Order, Senators. Yesterday, there was a Petition by Mr. David Gesicho. We could not proceed with it because of the Divisions that we had to undertake. I, therefore, propose that we proceed from there. Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, you may conclude.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Before I conclude, I had been challenged by the Chair, after a point of order by the Senator for Garissa. I had called the Chairman of the Independent Electoral and Boundaries Commission (IEBC) a thief and I was supposed to substantiate. I want to substantiate that, indeed, the IEBC Chairman, Mr. Issack Hassan, is not a man of integrity. I have only three points to confirm that. First, I want to table before this House a report of the findings of the Public Accounts Committee (PAC) of the National Assembly of Kenya that was tabled on 23rd March, 2016, in which various findings have been made. I do not wish to highlight them, but they just confirm what I said. The second point that I want to use to assert my allegation is that the same Chairman is being investigated by the Ethics and Anti-Corruption Commission (EACC). In fact, he has recorded a statement in respect of loss of public funds. Finally, I want to speak to the stolen election. Two bullets in the findings of the PAC Report indicate that Chairman Issack Hassan was an accomplice in the stealing of the election of 2013. This is under Part 4, bullet 6.0, on page 86 of the report – culpability. If you may just allow me to highlight two points, the reports says that Mr. Ahmed Issack Hassan, the Chairman of IEBC is directly responsible for involvement in the The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. You directed that the Senator for Kakamega substantiates the specific assertion that ‘Issack Hassan is a thief’ and not that ‘he is not a man of integrity.’ The Senator for Kakamega has just tabled a document of the PAC of the National Assembly. He has not pointed out specifically to the issue that speaks to Mr. Issack Hassan being a thief. He has to substantiate by saying what it is that he stole and from whom. I am aware of many Members of this House, from either side of the House, who are being investigated. Could the Senator substantiate specifically those issues speaking to the fact that Issack Hassan is a thief? What did he steal and from whom? Has a court of law actually confirmed the same? As it stands, a number of the issues that he has mentioned are still allegations. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to request that you find that substantiation is not conclusive.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I thought that I had discharged myself very well. I simply avoided going to the specifics that are in the Report. I have even pointed to bullet 6, Part4, on page 86 of the Report. The recommendations are very clear; you will read. But if you want me to say two things that were stolen, then I can confirm to you that the common law jurisprudence of the Commonwealth denotes that the finding by the courts in the United Kingdom (UK), about this same matter, binds our country on the discharge of justice. It was found in the UK that the London based printer, Smith and Ouzman, paid millions to IEBC officials to win printing contracts, and the two directors have been jailed. If we were respecting the provision of the Constitution of Kenya that says that international law, which we have domesticated, is part of Kenyan law, we should have handed over Mr. Issack Hassan, Mr. Oswago, Mr. Chirchir and others to go and face trial The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Order, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale. I must admit that you have made a very impressive attempt, but from what you have said, I have not heard the substantiation that somebody is a thief. I appreciate that the British legal system and ours have a lot in common in terms of the Commonwealth, but these are very distinct jurisdictions. Nobody is guilty until proven so. You cannot be convicted through a proxy. I could see you trying to be a very good student of your party leader, but, unfortunately, the session was not adequate enough. I am very impressed that you made a good show, but it is still not good enough. More fundamentally, repetitions are extremely important. There is no conviction, as far as you have advanced, that confirms that, that particular individual is a thief. So, you owe it to the House.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Standing Order No. 90 (3) states:- “It shall be out of order for one to use offensive or insulting language whether in respect of Senators or other persons”. Would you help the House to interpret the Standing Order No.90 (3) because even a thief out there would find it offensive to be called one in the House? Even someone who is convicted by the courts as a thief will still find the word “thief” to be offensive. Is it in order to use that term in this House, or we request Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale to use a better term or phrase to refer to Issack Hassan. I would understand what Sen. Khalwale was driving at---

Order. Your point is very clear. It supports what I had said earlier. Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, unless we are converting the sessions of this House into a court proceeding, the English definition of the word thief, in ordinary meaning outside the courts, does not mean somebody who has been jailed or convicted. It is somebody who has stolen and whether it has been proved or not, that person is called a thief in English. If you look at the recommendations of the Committee---

Order, Sen (Dr.) Khalwale. Does the same English language have words like suspected thief?

Yes, Mr. Speaker, Sir. That is when one becomes accused. You have now gone into the realm of the courts. But in a village like Malinya, when somebody steals a cow, the school children will say; “there goes the thief who stole our cow” as the assistant chief is escorting him to the police station. That is what the Class Four child will say in English. I want to be understood as an innocent Class Two child who is worried that the finding ---

Order, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale. For one to qualify to run for the seat of a Senator, you need to be an adult. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am in a very tight spot. This is because I am faced with a report of Parliament from our sister House and in bullet five; they have said that they want a special lifestyle audit on Issack Hassan. The report is here, we will be looking at it. These are very serious decisions of the National Assembly. If I start apologizing for it, what will I be saying about Parliament? Will it be that Parliament spoke in vain on 23rd March, 2016 in the National Assembly? As to whether the case will be proved has nothing to do with Parliament because Parliament has already discharged itself. It has found the guy to be dishonest.

What is it, Sen. Sang?

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. While I appreciate what Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale is taking the Senators through, we must be careful. This is because a lot has been said even about the Members in this House. If you lower the threshold by calling people thieves like Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale is saying, then even for the very Senator, there was an allegation of some Kshs12 million getting into his account that could not be explained. We could not call him a thief of Kshs12 million because we knew those were allegations. A lot of things have been said, and there have been scandals in this House like the National Youth Service (NYS), Tokyo and Malili Ranch where Members of this House were mentioned in those scandals. So, if we bring down that threshold, we will no longer have a House of hon. Members, Instead, we will be calling each other all manner of names. I want to persuade my brother, let us work with the legal--- because we are not in the village. If we were in a political rally, we could engage in these kinds of things.

Order, Sen. Sang. You have made your point.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, if Sen. Sang wants to refer to other cases as he has mentioned about Kshs12.5 million that the gutter press wrote about me, I agree, they wrote about it. I challenge him to bring any supporting document as I am doing now of a parliamentary process that has spoken of the Kshs 12.5million. He has talked about Tokyo. Yes, it was brought in this House and upon this House taking a decision, the Senate Minority Leader (Sen. Wetangula), stepped down and due process was done. He was discharged and that is why he is free. The ones who were culpable were taken and charged in court. He was not charged. If this man was a thief, Jubilee would have loved to jail him more than two years ago. It is because he is innocent that they cannot reach The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Order, Senator! Just a clarification; because I have not had the benefit of seeing the Report though I know of its existence; can you confirm if the report was adopted by the House?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I have not confirmed. I was working directly with the Committee but I can confirm if you give me time.

Order, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale. You have a very simple choice. You either do what I have suggested or we will take this matter in a way, which to me, will not be the best in your own interest. This is because I will have to look at all the allegations you have raised, and so far, from my preliminary reading, they are all misplaced. It is better for the House for you to proceed. This is because when you give examples like a recommendation about auditing a lifestyle, it does not mean that the particular lifestyle has been confirmed to be of this magnitude.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, what will I do with the judgment by the Public Procurement Oversight Review Board (PPORB) which is quasi-judicial that met and found out---

Order, Senator. I also listened to that one. Maybe there is more from the sections you read. In what you read to the House, you said the Commission took over the job of procurement. You did not say in taking over, they stole. Unless taking over is synonymous to stealing. From all that you have submitted, and you are a senior standing Member of this House, let us not go there, let us just sort it out.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I want to request most humbly, that the Speaker familiarizes himself with the actual findings of these two authorities that I have tabled here and leave out the allegations I have made about the on goings in the United Kingdom (UK) cases. Look at the findings of the Public Accounts Committee (PAC) and the findings of the Public Procurement Oversight Review Board. If you find that it is not sufficient, I will gladly apologise. We have Kenyans who have lost lives because they want Issack Hassan to go because he is not a man of integrity. So if I---

Order, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale. I will definitely look at the HANSARD and the documents you have presented but you are not going to determine what I should look at. I will look at the entire submission and I am going to make a ruling. I want to give you one more chance. You can withdraw and apologise so that I do not have to expend my valuable time looking at those documents because that time will not be in vain. If I look at the documents and I find otherwise, I am afraid I will give you a harsher punishment than to withdraw and apologise. The choice is yours Senator. What is it, Sen. (Dr.) Machage?

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. As you ponder or look into the HANSARD on what we have been discussing, also look at the different dictionaries on the definition of a thief and let it be part of your presentation.

What is it, Sen. Wetangula?

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I am happy that you are going to make a ruling. I want you, if you agree The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I want to thank you for your offer. As you listen to me with utmost respect, I request you to know that I am doing this in absolute good faith and I have no malice whatsoever against Ahmed Issack Hassan. Article 73(1)(a)(iii) requires that a public officer must bring honour to the nation and dignity to the office. For that reason – I know I am taking too much of your time – I invite you to look at the documents that I have referred to and those authorities and guide us in the next sitting. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I want to conclude by saying that police brutality and extrajudicial killings have occasioned the loss of many lives this week on Monday and the other Mondays that we have been holding peaceful demonstrations against the IEBC. I, therefore, send my condolences to all the victims including; Dickson Asila from Bushiangala Village of Ikolomani in Kakamega, Austine Omambo of Siaya who lost his life and especially the four-year-old Luo boy in Kisumu who was lying on sofa set when he was hit by a live bullet by the police. He is fighting for his life in hospital and I really hope that he will make it. Finally, I want to condemn the culture of mob justice. Mob justice was also used on us when we were doing the peaceful demonstrations in Kakamega. The Jubilee side of this country set up 20 youth who attacked us right under the watchful eyes of the police. Two wrongs do not make a right. I condemn both and I hope that the hour of settling the tension and the challenge of the IEBC---

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I appreciate that I really would not have wanted to interrupt. However, when the Senator says the Jubilee side unleashed a team of 20 youth, we are the Jubilee Side and I am a Member of the Jubilee side. Therefore, he needs to be specific because that would help. Some of us have never organised a team of 20 or even 10 or even one youth to attack people. Therefore, he should be specific because in this House, we are Members of the Jubilee side and I am The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Mr. Speaker, Sir, most of us were avid readers in our early days in high school. You will remember the series that we used to call James HadleyChase. They used to tell us that the guilty are afraid whenever you mention them. Mr. Speaker, Sir, the IEBC Chairman Ahmed Issack Hassan was nominated by the former Prime Minister, hon. Raila Odinga. Several times, the former Prime Minister has been challenged that that was his baby. It is true that he is his baby. You can give birth to a baby but the moment that baby turns out to be a thief in his adulthood, you normally hand him over to the authorities to discipline him. The former Prime Minister has asked us to join him in handing over Ahmed Issack Hassan to the authorities to be disciplined for the theft cases such as the “Chickengate” and the 2013 General Elections and the issue of 1.6 million signatures of Okoa Kenya. Therefore, he is not fit to hold public office. I support Mr. Gesicho’s petition.

Order, Members. I hope you know Standing Order No.226 give this Order 30 minutes maximum time. This Order is a continuation of yesterday. You may have the luxury of quoting from the dictionary but this is one uncontestable fact. Time is time and the time for petitions has elapsed because 30 minutes are over. Next Order!

On a point of order.

What is it, Sen. Wetangula?

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I want to beseech you that the interventions on this Petition were interrupted yesterday. We graciously allowed the interruptions to vote and we voted and we thank ourselves for doing so. For this afternoon, the aggregate time Boni Khalwale, Senator for Kakamega, has spent commenting on this Petition cannot be more than 10 minutes. Probably he has spent two minutes. The rest were interruptions from Sen. Sang who has since left. This is a petition of such immense importance that we would like you to subtract the interruptions from the 30 minutes allocated, so that you give at least two or three of us two minutes each to comment. Mr. Gesicho, who by the name is a person from the Kisii Community living in Kakamega, has raised a very critical issue when the country is at crossroads. I want to congratulate you because yesterday, you got very good news coverage right from television to radio stations until this morning. They announced that you have had the courage to order an investigation to police brutality. We want to complement and augment that good news that you have created for this House. Please allow us a minute or two to make a comment on this.

Order! Sen. Wetangula. I appreciate the humanely soul from other human beings because I would like to be recognised. However, where I sit, I do not work for recognition. I do the job that is before me without fear or favour.

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I want to seek your guidance on this particular Petition by Mr. Gesicho. Before that, let me thank him for bringing this very important Petition. I also thank him for believing in the institution of Parliament because this is not the first petition that Mr. Gesicho is bringing to this House. He has brought other petitions to this House before. Mr. Speaker, Sir, substantially, the point of order that I am bringing to your attention is this. I do not think we are doing this Petition justice in the form in which it is. First, the petitioner’s prayer was that you and your counterpart in the National Assembly form a joint committee of the two Houses to look into this Petition. In your own communication yesterday, you said that that provision is not there although when you look at Standing Order No. 216 (3)(c), that provision is there. More importantly, Standing Order No.220(3) says:- “The Clerk shall, within seven days of the date of receipt of a petition, review the petition to ascertain whether the petition meets the requirements of these Standing Orders and of the law”. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I do not know, if in your own opinion, you think that this particular section of the Standing Order was adhered to. This is because the Petition as it is, with the prayers of forming a joint committee, does not meet the threshold of our Standing Orders. In our Standing Orders, particularly, No.227(1) says:- “Every Petition presented or reported pursuant to this Part, shall stand committed to the relevant Standing Committee”. It does not talk about a Joint Select Committee but a Standing Committee. Now that the prayer of Mr. Gesicho is that the Petition be committed to a Joint Committee of the National Assembly and the Senate, I am seeking your guidance if the Clerk lived to the position of the Standing Order No.220(3). This is because it does not meet the threshold of that Standing Order and Mr. Gesicho should be advised by the Office of the Clerk to redraft his Petition and resubmit it so that you can determine which Standing Committee it can be committed to. As it is, you had even called the next order without committing this petition to any Committee, which is a requirement of our Standing Orders, that after comments by Members, the Speaker shall commit the Petition to a Standing Committee, which you have not done. I seek your guidance on this particular issue.

What is it, Sen. (Prof) Anyang’-Nyong’o?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I stand on a point of order. Will I be in order to request you to use your prerogative in Standing Order No.1 to channel this Petition to the relevant Standing Committee in the Senate so that the concerns of Sen. Khaniri are met instead of returning the Petition to the petitioner?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I will go a little further and point out that the discharge of the responsibility of the Clerk under Standing Order No.220 (3) is that when a petitioner who is a lay person and an ordinary citizen brings a petition here, the Office of the Clerk has a duty to advise the intended petitioner; including telling Mr. Gesicho that he has a good petition but he should not The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I want to join my colleagues in saying that the Office of the Clerk should be able to help. I am aware that two petitioners from my county presented a petition to the Senate and they were told that the format they used was not correct and they were assisted in correcting the mistakes including the format. Mr. Speaker, Sir, on several occasions, you have committed petitions to my Committee, the Senate Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights, and our duty in some of those situations has been advising the petitioners the approach and areas that they should focus on. I therefore, think that there are two ways about it if the petition has found its way to the Chair. If you were to direct it to a committee, one of the responsibilities of that committee would probably be to address that preliminary issue, and if need be, report to the House on that particular preliminary issue before they get into the substance. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I think the issue ought to have been sorted out by the Clerk’s Office. However, since it is on the Floor of the House, the committee that it shall be committed to will deal with that preliminary issue before they get to the substance.

First, I thank Sen. Khaniri for raising all the issues pertaining to Standing Order Nos. 220 and 216. I also thank the Senate Minority Leader, Sen. Wetangula, Sen. (Prof.) Anyang’-Nyong’o and Sen. Sang for the recommendations in terms of tidying up by the Office of the Clerk. I now know for a fact, they tried and Sen. Sang has confirmed that. We usually try to assist the ‘laymen’ petitioners. To address specific issues raised by Sen. Khaniri on a Joint Committee, we said that you need any other joint committee as may be established by a resolution by both Houses of Parliament or under any other law. We did not anticipate the Petition to go that route as it is a laborious and lengthy process. Once we made that determination, we went to Standing Order No.220(4) where the Clerk was sure that the Petition does not comply with paragraph three, which says:- “The Clerk may use such directions as necessary to ensure that the petition is amended to comply with that particular paragraph”. We have made those necessary amendments, and that is why we said that we would not be going that direction. In fact, I suggested against establishment of a joint committee by way of resolution in each House. The procedure for setting up, running and making decisions in such a joint committee, render it unsuitable for consideration to the petition before the House. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I would like to have your guidance on the issue of the Budget. Today, the Cabinet Secretary (CS) for the National Treasury is presenting the Budget Statement for financial year 2016/2017 to the National Assembly. The current Constitution and the laws do not provide for a typical Budget that is presented to the National Assembly. It provides for the Budget Strategy Paper and Budget Policy Statement which are submitted to both Houses of Parliament and all of us have had our input and estimates were tabled long ago. The Cabinet Secretary (CS) merely gives a Statement on Government policies. If you read the spirit of the Constitution, since the entire process has involved both Houses, could I have your guidance on why both Houses cannot, in a Joint Sitting, then, receive the presentation of the Budget Statement? I think that is the spirit in which the Budget is addressed. Going forward, perhaps the two Speakers could consult because there is no express provision that the Budget should be presented in the National Assembly. The documents have, however, been given to both Houses from April. Since we are putting a lot of our time in the process, when the Cabinet Secretary (CS) is giving the Statement, it should be given to both Houses. I think a Joint Sitting would be appropriate. As the whole country is watching and deliberating on the Budget today, we are sitting here as a House that has put in quite a bit of time and we are not participating in that process. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I also support what the distinguished Senator for Mandera has said. I do not see any reason why the Budget should only be submitted to the National Assembly and not the Senate too. In any event, we have a very big budget of counties that we take care of and control. As we all know, counties are independent governments. Therefore, I support what the Chairman of the Committee on Finance, Commerce and Budget has said. In fact, if you saw earlier on today, the people who were being consulted with regard to the Budget was the distinguished Senator for Mandera and the distinguished Senator for Nyamira County. I did not see anybody from the National Assembly being consulted by the media with regard to the Budget. It just shows how this House is highly respected. I do not see any reason why we cannot also loin them. We dearly plead with you to consult your colleague so that we can have joint sittings.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, this Senate represents counties. The national Budget also includes those funds that go to counties. Today as the Budget is being presented, counties are not represented in that House. I think that is a very serious oversight that should be considered seriously so that the two Houses can sit together. While we may not discuss the details of appropriations of funds allocated to the national Government, the Budget today is not just about allocation. It is about the financial policy for the whole country. It is not merely allocation of funds or taxation. I think it is not right that it is only the National Assembly that sits in the Budget presentation process.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I also echo the sentiments raised by my Chairman. As you know, we work on the Budget Policy Statement together. It is something that is passed by both Houses. If you look back at the last two years, we were not there. We did not go for a Joint Parliamentary Sitting. This year, again, we are not there. So, it is now three consecutive years. If, indeed, it is an oversight, I think it is time to correct it. If it is not an oversight and there is a problem somewhere, then it is time to address the problem head on.

Order, Sen. Wetangula! The difficulty I have is that I have seen your name here as a permanent feature of intervention. So, I was not sure whether it is a fresh request.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, sorry. I do not want us to look like cry babies. We are a House that is looked down upon and disregarded. We must appreciate this as a House. We did appreciate this long time ago. We formed a Committee, looked at the Constitution and drafted a Bill to strengthen this House, so that everything is in black and white as to what our role and functions vis-à-vis national issues including budget making, should be. My opinion would be – I agree with my Chairman in the Committee on Finance, Commerce and Budget – that you cannot do all the work and then the Budget Statement is presented to one House. It ought to be presented as a Joint Sitting if fairness is to be played. More importantly, Senators must also be alive to the fact that as defenders and protectors of counties and their governments, our interest is not limited to the amount of The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Sen. (Dr.) Machage, please be brief.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, whereas there is a lot of interest in the suggestion by the Chairman of the Committee on Finance, Commerce and Budget, I may have a different opinion unless we consider changing the very Constitution that has given us a lot of trouble. If you look at the Constitution, Article 109(5), Article 114(1) and (3) tell us how a money Bill should be handled and the definition of the same. I think we would be overstretching ourselves and being a little bit unwise to begin wanting to fit ourselves into the functions of the National Assembly. Unless this Constitution is changed, this prayer may not be appropriate for this House.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I totally agree with the Chair of the Committee on Finance, Commerce and Budget. First, let us start from the basics. I am informing my colleague, Sen. (Dr.) Machage, that there is no provision in the Constitution that says the Budget should be read in Parliament. That was an arranged session by the Speaker of the National Assembly, Members of the National Assembly and the Executive. That arrangement should have encompassed the whole Parliament, for the simple reason that we discuss the Budget Policy Statement and the Strategy Paper when it comes to this House. In fact, the Statement being read by the Cabinet Secretary, Hon. Rotich, has immense contributions from the Senators, many of whom were Cabinet Ministers and who understand it more than those sitting in the National Assembly. Secondly, that Budget has provisions on devolution, serious policy issues expected to be implemented by counties. It is only fair that when you are discussing The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Order, Sen. Murkomen! Order, Senators! The only thing we have done this afternoon is to raise points of order. I must admit that Sen. Murkomen obviously took advantage of other things. Let us proceed and vote now. Let me say I have heard you and I will communicate. I think it is a good suggestion. Even the other House is having the budget read under an administrative arrangement. If this House is desirous of the same, we were working on the assumption that, as Sen. Murkomen mentioned, as far as we are concerned, this is a hang up of the old order. The choice is yours. If you want to retain some good old habits, so be it. If you want to make a permanent departure, we will consider it as a leadership and give direction.

Order, Senators. The results of the Division on Order No.8 are as follows:

Hon. Senators, the results of the Division on the Political Parties (Amendment) Bill (National Assembly Bill N0.2 of 2016) are as follows:-

Order Members, we will now go back to our business on; Order No.5.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to lay the following Papers on the Table:- REPORT OF THE 133TH ASSEMBLY OF IPU AND RELATED MEETINGS Report of the 133th Assembly of the Inter-parliamentary Union and related meetings held 15th and 21st October, 2015 in Geneva, Switzerland. REPORT OF THE 134TH ASSEMBLY OF IPU AND RELATED MEETINGS Report of the 134th Assembly of the Inter-parliamentary Union and related meetings held between 17th and 23rd March, 2016 in Lusaka, Zambia. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Next Order.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, pursuant to Standing Order No. 45 (2) (b) I rise to seek for a Statement from the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Labour and Social Welfare on street families and urchins in Kenya.

Order Sen. Leshore! We are on Order No.6 and not Order No.7. Your matter must be under Order No.7. NOTING OF REPORTS OF THE 133TH /134TH ASSEMBLIES OF IPU AND RELATED MEETINGS

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to give notice of the following Motion:- THAT, the Senate notes the reports of the 133th and 134th Assemblies of the Inter-parliamentary Union and related meetings held between 15th and 21st October, 2015 in Geneva, Switzerland and 17th and 23rd March, 2016 in Lusaka, Zambia respectively, laid on the Table of the Senate on Wednesday, 8th June, 2016.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Let us have requests for Statements first.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I rise pursuant to Standing Order No.45(2) (b) to seek for a Statement from the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Labour and Social Welfare on the street families and urchins in Kenya. In the Statement, the Chairperson should state: - (a) whether there is a Government policy on street families including persons with disabilities and urchins in on our streets; (b) how the Ministry responsible for social services facilitates them; and; (c) their population per county. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Can the Chairperson or any Member of the Committee on Labour and Social Welfare respond? If there is no one from that Committee, can the Senate Majority Leader respond?

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I was consulting. I will get direction from the clerks what the direction is and convey it to the relevant Committee.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): All we want for you to give us timeline on when the Statement that has been sought by Sen. Leshore will be delivered to this House by the Committee on Labour and Social Welfare.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Mr. Temporary Speaker, give us one week.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): It is so ordered. What is it, Sen. Okong’o?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, did you see what Sen. (Prof.) Lesan did?

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): what did he do?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, Sen. (Prof.) Lesan consulted with us on this side and just crossed to the other side without following the laid procedures.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Sen. (Prof.) Lesan, go to the Bar and do what is required of you.

I am told that the Chairperson of the Committee has permission to be away. Therefore, we will skip Statements (a), (b) and (c) INVESTMENTS MADE BY THE NATIONAL GOVERNMENT IN DEVELOPMENT OF SCHOOL INFRASTRUCTURE DELAYED PAYMENT OF TEACHERS WHO MARKED THE 2015 KCPE AND KCSE EXAMINATIONS FUNDING OF LOW COST PUBLIC BOARDING PRIMARY SCHOOLS

Led us move to Statement No. (d). Can the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations proceed?

Order, Sen. Kajwang! You are the one who requested for this Statement The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, at a Sitting of the Senate held on 23rd March 2016, Sen. M. Kajwang requested for a Statement on the status of the National Security Communication System Project. He particularly sought to be informed on:- (a) The objective and total cost of the project. (b) The geographic coverage of the project and what Kenyans should expect from it. (c) The lead implementers of the said project and the procedure used under the Public Procurement and Disposals Act to select and award the implementers. (d) The current status of this project and its expected date of completion. (e) The security agencies that will utilize the national security communication system. (f) The procedure under the Public Procurement and Disposals Act used to allocate the 4G frequencies spectrum licence to the implementers of this project. (g) The value of the 4G licence and how much has been paid for each by the implementers. (h) Whether the amount paid for the 4G licence has been deposited in the Consolidated Fund. (i) How the Government intends to take over control and management of the project upon successful completion. I wish to respond as follows; the National Security Communication Network and Surveillance System of the National Police Service is a high security issue which can only be released ---

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. The Statement request that I made was very detailed. I have not seen a copy of that Statement. It will be quite difficult for me to interrogate that matter on the Floor of the House. Will I be in order to request that I be furnished with a copy of the response so that it can pave way for constructive debate?

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): We can revisit that Statement at the end of the other Statements---

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir---

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order Sen. Adan. I am still speaking. Can you make sure that Sen. M. Kajwang has a copy of what you are reading? What is it, Sen. Adan?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, with your indulgence as well as that of Sen. M. Kajwang’s, this is just a one paragraph response.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Sen. Adan. Whether the Statement response is one sentence, a paragraph or one word, Sen. Kajwang has made a request that must be looked into. Next Statement! Is the Chairperson of the Committee on Lands and Resources in the House? Who is Mike Sonko? Is he one of the Members of the Senate? The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, did you hear my neighbour, Sen. Murkomen, talk about Sen. Sonko as a colleague that we had? Sen. Sonko is alive and present. He cannot claim---

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I expected to discuss this matter with Sen. Sonko. Since, I have not managed to get him in the last two days, I request that we give him a little more time until tomorrow or next week.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): It is good that you have made that request. I was going to order that you give your Statement now because it is the property of the House. If a Member seeks for a Statement and is persistently absent, then the Statement can be given in his or her absence. However, since you have made that request, let us give him that chance. The Statement should be on the Order Paper tomorrow.

The Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Education has permission to be away. Where is the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Lands and Natural resources? CREDIBILITY OF WEATHER FORECASTS ISSUED BY KENYA METEOROLOGICAL DEPARTMENT

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I rise to give a ministerial response.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order! You are not a Minister neither do you issue statements of Ministers in this House. You may get information from Cabinet Secretaries. However, the statement you are just about to issue to this House is your statement as the Chairperson.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I have no quarrel with that. I will therefore, give the statement from myself.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Is it signed by you? Let me look at it.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, before I give it?

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Yes, it is so ordered. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I said that I would give the Statement from myself.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order! That Statement will be part of the records of this House and will be saved as it is. So, let us have a look at it. Do you have a copy? Can I have the report from the Clerks-at-the-Table? Order, have a seat. Hon. Senators, it has been a malpractice that has perpetually been on the Floor of this House. This is to all Chairpersons or those who assist them to issue statements to this House: They must be owned by the Committee and signed by the Chairperson. Usually, we have also to get copies of those statements even before you issue them on the Floor of the House. Those are the House rules. So, let us be careful on this. We are not puppets of Cabinet Secretaries, neither are we subordinate to them. We are senior. I, therefore, order the Statement to be issued on the Floor of this House by the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Land and Natural Resources tomorrow when it is properly documented. It is so ordered.

What is it, Sen. Okong’o?

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I sought a Statement from the Chairperson of the same Committee. I do not know whether my Statement which has been supplied falls within those which you have ordered to be authenticated. Yesterday, I agreed with the Chairperson that my Statement be listed today. I have the Statement. So, kindly guide us which statements fall within that order.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): I have just given guidance on the Statement that was sought by Sen. Kennedy Mong’are of Nyamira County. Is that you?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir it falls in my domain. I am most obliged.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Where is the Chairperson of the Committee on Health? He was supposed to issue a statement regarding the declining state of health services in Nandi County. It was sought by Sen. Sang. Where is he? THE DECLINING STATE OF HEALTH SERVICES IN NANDI COUNTY

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, Sen. Sang is not in.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Since Sen. Sang is not in the House, I order that the Statement be issued on Tuesday.

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, most obliged. Thank you.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Very well. I assume that the one paragraph Statement whose copy was supposed to be issued to Sen. M. Kajwang has been well executed. Have you got a copy of that Statement? Are you happy and comfortable? Is it properly signed?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, it is signed but I am not satisfied with the content.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Secretariat, can you authenticate the Statement being tabled on the Floor of this House? Can we have a copy of the Statement? Proceed, “Sen. Dul”--- STATUS OF THE NATIONAL SECURITY COMMUNICATION SYSTEM

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, you do not know my name?

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): I may know it but I do not know how to pronounce it. Can you tell me how it is pronounced?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, three years down the line and you cannot pronounce it?

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order! Let us have a look at it. Is that Statement properly signed?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, yes.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Is it signed by you?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, no.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Who?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, it is signed by hon. Major General (Rtd) Joseph Nkaissery.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order! That is not a Statement of this House.

Can you bring a proper statement tomorrow signed by the Chairperson of the relevant Committee?

What is it, Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo?

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. You said that the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Education is absent with permission. However, I have sought so many statements before and they were due as you directed earlier. You gave deadlines but those Statements have not been issued. Some are The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): What is it, Sen. (Dr.) Zani?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I would like to step in. Yesterday, the Chairperson of the Committee on Education, Sen. Karaba was here. He had most of these statements. He was ready to issue them but Members were not present. Today, he would have been ready because he was yesterday but he had to be away.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): I am aware of that. He has a demise of a relative. Anybody can understand that situation. We have to give him that benefit. I have listened to Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo’s concern. I order that the secretariat furnish him as soon as possible with all the statements that are due or lost. If there are statements that had been sought in the last Session, they lapsed. I hope you understand what I mean by the last Session, not this small break we had but the last Session. I mean last year. So, if you have that in your mind, you can reintroduce them as new statements. They lapse with time. It is so ordered. Next order! What is it, Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, your ruling is in order. However, Sen. (Dr.) Zani brought another point. If the Chairperson is bereaved or travels, do the statements also travel? She is a Member of the Committee. Any other person would also step in to read the statement if they are ready. It is a collective responsibility for Members of the Committee.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): That is a good concern. Sen. (Dr.) Zani, might you be in possession of the statements?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I am not in possession of the statements. I would like to make another proposal. It has been the tradition of this House to read out statements only when Members are present. In view of the fact that so many statements are pending, might we not want to reconsider and move to the point where we consider statements to be the property of the House? If a Member wants to interrogate anything, he can bring other statements later. There are so many statements pending because the Chairperson might be present but Members are not or Members might be present while the Chairperson is not.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): That concern has been hitherto raised in this House. Before the advent of the creation of the Senate, the tradition in the former Parliament, which was the only Parliament in this country, was such that, if a Member did not appear in order to listen to a reply to his Statement, it was dropped.

I think we should consider going that route. I will raise this issue in the Speaker’s Panel’s meeting but it may be later pushed to the Rules and Business Committee (RBC) to make a decision on that. I think the substantive Speaker’s attention will be drawn to your request, Sen. (Dr) Zani. It is very appropriate and may be that will make people to be a bit serious. I see no other interest on Statements. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

((Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki)): Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the Natural Resources (Classes of Transactions Subject to Ratification Bill (National Assembly Bill No.54 of 2015), be read a second time. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, hon. Senators, this is one of the Bills with constitutional timeliness…

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): what is it Sen. Kajwang?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I had an interest in this Bill and I thought I would get an opportunity to raise one or two issues before the Mover of the Bill comes up.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): You did not show interest on the computer. I am literate enough to read the computer and see Members interested in contributing. Your name is not among the people that have declared their interest to contribute to this Bill. Maybe a later request that came in when I had already called (Sen. (Prof.) Kithure Kindiki is Senator (Dr.) Agnes Zani. I see her name. Your name is appearing now. May be I will use standing Order No.1 to request that the Senate Majority Leader resumes his seat and we give the two legislators an opportunity to contribute.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I had actually pressed my button hoping to contribute to the Bill. Maybe that was premature. I wanted to be one of the first contributors. I am Sorry about that.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Go ahead. I have given you the permission.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, the Bill has not been moved.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Have you moved the Bill? Which Bill were you contributing to, Sen. Kajwang?

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, Natural Resources (Classes of Transactions Subject to Ratification) Bill (National Assembly Bill No.54 of 2015).

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): No, that one is premature.

Just hold your horses for some other contribution. (Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki), can you move the Bill?

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the Natural Resources (Classes of Transactions Subject to Ratification) Bill (National Assembly Bill No.54 of 2015), be read a second time. This is one of the Bills that the Constitution requires to be enacted to give effect to the various general provisions of the Constitution. In particular, this Bill gives effect to Article 71 of the Constitution. That Article provided for the first time in the history of our legal system, that all contracts and agreements which are entered into concerning the exploitation of natural resources, while they might be entered into between people and Government, they must be approved by Parliament. For a long time, the state has enjoyed unfettered discretion with regard to awarding of contracts for the exploitation of natural resources such as minerals, petroleum or natural resources like forestry and wildlife, and the people have not had a chance to have a say in the people who benefit. For example, if the national government is awarding a conservancy to a private person to run and manage wildlife, there must be Parliamentary approval of such a transaction. As we are going to see in some of the proposals in this Bill, the public must participate. Parliament must cause the local community to give ideas on the benefits that they are getting and also to give ideas on how the rights of the beneficiaries of that contract, licence or transaction are balanced with the rights of the local community. It is a very important Bill, very short but very critical. Let me highlight a few provisions in the Bill because at this stage it is a general debate, Second reading stage. I am sure the relevant Committee has already been seized of this Bill and when we come to the Committee of the Whole, they will give us any amendments to it. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, This Bill requires that transactions, contracts and agreements involving exploitation of natural resources in this country must be approved by Parliament. The use of the word “Parliament” here is instructive. It requires that both Houses; the National Assembly and the Senate must approve such transactions. The threshold for the contracts and agreements that must be brought to both Houses of Parliament are established in the Schedule to this Act, and include the following: First, with regard to crude oil and natural gas, any transaction involving authorization to extract crude oil or natural gas, must be approved by the two Houses of Parliament. Secondly, all mineral agreements with a threshold of $500 million and above must be approved by the two Houses of Parliament. Thirdly, the same case applies to water resources and to the extraction of sea water within the territorial sea for private The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I want to take this early opportunity to congratulate the Senate Leader of Majority, Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki, for being very explicit in moving this Bill. This is an important Bill which we shall be enacting in accordance with the provisions of the Constitution. It is a requirement of the Constitution that this Bill is enacted and is one of the Bills which have constitutional timelines. The objective of this Bill is largely to protect our national resources and to ensure that those resources are exploited properly and the benefits are enjoyed by Kenyans themselves. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, we have complained for a very long time about how our natural resources have been exploited by foreigners. This has been due to the absence of the law that stipulated how the resources would be exploited and how the benefits would be shared. In the past and in many circumstances, Kenyans have not benefited from the natural mineral resources that exist within our borders. You will find that some of them are important mineral resources, for example, oil and gas. We have known cases where large tracts of land are given to privileged individuals and other institutions. No justification is given as to why those tracts of land have been allocated to them. This Bill, if enacted into law, will address all these shortcomings. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, if somebody wishes to extract underground water within a protected area, they would not be able to do so without following the procedure and the requirements of this Bill which we hope will be enacted into law. In the past, excision or change of boundaries of the gazetted public forests has been done arbitrarily. You will find that a gazetted forest has been degazetted so that that piece of land can be allocated to individuals, sometimes for uses which are not very clear. If this law is The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Sen. Dullo Adan, proceed.

Thank you Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. You have been trying to pronounce my names and you are now coming along.

Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order. What is the right pronunciation of your names?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, it is the one that you have just pronounced. You did very well and I thank you for that. I will also thank the brains that were behind this particular legislation. This is a very important document to our country. In some areas, the current policy and legislation has been used to benefit foreigners instead of locals. This Bill will ensure that that will be history. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, one of things that I wanted to discuss in this particular Bill is the issue of consultation which is very important. This is because we need to be very clear on what ‘consultation’ means. We have seen instances where consultation has been regarded as meeting with few people in a hotel and taking photos in an attempt to convince people that consultation took place. A threshold for consultation has to be very clear for a country or a group. Secondly, the procedures that are going to be put in place in terms of how the process should be started or initiated should be clear. This will go a long way in ensuring that there are no loopholes and gaps. This will ensure the rights of the citizens are considered. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, there should be limitation within the law. For instance, if someone has been granted a license for a specific natural resource, it should be indicated in that particular license or agreement. This is because when people were The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, thank you for the opportunity to contribute to this Bill. I had earlier raised a point of order on the mistaken fear that the Senate Majority Leader was going to close debate on the matter. Thank you for your ruling which has given me time to listen to the Senate Majority Leader, the seconder and Sen. Dulo, from whom I have been able to pick some good points. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order! I do not want what is going on in the National Assembly to be legitimized by the Senate. What is going on today in the National Assembly is a kamukunji . It has no basis in law. Please, read your law.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, thank you. It is, indeed, a

. In the case of ratification of contracts relating to natural resources, it will not be subjected to a kamukunji but to Parliament - the National Assembly and the Senate. That is why we also say that some important issues that affect this nation should not be addressed in a kamukunji in the National Assembly or in the Senate. These are issues that should be addressed in Parliament which in its collective form are the two Houses. I will give you an example. The issues of electoral reforms that we are talking about as a nation should not be subjected to kamukunjis or caucuses of Members of Parliament (MPs) who drink tea together. There needs to be a formal structure and institutional approach to achieve some of these great things. Going back to the Bill, I looked at the definition of natural resources as contained in Article 260 of the Constitution. It is quite interesting that natural resources include the sunlight. Who would have ever thought that sunlight could be a natural resource that could be tapped and yet Kenya is blessed with natural sunlight, which can be utilized to a great extent, particularly in generation of solar energy. Sunlight has not been looked at as a tangible asset in this country. For example, there is a solar power project within my county. It is a huge project where investors have put in more than US$8 million to generate solar energy to feed into the national grid. That contract has been managed by the county government and it has not been subject to Parliamentary approval or ratification by any other body. You could understand because it is today that we are discussing this Bill. However, it is important that before we get into such grand projects, there has to be some clarity on how communities will benefit. At the very minimum, such a project should have been subjected to ratification by the county assembly. That lacuna has been there and I hope that with this Bill, such projects of grand magnitude will be subjected to a court where the people’s representatives sit. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, if you look at the problems that Nigeria has had on issues of lack of transparency, especially on oil and gas contracts; it has caused a lot of problems. Some of the problems that include terrorism, militarism and war in certain parts of Nigeria, especially in the oil producing regions arise out of lack of transparency on some of these deals where the local communities do not understand how they stand to benefit from some of those contracts. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Madam Temporary Speaker, I join my colleagues in contributing to this Bill which is important to Kenyans, particularly those in the regions where there is a lot of potential of untapped natural resources. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Senator, you have half a minute.

Madam Temporary Speaker, this Bill is important. I support it. I request my colleagues that we fast-track it. I urge the Senate Majority Leader that we should ensure through the relevant Committee, previous permits issued are tabled here. Then, we will know who has become rich for free yet we have this House. With those remarks, I beg to support.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I rise to support this Bill. It is important. It gives prominence to Article 71 of the Constitution. It enumerates transactions requiring Parliament’s ratification across the board. The Schedule is also clear. It lists various resources that are covered. It is a broad range of resources; crude oil, natural gas, minerals, water resources, underground water, wildlife, forests and genetic material. I will comment about genetic material later on. However, definitely when a mineral agreement is at a threshold of US$500 million, then definitely Parliament has to be concerned with it. The Bill is clear; Parliament means both the National Assembly and the Senate. At specific clauses, it is clear that even if necessary then the provisions of Article 113 be triggered to ensure that sufficient role is played by both the Senate and the National Assembly either at the initial level of deciding whether this is a process that will involve only the Senate or the National Assembly. More so, where there will be a difference in amendments that will be made, then that will immediately go to mediation. Therefore, this is important. It first deals with natural resources which are dear to Kenyans’ hearts. As Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo said, there is no county that does not have natural resources. As the Senate, we have been crucial. We have also played a role in The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

You have one minute. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Therefore, we need to ensure that we have clarity in terms of ensuring that we do not replicate. When we go to the Committee of the Whole, we will be suggesting amendments to remove clauses 10 and 11 in that list, because they have already been dealt with appropriately in the existing Acts. I support.

Yes, Senator Hargura.

Madam Temporary Speaker. I would like to support this Bill, because, first, it is a constitutional requirement that in our own wisdom as Kenyans, we have put in our Constitution Article 71. This Article states that Parliament has to enact a law which gives the classes of transactions which should be subject to ratification concerning exploitation of natural resources. So, this is a requirement which we have to come up with. The most important thing here is ratification because before, things have been done without the knowledge of the public. Even those who were affected by that exploitation did not know what was going on around them. Now that the the Constitution requires that we declare what transactions require ratification, then we are opening up an area which has initially been involved with a lot of secrecy. Now the public will know what has been done where to the extent that even a register is kept and you can access and see who has been given what in terms of the right to exploit resources, and this is good. In Clause 9, the Bill clearly states what ratification is all about, so that we make sure that the relevant Government policies have been complied with by the parties in these transactions who are seeking the rights to exploit the resources. The most important one is Part B which says, “Where there is adequate stakeholder consultation.” That is where we normally have problems. The stakeholders are members of the public who live on the land where those resources are found and who just see people who are unknown to them and even those who are known to them exploiting resources without them being consulted and this affects them in one way or another. So, this will give Parliament time to establish whether there was any stakeholder consultation and whether the public had agreed with it or not. The most important thing is that somebody who is interested in exploiting any resources, referred to here as “the beneficiary” will not go ahead to do the exploitation until this agreement has been ratified, and that will allow the public to come in if they had not been consulted before. The classes of transactions are also clearly stated in the Schedule. However, there are some new resources which have not been captured in this Schedule. For example, Article 260 of the Constitution identifies solar power as a natural resource but it is not in this Schedule. We also have wind energy and it is also not in this Schedule. From the direction we are moving now, in terms of renewable energy, these are resources which will be exploited by many investors. If we do not include them in this kind of classification, we will have a scenario of communities not been consulted as we have witnessed in the past. An investor will just come and start investing. In most cases, wind power involves a lot of land use. So, it requires acquisition of land first and then exploitation of the resource. This also needs to be included here so that The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Madam Temporary Speaker, I beg to move. I also request that you direct that the putting of the question be deferred, pursuant to Standing Order No.54 (3).

That is in order. We will defer the putting of the question to tomorrow, Thursday, at 2.30 p.m.

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The Senate Majority Leader.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Madam Temporary Speaker, I beg to move:- THAT. The Order of Precedence and Titles Bill (National Assembly Bill No.11 of 2014) be read a Second Time. This is a Bill to provide for the order of precedence for officials at diplomatic, official and social state functions within Kenya and abroad and to provide for official titles of designated office holders and for connected purposes. It is unfortunate that our country has become a country obsessed with titles, but at the same time, we have realised that a lot of confusion arises, especially now under the new Constitution. We have very many office holders, some of them elected, others appointed while others working for independent institutions. Sometimes when you meet in functions and meetings, there is no clear order of doing things and I think that is the basis of having this Bill. Nevertheless, I am one person who believes that titles and honorifics should never be the basis upon which leaders should demand respect from society. Yes, it is a good Bill but I think in this country, we have overemphasized on titles. I am aware of colleagues who if they are called by their names and you do not add the word “honourable” before their names, then you are in trouble with them. They will even remind you that. It is even embarrassing when somebody introduces themselves. I am saying this because I have a background in the academia. In the academia where my sister, Sen. (Dr.) Zani, also has a stint, people are very simple. In fact, the more learned or the more senior a member of the academia is, the more humble they become. When the best authorities in disciplines such as Sociology, International Law or Anthropology introduce themselves, they simply say their first names and that suffices. However, in this country, we have a culture of titles. People are almost forcing citizens to refer to them as honourable, Excellencies and things like that. That should not be a culture in this country. Of course, it is good to respect offices and office holders. However, that should come naturally from the people we represent and serve as opposed to demands by ourselves. For example, my name is Kithure Kindiki. My mother never called me professor. I will feel a bit uneasy if you did not call me Kithure Kindiki. All the other titles like Senator, Professor are honorifics and they are never demanded but given by other people. Madam Temporary Speaker, in a nutshell, I want to highlight three things. The first one is why we need this Bill and the answer is in Clause 3. We need this Bill to ensure that we maintain public order and decorum at national functions and social engagements of the Government of Kenya; to promote a national culture of respect, The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Madam Temporary Speaker, it is my pleasure to second this Bill. I am not deeply excited about this Bill even though I say it is a pleasure to second it. This is because this is the kind of Bill that does not put food on the table of Kenyans. It is the kind of Bill that the former President Moi, would have said will not increase the pans and pots of ugali in your household. However, in Government, there is something called protocol which deals with the mundane things like deciding who should seat next to who and who should speak before who. Personally, I advocate an easy culture and I am inspired by Shakespeare who said that a rose by any other name would smell as sweet. So, whether you call someone The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Madam Temporary Speaker, sadly, as has been said, this is a Bill that originated from the Senate and it is now coming from the National Assembly in more or less the same form. However, these issues need to be sorted out. It is an important Bill because it removes our ego and helps us to remember where we fit in. The Bible says that when you go somewhere, you should sit behind so that you can be told to go sit in front. Other times you could be sitting in front and you are told to go and sit at the back because you are not ‘honorable.’ That can be very embarrassing. As it has been said, I think we all like titles. People like to give themselves all manner of titles, for example, doctor or professor. Some prefer to be referred to as a minister, reverend, doctor; all the titles together. One really wonders whether it is that important. Some people ask about titles and what they prefer. At the end of day, it is important to have the right reference. We are in a new dispensation and Constitution. This is something that needed to be made clear because different office holders give themselves different titles. I am not sure whether after this Bill is passed and assented to, it will be easy to remove those titles that have stuck from right at the beginning. Maybe this Bill should have come earlier so that we identify specific positions and titles. A title, especially politically, gives the order of seniority and hierarchy. That is what politics is all about. That is why people prefer to speak last, so that they feel authoritative and answer everybody who cannot answer them back; they are the ones with the last word. The Bill is very clear in the objects and purposes, to maintain public order and decorum. We have seen ugly scenes of lack of decorum. We have seen people snatching microphones from one another, saying that they be the ones who deserve to address the audience. This needs need to be sorted out. Titles also create a culture of respect, order, discipline and form of doing things. When it is stipulated like this, nobody will ask specific questions. As has been said, it is also important in guiding the Salaries and Remuneration Commission (SRC) in determining the specific scales which will be critical. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I was skeptical when this Bill was first mooted. As time went by, I have been convinced that it is important to have some hygiene and order in public conduct of leaders, how they are addressed and how the pecking order should be. Madam Temporary Speaker, a lot of obscenities have been displayed all over with people over-playing themselves and behaving like they have descended on earth from Mars. That makes things look very convoluted. I have always said that we have a lot of respect for our governors but some of them behave in a manner that is so irritable to everybody. Whenever I am in my county, I see my governor moving around the county with 20 to 25 four wheel drive vehicles on the road with sirens causing all manner of commotion. I can count more than five people that my governor and his motorcade have knocked down and killed because of this madness. They have no remorse or respect whatsoever. Parliament has a duty to bring about public order. Whenever a Cabinet Secretary is passing in town, people are shoved off the road in all manner of recklessness. I hope that when this Bill is passed, it will be enforced so that people can have some decency in how they handle matters. More important to note is the misconduct that we have been seeing from a lady called Ms. Sarah Serem who pretends that she does not know what Parliament does or the work of a Senator. She said that a Senator should be remunerated at the same level as a MCA because she does not understand the work of a Senator. That is either high level ignorance, arrogance or a mix of both that does not help this country at all. When people are given public offices, they have a duty to understand what they are hired to do. If the office of the Salaries and Remuneration Commission (SRC) was working together with the Office of the President, we would have been able to have designed this without going through legislation. I fully agree that the pecking order should be as set out in Clause 4; the President, the Deputy President and Speakers of Parliament. However, as the Constitution is designed today, we cannot pretend that our Speaker is equal to that of the National Assembly. If there is a vacuum where the President or the Deputy President are incapacitated or removed from office, the Speaker of the National Assembly takes precedence. Nonetheless, they are Speakers and we should give them that order of precedence. The Chief Justice is the head of the third arm of Government. Therefore, he is rightly placed where he is. He is followed by former Presidents and former prime ministers, Leaders of Majority and Minority, former Vice Presidents and Deputies, the Members of Parliament, Judge of Supreme Court, Judge of Court of Appeal, Judge of High Court, Cabinet Secretaries, Attorney-General, Auditor-General and Principal The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

There being no further interested speakers, I call upon the Mover to reply.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Madam Temporary Speaker, the Senate Minority Leader exudes a huge duality. On one hand, he makes very useful contributions, fairly intellectual input but at the same time, he waters down all he has done by making strange and unnecessary remarks. For instance, the remarks he has made about my colleague hon. Aden Duale and others. Having said that, allow me to thank colleagues who have contributed in support of this Bill. We have all agreed that we need some form of order. In Kenya we have not cultivated a culture of respect. So, we need to legislate so that overtime, in another 100 or 200 years, we will not be dealing with this kind of legislation. I agree that the Chief of the Defence Forces (CDF) is a fairly senior person. That is an area that we need to consider. I also agree with my brother, the Senate Minority Leader, about the former Vice Presidents being recognised and given some stature and security. I do not even mind them flying flags. They are leaders in their own right. They have served this country. There is the issue of national honours which we passed last year, 2015. Nothing prevents us from bringing amendments to recognise very important cadres of leadership that have been brought up by my brother, the Senate Minority Leader; the county assembly speakers who have been forgotten. They need some kind of honour to be conferred by virtue of leading at that level. There are two arms of Government in counties; the executive and the legislature. So, I support a view that they should be honoured. The leader of the assembly is the speaker. Equally, governors need to be honoured. Let us say with an Elder of Burning Spear (EBS). The senior most among them, the Chair of the Council of Governors (CoG) can be conferred the Elder of the Golden Heart (EGH). That is fair. We have forgotten governors and county speakers. The The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate

Thank you, Senate Majority Leader. Your request is granted.

Our Order Paper is still full but Order Nos. 12 and 13 are Committees of the Whole yet we do not have the numbers. Therefore, we will defer that.

The Movers of Order Nos. 14 to 19 are not here. Therefore, I will use my discretion to defer them.

We only have two minutes to closing time.

Hon. Senators, there being no other business, the Senate stands adjourned until tomorrow, Thursday, 9th June, 2016, at 2.30 p.m. The Senate rose at 6.30 p.m. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate