Hon Senators, I wish to acknowledge the presence in the Speaker’s Gallery this afternoon of vising staff from Elgeyo-Marakwet County Assembly. The staffers are visiting the Senate on a one week attachment programme. I request each member of the delegation to stand when called out so that they may be acknowledged in the Senate tradition. (1) Ms. Sylvia Kwambai; (2) Mr. Gideon Moru; (3) Ms. Susan Cherop; (4) Mr. Pius Koech; (5) Mr. Ronald Sang; (6) Ms. Mauryn Koech; (7) Mr. Kevin Ruto; (8) Mr. Peter Kiptum, and; (9) Ms. Betsy Cheruiyot. On behalf of the Senate and on my own behalf, I welcome them to the Senate and wish them well for the remainder of their stay. I thank you. Next order. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to lay the following Paper on the Table of the Senate, today 21st February, 2018: The Commission on Revenue Allocation on recommendation on the basis for equitable sharing of Revenue between National and County Governments for the financial year 2018/2019.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to give Notice of the following Motion:- THAT, pursuant to Standing Order Nos. 181, 183 and 212, the Senate approves the following Senators nominated to serve in the Select Committees of the Senate as follows- (a)

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to give Notice of the following Motion:- THAT, this House adopts Sessional Paper No. 2 of 2016 on the National Slum Upgrading and Prevention Policy, laid on the Table of the House on Tuesday, 10th October, 2017. ADOPTION OF REPORT OF THE 8TH ORDINARY SESSION OF FP-ICGLR

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to give Notice of the following Motion:- THAT, this House adopts the Report of the 8th Ordinary Session of the Forum of Parliaments of Member States of the International Conference on the Great Lakes Region (FP-ICGLR), held on 5th – 7th The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to give notice of the following Motion: THAT, this House adopts the Report of the Senate Delegation to the Women Political Leaders Annual Global Summit, held in Reyjavik, from 28th -30th November, 2017, laid on the Table of the House on Wednesday, 14th February, 2018. TEACHING OF KISWAHILI LANGUAGE TO LEARNERS WITH HEARING DISABILITY

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to give Notice of the following Motion:- AWARE that Article 27 of the Constitution of Kenya guarantees equality of every person in enjoyment of all rights and fundamental freedoms and prohibits discrimination against any person on any ground including disability and language; FURTHER AWARE that Article 24(2)(a) of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons With Disabilities prohibits persons with disabilities from exclusion from the general education system on the basis of disability, and that children with disabilities are not excluded from free and compulsory primary education, or from secondary education, on the basis of disability; ACKNOWLEDGING that Article 7 of the Constitution of Kenya provides for the national language of the Republic as Kiswahili and the official languages of the republic as Kiswahili and English; APPRECIATING that the Report of the Commission of Enquiry into Education in Kenya (the Ominde Commission of 1965) proposed that Kiswahili language be taught as a compulsory subject both in primary and secondary schools in Kenya with the aim of making the language a vehicle for literacy works relevant to community work of various kinds; COGNIZANT that Kiswahili language has been recognized as a unifying language in the East African Community, hence making it a

in the region; CONCERNED that under the new curriculum of education in Kenya that is being piloted, learners with hearing disability are not offered Kiswahili language in primary schools, secondary schools and primary teachers training colleges; NOW THEREFORE, the Senate calls upon the Ministry of Education, Science and Technology and other relevant state agencies to: The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

What is your point of order, Sen. Faki?

Asante, Bw. Spika. Nilitaka kudandia Motion ya Sen. (Dr.) Musuruve.

Order! There is no Motion.

Hon. Senators, we will go to order No. 8 and come back to Order No. 7. Next Order.

Hon. Senators, I direct that the bell be rang for three minutes.

Order Hon. Senators! Order! Order! I now direct that the bars be drawn and the doors be locked.

Order, Hon. Senators: We are now ready for voting and you may start voting now.

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Order, hon. Members. Let the assisted voters come and vote.

Order, Members. The results of the voting are as follows:

Let us have, Sen. Mary Seneta. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, pursuant to Standing Order 46 (2) (b), I rise to seek a statement from the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Lands, Environment and Natural Resources regarding the use and management of riparian areas in Kenya. In the Statement, the Chairperson should state: (1) Whether he is aware that over the years, riparian areas in Kenya have been put under pressure due to residential developments, cottages, farm buildings, golf courses, commercial buildings, roads, sand and gravel harvesting, agriculture and industrial activities. (2) Whether there is a proper legal policy and institutional framework canvassing the interest of Government and riparian stakeholders in the use and management of the riparian areas. (3) Whether he is aware that the law relating to riparian zones protection is contained in several pieces of legislation thereby presenting a problem of overlapping mandates and lack of coordination in enforcement. (4) What reforms are necessary in the legal and policy regulatory framework to foster riparian zones protection zones in Kenya. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker Sir, for allowing me to ride on this important statement sought by the distinguished Senator. Riparian lands are also sometimes called wetlands. In his answer to the question, the Chairperson of theCommittee on Lands, Environment and Natural Resources needs to tell us why, contrary to the available law and policy, the national Government and county governments continue to allow persons to own parcels of land that cover riparian and wetlands. Two, why they allow these people to plant trees that are proven to be inconsistent with the management and resuscitation of the riparian lands, namely; blue gum trees? The other day I was talking to the distinguished Senator for Kisii County, Sen. (Prof.) Ongeri, who comes from one of the most well watered areas in this country in terms of rainfall. He told me that Kisii is under severe stress because of similar trees and this is everywhere you go. Secondly, could the Chairperson also tell us whether the Forest Conservation and Management Act, 2016, that is in force is being implemented in terms of a demand for every owner of land, including Government to plant a minimum of 10 percent of your land with trees that protect and sustain the environment, including riparian lands otherwise known as wetlands.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I rise to add on the Senators’ concern that has been expressed, highlighting various serious issues that are facing this country. I do not think that it is just a matter of riparian land. The issue of riparian land in itself is very serious because we all remember days when you could not have planted anything along the river bank and this country was well watered. When Sen. (Prof.) Ongeri says, “I was in Kisii County sometime and I know it is not wet.” I can understand. It is not only in Kisii County, but, today, rivers are drying up The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Senator, ride on the question; do not start to debate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am extending because of the seriousness of the subject, I am not contributing. In the response, let us know what is going to be done seriously and urgently to address the issue. Also, we should not be told that response will come in two weeks’ time, but should be done within a couple of days.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would like to ride on the statement by the distinguished Sen. Seneta. The Chairperson of the Committee on Lands, Environment and Natural Resources, when responding, to tell us what the Government is doing in terms the people who plant tomatoes along the rivers. When you go to Narok County, the Mara River is actually drying up. Let us call it dry. Sen. Seneta should know that in the riparian lands there are many different specifies of animals that live and depend on water on that part of land and do not survive anywhere else. So, what happens to these mammals which are no longer there? Secondly, why are people allowed to cultivate the riparian lands?

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I would also want to ride on the statement so that when the Chairperson of the Committee on Lands, Environment and Natural Resources is giving the response, he can also address the issue of acquisition of riparian lands. Much as preservation or conservation of the riparian land is very important, there are instances where the county governments and the national Government have acquired the riparian lands from individuals whether compulsory or otherwise, without compensating the people who own those lands. So, as much as we want to conserve, let us also know the recourse that the people who own the private land can take when their land is taken compulsorily to conserve the water catchment areas.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would like to ride on that question. Firstly, over a period of time, there has been progressive policy development on the use of riparian land such as the valley bottoms where people were encouraged to develop horticultural products. How much of that policy has eroded the policy on the conservation of the riparian land? Secondly, is the Ministry concerned willing to revoke all the necessary laws that may have inadvertently come into force in order to reclaim the ecosystem and the The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I agree that the question that the Senator has raised is very important. For the first time in this country, we are witnessing the drying up of rivers and many water sources. We are having a lot of infrastructural expansion and sprawling urban centres and many developments that might affect the riparian areas. I would want the Chairperson to tell us what the Government is doing to ensure that we do not continue losing these riparian areas at the expense of bringing up new infrastructural developments and urban centres. These developments might have very dangerous effects to our generation and the future generation.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. From my understanding of what riparian land is; it is supposed to be like a road reserve. For purposes of the river, it will be a water reserve to accommodate floods. Therefore, in Nairobi itself, riparian land has been grabbed to the extent that even the house that was collapsing in Mathare was on the river itself. There is one on Mbagathi Way where the river passes under the building. There are others on Argwings Kodhek and Brookside where the river passes under the buildings. We would like to know who is in charge in terms of authority of riparian land in Kenya. What is the legislative or policy framework of riparian land in Kenya? What is the size of riparian land for us to determine whether there is encroachment in those premises? If you are going to make any recovery, up to what extent will you make that recovery? If that does not exist, they should propose a legislative framework where we can recover riparian land. That is the problem we have in Naivasha where flower farmers have planted all the way into Lake Naivasha.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, this will have to be a loaded Statement. I undertake that I am going to respond to all the questions asked by all the Senators. I will bring an answer to this House in two weeks’ time, if it is acceptable.

Are you okay with the period that you have been given, Senator? The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am okay with the two weeks. RAMPANT FIRE OUTBREAKS IN INFORMAL SETTLEMENTS OF NAIROBI CITY COUNTY

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise pursuant to Standing Order No.46(2)(b) to seek a Statement from the Chairperson of the National Security, Defence and Foreign Relations Committee regarding the rampant fire outbreaks in the informal settlements of Nairobi City County. In the Statement, the Chairperson should:- (1) Table a list of all areas in Nairobi City County that have had a fire outbreak in the last five years. (2) Provide statistics of persons affected either directly or indirectly by the fire outbreaks in the last five years. (3) Quantify in Kenya shillings, the losses incurred as a result of the fire outbreaks. (4) Explain why, in several instances the Nairobi City County Government Fire Response Team arrives at the scene of fire without the requisite firefighting equipment, tools and materials. (5) Outline the measures that the national Government, working together with Nairobi City County government, has put in place to resettle and compensate the victims. (6) Explain the measures that the national Government, working together with Nairobi City County Government, have put in place to avert fire outbreaks and to adequately and expeditiously respond in case an outbreak occurs.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for giving me this opportunity. I would like to ride on the question. The issue of fire outbreak is so rampant all over. With regard to what Sen. Kwamboka has said, it is important to also investigate what happens to children and people with disability in the slums in the event of fire. There are some who are not mobile. What has the Government put in place to ensure that they are safe? The issue of fire is also rampant in schools. Remember there was fire at Moi Girls, Nairobi High School. What measures has the Government put in place to ensure that children who are in schools for the disabled are safe in the event of fire?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would like to ride on this question. Fire outbreaks are not peculiar only to Nairobi City County. We have these fire outbreaks in many of our county headquarters. One of the things that we want to know is with regard to the disaster management teams, whether in Nairobi City County or any other county is: What is the level of preparedness in terms of reaching at the site and what level of access do they have to any site? This is because it hinges directly on the quality of planning. Direct access to the fire site is important for one to prevent fire occurrence. When I was the Minister for Local Government, we had encouraged the municipal councils to acquire the fire equipment including vehicles. We even made provisions at that time to get these vehicles from France. To what extent are counties equipped with firefighting equipment for them to respond effectively when an emergency that threatens the life of people arises? The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Yes, Sen. Olekina.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I would like to ride on that Statement sought by the distinguished Senator. When the Chairperson will be responding to that question, I would like to get a definite explanation as to whether the City of Nairobi has a policy on how to acquire firefighting equipment and also where they are placed. Given that Nairobi is such a large city, I would like to know whether all that equipment is just placed at the City Hall or it is spread out in the suburbs of Nairobi. It will also be important for us to understand whether the disaster management system which is national and the fire fighting systems which are for counties have in their budget, provisions to buy firefighting equipment and what they do. Are they only for water or do they have any chemicals, in the event that they run out of water? Thank you.

Yes, Sen. Wetangula.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. In answer to the distinguished Senator’s question, I would wish that the Chairperson also addresses this House and the nation on:- (a) To what extent does the National Disaster Management Centre in Nairobi cooperate and collaborate with counties and do they have any offices and operations in counties especially in big towns such as Mombasa, Kisumu, Nakuru, Kisii, Bungoma and others? (b) To what extent are these rampant fires in the so called informal settlements in towns and cities, in fact, acts of arson, committed by unscrupulous landlords who would want to evict poor people living in those areas so that they can turn the lands into real estate? (c) How many people have been found culpable through prosecutions for criminal offences, where those cases have been proven?

Yes, Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. While the Chairperson is going to present his response, we have proposed, together with the Vice Chairperson of the Standing Committee on National Security, Defence and Foreign Relations, the Disaster Management Bill which will, of course, address this concern. However, for the purposes of the question, I am aware that the National Disaster Management Policy that was drafted in 2013 is still stuck somewhere on a shelf. The Chairperson should let us know, in his response, when that policy will be implemented or passed because it will then dictate or give life to the proposed legislation on disaster management. Thank you.

Yes, Sen. Mwaruma.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for this opportunity. I would also like to ride on Sen. Kwamboka’s question and ask if we have any standard for firefighting or disaster preparedness. Whatever gets measured gets done. So, in my job as a Senator, to protect the counties and county governments, if I go to, for example, Nairobi or Taita Taveta, I can be able to say that they are prepared to fight fire. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Let us hear from the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on National Security, Defence and Foreign Relations.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. For the Senator who is part of the Nairobi County Delegation, Sen. Kwamboka, thank you for bringing this issue to the Floor. This is a matter that is of great concern to the whole country just as much as Nairobi. I am glad the other Senators have chipped in with the additional questions which I have noted. This is a matter that ideally - given the experience and what is happening especially in Nairobi - we will need, even as we get the responses, to deal with, together with the Standing Committees on Energy and Lands, Environment and Natural Resources. In what we have seen as a practice in the situations we have been in, there are two major causes of these fires. The first one is the illegal electric power connections in a lot of informal settlements. Already we have been in discussion with the Kenya Power and Lighting Company (KPLC) on how we can properly provide electric power to people in the slums. For the record of this House, we will now need to mainstream that discussion together with the Standing Committee on Energy. I know there was the Last Mile Project; we will talk as it is. So, we will come together. That is one of the major causes. Secondly, we will need to liaise with the Standing Committee on Lands, Environment and Natural Resources. As the Senate Minority Leader has properly posited before this House, a lot of these fires are caused by land grabbers. Let us call them what they really are. By way of causing a fire in a slum, these land grabbers want to evict people so that they can fence the place and go on with their developments. You will find that a lot of the fires are on disputed lands. So, ideally, it is a matter that we will need to get proper responses not just from the Standing Committee on National Security, Defence and Foreign Relations, but in working together with the Standing Committees on Lands, Environment and Natural Resources and Energy. If I go to the additional questions, I do not know what to call them; the riders, there are many who have ridden on this question. Mr. Speaker, Sir, on the issue of the Persons living with Disabilities (PWDS), I would just like to mention that the PWDs in this country have a champion in this House. They must know that they have--- The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I like what the distinguished Senator of Nairobi County is doing. But is he responding to the questions so that we can interrogate what he is saying or is he preparing to give us a date when he will bring the answer? This is because when an answer is brought to any Statement, the House is obligated to interrogate the veracity, content and facts in it. So, if he is giving the answer, then we will be allowed to interrogate what he is saying. What he is doing is good, but it is un-procedural.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am first giving the context that will determine how long it will take to give us an answer so that Members can understand when I say it will take three or four weeks. The first area that I have touched on is the reason why we will also need to interact in looking at this matter with other Committees, that is, the Standing Committees on Energy and Lands, Environment and Natural Resources. So, I am doing the context to that. Allow me to proceed. I am not giving the answer; I am just giving that context to that. There is a question on where the equipment is being placed by Sen. Olekina. That is important to understand, but he is specific to Nairobi County. That means that we are forwarding a question not just to the Ministry that deals with the disaster response, but also to Nairobi County government. We are also forwarding the question to the Standing Committees on Energy and Lands, Environment and Natural Resources. There is also the issue of the National Disaster Management liaising with the county; are they present in other counties? Another issue is on arson from Sen. Wetangula. So, Mr. Speaker, Sir, all in all, we need some bit of time to deal with the issue comprehensively. We will give a response based on the questions asked which I am sure will be unsatisfactory if it comes in a short time. This is because Sen. Kwamboka has asked for five years of records. In Nairobi, in five weeks, we will have a hard time to talk about the number of fires that we have every fortnight. I am sure that we will not get a response on a record of five years in terms of victims, compensation and the number of fires in this county. It might take more than a month to get that response. But I will try to persuade the good Senator to reduce the period under review from five years to since this county government took over; that is from August. We should look at that and get a response in the next three or so weeks. After that, we will sit down with the other Committees involved so that we can bring an end to the issue of fires in the county. So, Mr. Speaker, Sir, I ask for three weeks and a review of the period in question from five years to about five or six months.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, the period under review should be for the last one year. The three weeks is okay.

Next Order. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move the following Motion:- THAT, pursuant to Standing Orders No. 181, 183 and 212, the Senate approves the following Senators nominated to serve in the Select Committees of the Senate as follows-

On a point of information, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

What is your point of information Sen. Wambua?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I just want to correct the Senate Deputy Majority Leader that the Senator that we have in the House is the Sen. (Prof.) Malachy Imana Ekal and not Ekai.

Thank you, Senator for that information. Let me correct it once again so that it is corrected on the HANSARD.

(Sen. Wetangula) seconded.

Next Order.

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Hon. Senators, Sen. Judith Pareno was on the Floor and she completed her time. So any other Senator can contribute to the Bill. Proceed, Sen. Cheruiyot Aaron.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I want to make my remarks very briefly. The tone and the mood which was set yesterday by the Mover and Seconder of this Bill set a cloud of anxiety and uncertainty about the drafters of this Bill and the thoughts therein. However, there are many good things that have been well thought-out in this Bill that I agree with and the very premise upon which they want to do this law. It is for that reason that this afternoon, I rise to support The Urban Areas and Cities (Amendment) Bill, 2017. Mr. Speaker, Sir, since the onset of devolution, it has become quite clear that, as a country, we need to have good legislation and laws that will govern how we manage our cities, towns and centres. I am certain that given an opportunity, each of these Senators here this afternoon can share their experiences to a great length of the struggles that they see in their individual counties. In all our counties, it is only what used to be the main towns of the county that have been properly developed. But they still do not qualify or meet the demands of a growing urban population. It is evidently clear that many of the urban centres and towns have an influx of population. This can be attributed to the challenges of life in the rural homes and villages which forces many people out of the rural homes and from the villages to come to towns to fend for themselves. We still do not have plans, either by the national Government or county governments, on how to respond to this growing demand. I can think of so many towns and centres within my own county where, even in a town with a population of more than 10,000 people, there is no working sewerage system and pit latrines are the order of the day. Therefore, the very premise that the drafters of this Bill do set out henceforth, is that we need to rethink and look back; we need to plan from the experiences that we gained from the time that we were setting up many cities like Nairobi. This is a thought that we must agree with. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I will start with the thoughts that I agree with in this Bill before sharing my thoughts on, perhaps, what I think should be amended. One of them is the thought of a cap on the population that is needed when declaring an urban centre, city or town. That is a good thought. Different counties are unique and they have unique challenges. I do not want to name specific counties because I may run into headwinds, The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I rise to oppose this Bill. I do so for the following reasons. First, when we talk about a small country like Kenya having several cities based on population, I think we miss the point. This is because we are forgetting the problems that are brought about by rural-urban migration. We have witnessed a lot of people settling in the urban areas in this country. As a result, we have seen mushrooming of slums in those areas. Secondly, I am opposing this Bill because of the issue of land ownership. I come from Narok; I know a lot of people who own land right next to Narok Town. The moment we say Narok Town has over 250,000 people, which I am sure it does, it ceases The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. This is a very strange Bill. I do not know why it is here. I do not know who brought it. It is a total misplacement of priorities. What is a city? What is a municipality? What is a town? The Oxford English dictionary describes a city as a large town –a big human settlement. Period! A municipality is a component of one that I have described. A town is a human settlement with a big cluster. There is no evidence brought here in the Bill or elsewhere, that the cities, towns and municipalities we are talking about, which are based in counties; that there is any contribution from the Council of Governors (CoG) or country representation to define what they want. Whether you are talking of Nairobi or not, it is not in the hands of the national Government. Mombasa and Meru are not in the hands of the national Government. They are all in the hands of county governments that should be the engineers for such a Bill. A Bill like this would be more helpful to this country if it is focused on planning, bringing sanity and order, and provision of services that either can be provided by the private sector or mandatorily provided for by the management of the cities. The Bill is just giving us a litany of issues that they say will qualify a town to be a city. They do not make sense. A population of 500,000 people do not really matter. If you go to the United Kingdom, Cambridge is a city. It is just a university town. At any one time, the population of Cambridge City never goes beyond 50,000 people. It is just students, their teachers and service providers, yet it is a city. If you look at Norwich; it is a city. It does not have even a population of 500,000 people. It is what you want to be called and want to be. As far as I am concerned, Ongata Rongai and Ruiru are cities on the outskirts of Nairobi City. You do not need any legal definition to call it a city. It is what it has grown to be. What we should be doing is to define and obligate the national Government, in collaboration with the country governments; more particularly, given the fact that the bulk of state resources are at the national Government, to support each other in planning and provision of services. Today, if you go in all our counties, the mushrooming urban centres are just growing as slums because there is no planning or industrial area. The planners of this city were great men and women. Today, you go to Industrial Area; an asbestos factory has a residential estate next to it. You go to a factory emitting dangerous fumes and smoke; they have licensed the construction of apartments. Mr. Speaker, Sir, as we were growing up, it was very clear. There was Industrial Area in Nairobi and residential areas. Each residential area had a shopping component and so on so forth. This is what planning is all about. Now you go to some places in Nairobi—there is a place we used to go with some friends called Shauri Moyo that has 23 shops. Sixteen are bars while the remaining are butcheries to service the bars. The place has therefore become a den of iniquity. Nothing else goes on there. Why would anybody license 23 bars in a square kilometre for heaven’s sake? This is what we should be addressing. The ridiculous thing about the Bill is that it says that for you to be called a city or municipality, you must have “water and sanitation.” That is available even in our private The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, this is a majority sponsored amendment Bill. There is already in existence a law that governs urban areas and cities. This bill seeks to amend that law and it is our opportunity to amend it. We are coming up to the Committee stage where we can amend. It is an opportunity for us to change the criteria and the categorization of our towns, cities and urban areas and plan them better. I do not see the controversy in the Government side bringing a Bill that can cover and allow people to get back to orderly and well serviced towns, urban areas and cities. I therefore have no hesitation in supporting this amendment and I ask that we use this opportunity. If we do not like the figures or population numbers, we can change and amend. If you do not like the titles or the management levels or styles, this is the opportunity. I thought we should be congratulated, as a side for even bringing this to the public so that we can amend the Act. I know that it is a bit controversial. My thinking is that cities do not have to be limited in numbers or defined by the number of people who live there. Some cities have people permanently living there while others have a higher population during the day than the night and do not necessarily need to be defined by the number of people who live there. They are about management, and getting the very basic services. If Kapenguria had a sewerage system and a water supply, people would move there, buy land and build better houses. Cities will develop if we set the right criteria. We are going back to a situation where we have centres called municipalities. In those days, when Sen. (Prof.) Ongeri was Minister for Local Government, there were many municipalities and people would go and ask the Minister if their area would become a municipality and many times the answer would say; ‘okay, you can be a municipality’. However, there were no services that were in tandem with the name municipality. Then there was the municipality council that created more politicians. Mr. Speaker, Sir, this Bill amends all that and deals with the management. How do you call those people who manage the town and the city or the urban areas? Give them opportunities to change and serve in the capacities. Qualifications are being provided for now. You can be in a town council or committee if you have a certain level of education. If it is an urban area, your qualifications are higher and for a city your academic The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Sen. Sakaja.

Thank you Mr. Speaker, Sir, for the opportunity to speak on The Urban Areas and Cities (Amendment) Bill (Senate Bills No. 4 of 2017) that has been brought to this House. From the onset, I concur with a lot of the sentiments by Members from both sides. It is difficult to understand the real rationale behind this legislation, given the fact that the Urban Areas and Cities Act as it exists today is not being implemented. The priority at this point and, of course, we will support the Bill because I do not believe in throwing out the baby with the bath water as it has been done on the Irrigation Bill, which now even if we agree cannot come back until six months are done. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Very well. Sen. Naomi Waqo, have you withdrawn your request? Proceed, Sen. (Dr.) Milgo.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I rise to support this Bill. If amended to factor in all the proposals that a number of my colleagues have talked about, it will be a very good Bill. You realize that we have already devolved over 47 centres that are going to be urban centres and the Governors have to be guided on how to implement this. Light should be shed on the policy in terms of managing, organizing and even planning for those particular cities. In any case, I love it because of the fact that the Bill is giving a guide on the type of people who will manage those centres. In my view, there is no better Bill that is going to guide the counties like this Bill. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, we have been complaining about congestion and non- collection of garbage in Nairobi City. The facilities in Nairobi are already overstretched. There is rural-urban migration of people in search of jobs who, upon arriving in the city, find no places to stay. That is the reason why we have very big slums surrounding Nairobi. In addition, we have a lot of congestion not only in housing, but also in traffic, which causes pollution. A lot of basic facilities are being overstretched. For instance, we stay in houses where there is water shortage, sometimes there are power blackouts and so many basic and necessary services like medical facilities are also overstretched. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, our country has been independent for over 50 years and we have areas that have been marginalized because they have never been considered in terms of proper infrastructure. For example, they do not have electricity. If this Bill is passed, it will give guidance to those areas to receive the necessary infrastructure, proper schools, recreational centres and medical facilities. This way, we will be assisting to decongest the big cities and people will be looking for jobs around those centres. This Bill is worth supporting. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Thank you. Proceed, Sen. Moses Kajwang’.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, for giving me this opportunity. First of all, I want to congratulate you because this is the first time I have caught your eye since your elevation to the very lofty position of Deputy Speaker of this august House. Allow me to congratulate you and to wish you all the best in your current endeavours, in your future endeavours of building schools, supporting education and in your future ---

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order! Order, Senator! Proceed with the Motion.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I am well guided. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, this amendment Bill--- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, you should have allowed me to laud you for your support of education. Article 184 of the Constitution requires Parliament to legislate on the matters that we are talking about today. So, from the word go, it is not an idle undertaking today, when we are discussing The Urban Areas and Cities (Amendment) Bill (Senate Bills No.10 of 2017), because it is a constitutional requirement under Article 184. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, as has been noted by my colleagues, the Cities and Urban Areas Act already exists. The Cities and Urban Areas Act is indeed a strange piece of legislation. There are three structures that are currently emerging. For those of us who are devolution purists, we know that the levels and structures of devolution and development consist of the national Government and county government, which then goes to the ward and village. To those who are still holding on to the Provincial Administration mentality, we will have the national Government, Provincial Level, because we still have the Regional Coordinators; county, sub-county, division – we are still creating divisions in this country in this time and age – then location; sub-location and the village. So, those are the two distinct layers and structures that we have been used to. When you read the Cities and Urban Areas Act, you find the third strange dichotomy where you are moving from the national Government, the county governments and then, there are cities, municipalities and towns in there. It is for that reason I say that the original Act that we intend to amend is quite a strange and confusing Bill because it brings about nomenclature that is different from the devolution purists and provincial administration oriented kind of people. The Memorandum of Objects and Reasons of this Bill goes to confirm the comments that have been brought by other Senators before this House. Allow me to quote just one paragraph of the Statement of Objects and Reasons. It says: The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

It is a city county.

Thank you, Sen. Sakaja. We also went to the same school, as the Deputy Speaker and that is why you are very good in the arrangement of English words. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I want to share with the distinguished Senators. Recently, we visited Washington DC with the Deputy Majority Leader. Washington DC is the capital of the United States of America (USA) and it is interesting that it does not have a Senator with voting power. It does not even have a congresswoman or congressman with voting power. Yes, it has a Senator, a congressman and congresswoman, but when they go to Congress they do not vote because they want Washington DC to retain its distinct identity as the capital of the nation. So, they do not want it to be called a Democratic or a Republican State, and that is how it has worked for them. The other example is our next door neighbour, Uganda. The City of Kampala used to have a Lord Mayor. In their wisdom, they decided to create Kampala City Authority because they felt that Kampala City was such an important place that could not be left to be run by politicians. In Kenya, we have gone for limited sovereignty for the capital city, in the sense that it is controlled by a county assembly and has representatives that have got rights to vote in both the National Assembly and the Senate. It was for this reason that even in the last Parliament we saw a proposal by one of the Senators, which I believe still lies alive somewhere. The proposal was that Nairobi status be converted, so that it is not a county in the strict sense, but it is accorded some special privileges and obligations. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, if my fellow Senators look at Clause 6 of the proposed amendment, you will find that this Bill attempts to force Nairobi to do something, which in my view, is unconstitutional. This Bill says that: “Nairobi County shall enter into an agreement with the national Government.” The word cannot be “ shall.” We already have the Intergovernmental Relations Act that provides ways through which governments at the two levels can go into agreements. You cannot come up with a Bill that forces Nairobi County to enter into an agreement with the national Government because that is the first step towards bastardization of the status of Nairobi County. For that reason this is dangerous. I want to call upon the Senator for Nairobi County and all of us to look at that particular provision. If it is an obligation, it is dangerous. Perhaps, the right word should be ‘ may’ because that reflects the spirit in the Intergovernmental Relations Act. I would also like to propose that we have some national conversation on relocation of the capital of Kenya from Nairobi to Isiolo where Sen. Dullo comes from. We can even take it to Machakos where we want to have Konza City. This has been done The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Sen. Kajwang'! You have no option. You either support or you oppose it.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. When it is hot, we eat a lot of watermelon. I will support this Bill subject to amendments that will come to the Committee stage and at the Third Reading.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Does that mean that you support?

I support.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Very well. There being no other interest, I now call upon the Mover to reply.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. Before I respond, I must say one or two words on what happened to the Irrigation Bill this afternoon. We cannot be crying as a Senate and requesting for Bills to be introduced first in this House before they go to the National Assembly. I believe this is an initiative by one side of the Government. You cannot say that let us be nonpartisan as the House of the Senate when you have one card on the table and the other one under the table. I regret what happened this afternoon.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Senator! Are you on a point of order or are you replying on this Order? We have two things. If you want to reply, you should address yourself to the Bill. In the context of that reply, you can now see how you can comment on other things. This is because your debate around a Bill can be generalized, but you cannot start by addressing us to an Order which is already closed. Reply to the debate on this Motion. In the context, if you want to comment about other things, of course within the constraints of the Rules of Relevance, you can still do what you are doing. However, you should first address yourself to the reply on this Motion.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I wish to respond. I thank all the Members who have contributed to and against this Bill. That is within their mandate. From my personal view, I believe that this is a useful document. As some of the Senators have said, this is just an improvement of an already existing Bill. I know very well that cities and municipalities were earlier created through political interest or influence. However, if we now have a criteria established, I believe that it is the right way. I believe that this Bill will be useful in that area. This is because it clearly shows the delineation of the urban cities and areas. I believe that is a criterion that is useful. It also sets out the standards for eligibility of an area to acquire conferment of The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): What is it, Sen. Olekina?

On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I rise pursuant to Standing Order No. 90 (2) which states as follows: “It shall be out of order to introduce an argument or any specific question upon which the Senate has taken a decision during the same Session, except upon a Motion to rescind that decision made with the permission of the Speaker.” Is it in order for the hon. Senator to discuss a matter that has already been disposed of?

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Senator! I have already guided Sen. Dullo on the constraints of how much she can talk about what happened this afternoon. So, we should just allow her to conclude. If I sense in any way that she is going out of the constraints, I will be the first one to stop her.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I believe I am just responding to this particular Bill in reference to what happened this afternoon. So, Sen. Olekina, kindly bear with me because what happened this afternoon is really hurting, not to the Government but to the Senate. It is not really right for some Members to say that this is trash because it is not a useful Bill. I believe there is a way, at the Committee level, that we can amend or, maybe, improve on the Bill as it is. However, all is not lost. So, I support this particular Bill and I wish Members should take that particular direction to make sure that we, as the Senate, can generate Bills from our level and push it to conclusion, instead of us just allowing Bills to come through the National Assembly to our end. For our side, we will introduce as many Bills as possible. We need to get serious as a House to see that the Bills introduced in the House go through for the benefit of everybody. This is because we have a committee level where we can bring on board also the members of the public to strengthen these particular Bills. We cannot just say that we have lost it; we have all opportunities to make sure that we strengthen this particular initiative. So, I request our brothers and sisters on the other side that it is not really good to hurt this particular Senate. It is not for anybody’s interest. Let us contribute to the business of this particular House and make sure that the Senate stands together whenever issues happen. Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Please, move the Motion. Order, Sen. Dullo! Move the Motion.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I beg to move. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Thank you. Sen. Olekina, Sen. Dullo was making was a general point on Bills for the good of the House. I remember, in the last Parliament – you were not with us here – but for those of us who were here, I was the Senate Majority Leader and we really struggled to convince the Executive that Bills should come to us. So, the point she is generally sending without, of course, trying to impinge on the legislative powers and discretion of the House, is that if there are things in the Bill that can be tackled through our Committee and without losing a Bill, that could be a better way than to just throw away Bills and then we go back to where we have come from. We really suffered. However, we have made tremendous progress and I think that now almost all Bills that should be coming here are coming as a matter of right without having to struggle. So, it was just a general comment but you are also right that if the Senate has made a decision, it must be respected. Debate cannot be opened unless through a Motion which is specifically approved by the Speaker.

Order, Senators! Sen. Dullo, you should get used to these setbacks. That is why you are in that office, my friend. You will get more of these. You know that you are the sponsor of the Motion. So, in future, you should do your homework a little better with your Senate Majority Whip a night before the debate, the morning of the debate, over lunch time and during the debate because it is in your interest to push through your business. Nevertheless, did you want to make another application or can I put the question?

On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): What is it, Sen. Kajwang’? I hope it is not about building schools.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I just want your guidance because the Senate Deputy Majority Leader has gone on record when she was moving the Motion and the record will indicate that, perhaps, there was a decision that was made in a very partisan manner that a section of the House could have acted in a manner that was not proper for the good of this House. I would like to go on record that as a Senator elected through the Orange Democratic Movement (ODM) Party and being part of the National Super Alliance (NASA), when I come to this House, my first and primary responsibility is to devolution and to the people who elected me. When the records are being examined, it should come out from the sentiments and the comments of the leadership of this House that this House attempts to put devolution first rather than political parties.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): So, what is out of order Sen. Kajwang’? The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, is the Senate Deputy Majority Leader in order to impute improper motives on a section of the House that made a decision?

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): You cannot bring a point of order when the Senator has already concluded.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I am guided and thankfully on record.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Thank you.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Sen. Dullo, do you want to contribute on the same subject matter?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, it is on another subject matter.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): On another subject matter? Very well, proceed.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. Pursuant to Standing Order No. 55 (3), I request you to defer putting of the question to another date.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Right. I direct that the putting of the question be deferred to Wednesday, 28th February, 2018.

Next order!

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I wish to move this Bill. I would like to start with the background.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Sen. Dullo. This is your second term in this House. Please, resume your seat for a minute. We need to up our game a bit. Perhaps, the first timers are still learning. You have not moved the Bill. You cannot start to talk about it if you have not moved it. In other words, you are supposed to say that this particular Bill be read a Second Time and proceed. This is a House of record.

. I am Sorry, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I must have had a long day today. I beg to move:- THAT, the Warehouse Receipts System Bill (Senate Bills No.10 of 2017) be now read a Second Time. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I rise to second the Warehouse Receipts System Bill that will help to streamline and structure the warehouse industry for agricultural commodities. Thank you.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): You should finish by saying: “I second.”

I second.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I rise to support this Bill unequivocally. This is because I was in the Committee on Agriculture, Fisheries and Livestock in the last Parliament and we did a lot of work coming up with a Warehouse Receipts Bill. I recall that the Bill went through the National Assembly, it came to the Senate and when we were about to finalise its processing, we came to the end of the life of the House. So, I do understand that this is a Bill in which a lot of work had already been put, in the last Parliament. It is to the interest of not just the Senate, but the farmers of this Nation if we fast-tracked the implementation of the warehouse receipting system. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, about three weeks ago, I attended a stakeholders forum with Sen. Waqo; that is Waqo with a “q”. This forum was to talk about the establishment of a commodities exchange in Kenya. The stakeholders included players in the agricultural industry, the finance sector, and the international and local traders. They said that we cannot have a commodities exchange in Kenya if we do not have a clean legislative framework for warehouse receipts. There was a facilitator who had come in from India who shared with us experiences from India. They shared that they established a commodities exchange which went a long way in helping to stabilize prices. A commodities exchange helps in price discovery and fixing prices for various products. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, if you move around some of the counties where potatoes are produced, and I do recall the former Sen. for Nyandarua County, Sen. (Eng.) Muriuki, came up with a very nice Bill – the Potato Produce and Marketing Bill. I also recall that some dark forces somewhere decided that the Senate was so idle that it was only discussing potatoes, forgetting that the potatoes we were discussing were directly relevant to the needs of hundreds and thousands of farmers. However, the potatoes in Nyandarua County would fetch a different price from the potatoes in Nakuru County. We realised that in Nakuru County, especially going towards the Kuresoi side– I do not know whether that is the upper or the lower side – produces a lot of potatoes but there is a price difference. The potatoes from Nakuru County have something they call “ chomelea ”, which is an extra carriage that sometimes even has more than the actual gunny bag. Different prices, same product, same market. A commodities exchange helps in stabilizing prices for similar products in the same environment. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): That is how it should be, Sen. Kajwang. Proceed, Sen. Kihika.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, for the opportunity to also add a few remarks in support of the Warehouse Receipts System Bill (Senate Bills No. 10 of 2017). It is a Bill that is very timely because of the issues that we have seen the farmers of this country face. It aims at helping farmers to manage the post-harvest losses and make profits. It will also help stabilize the food supply as well as ensure sustainability in food security in the country. It will ensure that the farmers in Kenya make money from harvests as opposed to losing them. I have come across a study that shows that about 30 per cent of food is lost post-harvest. That is a very high percentage. Many of these farmers are generally small- scale farmers who probably do not have too much to rely on, other than the hard work they have put in through the year, so that they can sell their harvests and make ends meet. As the Senator who spoke before me said, there is a lot of potato farming in Nakuru County, especially Molo and Kuresoi areas. Farmers work hard day in, day out, and they harvest a lot of potatoes. However, by the time they take their potatoes to the market, a lot of them get spoiled because of bad road systems in these rural areas. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Very well. Let us have Sen. Pareno.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I rise to support this Bill because it provides a legal formula outside the framework that we already have with the National The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): I see no further requests.

For the avoidance of doubt, I have just seen Sen. (Prof.) Ongeri’s request on my screen. Please proceed. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, initially, when Sen. Dullo asked me to second this Bill, I was not quite clear on the nature and direction that the Bill would take. However, now that I feel more educated and informed, it is quite clear that one of the most untidy business today is the produce coming from the farmhouse. The prices being offered at the farm gate houses or delivery centres including the ones at the National Cereals and Produce Board (NCPB) are appalling. For instance, I have in mind one of the most precious commodities coming from my county, Kisii County, as well as Nyamira County; the production of avocado. Every time I have visited the small markets, it is very distressful that the avocado which is so cherished in hotels in Nairobi and export markets is being wasted away for Ksh5. When I am in a hotel in Dubai, the price of the avocado is about US$5. A poor farmer is being coerced because of the glut in the market of avocado fruit. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I hope that this Warehouse Receipt System Bill will go a long way in addressing this important transient means of marketing some of these products that the farmers waste away. They put in so much energy and pressure in trying to grow these items yet they get wasted away. The other commodity that I see is wasted away is the banana unless you have a value addition. I hope that these warehousing systems will also mutate or transform the farmer to go a step further so that the warehousing of these products will be semi- processed where they are processed partially for local consumption as well as export. It will be a stimulus for everyone to buy these commodities and items. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, during the contribution, I heard Sen. Poghisio or Sen. Kajwang say that this can act as a barter trade on commodities based on the expert advice that they got from India. Barter trade was at one time considered a very primitive way of dealing with trade. However, a time came when countries were stressed on the issue of foreign exchange reserves that they had no choice except to resort to barter trade. The trade had the element of defrauding the farmers and those who supply the commodities. I hope this warehousing receipt system will innovate on the crude barter trade system so that whatever is stored and the grading and the categorisation of the product will help to fetch a better price. I am also wary about some of the warehouses; farmers in this country have lost products like coffee in the private warehouses. We must be very careful when we want to promote this kind of system without recourse to what has happened within this country. For instance, the cotton ginneries were one such example where farmers were lured into.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order! Order! Sen. (Prof.) Ongeri, Senator for Kericho County, you know what you have not done. You cannot walk into the Senate as if you are entering Konoin or Sotik market, for that matter. Have a seat Sen. Cheruiyot. Sen. (Prof.) Ongeri Proceed. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the Senator is my neighbour and I am sure he heard that I was speaking about some of the problems that we have in warehousing. Will this extend to items like tea? One of the problems we have discussed with my friend is that the tea industry is very tight because of the auctioning system in Mombasa. The only option a poor tea farmer in Kisii, Kericho, Nandi and other places has is to get their tea all the way to Mombasa through their Kenya Tea Development Agency factories. If we are going to this level of liberalisation, how does the tea farmer also benefit from this Warehousing Receipt System so that he is not told by the tea directors that the poor price was occasioned by transport costs from one level to another? I believe this Warehousing Receipts System will help to bring the services closer to the people. At the moment, county governments are spending a lot of money in creating storage facilities in markets for grading their products. Will this council support this market system within every county and ward, to help the farmers to get their products closer and closer to the warehousing? My experience in the past is when this kind of legal framework is put in place, the warehousing will be done in Mombasa, Nairobi and there will be nobody interested in warehousing in Kisii town or Keroka town. The poor farmer will depend upon the good will of the so called middle men who come and say; ‘look, I have a warehouse in Mombasa but this is what it will cost you’. Let us hope that the Committee Stage will examine the processes and the distances that farmers have got to travel to deposit their products in these warehousing systems. It is a very important system that has got good intentions, but how well does it serve the farmer? Is it in close proximity to where the farmer grows his product or will somebody come and say, “there is a better warehousing system but it will cost you so much?” When you look at the end benefits, it erodes all the benefits that the farmer would have expected to accrue from his products. We need to examine all these little points which mater in how a farmer is being treated in this system. Another area I want to get into is the fee structure. What will the fee structure of this warehousing system be? We may send people to this system and then they have the lee way to impose a fee that is out of reach for the people it intends to serve. As law makers, we must examine the process it goes through and the costs involved. Obviously, there will be a cost to it, but to what extend is this cost being mitigated against the interest of the farmer? This is an important point that we must look at. Yes, we can pass this as a good Bill that benefits the farmer as the Senate, but at what cost? This is an area that we need to get in to. On the issue of inspectors, there are inspectors who go there for different purposes, especially to distort the market prices. They will tell you that your product is of low quality and hence they cannot accept it in the market. At this level, let us avoid frustrating the farmer. A farmer will come with his produce, excited that a warehousing and legal system is in place. But when they get there they will be told, “Sorry, your product is of low quality and, therefore, we cannot accept it in this warehouse.” So, farmers will be at the mercy of this warehousing system and we should be very careful when we will be dealing with this Bill at the Committee Stage. All these The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Thank you, Sen. (Prof.) Ongeri. For your information, miraa is a crop under the Crops Act, courtesy of the hard work by Sen. Kiraitu Murungi, other colleagues and I in the last Parliament. So, you can comfortably categorize miraa with tea, coffee, bananas, cashew nuts, sweet potatoes and other potatoes that are not sweet. Finally, the Senator for Kericho County.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I have noticed something. When I walked in you looked a bit tired, but when it came to addressing Sen. (Prof.) Ongeri on matters miraa, your face brightened. I know that this is a topic you are extremely passionate about.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Senator. Proceed.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. This Bill is very important. Forgive me for rushing into the House. I was watching the proceedings from the lounge and feared that my good neighbour, Sen. (Prof.) Ongeri, was about to finish. I heard you say that there was not so much interest in the Bill and felt that there is need for me to add my voice because this is a brilliant piece of legislation. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): What is it, Sen. Kajwang'?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would like to know on what authority and mandate does the Senator for Kericho purport to speak exclusively for the girl child and for the women? I thought that as the leader of Kericho delegation, he represents everybody, including the boy child.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I do not think Sen. Kajwang' understood what I said. I tend to believe that he chose to misunderstand me. It is not that he does not get what I am saying. He is being cheeky. I do not think that I need to b labour the point further because I have made my point. I was speaking about the issue of generic repetition of phrases that we keep on finding in many of our Bills that I feel our legislative drafting department need to take a keen interest on and perhaps, notice. Last week when contributing to another Bill, I did point out that many of our young people are jobless. I do not believe, as a legislature, that when given an opportunity to serve somewhere, you should seek to stay beyond the time mandated, either constitutionally or even do more than two or three terms. I do not like the phrasing that is used in many of our Bills where they say that:- “The Chief Executive Officer (CEO) shall serve a term of three years and shall, subject to satisfactory performance, be eligible for reappointment for a further term of three years.” It is never put in black and white. Kenya is increasingly becoming a litigant nation and when things are not so clear and black and white, we have seen courts grant leave of thought to many of these things. That phrase as it is scribbled in this Bill does not qualify to tighten the noose such that as a CEO, once you have been appointed for a further term of three years after doing the first term; that it is clear that it is your final term. You can still be appointed for a further three year term. I have actually seen, but I do not remember the court case number, somebody going to court to challenge this. Therefore, as we continue to draft some of these things, it should be clear. Why do we not expressly provide for it that the CEO can serve for a The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): What is it Sen. Dullo?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, have you noticed that the Senate Minority Leader, Sen. Wetangula, walked into the Chamber without bowing? Is it really in order?

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Actually, I did not notice because I noticed that he bowed. So, I did notice that he did not bow.

Sen. Dullo, I know that you have unresolved issues but as the Swahili say “ Mgala

.” Proceed, Sen. Cheruiyot.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, maybe we need to define bowing because what I noted is that he nodded his head which is totally different from bowing. Anyway, let me go back to my contribution. I was speaking about things that the council can do and something really pricked my thought and I was excited about it, that this council that is being proposed can actually suspend the operations of a warehouse operator, an inspector, weigher or grader operating under this Act for failure to comply with any of the provisions of this Act. This is really encouraging. Many of the people who, perhaps, are in this House and are not farmers may not understand why this is a big point. But let me shock you by telling you that today farmers in this country do not have direct access to the market despite the fact that we pride ourselves as being a free market economy. It does not matter whether you are a sugarcane or a potato farmer, the minute you have your sugarcane or potatoes ready for the market, what I know and I have seen people doing is that you will get them to a lorry and transport to the market. But the minute you get to the market, you are not allowed to sell despite the fact that you may be the one who planted these potatoes. What people are normally told to do is that you sit aside and wait for people known as market brokers to get a price for you and they will be sold at the price that they feel is right. If you go to Wakulima Market tomorrow morning and observe the farmers that are delivering their farm produce, from fresh kales to oranges and onions, you will realize that the farmers - who come at the back of the trucks because they cannot afford to have vehicles of their own - will be told to sit aside and wait for a farm broker who will sell the produce for them. The provision of the Council begins the important process in our agricultural sector where we are de-linking farmers and brokers and separating them. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Very well. Proceed, Sen. Wetangula.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, for an opportunity to contribute to this Bill. Warehousing is one of the most critical components in commodity handling. In this country, we have statistics that show that post-harvest management of cereals and other products occasions farmers losses of up to 60 or 70 per cent. So, this Bill comes at a time when the country is devolving activities and where value addition is now the trend in the agricultural sector. So, it is important that order and sanity is brought to the management of warehouse products. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, a Bill is important to the extent that it will streamline, keep management records and produce statistics that can be of use and help even for the future. If you want to look at the records of production of food products in this country today; for example, if you go to your area of Meru, Mitungu and those areas, there are no tomatoes in this country better than what comes from that area. But, if you look at statistics on how to leverage on this, help the farmer, warehouse them, keep records and market them, we in the west do not have to grow tomatoes because we can depend on you. You also do not have to grow maize, because you can depend on us. This is how a country can coexist and live with each other in a better way. This can only be done when there is a legal regime that brings order and sanity to these kind of products. In fact, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I have been seeing a mushrooming of what they call ‘cold storage’ warehouses, but they are being done in a very haphazard manner. I have seen in one place where they have sunk in about Kshs10 million to put up a warehouse for storage of tomatoes where no tomatoes are grown. This is the same madness that came to this country when people jumped on to something called fish farming. You would find somebody going to Mandera to put up a fish pond, where evaporation of water is 95 per cent. By the time you put in the fish, The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Sen. Wetangula! Which team is that?

Proceed without any further reference to that team.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, in the last Parliament, there was a team that acquired some common notoriety called the ‘sky team’ that was all over with helicopters. When you fly over Narok you see a lot of empty ponds, with black polythene everywhere. In each one of those ponds, we have sunk Kshs3million or Kshs4 million of public funds. Why is that so? It is because somebody sits somewhere and says that since fish farming is good, they can make money. If they do 500,000 ponds and make Kshs1 million on each, that is a couple of billions. That is Kenya for you. When we bring this Bill that will help the farmer and businessman, it is very important for record keeping. When you visit a dairy farmer in a country like the United Kingdom or Germany, he will give you the history of an animal for the last 50 years. He will tell you: “This animal was the offspring of this and that.” Recently, I visited some farmer in Trans Nzoia and I was shocked that we have people like that in Kenya. This gentleman from Central Kenya, who settled in Trans Nzoia, has livestock. In the first lactation of a heifer, he is draining 36 litres of milk. He has put them on very high standards. He keeps records that are fully computerized. When he is in his office in Nairobi, at milking time, he can see what a particular cow has given. For example, if the distinguished Senator for Tharaka-Nithi goes to him to buy a cow, he will give him a full record. When I eventually buy from him, I will also inherit a full record. That is what record keeping is all about. But in many cases people would just say: “W ewe angalia tuvile anatoa maziwa halafu chukua ng’ombe.” That kind of thinking does not help this county. I hope that when we pass this Bill into law, it will change the manner in which we do things. Again, for the first time in the recent days, I have seen that the structures being set appear to be reasonably consultative with the country governments. I heard the distinguished Senator for Kericho speaking and I am told that he has been nominated to serve in the Parliamentary Service Commission (PSC). I hope that he will not pursue a narrow personal agenda there, but support the Members of this House and the other House.

For every law that comes to this House, we must be keen to ask what is in it for counties. That is what we represent. What will be done at the national level that will impact on The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Sen. Wetangula! You will have a balance of 52 minutes when the debate on this Bill continues.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Hon. Senators, it is now 6.30 p.m. and time to adjourn the House. The Senate, therefore, stands adjourned until tomorrow, Thursday, 22nd February, 2018, at 2.30 p.m. The Senate rose at 6.30p.m The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.