Hon. Members, there is no quorum. Serjeant-at-Arms, ring the Quorum Bell for 10 minutes.

Serjeant-at-Arms, you may stop the Bell. Let us proceed. Hon. Members, allow me to rearrange the Order Paper. We will not deal with Order No.7 now. We will first go to Orders Nos.8, 9 and 10, and then come back to Order No.7. Let us have the Deputy Leader of the Majority Party.

Thank you very much, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I beg to move the following Procedural Motion: THAT, pursuant to the provisions of Standing Order 30 (3), this House resolves— (i) to hold a Morning Sitting on Tuesday, 8th October 2024, commencing at 9.00 a.m. for purposes of the commencement of debate on a Special Motion on the proposed removal from office, by impeachment, of H.E. Hon. Rigathi Gachagua, Deputy President of the Republic of Kenya; and, (ii) to sit until the conclusion of the consideration of the Special Motion on the proposed removal from office, by impeachment, of H.E. Hon. Rigathi Gachagua, Deputy President of the Republic of Kenya, during the afternoon sitting of Tuesday, 8th October 2024.

As per yesterday's Communication by the Speaker and the general consensus of the House, we propose to have a morning and an afternoon sitting on Tuesday. The afternoon sitting will only end when the order of business for the day is concluded. We have a Special Motion that we must dispense of. Therefore, we must give it due consideration and enough time for debate so that every Member in this House has an opportunity to be heard, including all dissenting voices. This is a democratic House where all perspectives are valued and all voices are welcomed. It is important that we add one more sitting and also extend the afternoon sitting so that we can have ample time to debate this Motion of national importance. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, I beg to move and request the small lion from the other side, Hon. Wanami Wamboka, to second the Motion.

A lion is still a lion, even when it is small.

Hon. Wamboka.

Indeed, this is an important Motion but, I am not a small lion as such. This Motion affects the entire country and we need to allow everyone to have their say so that we can put Kenya back on track. I second and fully support this Motion.

Thank you, Hon. Members.

Put the question!

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I beg to move the following Procedural Motion: THAT, pursuant to the provisions of Standing Order 28 (4) ( Calendar of

), this House resolves to suspend its Sitting of Thursday, 3rd October 2024, so as to allow administrative arrangements that are necessary to facilitate the programme for public participation on the Special Motion for the removal from office, by impeachment, of H.E Hon. Rigathi Gachagua, Deputy President of the Republic of Kenya. Just as my Deputy has said, the Special Motion is due for debate next week on Tuesday, as communicated by the Speaker yesterday. Public participation is mandatory, and we plan to conduct granular public participation from the polling stations to the county level. The advertisement has been published in the dailies and on the website. The public can find the venues on the said platforms. Therefore, Members of Parliament need to retreat to their constituencies and inform their constituents accordingly, to ensure that everybody in every polling station is aware of the Motion, and the grounds of the Motion. The public can give their opinions at the county headquarters. Members of Parliament are seasoned in this area of public participation and will, therefore, enable their constituents to give their views. A call for memoranda is already posted on the websites. Hon. Members should encourage their constituents to complete the memorandum and send it to the specified addresses. It is necessary to cancel tomorrow's Sitting, as is the norm. I beg to move and ask Hon. Farah Maalim to second. I almost called him “ Hon. Maraa

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Hon. Deputy Speaker, the Leader of the Majority Party has moved a very important Motion to allow us to engage in public participation. Public participation is provided for in our Constitution and holds significant importance. This marks the first instance under the 2010 Constitution, which is considered one of the most progressive in the world, not only in Africa or among Third World countries, but also among developed nations. I second that and I hope that we will all go back to our constituencies, inform and listen to Kenyans as provided for in the Constitution.

Thank you, Hon. Members.

Put the question!

Leader of the Majority Party.

Thank you very much, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I beg to move the following Procedural Motion: THAT, pursuant to the provisions of Standing Order 97(1) and notwithstanding the Resolution of the House of 14th February 2024, this House orders that each speech in a debate on a Special Motion under Articles 145 and 150 of the Constitution shall be limited as follows: A maximum of 60 minutes for the Mover in moving and 30 minutes in replying and a maximum of five minutes for any other Member speaking, except for the Leader of the Majority Party, the Leader of the Minority Party and the Member seconding the Motion, who shall be limited to a maximum of 10 minutes each, and that, at least, two and a half hours before a vote is taken on the Motion, the Deputy President or the President (as the case may be), shall be accorded an opportunity to be heard, in accordance with Standing Order 67(b)(ii). Going by the Notice of Motion tabled yesterday, this Motion received overwhelming support of 291 signatures. That ideally means that Members should be given adequate time to debate this Motion. Usually, of course - and the House knows - each Member gets about 10 minutes to speak on any Motion. But because of the overwhelming interest across the political divide, with 291 Members supporting and the minority of about 54 Members who do not support, will get an opportunity to articulate their issues within the five minutes. They should arrange their thoughts and articulate them within the five minutes that is allocated to them. We should also allocate 60 minutes to the Mover so that he can place his grounds on the Table without a hurry, and 30 minutes right of reply. For us, this is fair. To add to that, we wish that the Deputy President is accorded an opportunity to be heard in this House. The proposal is to allocate him two hours of defence on the Floor of this House without being interrupted. So, I beg to move that Members arrange their thoughts within the allocated timeline and come in large numbers that day very early in the morning to articulate their issues in support of or while opposing the Motion. I beg to move and ask Hon. Sam Atandi to second. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. As it has been explained by the Whip of the Majority Party, this is a historic Motion. Some of us are lucky that we are going to witness and participate in the impeachment of the Deputy President. This is something very special. I am sure that, like myself, all Members of this House will be interested in contributing to this Motion. Therefore, I would like to request that everybody be given an opportunity. The proposal that we have five minutes as Members and 60 minutes for the Mover is something which I would like to second and appeal to Members to support. Thank you. I second.

Put the question.

Hon. Members, may I put the question.

On a point of order, Hon. Deputy Speaker.

What is your point of order, Hon. Kamket?

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I just want a little clarification. While I agree with the Motion, I have tried to do the computation of the time allocated. The Mover will have one hour, the Seconder will have 10 minutes, and the Leaders of the Majority and Minority parties will have 10 minutes each. That is a total of two and half hours, and then each of us gets five minutes. We have a lot to say about this Motion. I am a bit disturbed that five minutes may not be enough. We can allocate the Mover 40 minutes so that we can also get some more time. We have a lot to say about this Motion.

Hon. Kamket, remember the Motion will be debated until the end of the day, which means midnight.

In that case, Hon. Deputy Speaker, I propose that five minutes is too short for us. We have a lot to say. I can assure you.

Hon. Kamket, you have been overruled by your colleagues. In any case, the practice in this House is that we have been doing five minutes. In my experience, most people can make their point in three minutes. After that, they start repeating themselves.

On a point of order, Hon. Deputy Speaker.

What is your point of order, Hon. Mwago?

Please put the question, Hon. Deputy Speaker!

Hon. Members, I will entertain only two points of order.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I tend to agree with Hon. Kamket: We need more time to interrogate this issue. The impeachment of the Deputy President is not a clandestine issue. It is an issue that we need to interrogate. Some of the Members who have appended their signatures may have had the privilege to see the Motion before. They signed on the Motion after having had some insight into what was in the Motion. For us who are in the dark, we ask for more time to interrogate and discuss this issue entirely. Thank you.

Hon. Farah and then I shall put the question.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, for the benefit of the House, there was a Procedural Motion that preceded this Procedural Motion. Hon. Deputy Speaker, protect me from all of them!

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Order, Hon. Members! Let us listen to Hon. Farah.

The Motion said we can debate until conclusion, which means we can go up to midnight. With the signatures of 291 Members, anything more than five minutes is not likely to give an opportunity to everybody. In any case, for those of you who have studied literature, whatever you cannot convey in five minutes, you cannot convey in five hours. So, Hon. Deputy Speaker, put the question.

Like I said, Hon. Members, my experience is that you can say whatever you want to say in three minutes. Beyond three minutes, you are repeating yourself. Hon. Members, allow me to put the question.

Let us go to Order No.11.

On a point of information, Hon. Deputy Speaker.

What is your point of order, Hon. Leader of the Majority Party?

Hon. Deputy Speaker, actually it is a point of information emanating from something that Hon. Mwago. He has said that the 291 Members who had signed the Motion had interacted with it. It is true that the 50 or so who have not signed may not have interacted with it. Just to inform the Hon. Member for Starehe, indeed, the Clerk's Office is in the process of now translating the Motion in Swahili so that you may read and understand. The only language we may not be able to translate to is vernacular, but both the Motion and the Questionnaire will be uploaded in Swahili. Therefore, it will be very easy for the Member for Starehe to read and understand the Motion. Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker.

On a point of order, Hon. Deputy Speaker.

What is your point of order, Member for Starehe?

It is quite unfortunate that such a senior Member in this House would take time to insinuate that I do not understand English. I understand that you went to The Alliance High School but of late, your utterances have been putting Alliance High School into question by the way you are conducting yourself. It is very wanting. You are a ranking Member to be answering me that way. Thank you.

Okay, Hon. Members! Let us move to the next Order. But Member for Starehe, I think the assurance is that it needed to be translated into Swahili because those are the two official languages and for the benefit of our constituents who will be reading it. Most importantly, you can find the Motion at the Table Office which means you can get a copy of it as soon as now and then you can read it. Let us go to the next Order. Order No.11.

Point of clarification, Hon. Deputy Speaker.

What is your point of clarification, Member for Dagoretti North?

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. Just to tell the Member of Starehe, the Motion was tabled yesterday. It is in the public domain. You can just pick and read it. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you. Let us proceed to the next Order. Order No.11.

I think we have a Question by Hon. Robert Gichimu, Member for Gichugu. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. Actually, it is a request for statement regarding payment of tea bonuses for Kimunye and Thumaita tea factories for the Financial Year 2023/2024. Pursuant to the provisions of Standing Order 44(2)(c), I rise to request for a statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Agriculture and Livestock regarding the payment of tea farmers’ annual bonuses in Kimunye and Thumaita tea factories for the Financial Year 2023/2024 Hon. Deputy Speaker, in mid-September 2024, the Board of Directors for Kimunye and Thumaita tea factories in Gichugu Constituency declared payment of bonuses for the period between 1st July 2023 and 30th June 2024. Those factories which fall under Zone 5 of the tea growing regions were ultimately to pay bonuses at Ksh51 per kilogramme and Ksh46 per kilogramme, respectively. The declaration which fell lower than the expected payments has sparked mass demonstrations and a boycott of tea plucking by farmers who primarily depend on tea farming for their livelihoods. This situation poses a serious risk to the economic development in the region. The Kenya Tea Development Agency (KTDA) National Chairman, one Mr. Enos Njeru, vide a public announcement, stated that the bonus would be at least Ksh60 per kilogramme. The lower payments have thus led to widespread dissatisfaction and accusations of misleading information. It is against this background that I request the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Agriculture and Livestock to apprise the House on the following: 1. Provide a detailed breakdown of the total gross tea bonus payments per kilogram of green tea leaves that should have been payable to farmers before the deductions. 2. A clear explanation of the deductions made from the gross payments that resulted in the declared net pay for both Kimunye and Thumaita tea factories. 3. A clarification on amounts reserved or retained from farmers' payments per kilogram of green tea leaves, the specific purposes of those reserves or retentions, and whether they can be disbursed as part of additional payments to farmers beyond the declared net bonus. 4. The basis under which the KTDA National Chairman, Mr. Enos Njeru, publicly declared that the bonus payment for the period would be at least Ksh60 per kilogram of green tea leaf. This is a very urgent request for a statement because the farmers under the two factories are still on a boycott. They are not plucking tea. So, I request an urgent response to this request for a statement. Thank you.

Is the Chairperson for the Committee on Agriculture and Livestock Development here? Okay, Hon. Brighton. Are you going to speak? Give him the microphone.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, this matter by Hon. Gichimu is related to two other statements that we had done before. We request for two weeks to reply. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

All right. Deputy Leader of the Majority Party, you will ensure that it goes to the desk of the Committee on Agriculture and Livestock Development. Next, we have a request for statement by Hon. Francis Sigei, Member for Sotik.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, pursuant to the provisions of Standing Order 44(2)(c), I rise to request for a statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Transport and Infrastructure regarding the status of the construction of Cheborge Junction-Kipwastuiyo Road and Sotik-Silalo Road. On 8th May 2021, the Kenya Rural Roads Authority (KeRRA) awarded MSQ Construction Limited a contract to upgrade the Cheborge Junction-Kipwastuiyo Market Road and Sotik-Silalo Road to bitumen standards for a contract sum of Ksh590,662,680. The project was initially scheduled to commence on 6th July 2021, but commenced on 3rd August 2021 with a completion date of 3rd March 2023. In addition, it is alleged that the contractor has been paid the full contract sum and yet, the project remains incomplete. The delay in the completion of upgrading of the road has severely impacted businesses in the area, with farmers facing challenges in transporting their produce to the markets. This has resulted in substantial losses for families who are dependent on those businesses for their livelihoods. It is against this background that I request for a statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Transport and Infrastructure on the following; 1. Challenges experienced by the project leading to prolonged delay in completing the upgrading of Cheborge Junction-Kipwastuiyo Market Road and Sotik-Silalo Road. 2. State whether the full contract sum for the project was paid to the contractor and the justification for the payment despite the project being incomplete. 3. An update on when the contractor will resume the works and expected timelines for completion of the road considering that the Sotik-Silalo Road is impassable. 4. The measures being taken by the Ministry to ensure that value for money is obtained with respect to the project without causing significant inconveniences to the locals and alternative measures for the impassable section of the road. I thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker.

Thank you. That would be marked to the Departmental Committee on Transport and Infrastructure. Is there a member here or the Chairperson? Again, Deputy Leader of the Majority Party, I will leave that to you. Let us now go to answers to the Questions that had been posed last week. Hon. Melly, Member for Tinderet, Chairperson of the Education and Research Committee. You have a response for Hon. Edith Nyenze, Member of Parliament for Kitui West.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. Hon. Edith Nyenze, as per Standing Order 44(2)(c), on the 21st of August 2024, requested for a statement on the employment status of P1 teachers who had upgraded their education with a view to being absorbed as Junior Secondary School teachers. Hon. Deputy Speaker, the issue raised by Hon. Nyenze is an issue of national concern to the teachers of this country, especially those who have upgraded while intending to go and implement it, as part of the retooling of the CBC. In response to that particular request for statement, I transmitted the question to the concerned government agency, the Teachers Service The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Commission, who gave me the document that I have. I will skim through the document and, thereafter, hand it over to Hon. Nyenze to go through it. If there are any further clarifications, she will seek them later. The Teachers Service Commission responded as follows to the issues that were raised in the request for statement. That, there is a report on the policy framework when TSC directed P1 teachers to upgrade their courses. This is a policy paper on why the Teachers Service Commission directed P1 teachers to upgrade. With the introduction of the Competence-Based Curriculum (CBC), it became necessary for P1 teachers to be trained on the new pedagogical skills to enable them to effectively implement the new curriculum and disseminate knowledge to learners. Accordingly, the Commission put in place an elaborate and comprehensive programme for P1 teachers who are employed by the Commission to be retooled on the new pedagogical skills to upgrade them to effectively disseminate the knowledge. The other policy statement is that the Commission is aware that the policy direction by the Ministry of Education was based on the recommendation of the Fatuma Chege's Taskforce on Enhancing Access, Relevance Training, Equity, Quality for Effective Curriculum Reforms and Implementation, 2020. The Report of the Presidential Working Party 2023 recommended that the Ministry of Education ensure that all teachers who graduated before 2023 undergo a mandatory one-year retooling and upgrading programme to align with the new curriculum. That upgrading is essential for teachers to acquire proficiency in CBC implementation. That is the policy behind the directive for teachers to upgrade their education. The second question was on the timeline of when the referred teachers will receive certificates for the diploma courses they pursued. Noting the upgrading programme for P1 teachers who are not yet employed by the Commission, the timelines may be provided by the Ministry of Education who coordinated the programme. The providers of the diploma training should explain on the certificates. As I explained earlier, the teaching and training of the teachers took place in the primary teachers training colleges. Further, the Teachers Service Commission (TSC) has indicated that, that issue is the preserve of the Ministry of Education. As the Chairman of the Committee, I went ahead and asked the Ministry to give us the timelines under which those certificates are supposed to be issued. That is a supplementary question that the Ministry of Education needs to respond to. On the third question, she sought an explanation as to why the Commission is yet to prioritise and consider P1 teachers whom it advised to augment their education for purposes of absorption as Junior Secondary School (JSS) teachers. On that question, TSC indicated that in the wake of CBC, it became pertinent for P1 teachers to be re-tooled on the new pedagogical skills so that they could effectively implement the new curriculum. Accordingly, the purpose of re-tooling the P1 teachers was to effectively equip them to better teach CBC at the primary level and not at the JSS level. The P1 teacher is supposed to teach CBC in Grade One to Six, not at the JSS. To this end, the course content of the upgrade in diploma primary education programme is designed specifically for primary education to improve quality teaching in the primary schools. Additionally, the career pathway for teachers teaching at JSS is that of secondary school teacher and is distinct from P1 teacher at the primary school level. Hence, the upgrade was not intended as a pathway for P1 teachers to be absorbed into JSS. The fourth question was on the steps taken by the Commission to ensure that P1 teachers who upgraded their education are absorbed in the rightful job grades. This is a question that is being asked by every teacher who was upgraded, even in my constituency and the country at large. Teachers are concerned that they have been re-tooled and are no longer the P1 certificate teachers because they now have a diploma. TSC has made a statement to that effect. They indicate that the upgrade in diploma primary education programme is meant to The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

equip P1 teachers with the required pedagogical skills to implement CBC at the primary school level. Once those teachers are employed, they are posted to public primary schools. In view of the upgrading programme and the ongoing certification by Kenya National Examinations Council (KNEC), the Commission will commence the review of its career progression guidelines for purposes of grading such teachers. This particular statement does not indicate when those teachers will be paid for the opportunities forgone. It has just indicated that they will look at the career progression guidelines for purposes of the upgrading of the teachers. I have gone through the bulky statement and it has indicated every other aspect that Hon. Nyenze had asked. Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I will hand over the Statement to Hon. Nyenze. I submit.

Hon. Nyenze, would you like to say something?

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. Thank you for the answers, but the response is not satisfactory. That is because the TSC advised the teachers to augment their education, and they spent 1,500 hours, which is roughly 9 months. They went for that training, paid some tuition fee and spent a lot of time. They even stayed away from their families for that period, but they were not considered in any way. Those ones who were already P1 teachers were neither promoted nor given any advantage, even after getting the diploma. The other P1 teachers are still being re-tooled even now. In this case, after the training, they are reimbursed and have the advantage of not spending so many resources on the training they are undertaking. The other first batch of teachers feel like they have been forgotten. Those who got the diploma and were already P1 teachers, were not absorbed to teach in the JSS. The response says that they were being trained to be in the primary school section under CBC. But we still do not have adequate teachers in JSS. For instance, someone who is a trained Maths teacher is given a whole class to teach history or Christian Religious Education (CRE) there. Therefore, as far as JSS is concerned, the education system there is wanting. The reason why the Commission came up with that diploma course was so that those teachers could be upgraded to teach in the JSS. The other disadvantage is that some of the unemployed teachers went for that training and spent more money with the hope that they would be absorbed by TSC, but they have not been employed even after getting the diploma. So, the response is not satisfactory as far as those teachers who upgraded are concerned. That is because they have no advantage over the others. Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker.

Hon. Melly, do you have a response to that? You can clarify to Hon. Nyenze on that issue.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, I agree with Hon. Nyenze. In the education sector, we have opportunities that are forgone. If TSC directed that the teachers upgrade, get a diploma certificate and are back and yet there is no advantage gained, then it is not proper. Since the teachers gained the pedagogical skills and the technical know-how, they deserve some salary increment. This is to show that they have taken 1,500 hours and paid for tuition. As the Chairman of the Departmental Committee on Education, and the Committee as a whole, that is something that we need to pursue. This is to ensure that those teachers are adequately compensated for the acquisition of new skills and the time taken for the training. We must appreciate that they are now better teachers than those who have not undergone that training. Hon. Nyenze, you have a point. Hon. Deputy Speaker, I will pursue that. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Let us now proceed to the answers by the Chairman of the Departmental Committee on Health, Hon. Pukose. Has he nominated somebody to answer to the question by Hon. Rahab Mukami, Member for Nyeri County? I The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

thought I saw Hon. Pukose here. He also needs to answer a second question that was sought by Hon. John Mukunji, Member for Manyatta. Did Hon. Pukose assign anyone? We will pass those two questions and move them to another time. We can now move to the next Order. Hon. John Kiarie.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I beg to move the following Motion: THAT, aware that, Article 11(2)(b) of the Constitution provides that the Government shall recognise the role of science and indigenous technologies in the development of the nation; further aware that the Vision 2030 provides for the integration of information, communication and technology in the country’s transformative agenda; concerned that, there exists no science museum for consolidating indigenous scientific and technological innovations, training and research purposes in the East Africa Region; appreciating that, integration of science and technology would greatly enhance Kenya’s economic and societal success; noting that there is potential for growth in the technology sector by establishing a science museum; further noting that, the informal science education plays a key role in the progression of Science, Technology, Engineering and Mathematics (STEM); acknowledging that science museums operate as the nexus between science practitioners, policy-makers and the public; cognisant of the fact that, a science museum in the country would greatly impact on the economy of the country in the quest to become an industrialised nation; now therefore, this House resolves that, the national Government, through the relevant Ministries establishes and operationalises a science museum in the country. I am standing on the Floor of this House in the year 2024, and asking the House to agree with me that we should urge the Government to establish a science museum in Kenya. This will not only be the first science museum in East Africa, but the first and the only one in Africa. A science museum becomes something important for a nation like us, that has espoused in its guiding documents, starting with the Vision 2030 that says that we endeavour to be a knowledge-based economy. It is also this country that has developed the Kenya Digital Superhighway Project, an aspiration of Kenyans to be connected to the technology of today. When we talk of the technology of today, we are talking at a time when there is the onset of the Fourth Industrial Revolution, also known as the era that would be driven by Artificial Intelligence (AI). We are seeing technologies like Blockchain Technology and Internet of Things (IoT). All those advancements in technology are telling us that we are in a new era. However, even in this new era, we ought to speak as Kenyans and Africans and ask ourselves whether, if this is the fourth industrial revolution, where was Kenya in the third, second and first industrial revolution? Where was Africa when the world was moving into steam energy and mechanising operations? Where was Africa when the world adopted electricity as a way and mode of driving their technology? Where was Africa when we were moving into microchips in what was called the dot.com era or the third industrial revolution? I dare say that Africa slept through all those previous three revolutions. The question begs: Are we the generation of Parliamentarians that will superintend over Africa sleeping through the fourth industrial revolution? Today, the world is advancing using what I would call the Western model of development, which is informed mostly by the advancements that have been introduced to the world by the British Empire, when they were able to conquer the world The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

to a point where it was said that the sun never sets on the British Empire. The British are the ones who have introduced that new model of advancement that we are in today. But if you approach the British, they would tell you that before they came into their advancements, they were referred to as barbarians. If you ask the British the person who advanced them, they will tell you that all the knowledge that they have, they got it from the Romans. If you approach the Romans and ask them where they got the knowledge that they pride themselves in, they would tell you that all the knowledge that they have was gotten from the Greeks. Our education system will only teach us that far. If you seek further than that, you shall find that the Greek got all the knowledge that they have from Africa. The people we celebrate and call Pythagoras, Boyle’s, Aristotle, Socrates, and all those famous people said to be the fathers of the disciplines of knowledge that we practice today such as psychology, philosophy, chemistry, and all the advancements that we talk about in education today, if they were honest, they will tell you that they came to Africa and found advanced universities. In North Africa, we know of the universities that were in Egypt. In West Africa, we know of the great advancements, civilisations and libraries that were in Mali. Where we are, around the Habesha region, also known as Abyssinia, the Kush kingdoms, we had our own technological advancements and advanced technology that would shock the world. If you go south, you will find extremely advanced…

On a point of information, Hon. Deputy Speaker.

He is still moving his Motion.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, I want to inform my colleague who is my good friend about the Greek philosophers, Aristotle and Plato. Majority of them never went to Africa, but we acknowledge that Pythagoras theorem came from Egypt. It is good for my brother and a good friend of mine to learn that. Most of the philosophers never visited Africa before Athens moved towards democracy. Thank you.

I am sure you are informed. You may now proceed.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, that is a point of argument, and I wish that “Hon. CNN” would wait for me to move the Motion so that he can bring up this argument. However, if you are patient enough, I will take him to class and let him know that I am speaking from a point of fact that all the advancements that we call the Greek foundational knowledge was actually stolen, pilfered and borrowed from Africa. There is a great city in North Africa called Alexandria, and it celebrates a man known as Alexander the Great. That man is known worldwide as a great general of war. The story we are never told is that when Alexander and his soldiers came into Africa, they went into our very advanced libraries and universities, but they were not kind enough. When they pilfered what was in our libraries, they burnt them down to the ground, razed down all the knowledge, stole it, pilfered, and took it to Europe and claimed it to be their own knowledge and that is the knowledge that they have put in books. Today, we celebrate the Greeks as the foundational fathers of the knowledge that we have, but I would like to let “Hon. CNN” know that this knowledge, as a matter of fact, if you dig deeper into your reading, you shall find that it was actually stolen from Africa.

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This would help in explaining why we have such advanced technology in places like Cairo in Egypt, where we have what you would call the Pyramids. People see pyramids just as structural formations, but I would like to say that even today, with all the advanced western knowledge that we have, scientists are unable to explain how the traditional African was able to put up such technological marvels as the pyramids. The Pyramids are aligned astronomically, astrologically and scientifically perfect to pyramids that are in South America and the East, all scientifically aligned to a scientific exactitude that cannot be achieved even by the knowledge and scientific advancements that we have today. Most importantly, Africa has not always been a technological dwarf. At some point, in its moments of greatness, it was a scientific and technological giant. The misconceptions that it is a scientific dwarf emanate from the fact that all of African traditional knowledge and heritage has neither been put in books nor recorded in words and figures. As such, the people who read science today only understand what is captured in books - in numeracy and literacy. However, they may never understand some of the oral traditional African knowledge that used to be preserved and transitioned to other generations orally. That is why Africans today suffer inferiority complex. Africans, like Hon. Charles Nguna Ngusya (CNN), may never know that they are the ones who civilised Europe into hygiene. Between 700-1400 AD, emperors from Africa went to Europe and conquered and civilised it from its barbaric ways and taught them how to use toilets. Those Europeans were just busy defecating in the streets. It is a historical fact that the Black Moors were the emperors who ruled Europe between the years of 700-1400 AD. The absence of the recordings and exhibits of our history, and not being able to preserve our technological advancements, make us suffer the risk of misunderstanding our history. Therefore, we shall only be served that which the oppressor wants us to know. However, we ought to understand that if you do not tell your story the way you want it to be told, it shall be told by somebody else in the way he or she wants to tell it.

On a point of order, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): What is your point of order, Hon. Gisairo? You have raised your hand. I can hear you saying point of order, but I cannot see your name anywhere on the screen. Do you have your card? Is it working? Okay, it is now working. What is out of order?

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. My concern is that Hon. Kiarie is bringing out valid points. However, he has used a statement like: 'Africans, like Hon. CNN, will never understand or know….' That puts all of us in a point of ignorance that we do not know anything except Hon. Kiarie. Can he use more dignified language towards Africans whom I am one of them?

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): I do not want to defend you because I know you have a lot of respect for Africans.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, you got it perfectly. In fact, I celebrate Africans. That is why I am moving this Motion. I do not want to generalise anybody into a point of ignorance because I know how well-informed Africans are, up to and including my good friend, Hon. CNN. I was making a reference to the fact that if one does not tell his story the way he or she wants to, it might be told by somebody else in a way that he or she does not want to tell it. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

I am moving a Motion which I want the Members of Parliament to support, so that we can establish a science museum that will create a nexus among scientists, scientific practitioners, policy makers, students and different members of the public. This will enable us to preserve our technological advancements in a living museum. It might be a point of argument that we already have museums. However, the kind of museum I am talking about is not of natural history, which I refer as dead. With all due respect, I mean dead in the fact that we go there to see exhibitions of taxidermies or stuffed animals that are already dead. We go to see things of the past. A science museum is a living museum which covers the history of technological advancements from the past, taking into cognisance what is happening in the present and also trying to imagine a future as we would want to imagine it. In Kenya today, if you take one line of science, for example, the line of telecommunication which Hon. Elisha knows very well, only a quarter of a century ago, the order of the day was a dial telephone and a call box. For a child who is born today - Generation Z or Generation Alpha - they cannot tell you what a call box, Compact Disc Read-Only Memory (CD-ROM) or floppy disk drive are. This is knowledge that will be lost. If we do not preserve it, we might suffer the fate that our forefathers suffered when traditional historical artefacts were being expatriated from this continent and exhibited in far-flung capitals. As we speak today, it is common knowledge that we have tonnes of traditional African artefacts that are on exhibit in capitals far away from this continent. In this fourth industrial revolution, Africa cannot suffer the same fate. We ought to proactively stand up and claim our pole position as an African technological giant that Kenya is, to spearhead the new era by establishing science museums that will showcase Africa's traditional scientific prowess. When there was COVID-19, people were scampering for a remedy. I dare say that in places like Nyanza, somehow, it was not as prevalent or as bad as it was elsewhere. When you whisper to Members from Nyanza, they will tell you that when COVID-19 broke out, they fell back to a traditional remedy that they had used for centuries to cure and remedy malaria. It is a very bitter herb that is normally boiled and taken as such. It mitigates the effects of fever, flu and COVID-19. That traditional knowledge is what is normally picked up by multinationals. They extract the active ingredients. And because they do not want to have something they cannot preserve, they add preservatives. Even more dangerously, they put up a brand. When it comes on, they give it a premium position, and it becomes an expensive product. Where are the Africans with the Wairimu Plant which is planted in the mountain region, which cures cold or flu? It is an active ingredient that forms part of very many modern medicines. If that knowledge is not preserved or exhibited, it will go to waste. We are coming into a new world which I call the fourth industrial revolution. It is mainly driven by Artificial Intelligence (AI), which relies on data because it is the driver of industry. Data shall fuel the next world. Traditionally, Africa has not written down its data. It is not in numerals or numbers. Today, AI is scrapping data out of the internet which says Africa is not present. This makes us realise that Africa has not africanised the internet as much as we have embraced it. Therefore, going into the fourth industrial revolution, our data might be missing in the formation of the driving force and fuel that will drive it. Most importantly, on data representation, all the main data centres are in the Northern Hemisphere. We want to see Africa contributing its data to be able to drive that fourth industrial revolution.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, with those few points, I would like to call upon Members to support me in this Motion that seeks to provide a science museum that shall consolidate indigenous scientific and technological innovations; shall be a centre of training and research purposes; and, shall be the nexus between the scientists, the science practitioners, policy makers and the general public. Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I ask Member to support me on this Motion.

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(Hon. (Dr) Rachael Nyamai): Hon. KJ, who is the Seconder of your Motion?

Hon. Temporary Speaker, I would like to call Hon. Elisha to second this Motion.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Hon. Elisha, you may proceed.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, I beg to second the Motion by Hon. KJ. It is important that our country preserves our indigenous technologies from outsiders. Establishment of a science museum is a good thing. I congratulate Hon. KJ for thinking this far in terms of technology engineering and getting Kenya to the next level. I second.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Hon. Members, we may now go ahead to debate. I can see Hon. Charles Ngusya Nguna, Member for Mwingi West, wants to contribute.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for giving me this opportunity to defend and also support my brother, Hon. KJ, for bringing up this Motion. Let us note that we need science in every sphere of our life. In the purported developed world, they have museums everywhere. For instance, I have a lot of interest in Athens, Greece, and I am proud of it. That is one of the countries that we need to go and benchmark on things to do with museums. If you go to Acropolis, Athens War Museum and Tate Britain Museum in London, you will find thousands of tourists visiting. There are many other museums that receive many visitors. Museums act as a key driver of economic growth in any country because of the tourists. Establishing a science museum will also help our learners and university students in advancing knowledge and leading to new discoveries and innovations in our country. Who said we cannot become innovative? Who said we cannot become more intelligent than the developed world? That is why I am supporting this Motion. Establishing a science museum will also help us live a better life than other countries. It will boost productivity in many aspects if we research on them. It will also facilitate us to access information. Where do we store information to do with discoveries? We have a lot of historical sites in our country. Where do we store such information? If we establish a science museum, we will be able to access a lot of necessary information, including our history. For example, if we want to get facts about our founding father President Kenyatta, where can we collect such information? We do not have museums that actually preserve our information and knowledge. Establishing a science museum will also help us to collect, preserve and display our significant scientific artefacts. That is why I am supporting the Motion. I am happy that my brother Hon. KJ, in bringing the Motion, has borrowed a lot from Greece by recognising the likes of Aristotle and Heraclitus, some of the Greek historians who made the world what it is today. With those few remarks, Hon. Temporary Speaker, I fully support this Motion.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Thank you. Hon. Phylis Bartoo, Member for Moiben. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you Hon. Temporary Speaker for giving me an opportunity to contribute to this Motion by Hon. KJ. A science museum is primarily devoted for science. Worldwide, in established countries, science museums play a very important role in educating students, professionals and citizens. When I was lecturing at the university, we used to have problems with history students. We encountered situations where history post-graduate students who were collecting data were not able to get real life data, especially in our museums. A case in point is Fort Jesus and the Archives in the Central Business District. There is nothing lively in those spaces. They just have documents that do not communicate. Hon. Temporary Speaker, if we establish real museums where we have information from the past to the present, they will be very informative and important to our post-graduate students. I particularly talk about post-graduate students since I come from the academia. If one visits a country like Israel, one will get real life experiences. You will get carried back in history. You go back in history. You learn about their cultures. You learn about mummification – how they used to preserve their dead. It takes you back in time and you feel connected to the past. You feel like you can identify. You feel like you can touch the past. It is very communicative. That is the essence of a science museum. In Kenya, we have many activities and cultures which need to be documented. Those cultures are not just for the present, but they will also shape our future. We are re-shaping our educational curriculum. We have the Competence-Based Curriculum (CBC) which aims to teach our learners to practise what they learn in class. Where else can they refer to history? What can they relate to if we do not have facilities such as science museums in Kenya, where they can go and interact with knowledge that shapes their future? Science says that the past shapes the future. Science museums are very important. Our museums in Kenya are only for recreation. We only visit them to pass time and for tourism. I do not think the tourists who come to Kenya take home so much because we do not have much to talk about. Fort Jesus is dead. You only meet young men and women there who take you around, creating stories which even they might not be very sure about. The sites are also dilapidated. There is not much to talk about. For instance, they can only talk about the slave trade which happened in Kenya, and the barter trade which was going on across the Indian Ocean. If we establish a communicative science museum, we will document all the stories and theories which we have heard about Kenya. Many people will visit Kenya to get a feel of what happened in the past. Our cultures will soon become dormant because we do not have a place to preserve them so that even our young people can have a connection. Those museums will help us to appreciate revolution. Culture and life are not static. What will we tell our people in the next 100 years if we do not have somewhere to store information? What will we tell our people in future if we do not have places to store our stories? For instance, Kenya is currently going through an impeachment process of a sitting Deputy President, which is new and unprecedented. Those stories should be preserved in our museums. Our children will learn that in 2024, the Parliament of Kenya had a procedure for impeaching a Deputy President. We should preserve that information in videos. Where else will we store that information? Not everyone can get an opportunity to come to Parliament to get that story, but that story can be found in a science museum. A science museum will facilitate the convergence of various disciplines. It will bring together science, technology, maths and the arts. Therefore, it will improve our daily lives. We are teaching our students to be innovators. Where will they learn about innovation if they do not get the knowledge from the past so that they can relate it to what is currently going on in the present? The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

I applaud Hon. KJ for bringing this very important Motion because it will shape our lives differently. It will inform history, science, knowledge and make our education system even better. Our post-graduate students will have a place to get data, which is very important in research. It is only in those science museums that students can go, sit, interact with real-life experiences, and even improve on their knowledge and knowledge management. With those few remarks, I support the Motion.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Thank you, Professor. Hon. Olive Gisairo, Member for Kitutu Masaba.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. My name is Clive, not Olive. Just for the record!

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Okay, Hon. Clive Gisairo, Member for Kitutu Masaba, and a very proud alumnus of Alliance Boys.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I am a proud product of the Alliance High School, not Alliance Boys. Hon. Temporary Speaker, I rise to support this very good Motion by my friend, Hon. Kiarie, on the need to establish a science museum in Kenya because of the many reasons he has raised, which are positive, including to preserve our culture for future generations. African history today is better documented outside Africa than in Africa itself. If you want to learn about the cradle of mankind, you will have to go to Europe and visit their museums for them to tell you that the first invention of “ABC” was in Africa. However, there is no place in Africa where you will find such documentation. This explains a broader challenge that we have as Africans. We have embraced westernisation to the point that anything African is bad and anything from the West is good. Africans could perform surgeries before the arrival of the white man. We could perform caesarean sections, but who knows about that? We have been made to believe that all those medicines, surgeries, operations, and bone repairs came with the white man. There is nothing further from the truth. This has gone further to ensure that we believe that the African way of worship was evil and it was easily classified as witchcraft. We were taught that the white man's way of worship is the right way and, therefore, we were forced to discard our traditional African religions. Such a museum will ensure that we have positive ethnicity. Each community and its history and innovations can be preserved in a place where our young children can see the good about culture A or culture B. That creates a united country because we can learn from each other and embrace the good in each other. We should not just see the negative in other communities. We may be the last group that can explain slavery because of our education system. The generations coming after us may not even understand what we are talking about. The only knowledge they get about slavery, because we have even adopted their education system, is what they tell us. It is not what we tell them. It is not what was documented by us. It is what the white man, the westerners, want to tell us about slavery. The perpetrator cannot have a better view of the subject matter than the person affected. The best people to document this for the future generation are us Africans. Unlike Hon. ‘CNN’, who has been to Greece and has interest there, I happen to have toured very many African countries. I have been to the deep of Congo. The history there is rich, but no one writes about it. Outsiders come and write how they discovered Mount Kilimanjaro. Where were we when they were discovering it? How they discovered Lake Victoria. Where were the Luos? We cannot sit down for people to discover us. They say they discovered Africans. We should support such a Motion to ensure we are able to give our children something to look back to and something to learn. We have absconded our languages. The Bible is translated into almost all native languages, but the child of today struggles to speak even The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Kiswahili. Forget about my native language. Where are we heading as Africans? Traditional songs will disappear if we do not put up a museum that is not just well equipped, but is always revamped, supported financially, and enabled to ensure it keeps updating and upgrading itself using modern technologies. That way, information is not only retained within the museum itself, but reaches all the people not just in Africa, but in the whole world. That is possible. I strongly support this Motion by Hon. KJ and I like his views. He has an artistic mind. A mind that shows the creativity of our people that nobody is ready to showcase. Hon. Kiarie, thank you for such a Motion. I support it in full. I submit, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

(Hon. (Dr.) Racheal Nyamai): Thank you very much. Hon. Julius Sunkuli, Member for Kilgoris.

Thank you very much for giving me this opportunity to discuss this Motion by my good friend Hon. KJ. I am a lover of museums. When I go to Washington, D.C., I always visit the Smithsonian Museum. It has all the types of museums: Museum of history, museum of science and all the other museums. When you look at the definition of a science museum, it is supposed to be a museum that collects and displays objects having scientific interests. People who run science museums must, first of all, have things to display; things that they show for themselves. Then they use the forum of the science museum for education. I support this Motion because I know the Mover is a visionary man who looks far away. In Kenya, this is a good idea. I do not know whether it is an idea whose time has come. Unfortunately for our country, we are not well known for scientific innovation. The things we are supposed to display must be as a result of our physics, chemistry, geology, technological information and so on. We are still developing those things. I agree that we need to use those museums as incubators towards the development of a good scientific environment in our country. We need to orient the minds of our young people to start thinking about science. I am a lawyer and my specialty is history and literature. Nowadays, those subjects are considered not to be as important as they were when we were in school. But to say the truth, I think science is acquiring a new meaning, especially technology. We require a place where we can dedicate ourselves to those things. If that museum becomes a reality, I hope that we do not make the same mistake that we are making with the national libraries. Recently, the country decided to devolve national libraries and make them the responsibility of the counties. Libraries will die there because that is not a priority of the counties. If you take those kinds of museums to the counties, they do not have the same vision as my friend Hon. KJ. Counties will bury the museum and forget about it. Let us begin big in the big towns of Kenya - in the City of Nairobi, in the City of Mombasa, in the City of Eldoret, in the City of Nakuru and in the City of Kisumu. If we begin in those big places, then young people will learn their science there, learn to store the information they have and learn to respect the fact that we learn from the past. Scientific knowledge in Kenya is what we need to move this country forward to where Korea is. Koreans can display how their original car looked like, and then inspire young people to make their own cars. We can also have our own Uhuru car in that museum. We can have the good old ERNH of the old East African Railway in that museum. We may have something to display, but we must use that as a springboard towards going forward to new innovations. Hon. Temporary Speaker, I support.

(Hon. (Dr.) Racheal Nyamai): Thank you very much. Hon. John Gitonga, Member for Manyatta.

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Order, Hon. Momanyi. I can see you are lifting up your hand. I am not even able to see your request on the screen. What is out of order, Member for Nyamira County?

Hon. Temporary Speaker, thank you for giving me this opportunity. It is not a point of order. I just wanted you to take note that I am in. My card got lost somewhere. I want to contribute and so, you can allow me to continue.

(Hon. (Dr.) Racheal Nyamai): Since you do not have a card, please, take your seat. I will make a decision on what to do. You may proceed, Member for Manyatta.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I rise to also support this motion. I commend my brother the Member for Dagoretti, for such a thoughtful Motion. I am very intrigued by the proposal of a science museum. It is true that we have allowed for too long our stories to be told by people who do not care much about our history. A science museum will be a very important establishment for the future of this country and for the future of Africa in terms of the advances that have been there since time immemorial in science. Interestingly, Hon. Temporary Speaker, Hon. K. J, who is in the arts, is the one who is proposing a museum for science. I believe this country has contributed a lot to the advancement of science in the world. Just the other day, I was reading a book and found out that what we call dirty jeans originated from this country, somewhere in Naivasha. But if you look around, you will find that the patent for such things is not in this country, but is somewhere in the United States. It is true that the contributions of Kenyans and Africans in the colonial history was documented by the whites and not by the people who actually were supposed to give the story. It is sad, wrong, and a big loss for our African culture, that even what we depend on is not by us, but by tourists. We have had advancements in gastronomy research that is being done in this country for years, but you will not find those things in our history because we do not have a science museum. That is why I really commend this Motion. It contributes a lot in ensuring that we create a multi-million niche in research and advance the local technologies that have come from within as opposed to depending on what we get from without. We have a lot of interest in Kenya Medical Research Institute (KEMRI). It is one of the organisations that need to be well-guarded, but the Government does not give them much for research. It tells you why we have a very low output when it comes to science research. We really need continuous embracement of research regarding the problems that we face in science today. Recently, we had COVID-19, but not much money was allocated for the creation of medicine by our own institutions and people. I believe that for a country that is bombarded with a lot of things from the West, it is upon the National Assembly and the current administration to ensure that we allocate resources to improve the technologies that can advance our country. I am happy that today, we are talking about Artificial Intelligence (AI). Interestingly, I heard Hon. K.J. mention that with AI, we should be able to document things from our past and ensure that they are well preserved in a science museum. This country has put some little effort in ensuring that we are leading in the research on Artificial Intelligence. We are waiting for others to do things, then we pick it up. That is why you find we have embraced technologies and applications from outside without empowering our own technological advancements. I believe all this can be said, but if there is no deliberate funding, we will not be able to keep up with what is happening in the world. The world is moving too fast and when it is moving too fast, there is need to put more effort. While we encourage job tourism outside Kenya, we should have a strategy to retain some minds within Kenya for advancement of our own country and ensure that our workforce does not have brain- drain. I believe this Motion regarding science museums is something that needs to be supported. I support it 100 per cent and the Government needs to do an extra thing and ensure that it deliberately funds science. I was in the University of Nairobi and many of the researches The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

that are happening in our universities are being funded by the West, like the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation and many other organizations that fund research in this country. They fund and take it away to other countries. It is sad, but I believe that it is upon us to ensure that we start taking research seriously. Research goes hand in hand with the development of a nation. If you do not research, you do not develop. Today, we are talking of AI but tomorrow, we are going to be talking of a different thing as the world is moving. I support.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Thank you. Next is the Member for Bondo, Hon. Gideon Ochanda.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I want to quickly mention a few things that, in my view, Kenya needs to be very careful about. First, is the place of museums. If you compare the place of museums in this country to other parts of the world, you will realize that we are very far from where those people are. We are far from what many other countries have isolated as their core historical, scientific or cultural developments. Museums ordinarily indicate how people have evolved over time. They are in place to preserve evolution history in terms of how we do things like agriculture, production and many other things. However, if you look at our situation, the first problem we encounter is who does the collection of artifacts and tools? Who identifies where to collect or get those things? Before you start talking about building infrastructure for storing them, who does them? If somebody came across some old technology in the village, for example, the grinding stones, which in my view are scientific as much as they are for the purpose of culture, history and how food was produced... How do you want to compare that with the meals that we have currently? It indicates exactly how we have developed and evolved over a period of time. Who does that? Who identifies that what I have talked about was really a scientific engagement? Identification of those things is one big challenge that we have. Many are disregarded and strewn all over and nobody really connects them with the evolution that we have experienced over a period of time. This is the biggest challenge we have as a country. Secondly, have we seen what other museums have evolved to? Museums in the rest of the world have evolved from just being indicators of evolution to being real spots for tourism. If you go to some of those big cities and ask what the best sites are, museums will be featuring all over! They will be located in one part of the city or the other. They are no longer looking at museums as just storage of science history, but as spots to attract tourists. The Roman artifacts, including their ancient roads, remain historic. Roads that were built in the 17th to 18th century still exist. What was the science behind the construction of those roads? If you go to London today, you will realise that people are staying in houses that were built in the 18th to 19th century. What is the science behind that when our houses here in Githurai are collapsing in under three years? What is it that was behind that? In my view, those are some of the things that need to be collected deliberately. The Mover needs to seriously consider how to identify what should be retained. Who is able to identify for us the first house or mansion that was built by our first Jua kali artisans ? What was the first house that they did? Where is it and is it still surviving? What is it that was done that our current houses cannot stand for five years? Those are the reasons why museums are very necessary. Apart from being the evidence of evolution, there are also reference points that something happened or was done and it has withstood the test of time and, hence, it still exists today.

Therefore, Hon. Temporary Speaker, I support this. We need to focus on the identification process of what we consider to be scientific, and that has evolved and grown with us over a period of time. What we have at the moment are shells. I can clearly say that the only thing we have now as a scientific museum is the Railways Museum. I do not think there is any other. It is somewhere in the middle of a dilapidated and ignored place. Nobody knows it exists. Only a few of us have an idea that it exists. That is a serious scientific museum that we have. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

As much as it is not us who developed the first rail lines, it is here to demonstrate and help us know the things that happened. When you look at the bridge that was done in San Francisco in the 18th Century, it still survives and remains one of the biggest bridges we have in the world. However, in this country, the bridge that we can really say belongs to us and we have seen it over a period of time ― and it was built in the 1970s ― is the Nyali Bridge. The one in San Francisco has withstood the test of time because it has been there for over 300 years. It is the biggest and it is such a scene that beholds. When you get there, you realise something was done. If somebody was able to do that 300 years ago, what kind of a brain would that be currently? That is the kind of a relationship that we need to look at when we are looking at the issues of museums.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, I thank Hon. KJ for bringing this Motion. I support.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Thank you, Dr. Ochanda. Hon. Momanyi Jerusha, Member for Nyamira County

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I also rise to support the Motion on the establishment of science museums in our country. The kind of museums that we have were established along time ago, but they do not have artifacts for Africans to appreciate what used to happen. Some us who studied oral literature in school and went out to do research were getting real information from the old people. They were telling us how they used to do things. Before the invention of health facilities that we have these days, even our forefathers used to carry out operations. They could operate on somebody and that person could survive. We are not able to understand how they used to do it. If there were science museums, they could keep those facts and explain them to us. We then could appreciate how far we have come and how far evolution of knowledge that we have these days has come. Hon. Temporary Speaker, looking at our country today, we can appreciate different cultural backgrounds where we come from and also appreciate the different languages, including our mother tongues. Children in this era are not able to communicate or understand what is being communicated through the native languages. I support this Motion because the science museums will keep what is there for posterity, so that those who will come after us will understand where we have come from and where we are. They will also understand some of the innovations which have been put in place that have made our economy and education to grow. It will be a place where the students in universities can go to research, and even contribute to the knowledge that we want as a country. I, therefore, support the Motion. I thank Hon. K.J., for bringing this progressive Motion.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Hon. Naomi Waqo, Member for Marsabit County.

Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for allowing me to add my voice to this important Motion. I also congratulate Hon. John Kiarie for coming up with this Motion on the establishment of a science museum. At the outset, I confirm that I support the Motion. It is a good idea but I suggest that, as we establish the museum, let us not only think of the big cities, but also think of every county and every constituency if possible. When it comes to development and growing different areas, in the past, we have been concentrating on big towns and places and forgotten some areas that need establishment of such museums. Kenya is growing very fast. Our young people have gone before us, have connected with the world, and they have learnt a lot of things. In order to keep them busy and relevant, we must establish different museums and ICT centers and different hubs that can keep them busy and create employment for them. We know very well that we have so many unemployed graduates in the country who are seeking employment. The establishment of science museums The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

will be an exciting thing for them. That will keep them creative, innovative and they will easily connect with the world and remain relevant. Hon. Temporary Speaker, I support this idea because as Africans, we have lost a lot. When we were colonised, we lost almost everything that we had in terms of our culture and tradition, and we adapted the western culture. It is now hard for us and our generation to go back, and it will even be harder for the younger generation. The only way that we can be relevant as Africans is by coming up with our museums so that our young people or the generations that will come after us will be able to see what was happening in the past and also relate with the history and learn from that. Museums are places to explore and test ideas about the natural world. Our country is endowed. We are blessed with different cultures, traditions and languages. We are all proud of where we have come from, but nothing much has been done in terms of keeping history and showcasing what we have had in the past. Therefore, displaying those things today in our museums will be the best thing that we can do as a country. Hon. Temporary Speaker, when it comes to science and research, we are also gifted. Kenyans are very knowledgeable in research, but many of our young people who have that skill have not utilized their skills. If we do this in every county, we will utilize the skills of our young people and even those who are experienced so that we can come up together and even explore more ideas, do enough research and see how we can benefit our country. Hon. Temporary Speaker, today, cancer is affecting the entire world. As Kenyans, we have been seriously affected. For those of us who come from the northern part of this country, especially Marsabit, we have been wondering why we are losing so many of our people to cancer. It will be good for us to engage in more research and invite experts so that we can know the root cause of our problem. The only special gift that we can give to our young people and generations to come is to establish a science museum in every county.

The purpose of a museum is to educate. Our young people will be motivated. They will go to different places and exchange ideas. The other purpose is inspiration. We will inspire so many people. We have other people who have gone before us in different communities and it will be good for us to keep the fire burning by talking about them, capturing the ideas and what they have done in the past so that even the young generation can be proud of what our forefathers did. We will inspire so many people by showcasing different cultures and traditions. The museum will also be a tourist attraction center. Our young people in schools will be able to visit museums and learn. It will encourage so many people because, for some of us, seeing is believing. When people visit and see different cultures, traditions and the things that we used to do in the past, they will all be proud of that. When we were young, we used to gather around our grandparents and elderly people to learn from them. They used to speak to us and up to today, some of the things and words of wisdom that we learnt from our villages are what we used when we were growing up.

This science museum will serve a great purpose in our nation. As a Government, if we can invest in the establishment of a science museum, we will have achieved a great deal, and invested for the future. We should not just establish the science museum, but we also have to maintain it. That is because, as a country, we are good at establishing something and forgetting about its maintenance. So, we should come up with a programme or a roadmap from the beginning to the end. This will make sure that it is well planned for and self-sustaining so that even generations that will come after us will continue to enjoy that. It will go beyond our generation and developing our different counties and creating jobs. With those few remarks, I support the Motion. I pray that it will be established, if not in all the villages, in every county and constituency.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Hon. Abdisirat Ali, nominated Member. The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. First of all, I take this opportunity to thank Hon. K.J., a very young and innovative Member. Establishing a science museum will help this country in the collection of scientific ideas. We have a lot of scattered skills and having a museum will give us a center for innovation and skills data. The museum can also be used as a reference point for our technological aspects. When data has been collected for some time and information taken to a center, it can be used for perfection and creation of skills that can take this country far. We have technology as a culture and it is always evolving. It is dynamic and by having a science museum, that innovation culture will always be remembered by our generations. I once travelled to Stuttgart in Germany and I visited the Mercedes-Benz Museum. I learnt how a Mercedes-Benz has evolved over a century. It used to be pulled by a cart and it has now evolved to its present level. By going there, you will just see a whole complete culture of innovations. By emulating such advanced museums, we can create very robust science and historical hubs that can be used by our youths.

Finally, history is known to us. We know our past, and we can compare it with our present to perfect it. Our future can only be good if we grab the knowledge of our past and the present. Therefore, a museum that is technology-oriented will take our country to the places we aspire it to be. With those few remarks, I support the Motion. Thank you very much.

(Hon. (Dr.) Rachael Nyamai): Thank you. Hon. Mpuri Aburi, Member for Tigania East.

Ahsante, Mhe. Spika wa Muda, kwa kunipa nafasi hii. Yangu ni machache. Kuwa na scientific museum katika nchi yetu ya Kenya ni jambo la maana. Hii ni kwa sababu hapo awali, kulikuwa na mashine ya kutengeneza unga kabla zile mashine za Lister zije. Tulikuwa na zile ambazo zilikuwa zinazungushwa na maji. Kulikuwa na mawe mawili ambayo yalizungushwa na maji kutoa unga wa ugali. Lakini ukiwaelezea watoto wa kisasa kwamba kulikuwa na mashine kama hiyo, hawawezi kuelewa maana nasi tulisahau. Zamani mtu angekatwa na panga, kulikuwa na mti aina fulani uliotumika kama dawa. Huo mti ungekatwa na maji yake yakaguzishwa kwenye mkono uliojeruhiwa na ungeshikana. Vijana wetu wa kisasa wakiulizwa hayo mambo, hawawezi wakajua. Ndiposa, lazima tuwe na makavazi ya kisayansi.

Kwa mfano, katika makavazi ya Jimbo la Meru, utapatana tu nyoka na kobe ilhali, wanyama hao hawatakikani nchini. Zamani kulikuwa na gari tuliloita telebuka . Hilo gari lilikuwa la miguu minne na liliundwa kwa miti. Nikiwaeleza vijana wetu kwamba kulikuwa na gari kama hilo, hawawezi wakaelewa. Naunga mkono uundaji huu wa makavazi ya kisayansi ili wakati utakapofika, watoto wetu wasituulize tulikuwa viongozi ilhali tuliachilia utamaduni wetu upotee. Ndiposa nawaambia watu wetu waweke magari yao kando na watumie vioo vyapembeni kuangalia nyuma ili waangalie mahali wametoka na wajue, kuna watu wamewaachanyuma. Ninamuunga mkono, Mhe. John Kiarie. Ahsante.

(Hon. (Dr.) Racheal Nyamai): Hon. James Nyikal, Member for Seme Constituency.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker for giving me this opportunity. Let me start by appreciating the initiative by Hon. John Kiarie (KJ). Storing knowledge is recognising knowledge, and a museum is exactly in the same place as a library, except how it is used. We should not only see it in terms of tourism, but also in terms of the knowledge that is there. The world we live in is actually technical. If you look at the link between religion, science, politics and development, you will be amazed that for those who are religious, when The electronic version of the Official Hansard Report is for information purposesonly. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

God created the world, at the end of it, he said: 'I put this in the hands of human beings'. Man was created last to take care of them. You cannot have dominion over anything if you do not understand it. Therefore, the basis of our existence in this world is understanding how creation works, and that is what science is all about. What we do in politics is basically to manage that knowledge, whether it is technology or pure knowledge for the benefit of mankind. To that extent, it is our duty to store that knowledge in a structured manner that can later on be actually used so that knowledge grows upon existing knowledge. It is incremental. Many people do not think there was science in Africa. But how could we have survived in a technical world if we did not understand? I am amazed by the indigenous knowledge we have. I look back when I was a child and I think of the environment. One thing my grandfather hated was people who cut trees. He would always say: ‘‘Why are you cutting that tree? You will create a desert.’’ Did it have to take time for us to know this or go to international conferences to know what my grandfather knew? Of course, not! If you look at food in terms of storage, we look at freezing as the best way of storing food. But look at how we stored food in the old days. Drying food with salt is extremely scientific. No bacteria can grow in a dry environment, which is with salt. It is extremely scientific. Fermenting food produces antibacterials. It took a long time before it was realised that fermented milk or sour milk stays longer on the shelf without invasion from bacteria. When we were giving our children fermented milk, people thought that this was not smart. Look at food. In my culture, people knew that children and pregnant women needed to be fed blood from animals and now, we go to the hospitals to get folic acid so that we can get iron. Them, they were just given food. When the Europeans came, those things were seen as backward and we did not continue with their storage. Just like iron mongering, all cultures…

(Hon. (Dr.) Racheal Nyamai): Order, Hon. James Nyikal. The Motion will proceed another time. You have a balance of five minutes in case you wish to continue with the debate. Hon. Members, as you are aware, the Speaker made a Communication yesterday, 1st October 2024 that today’s morning Sitting would be interrupted at 12.00 noon to allow a forum for a briefing of Members on the modalities of public participation in regard to the Special Motion for removal from office by way of impeachment of His Excellency, Rigathi Gachagua as the Deputy President of the Republic of Kenya. The Kamukunji will be at noon, here in the Chamber. I, therefore, call upon Members to attend. As I adjourn, I request those in the Chamber to remain behind.