enough time, they can deal with the bandits and return to their barracks to restore law and order in that area. Can we take the Anti-Stock Theft Unit (ASTU), which is lying idle in Gilgil, to somewhere in Samburu and around the Suguta Valley? This will guarantee the presence of the military in the area. People there will feel and see the presence of Government. We need to take development to those areas besides disarming everyone.

Lastly, we need to continuously make sure that these areas are never marginalised or left behind in development.

I thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker and may God bless this country.

Very well. Let us hear from Hon. Harisson Kombe. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Mhe. Spika wa Muda, hakuchi hakuchi hucha. Ama kwa kusema kweli, suala hili la usalama ni tata sana, lakini yapaswa tufahamu kwamba usalama huanza na mimi na wewe. Vile tutakavyo ishi ndivyo itakavyochangia usalama wetu. Sehemu hizi husika katika mjadala huu zina historia ya wizi wa ng’ombe kwa miaka na mikaka. Imekuwa kama mchezo kwao. Huyu akimwibia huyu leo, kesho yake ni yule mwingine atakayeibia mwenzake. Haya yote yamechangiwa na kuachwa nyuma kimaenedeo. Nilipata nafasi ya kutembelea Turkana, pale Kapenguria. Niseme hivi: kwangu kuna barabara mbaya, lakini vile nilivyoona katika sehemu hii, barabara ni mbaya zaidi. Hii inaweza kuchangia kutokuwa na usalama. Barabara na vituo vya polisi, ambavyo sikumbuki vikiwa njiani hadi nilipofika Turkwel, viko hali mbaya. Hali ni ya kuhangaika kwa kuingia kwa shimo na kuamka. Hali ilikuwa mbaya. Ukitazama runinga uone hali ilivyo kuhusu janga la njaa katika maeneo hayo, hata kama wewe sio mkaazi wa Turkana, utatokwa na chozi kwa sababu ya yale utakayoyaona. Hii ni ishara kwamba ndugu zetu wameachwa nyuma. Inahuzunisha maana Kenya ni moja. Inastahili kwa sasa niipongeze Serikali kwa ile hatua ambayo imechukua lakini pia niseme haijatosha. Hawa ndugu zetu wanastahili kuongezewa vituo vya polisi. Kama kituo kimoja kitakuwa mbali na kingine iwe ni kilomita tano au kumi ikizidi. Ilivyo wakati huu, unatembea zaidi ya kilomita ishirini na tano au hamsini lakini huoni ofisi ya Serikali. Jambo hilo halitaleta usalama katika maeneo haya. Ndugu zetu wako mipakani. Wakati mwingi ambapo operesheni inaendelea, wale majangili hawako hapa nchini. Wamevuka mipaka kwenda kuficha silaha. Wakirudi huku, huwa wana mikono mitupu. Hiyo tayari ni shida. Laiti mipaka yetu ingelindwa kisawasawa, ndugu zetu wangekuwa na hali nzuri ya usalama na wangejiendeleza.

Suala la maji ni tata. Ningependekeza kuwa ule mradi wa Serikali wa kuchimba mabwawa udumishwe zaidi katika sehemu hizi ili mashambulizi yasikuwepo. Inakuwa vigumu ikiwa tuseme ng’ombe wako wameibwa na kesho unawaona wakinyweshwa maji katika bwawa hapo nyumbani. Moja kwa moja hutaweza kuvumilia hata kama uwe mvumilivu wa kiasi gani. Hivyo basi, hali hiyo ya maji pia ichunguzwe.

Upatikanaji wa hospitali pia ni jambo la kusikitisha. Ili upate hospitali katika maeneo haya, lazima utembee mwendo mrefu zaidi. Serikali iwafikirie na iwajengee hospitali ili nao wajihisi ni Wakenya.

Asante sana. Umesikizwa vyema sana. Wacha tumsikie Mjumbe wa Muhoroni, Mhe. Onyango K’oyoo.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for remembering me during this very important Motion. From the outset, I thank my colleague, the Woman Representative for Turkana County, for coming up with a very serious Motion about security. Nothing can happen in this country if there is insecurity. Even the Kenya Kwanza Government, which pledged to fix all these problems immediately they put the Bible down, has not been able to address it. We want to be very sincere. For us to fix these insecurity problems, two things must be done. Leaders must engage. Leaders from diverse communities and localities must meet and engage. They should bring their people on board and ask them to expose the few charlatan characters. Secondly, the Government must also provide the necessary basic commodities. There should be water. Almost 50 years after independence, I do not know why cattle should be struggling to get water or good pastures when we are busy building high-rises and funding irrelevant things. We forget that in Rift Valley, the mainstay for those people is cattle. We are not providing them with proper environment for keeping cattle. Leaders must be sincere because they could be among those either directly involved in the so-called banditry, or they could be promoting banditry either for political expediency or economic reasons. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

The Government must also ensure that because of this lucrative business of selling cattle, its administrative officers should be reshuffled every other time so that the Deputy County Commissioner who has been in Pokot for five years will not easily find a way of facilitating cattle rustling so as to make money. We urge that the problem of cattle rustling be taken very seriously. Leaders must be very sincere. Leaders from Pokot should meet with those from Marakwet without any bitterness. I come from a constituency that is an island. On one side, there are Nandis and on the other side there are Kipsigis, but we live very cohesively like brothers and sisters. There are a few cases of cattle rustling but we manage them because we engage as leaders. We believe that we are brothers and it is God who created our geographical setup. He knew that we are brothers and that is why He brought us together. However, when you see the Marakwet and the Pokot meet, there is a lot of bitterness which is generated by natural hate. This will not help us achieve what we want. We got independence a long time ago and I am wondering that even after 24 years when we wallowed in Nyayo milk, some people who were in the Rift Valley are still claiming that they do not have water and roads. I know that in Rift Valley, almost all the roads which were to be done by the Kenya Rural Roads Authority (KeRRA) are on low volume. I wonder why places like Pokot lack proper roads. We want to be very serious and sincere to ourselves and make sure that the Government must be put to task to provide water, infrastructure and electricity so that bandits can be seen at night when driving the livestock away.

With those few remarks, I support. This is a very important Motion that must be supported. Thank you.

I believe that Hon. Protus Ewesit had spoken on this one. Therefore, let us hear from Hon. Irene Njoki, the Member for Bahati.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I rise to support my sister from Turkana. I have listened to her and I have also heard my colleagues’ comments. I feel her as a mother and a leader. Normally, when there is insecurity or displacement in any place, it is the mother and her family who suffers. As we debated, I heard our colleague talk about peace talks. Why do we need to re- invent the wheel? We have been told what Trans Nzoia County did. Why can we not follow that example? I want to ask our Government to bring together all these leaders. All the previous speakers have said that peace talks will help. I want to request our Government, through the Cabinet Secretary and the Principal Secretary for Interior, to bring the leaders of the affected areas together. In Nakuru we are a living example. Young girls were being killed and when we were put together in one room, we did not have any emotions. There was so much blame game but it ended. Dialogue is key. Hon. Temporary Speaker, I want to tell the Government that is also important to provide development. We know that Ministries have emergency funds. Why should we be requesting the Government? The Ministry of Interior and National Administration and the Ministry of Roads, Transport and Public Works should focus on development in these areas. If roads are inaccessible, they should be done. Why should leaders look like they are pleading? We request the Government to feel these leaders, the people of North Rift, West Pokot and Baringo. I also get affected in Bahati Constituency because when people from Baringo fight and are in injured, they are brought to Bahati Sub-County Hospital, which is a Level 4 hospital. So, there is an overflow of patients. Yes, it is a referral hospital but if we had development and hospitals in Solai, the affected people would be going there for assistance. However, we do not want anyone to go to hospital because we can solve this problem. I also want to request the Government, as I finish, to protect our boundaries. Sometimes it looks like a joke. I read a comment where someone was saying we are busy talking and the bandits are on holiday in our neighbouring countries. We want to request the Government to The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

look at that and protect our boundaries. The Government had indicated that it was going to protect our administrative officers. Why should officers die? Why would a chief die? They had been told that they were going to be given five police officers. It is the high time they implemented it. I want to support this Motion. Let us take development there, protect lives, and not re- invent the wheel but call leaders for peace talks in one room. That way, they will not have any emotions. Thank you.

Hon. Deputy Whip of the Majority Party, Hon. Naomi Waqo, proceed.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for allowing me to add my voice to this very important Motion on insecurity in Turkana. It also affects many other areas where some of us come from. I also want to take this opportunity to congratulate the Woman Representative for Turkana County for coming up with this very important Motion that touches on the lives of our people and many other Kenyans who suffer from this problem. Cattle rustling and banditry has affected Turkana and many other areas in northern and north-eastern Kenya. For the last many years, that has been the practice. Before, people used to think that it is the normal cattle rustling and nothing much. But right now, it has become a business whereby bandits are hired in order to attack, get cattle and then a certain businessman somewhere gets them for sale. So, it has become a huge business and it continues from time to time. As a result of this, many have been widowed. I come from Marsabit County and I know that many of our young women have been widowed and we have created a lot of orphans as a result of this. In fact, sometimes I sit and tell myself that maybe we need to come up with a school that will take care of orphans so that those children from different ethnic groups grow together because right now they are placed in different places and they do not know one another. If the Government builds schools that take care of children orphaned by banditry and tribal clashes, then our children will grow together and, maybe, overcome the problem that we have with our ethnic groups. Poverty levels, again, in all these areas have increased. I know my own experience in Marsabit is the same one in Turkana and other areas. This is because when they get the animals from one person or one family, they enrich themselves, but others are rendered poor. I know very well that the poverty level of my own county has gone high as a result of this practice. There is need for us to see how we can empower our people and also see how best they can earn their living other than just practising pastoralism. That has proved to be a very difficult lifestyle because all the pastoralists today have no food to put on their table. They look to feed their animals and they struggle, but without notice, an enemy comes and drives away their animals. It is the responsibility of our Government to see how to grow our people economically so that they can have a different source of income other than that of keeping livestock. They can invest in different types of businesses to earn a living. We need to ensure all the young people go to school. Most of the time, young boys take care of livestock. The Government can push the people to take their children to school so that we can have a helpful society. Drought is already taking away livestock. It is high time we overcame the problems we are going through. Tribalism and ethnic clashes are the other issues that have contributed to this matter.

I add you one minute.

Thank you. It is better to have a subject in schools on peaceful co-existence and see how we can bring people from different ethnic groups together. I congratulate the Government for its efforts. I pray that we invest in the areas The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

that have been neglected for many years and see to it that people do other things to earn a living. I thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I support the Motion.

Hon. Francis Sigei, Member for Sotik.

Asante sana, Mhe. Spika wa Muda, kwa kunipa nafasi hii kuchangia mjadala ambao ni wa maana sana. Nashukuru mwakilishi wa Turkana kwa kuleta mjadala huu. Nauunga mkono. Pili, naunga mkono Serikali hasa Wizara husika kwa yale wanayofanya upande wa North Rift. Tungependa kuona Waziri, Prof. Kindiki, akichukua hatua ya kuunganisha watu. Tungependa kuona viongozi wote wa North Rift wakifungiwa kwa nyumba na viongozi wa dini ili wazungumzie vita hivi. Tatu, nakemea mauaji yanayoendelea huko. Tumepoteza watoto, machifu na askari. Kuna umaskini. Shule zimefungwa. Haya mambo yataendelea hadi lini? Naomba Serikali kutuma wanajeshi. Kuna wanajeshi Garissa, Mandera, na Wajir. Tungependa kuwa na vituo vya wanajeshi Turkana ili watu wafanye kazi na wanafunzi warudi shule. Mhe. Spika wa Muda, ningeomba barabara zitengenezwe katika hizi sehemu. Wenyeji wa maeneo hayo pia wapewe maji, stima, na wejengewe shule nzuri. Serikali lazima iweke pesa katika maeneo hayo.

Ingawa Serikali inaendeleza operesheni kule, ningependa kuyasihi makanisa yashirikiane na Serikali ili tuweze kuleta amani kule. Jambo lingine ni viongozi wa maeneo Bunge husika kuungana pamoja. Wasigawanyike kama viongozi wa sehemu tofauti tofauti kama Pokot ama Marakwet bali waketi chini na wazungumze ili wakubaliane jinsi amani itakavyopatikana. Mhe. Spika wa Muda, ninataka kushukuru sana kwa huu Mjadala. Matumaini yangu ni kuwa hivi karibuni, tuweze kutatua matatizo ya maeneo haya ili tupate amani na wenyeji wawe kama watu wa nchi nyingine. Watu wa maeneo hayo wamekua maskini na wamekuwa

ilhali hii nchi ni moja.

Ninaunga mkono. Asante.

Very well. Hon. Charles Kamuren. Please, go to the point so that we can have more Members contribute.

Asante Mhe. Spika wa Muda. Ninasimama kuunga mkono mjadala huu ambao umekuja kwa wakati unaofaa.

Kwanza, ninamshukuru sana Rais wetu na Serikali kwa jumla kwa yale yanayoendelea katika maeneo haya. Juzi, baada ya kukutana na viongozi wa maeneo-bunge hayo, alitoa amri ya kuwa wale watu wetu ambao wanahangaika, wapate kushughulikiwa. Baada ya hiyo, kulifanywa g azettement ya operesheni inayoendelea.

Pili, ninatambua kazi ambayo Waziri Prof. Kindiki anafanya pamoja na Wizara yake ya kujaribu kuhakikisha kwamba usalama unapatikana. Katika Eneo Bunge langu la Baringo Kusini, Mochongoi na Mukutani ni sehemu ambazo zilikua gazetted ilhali operesheni hiyo haijafika. Ninapozungumza, mbuzi waliibwa na sauti za risasi zilisikika maeneo hayo masaa ya saa tisa usiku. Watu walihangaishwa sana na mbuzi wakachukuliwa. Wiki iliyopita vile vile, waliibiwa upande wa Lomaiwe. Hatujapata usaidizi vile tulivyotarajia. Tuko na imani kwamba kuna mpangilio unaofuatwa. Ninaomba wale wanahusika waharakishe ili wasaidie watu pale.

Hatuna bunduki vile watu wanasema. Maeneo matatu huko kwetu ambayo ni takriban kilomita sitini na nne mraba kukiwemo Rukus, Mukutani, Arabal na Mochongoi yamechukuliwa na hao wakora. Serikali ilipoanza operesheni, inasemekana - sina uhakika - magaidi walihamia eneo-bunge langu. Ndiposa, ninasema kuwa wanajeshi waje watusaidie ili hao wakora watolewe katika mashamba ya wenyewe. Waheshimiwa wengine wanapojadili hapa wanasema kuwa sijui watu wafanye nini. Je, ambaye hana lolote atafanya nini? Mwenyewe nimekuwa na shida mpaka nimepoteza watu The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

wengi. Isitoshe, shule tano hazijafunguliwa hadi leo. Tuko na nini sisi? Ninaomba watu wasaidiwe. Mambo ya upokonyaji silaha yaendelezwe. Mhe. Spika, nimeshangaa kusikia Mbunge mmoja akisema kuwa watu wake wakae na bunduki. Bunduki ni haramu. Bunduki ni ya askari wa Kenya. Hatutaweza kuongea juu ya amani wakati watu wako wana bunduki. Katiba inasema kuwa bunduki ni ya askari. Raia wote wameamrishwa na Serikali kutoa bunduki. Ikiwa watakataa, basi sharti Serikali itumie nguvu kutoa bunduki hizo. Nimeshangazwa hata na Wabunge wengine ambao wanauliza juu ya wanajeshi. Je, wanajeshi wamefanya makosa gani? Hawajakuja kufanya kazi bali kusaidia polisi. Hii imekuwa biashara lakini ninaona Wabunge wenzangu hawataki kusema ni biashara ya watu fulani ndiposa wanahangaisha watu. Ningependa kusema kuwa bunduki ichukuliwe kutoka kwa raia na watu wapewe National Police Reserve. Magaidi wote wanaohusika, hata kama ni Wabunge wakamatwe. Bunduki zote haramu zirudishiwe Serikali. Hao magaidi wasibembelezwe. Ugaidi ni ugaidi. Hata watu wangu hawana maendeleo. Kwani ni lazima watu wako wachukue bunduki ndiyo Serikali ilete maendeleo? Yaani wanatisha Serikali na bunduki ndiyo watengenezewe barabara na shule. Ni sharti watoe bunduki ndiyo Serikali ilete maendeleo. Kama kiongozi, ugaidi wa kuambia watu wakae na bunduki ndiyo Serikali iwasaidie…

Very well. Hon. GK, George Kariuki.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for allowing me to contribute to this Motion. I want to congratulate the Mover of this Motion. We understand that insecurity destabilizes human life in a great way. In the North Rift, women and children have been unable to live the kind of life that other Kenyans are enjoying. I want to call upon leaders from these areas to support the Government’s effort of stamping out this menace.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, we know that there can never be development without security. As key supporters of this Government, we understand that there is no way our people will build schools and put up hospitals if there is no security. There is no way the people of North Rift will enjoy quality life if we do not encourage leaders from these areas to support the Government’s effort of securing the lives of our people. One of the things that is fuelling insecurity in the North Rift is the livestock business. The criminals who engage in this activity know where to take these animals. There are people who are laughing all the way to the bank with the proceeds of this nefarious crime. We need to call them out. We need to tell them that whatever they are doing is a crime. The earlier we get them to face the law, the better. We should not negotiate with criminals and murderers. Anyone who is holding a gun ready to kill you and take away your animals or property is a criminal. If it was happening in Nairobi, we would call it a crime but because it is ‘these other areas’, we want to call it cattle rustling. They want to pamper these people. We should not allow them to continue behaving this way because we will not have a country to run without the support of every Kenyan, especially in the area of security.

We have malnourished children in these areas. They have never seen a classroom. Most of them have never been to a hospital. Insecurity and low life expectancy are always hand in hand. If you are living in these areas, you cannot live a good life to the 70s and 80s because you can die anytime of a small ailment that can be treated in a hospital which you cannot access because of insecurity. I call upon leaders from these areas, especially politicians, to make sure that we work and live together in harmony. We should preach peace because it will keep us going as a country and spread development.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. Once again, I congratulate the Mover of this Motion. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Very well. Hon. Oundo take two minutes to contribute, so that we can spare some two minutes for the Chair of the Departmental Committee on Administration and Internal Affairs.

Okay. Hon. Temporary Speaker, it is sad, indeed, that several years after independence, we still have this shameful menace in this country. I listened to the Governor of Trans Nzoia, Hon. Natembeya, who is the former Regional Commissioner of that area. What he revealed was extremely shocking. If that is the case, then, probably, the current onslaught or operation is targeting the wrong solution to a problem which is typically a commercial enterprise. The poor road network and infrastructure in North Eastern Kenya, almost 15 years since devolution, is unacceptable dereliction of duty by the successive county governments. We call upon them to provide water, build roads, hospitals and schools so that people do not fight over resources, do not feel neglected, and, surely, isolated from the rest of Kenya. I had an opportunity to walk around there. They always told me to “ salimia Wakenya ”. Many of them still think President Moi is still the President of the Republic of Kenya. It is that bad. With those few remarks, because you requested me to keep them short, I support the Motion. Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

Very well, Chair of the Departmental Committee on Administration and Internal Affairs.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I have listened to my colleague and brother talking about our brothers in North Rift still believing that President Moi is the President. I think he just tried to make a joke. Thank you for giving me the opportunity to contribute to this important Motion. It is really very unfortunate that such a menace is still happening in the 21st Century in a country as good as Kenya. It is true this thing has been with us for quite some time, almost since independence. The subsequent governments have been always trying to control it but it seems that they have never really managed to fix the problem. It seems to be growing bigger and becoming more complicated and, even, actually mutating from mere cattle rustling to something worse. These criminals attack our security forces, burn their vehicles and even kill innocent wives, mothers, and children. What is happening is unfortunate. I want to bring to the attention of this House and Kenya that the country has moved swiftly to address the problem. For two weeks now, we are all aware of the operation which is being undertaken and led by the National Police Service command and supported by the KDF. To this end, there is a lot of success. It has been reported that more than 157 people have already been arrested. There is good progress. There is hope at the end of the tunnel. His Excellency the President has assured the country that he is not going to leave any stone unturned. The Cabinet Secretary for Interior and Administration of National Government has also committed to the same. This afternoon, we had a joint session of the Departmental Committee on Administration and Internal Affairs and the Departmental Committee on Defence, Intelligence and Foreign Relations. We had a very fruitful discussion and engagement with the Cabinet Secretaries in the Ministry of Defence and National Security and the Ministry of Interior and Administration of National Government. We got the opportunity to understand the operation and the activities being undertaken in the North Rift to address the problem which has escalated and is now affecting more than four counties.

I, therefore, assure the House that the Government is more than committed and is doing anything possible within its capacity to bring this to an end. Some bit of legislation on resources may be needed from this House to support our operation and security personnel to effectively address the problem. It is unfortunate that lives have already been lost and the damage is done. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

The Government is also committed to having a marshal plan to include opening the area in terms of infrastructure to ensure there is a long-lasting solution to this problem.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

Hon. Members, the time being 7.00 p.m., this House stands adjourned until Tuesday, 7th March 2023, at 2.30 p.m.

The House rose at 7.00 p.m.

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Clerk of the National Assembly Parliament Buildings Nairobi The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.