(Hon. Lusaka)

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I bring a Petition which is dated 23rd February, 2018. The Petition is from the residents of Murang’a County who draw the attention of the House to the following:- (1) That the insurance sector in Kenya is well regulated by the Insurance Regulatory Authority (IRA), and there are specialist Medical Insurance Providers (MIP) that act as brokers who then source various health insurance coverage plans. (2) That health insurance protects the insured from high costs arising out of an illness or an accident provided, they are covered on a health policy from the health insurance companies. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Hon. Senators, pursuant to Standing Order No.225, I shall now allow comments, observations or clarifications in relation to the Petition for not more than 30 minutes. I cannot see any request on my screen. If there are no comments, let us move to the next Petition.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I have made a request.

Kindly proceed, Sen. Murkomen.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, this is a very important Petition. I congratulate the petitioners from Murang’a County, who are:- (1) Mr. Andrew Thairu Ngone (2) Mr. Noah Gachucha (3) Mr. Eliud Maina (4) Ms. Edna Njoki (5) Mr. Davis Mburu (6) Mr. Sammy Kahura Muriuki (7) Mr. Abdalla Juma (8) Ms. Jane Wairimu (9) Mr. Joseph Karatu (10) Mr. Samuel Gatuguta The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

The Senate Majority Leader, you are being very generous with complements to the Senator of Murang’a County. Please proceed, Sen. Outa. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I thank the residents of Murang’a County and the good Senator and my friend, who destiny made it possible for us to be here in the Senate for bringing this Petition. If you had asked my friend and I before if we would want to come to the Senate, it would not have been our choice. We however found ourselves here. I thank the people of Murang’a County for bringing this Petition because under this so-called insurance or medical cover, there are so many underlying details which are not disclosed. Even we, at the Senate, have a medical cover from the Jubilee Insurance. But what is surprising enough for me is that when my daughter was sick, we sent her to the hospital thinking that she was fully covered. However, we realised that the Jubilee Insurance cover does not cover us fully and we had to part with some money. That is why we need more disclosure on this medical insurance cover before they fleece individuals and institutions like Parliament. As I thank the Petitioner, we also need to go deep and unearth the uncouth ways of how insurance companies have been fleecing the public of resources. Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Hon. Senators, pursuant to Standing Order No. 226(1), the Petition stands committed to the Standing Committee on Labour and Social Welfare. In terms of Standing Order No. 226(2), the Committee is required, in not more than 60 days from the time of reading the prayer, to respond to the petitioner by way of a report addressed to the petitioner and laid on the Table of the Senate. I thank you. Next Petition. THE PROPOSED MITUBIRI SANITARY LANDFILL PROJECT

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I bring another Petition which was received on 28th February, 2018. I rise pursuant to Standing Order No. 224(3) to present a Petition on behalf of the residents of Maragwa, Kandara, Kigumo and Gatanga Constituencies in Murang’a County. A sanitary landfill has been proposed to be located at a place called Mitubiri, in Maragua sub-county of Murang’a County, occupying 19.5 hectares. The said project is situated in a place which is largely agricultural and in a fast developing area due to its proximity to Thika and Kenol Towns. Mr. Speaker, Sir, the project is intended to be a dumping site for waste from the five counties of Nairobi, Kiambu, Kajiado, Murang’a and Machakos. Although the National Environment Management Authority (NEMA) conducted an Environmental Impact Assessment (EIA), Murang’a County Government has dismissed claims that it was involved in the planning of this project. Area residents have raised concerns that the project may turn our county into a dumpsite and, therefore, affect ground water and pollute the soil. Landfills have the potential to cause serious health problems to human beings, including bringing hazardous elements like lead, mercury and cadmium. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Hon. Senator, do not get carried away by your own Petition. Hon. Senators, pursuant to Standing Order No. 225, I shall now allow comments, observations or clarifications in relation to the Petition for not more than 30 minutes.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I want the sponsor of the Petition to listen; as you can see, he is standing up. Sen. Kang’ata has come up with an interesting proposal. However, if he had listened to me the last time I was moving the Sessional Paper on the National Slum Upgrading and Prevention Policy, he would have realised that this Petition is more premised on the argument that Nairobi County is different from Murang’a County. However, in my moving notes – which I want to repeat here – I said that Nairobi County is probably carrying burdens of Murang’a County than any other county in the Republic of Kenya. Mr. Speaker, Sir, the principle that this waste should be dumped anywhere in this country – and I am not saying that it should or should not be dumped in Murang’a – is wrong. All of us who come from Kajiado, Kiambu, Murang’a or Machakos are the reason why the population of Nairobi County during the day is more than twice the population of Nairobi at night. Most of the waste that Sen. Kang’ata is saying will be taken from Nairobi to Murang’a probably includes the waste attributed to him, because he is based in Nairobi.

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Those who want to speak should press the intervention button because I think there is a challenge. Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr.

.: Mr. Speaker, Sir, allow me to congratulate Sen. Kang’ata for this timely Petition. Through the last Senate and the Committee on Energy, Roads and Transportation, at the time chaired by Sen. Moi, the people of Kibwezi East Constituency managed to benefit from an intervention of the worst oil spillage in the country. So, this is also a matter that should be taken seriously. Part of the recommendations made by the Committee on Energy, Roads and Transportation at the time was that part of the failure in some of these disasters or events is the National Environment Management Authority (NEMA). Therefore, the Committee that will be charged with this responsibility should look at a proposal; do we need to restructure the NEMA? This is because the Act is very clear. Sen. Kang’ata would not need to bring a Petition like this if somebody had bothered to advertise and publicise the report that would lead to the said dumpsite. Needless to say, we have mismanaged waste management in all counties. If you drive to the airport in Mombasa County, before you get there, the first thing that you see on the left hand side is an ugly site of waste. Before we deal with this issue, and I believe it will most likely be the Committee on Health and the Committee on Lands, Environment and Natural Resources --- This is a matter that affects Nairobi County – I can see Sen. Sakaja here – and we need to handle it. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I wish to support this Petition. The fact that garbage from Nairobi City County is being dumped in Murang’a County may not be the biggest issue. It is high time this country decided and came up with enforceable policies that will protect our mother nature everywhere. The dumping of the refuse in Murang’a County will be an issue because there is no process for ensuring that the garbage itself is processed in a manner that ensures it does not become toxic to Mother Nature. Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. mentioned that as you drive across Mwache Creek from Changamwe in Mombasa County, you see a grisly site of garbage on your left hand side. Even here in Nairobi City County, garbage is just dumped in Dandora. A few vultures go there and pick what they can get. Street children go there too and try to survive. Some women go there and pick a few items and sell. Mr. Speaker, Sir, today, proper garbage management is done to the benefit of humankind. It is used in other counties to generate power and actually segregated in a manner that it becomes acceptable to Mother Nature. It may be interesting to note that there are countries where sewage is treated to such a level that it is pumped back for domestic use. I may not feel very comfortable to use it, but it is processed to a level where it is hygienically palatable. Now, this Committee should tackle the issue of garbage handling in this country. However, I do not know whether we should start with our blatant cutting down of trees or garbage management. We need to wake up because we have a beautiful country that has all the treasures that we were given by Mother Nature. Why could the garbage not be processed here or somewhere in the vicinity and used to generate power? Somebody approached me years back and said that they were ready to do this. They gave a proposal to the then Nairobi City Council to actually process garbage in the manner it is done elsewhere and generate quite a substantial amount of power. That got nowhere. The question is: How and why? There are things that we need to address. Therefore, the Committee should go deeper and not just be concerned with the dumping. This is because if it is not dumped in Kenol in Murang’a County, it will be dumped somewhere in Kajiado or Machakos. That is not a solution; we are just removing poison from here and taking it elsewhere, and it is not the right way. The Committee should come up with a thorough policy guideline and let us have enforceable laws. I keep sympathizing with Hon. ole Kaparo when I see him every time talking passionately and almost breaking into tears. But who takes him seriously? Mr. Speaker, Sir, we need to address those attitudes.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I also congratulate the Senator for Murang’a County for bringing this Petition. However, The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I also congratulate the Senator for Murang’a County for bringing this important petition to this House. This is not only a problem in Murang’a or Nairobi counties, but also in all our urban areas, towns and shopping centres. We, as Senators, need to legislate on solid waste management in this country. It is a big a problem. Dumping waste everywhere causes conflict among communities. For example, we cannot allow Kajiado or Murang’a county to be the dumping site of waste from Nairobi County even if water comes from Murang’a County. It is unacceptable. We, as a country, need to think of a technological way of managing our waste. Currently, we have waste all over our counties. We need to designate specific areas as dumping sites where we can recycle the waste and make use of it. I urge the Senate Committee dealing with this petition to engage the Ministry and the National Environment Management Authority (NEMA). This NEMA has been sleeping on the job. Do they have the capacity to do their work? Do they have sound policy on waste management? The NEMA is failing this country in terms of waste management and health hazard measures.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. This is a very timely petition, Sen. Kang’ata. I would urge the Senate Committee on Land, Environment and Natural Resources to draw heavily from the document of the New Urban Agenda which has been The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I rise to support this petition. I saw my very good friend, Sen. Kang’ata with his constituents vigorously demanding that Murang’a County, which has been a very good source of water for the city and other amenities, being used as a dumping site is totally unacceptable. I do not know whether it is in the same vein that we also saw some monkeys being chased away around sometimes back. However, that is a story for another day. Mr. Speaker, Sir, if you look at the history of this Republic, in the 1980s, the major concern was the dumping of poisonous waste from the so-called developed countries to African countries. In fact, a classical case was where somebody from the United Kingdom wanted to buy land worth Kshs2 billion then to use it for toxic waste dumping. It is quite interesting that with the advent of devolution, we are seeing this issue arising from two neighbouring counties –Nairobi and Murang’a. The data that is available shows that if we are not able to take care of our waste globally, our oceans are suffocating with plastic waste. In fact, it is estimated that by 2050, there may be more plastic waste than fish in our oceans. That is something that is quite telling. We need to look at this because plastic alone takes about 500 to 1000 years for it to decompose and much less years if at all that process is fast-tracked. Yet, if you look at plastic particularly, only about 12 per cent is recycled for use globally. Rather than having these disputes between Nairobi and Murang’a counties, we have an opportunity to invent ways of ensuring that we meet our energy demands. In fact, we are able to depopulate our environment with the waste that is there. So when the Senate Committee on Land, Environment and Natural Resources goes to investigate this, I think one of the things that would help this august House is to propose measures through which we can ensure that such disputes do not arise in future and that we take advantage of the humongous amount of waste that is being generated by our cities, towns and villages. All of us have seen a tremendous change with the ban of polythene in our places. This is because you see less and less of these papers around and that has provided a better environment for all of us. I fully support this Petition. It is in good taste, and I would The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Hon. Senators, since this is just a petition, let the remaining Senators just take two minutes. Let us have Sen. Malala.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. First of all, I appreciate my colleague, Sen. Irungu for bringing up this Petition which has in fact ignited a debate bigger than its content. The big question here is: “Are our counties autonomous and can they operate in isolation?”. The answer is; no. In Kakamega, we get water from Nandi County and supply the same to Busia County after processing it. Therefore, we cannot operate autonomously as county governments. I would like to urge my friend, Sen. Kang'ata, to be creative with the waste that is being dumped in Murang’a County. Murang’a County is the food basket in Kenya since it is agricultural. If you converted the waste into manure, it will be more valuable for you than to take it back to Nairobi. Secondly, I would like to support the Senate Majority Leader who suggested that it is Murang’a that is benefitting more from Nairobi. Therefore, we would even urge Nairobi to transfer the dumping site in Dandora to Murang’a so that the traders of Murang’a can get space to trade in Nairobi. This is because the markets in Nairobi are congested.

No!

Therefore, this exercise will benefit both counties so that we take the waste back to them. Mr. Speaker, Sir, this brings us to a need to have a policy entrenched in legislation to be adopted by all county governments so that we have a sustainable way of disposing off our waste. Moving forward, I think we will need to mentor our county assemblies to prioritise the waste management legislation so that we can have a sustainable solution to this problem.

Let us have Sen. Sakaja.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I thank my colleague, Sen. Kang'ata, for bringing this matter to the fore. I may not agree with his approach because I think the Senator needs to, first, count himself very lucky that Nairobi intends to take waste there. If he sees how the world is moving, even countries like Sweden are importing waste. I think we need to raise our level of engagement on this issue. The benefit of this Petition is that we will discuss deeper on matters of waste management. As it is, Nairobi and Murang’a counties have a very long and deep relationship, politically and on ecological issues such as water. We receive a lot of water from Gatanga in Murang’a County and in return, Murang’a County also gets a lot from Nairobi. Mr. Speaker, Sir, if you look at a landfill - I hope this Committee will look at those issues - a highly engineered sanitary landfill - and I would like the Senator to listen to me - will be of great benefit to the people of Maragwa, Kandara, Kigumo and Gatanga. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Let us have Sen. Faki.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I wish to congratulate my colleague, Sen. Kang’ata, for this timely Petition. Garbage is a real problem. For instance, in Mombasa, garbage collection companies are claiming over Kshs300million in unpaid bills for garbage that is said to have been collected. If you drive across the Makupa Causeway, which is the entry to Mombasa Town and the rest of the former Coast Province, you will find piles and piles of garbage that is being dumped without any use to mwananchi and the county in general. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I wish to support the Petition and say that we should devise ways through legislation to deal with this problem of garbage. We are spending more money in collecting the garbage and dumping it than doing development in areas that require it in the counties.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I take this cue to congratulate my friend, the Senator for Murang’a, for this important Petition. However, I would like him to take into cognizance a very important aspect in terms of the dumping of waste. We need to know that the dumping is not only done in Murang’a County but also in other areas like Athi River which empties its waters into the Indian Ocean. It is important to know that all the industrial effluent from Nairobi, Murang’a, and Kiambu counties empties its heavy pollutant metals into Athi River. That is the water which is used by our people downstream. That goes a long way in affecting aquatic life. Again, there is a lot of irrigation along the said river and a lot of risk. Last time, we were talking a lot about cancer. It is now proven - in fact, if you read yesterday’s Daily NationNewspaper, you will realise that the top page touched on the cancers caused by vegetables grown along the polluted rivers. Very soon, my colleague here, Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr., should not very much celebrate that we are going to have Thwake Dam. All these effluent is going to be emptied there. We therefore, need---

You time is up! Let us have Sen. Omogeni.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I also want to join the speakers who have spoken before me in congratulating the able Senator for Murang’a for this very timely intervention. I want to join my colleague, Sen. Kang’ata, in agreeing with him that we must be very proactive in taking care of our environment. The greater risk that we pose to the future generation is failure to protect and take care of our environment. Mr. Speaker, Sir, what is trending in the international fora is concerted efforts to ensure that we protect our environment. That far, I fully agree with Sen. Kang’ata. However, we also must embrace technology in seeking intervention on how we can The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Yes, Sen. Kihika.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I join my colleagues in supporting this timely Petition by Sen. Kang’ata. It is a Petition whose subject matter affects all the counties across the board. As others have said, as you drive from one county to another or from one town to another, you notice and see the eyesore that is the garbage that is across our counties. In Nakuru, for example, there is this Kioto in London ward that is a terrible eyesore. Beyond that, there are a lot of health hazards attached to lack of good waste management. In bringing this Petition, this provides an opportunity for a discussion on how to properly come up with legislation that will help our counties to manage their waste in a way that helps create jobs for the youth. In addition, it will help to dispose the waste properly so that it is not a health hazard. As the population grows across the counties, this becomes a big problem. It is an issue not only restricted to Murang’a but also across the board. I look forward to hearing what the relevant Committee will bring to the floor.

Finally, Sen. Olekina.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise to support my good friend, Sen. Kang’ata for bringing this timely Motion. I see it as a business opportunity for a lot of unemployed youth. This morning, as I was coming from Mombasa, I saw a big dumpsite and all I could see is income. When I go to Nakuru there is a timber yard and also another dumpsite; all I could see is money. It is important that the Senate intervenes to support the petitioner in implementing this project so that we can do more consultation as the petitioner is seeking, to enable us come up with legislation that will guide this country and not just Murang’a County. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I commend NEMA for having taken away all the plastics. It is time for us to instill the knowledge of recycling into the culture of this country. With those few remarks, since I can see the warning light is already yellow, I fully support him on point A, B and C. It requires public participation so that it can give millions of unemployed youth an opportunity to make money, by converting that waste into manure which can be packaged and sold worldwide.

Order, Hon. Senators! Order! Hon. Senators; pursuant to Standing Order 226 (1) the Petition stands committed to the Standing Committee on Lands, Environment and Natural Resources. In terms of Standing Order 226 (2) the Committee is required in not more than 60 days from the time of reading the prayer, to respond to the petitioner by way of a report addressed to the petitioner and laid on the table of the Senate. Next Order! The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

The Chair Committee on Finance and Budget.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to lay the following Paper on the Table of the Senate, today Tuesday, 6th March 2018; The Report of the Controller of Budget on the County Government Budget implementation review for the first quarter financial year 2017/2018. Thank you.

Next Order!

Yes, Sen. Wetangula.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to give notice of the following Motion: That pursuant to Standing Order No.34 (1) The Senate adjourns to discuss a definite matter of urgent national importance regarding insecurity in Mt. Elgon Constituency of Bungoma County.

Order! Sen. Wetangula, you are supposed to seek leave.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, pursuant to Standing Order No. 34, I seek leave to move that the House adjourns to discuss a matter of definite urgent national importance regarding insecurity in Mt. Elgon Constituency of Bungoma County, where in the last one month, over 33 people have been brutally murdered, some children, women and families wiped out.

Hon. Members, you have the requisite number we will do that at 5:30 p.m. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Hon. Lusaka): Yes, Sen. Olekina.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, pursuant to Standing Order No.46 (2) (b) I rise to seek a Statement from the Chairperson, Standing Committee on Land Environment and Natural Resources, regarding the long outstanding land dispute between Taita Sisal Estate and the local community within Taita Taveta County over the land parcel numbers; LR. 3890/5,1137, 86924 and 9487, totaling to an acreage of 30,284 acres. In the Statement, the Chairperson should explain the steps taken by the Government to resolve the land dispute between Taita Sisal Estate and the local community indicating the current ownership status of the said parcel of land. Mr. Speaker, Sir, in the Statement, the Chairperson should state when the long awaited access to land ownership documents and titles by residents of Mwatate in particular, Singida Majengo area, will be accomplished. The Chairperson should also explain why the Cabinet Secretary for Lands, Housing and Urban Development gave two conflicting sets of recommendations concerning ownership of the said parcel of land in the Report which was issued in June 2017 and another on September 2017. Finally in the Statement, the Chairperson should confirm to this House when the recommendation of the joint surveyor report on the land in question will be implemented.

The Chairperson, Committee on Lands, Environment and Natural resources.

Mr. Speaker, Sir I undertake to bring the Statement in two weeks. I spent the whole of yesterday afternoon in the Ministry of Lands and Physical Planning. While there, I talked to the Permanent Secretary and Prof. Muhammad Swazuri, the Chairman of the National Land Commission (NLC), regarding statements required in this house. We agreed that in future, they will be proceed on time. So, I undertake to give the statement in two weeks’ time. Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Is that okay with you, Senator Olekina? That is fair enough. Sen. Mwaruma, what is your intervention on?

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I want to support and ride on the statement by the Senator for Narok, Sen. Olekina, that we should get a real statement about the status of the dispute of Taita Sisal Estate. There has been a long-standing difference between the owner or the investor and the people surrounding the sisal estate of Sigila/Majengo. So, I eagerly wait for that statement. Similarly, Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would like, as the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Lands Environment and Natural Resources seeks answers, to also seek for the status of the lease of Voi Sisal Estate, where there has also been a long-standing dispute with the people of Mkamenyi area of Voi. The lease was renewed un- The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Order, Sen. Mwaruma. You are asking for a completely different statement. You are derailing the question.

Mr. Speaker Sir, I am riding on it.

But in your riding, you are going off; you are veering off the main point. So, you are getting into the bush with your rider.

Okay, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

You have made your point. The Chairperson had requested to be given two weeks and I wanted to find out from Sen. Olekina if that is okay. What you have raised will also be included in the response to the statement.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I just wanted to remind the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Lands Environment and Natural Resources – I know he is busy – that there was a statement which had already been issued by the previous Minister for Lands and Physical Planning. He issued two reports in particular concerning this parcel of land. So, my request is whether he can take seven days, because this issue had already been dealt with; it is just that it is conflicting. Alternatively, we can get a preliminary statement in seven days and then the full report in two weeks. That will be fine with me.

Chairperson?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I do not think there is much difference about time. These statements are taking a little bit longer. I explained that the whole of yesterday afternoon, I had time to sit with the Permanent Secretary in the Ministry of Lands and Physical Planning and the Chairman of the NLC and requested that we should be receiving the statements in good time. I do not think I can do more than that. Two weeks will be adequate because I am dealing with many statements.

Very well, it is okay, Chairperson; it is understood. I direct that you respond in two weeks. Let us hear the Senator for Kwale County. TITANIUM MINING IN KWALE COUNTY BY VARIOUS MINING COMPANIES

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Pursuant to Standing Order No. 46(2)(b), I rise to seek a statement from the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Lands, Environment and Natural Resources on titanium mining by Base Titanium Limited Company (Kenya), Base Resource Limited, Austria and other mining companies in Kwale County. In the statement, the chair should explain: The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Sen. Moses Wetangula, you have the floor.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I wish to ride on this statement and request the Chairperson – when he or she brings the answer – to table in this House the following; the number of foreign-owned companies licensed to mine in Kenya and where they are mining; the quantum of mining per annum, the income thereof and how much it benefits both the local communities and the National Treasury. Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Chairperson?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, this is a statement that requires details and, therefore, it needs to be given special handling. It will require us to invite the companies which are mining in Kwale County so that we can understand the whole saga. That notwithstanding, I undertake to give a response in two weeks. Fortunately, the hon. Member requesting for the Statement is also a Member of the Standing Committee on Lands Environment and Natural Resources. So, he will understand how we deal with this matter.

Is two weeks okay? Very well; Let us hear from the Senator for Lamu County, Sen. Anuar Loitiptip. If he is not present, let us then hear from the Senator for Nyeri County, Sen. Ephraim Maina. DESTRUCTION OF FORESTS IN KENYA

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Pursuant to Standing Order No. 46(2)(b), I rise to seek a statement from the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Lands, Environment and Natural Resources on the careless destruction of forests in this country. In the Statement, the Chairperson should: (1) Table a list of gazetted forest areas, indicating their respective coverage in hectares and, further, state those that are gazetted as water catchment areas. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Let us have the Chair of the Standing Committee on Lands, Environment and Natural Resources.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, this is a major concern for the Government today. We will seek the statement from the Ministry of Environment and Forestry. I will also visit the Ministry because today, a chairman has to go to the ministries to seek for the response. I will undertake to bring the statement to the House in two weeks, if the Senator seeking for the statement so agrees.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I may not mind two weeks but I beseech the Chairman to ensure that the matter is addressed urgently. We need to wake up to what we are likely to face. I was born around Mount Kenya. I grew up and crossed rivers there when I was young. The matter is a bit urgent. Therefore---

Order Sen. (Eng.) Maina!

Mr. Speaker, Sir, in the interest of the circumstances prevailing, could he try to get the statement sooner, so that action is taken?

Okay, two weeks. Let us now have Sen. Olekina.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, thank you for giving me an opportunity to ride on the statement by the distinguished Senator for Kirinyaga. I would like the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Lands, Environment and Natural Resources, in his response, to let this House know how many forest officers are deployed to the Mau Forest which is being destroyed on a daily basis. I thank you.

That is noted and I hope the Senator has heard. DEROGATORY SONG AGAINST THE KAMBA COMMUNITY

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise pursuant to Standing Order No.46(2)(b) to seek a statement from the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on National Cohesion, Equal Opportunity and Regional Integration regarding a song which is derogatory against the Kamba Community composed by some two Kenyan musicians in which they allege that now that the mango season is over, the Kambas will have to resort to eating dogs if they cease to sell charcoal. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, in giving the statement, could the Chairman also bring information from the Chair of the National Cohesion and Integration Commission (NCIC) Mr. Francis Ole Kaparo, who was very quick in summoning Governor Ngilu to his office to question her about banning logging and charcoal but has maintained a conspiracy of silence and he is making some faint noises about the song that is derogatory in nature and that is likely to inflame ethnic passions in the country? Equally important, if Kaparo summoned Charity Ngilu, the Governor of Kitui County, for banning logging, is he telling the country that the very positive statement made yesterday by the Deputy President Hon. William Ruto also runs counter?

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Is it in order for the Senate Minority Leader to mislead the House and the country that the reason for summoning the Governor for Kitui County, Hon. Charity Ngilu, was because of banning logging? The reason why she was summoned was because of burning a truck belonging to a Member of County Assembly (MCA) of Kiambu.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Is it in order for the Senate Minority Leader to misuse his opportunity to ask for clarification or supplementary question to defend a person facing investigation and introduce alternative facts? If Sen. Wetangula who is an accomplished advocate wanted to defend the governor of Kitui County, the right forum is to go and defend her before the NCIC and, eventually, the court. We will be misusing the Floor of the House if we were to do a trial by looking at the grounds for which the governor is being investigated. That is to pursue in vain what is called “alternative facts” and changing facts to suit political interests of one side. Is this House not the place where we are looking for cohesion and not trying to defend individuals if they belong to our side?

Honourable Senators, as you ride on the statement, let us be within the question so that we do not lose track.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I never defended Gov. Charity Ngilu; I only asked a question about her being summoned for interrogation. Secondly, there is no Standing Order – and Standing Orders spring from the Constitution – that bars a Member from commenting on or asking about a matter under investigation. It is not covered under the Sub Judice rule. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. If the Senate Minority Leader speaks for Gov. Charity Ngilu, he should first declare his interest. He cannot on one hand pursue vigorously such a production of some musicians that we do not even know by name. I agree with Sen. Wambua that we must first get their identities. The Senate Minority Leader is trying to pursue them vigorously and using the same platform to defend another citizen of this Republic, who is being investigated with regard to an issue of burning of a vehicle. This idea of trying to speak from both sides of the mouth is very defeatist.

Sen. Wambua has asked a very important question. Let us not lose track of what has been asked, so that we can get an answer that will enhance cohesion in this country. So, these riders are actually derailing us.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. It has become a routine now that every time I am on the Floor, my colleagues who are about two or three, for no reason whatsoever, feel very agitated. They stand up and purport to raise points of order that are actually calculated at derailing what I am saying. I need your protection on that. More importantly, the question that I was pursuing is in public knowledge; that the Chairman of National Cohesion and Integration Commission (NCIC), hon. Francis ole Kaparo, summoned Gov. Charity Ngilu---

Order, Sen. for Kajiado. Let Sen. Wetangula finish and then I will give you an opportunity.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am on a point of order. For my colleagues who may be new in the House, when one is on a point of order you cannot rise on a another point of order. I lauded the Deputy President for banning logging. I have also said that if Gov. Charity Ngilu and is being pursued by law enforcement agencies, are they going to turn the same heat on the Deputy President, which I do not agree with?

Order! Hon. Members, when you rise on a point of order, go straight to the point of order and point out what is out of order. Sen. Murkomen.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Is it in order for the Senate Minority Leader, whom we expect since 1992 to have at least understood something about the Standing Orders, to assume the position of the Speaker and determine what becomes a valid point of order or not?

It is out of order. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I have received the request on behalf of the Chairperson of the Committee on National Cohesion, Equal Opportunity and Regional Integration. We will give it all the necessary attention and respond within the next two weeks. Sen. Wambua is a Member of that Committee and we will give our best.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I actually thought that you would give me an opportunity to ask a follow up question. But on the issue raised by Sen. (Rev.) Waqo, two weeks is too long. First, I must declare that I have already issued a complaint to the Director of Public Prosecutions and NCIC. However, if we allow the music video to continue running and circulating in the manner that it is for the next two weeks, we will actually cause more animosity. When the national Government was aggrieved by a function on 30th January, they switched off the media. Therefore, there should be a facility of shutting down or retrieving a material like that from the internet to stop these two young men – misguided bigots – from continuing to insult the Kamba community in the manner that they are doing.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, we do understand this is a very touchy issue. I believe that we will give it due attention in the next two or three days. I promise that as soon we get the full information, we will bring it to the House. My humble request is that you give us a maximum of two weeks, but we will give it all the necessary attention.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Bearing in mind what Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. has raised and considering the significance of the continuous broadcast of that song, is it not possible, from where you sit and the powers of the Speaker, for you to order the necessary agencies, in the interim as the Committee tries to understand who they are and what action is being taken by NCIC, to take remedial measures? That includes bringing down the music video from YouTube or whichever other place, because I do not know where it is, so that we can also know that the Speaker can bite, apart from not having eyes. You once said that you do not have ears or eyes, but you can bite.

Order! Order! That is blackmail.

First, I have just gotten the allegations; I do not have the facts ready with me to make a determination on the matter. But, I am sure that the agencies that are responsible for taking action have heard what we have said. We want a response by Thursday, as the Chair has said. Sen. Orengo.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, this is a matter so grave that if left to a Chair of a Committee of this House, it will not be good enough. In fact, I was wondering, if ever there was a Government in place which was legitimate and assuming that this Government--- The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Order, Sen. Orengo!

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am using my words very carefully. Assuming that it is legitimate, this is a matter which the Senate Majority Leader himself would have taken instructions from the relevant Government Ministries and brought a Statement here. First of all, the Statement should state the Government’s position in relation to its duty under the Constitution. This is because we tend to forget why the Executive exists. If you look at the Constitution you will know why it exists. Creating harmony and security in the country is a very important mandate of the Government which is in place. The Cabinet Secretary for Interior and Coordination of National makes so many statements whenever he thinks it is important to make those kinds of statements. This is a matter on which the Cabinet Secretary for Interior and National Coordination, Mr. Fred Matiang’i, would do well to have issued a Statement and give assurance that this Government is not applying the law with a double edge. But the Senate Majority Leader, being a lawyer - although a junior lawyer - should have shown leadership and come here with a Statement, instead of waiting for the Chair of the Committee, who cannot even summon an Assistant Secretary in the relevant Ministry. By doing so, this House would know that this Government is taking this issue seriously. But as it stands now, there will be deaths and still this Government will be quiet. Could the Senate Majority Leader take it upon himself to bring a Statement?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, first, I want to acknowledge that I am the Senate Majority Leader. It is a fact that I am twice younger than Sen. Orengo. It is also a fact that in the legal profession; Sen. Orengo is at the apex; he is a Senior Counsel. However, he needs to be reminded that those who hold very high offices like himself, as a Senior Counsel, do not need to remind us, his juniors, that we are junior. We know it. We are only praying that one day, with age and time, we will reach there. On the question of the seriousness of the Government, I want to acknowledge and congratulate the Senate Deputy Minority Leader, Sen. Orengo, who is my friend and my senior, for he has severally used the word “government.” Contrary to the false stories out there, it is now clear to you that Sen. Orengo recognizes that there is a government in place. Mr. Speaker, Sir, for that great recognition and commitment to rule of law, without your prompting, I undertake that I will take the necessary action to demonstrate that there is a Government. I will make an interim statement tomorrow and I hope that we will have succeeded to bring down that injurious song by then. Meanwhile, the Chairperson can continue with the other duties of ensuring that the culprits are brought to book.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

What is your point of order, Sen. Orengo?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I want to go on record that what I was doing is in the manner of the parties. When you appear before a court and you have a junior, you must always repeat that, “I am here with my junior.” As he said in his address that he is my senior, but I chose my words very carefully. I said that “assuming that this Government is illegitimate.” Go back and look at those words carefully before--- The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Order, Sen. Orengo.

But if that makes you happy for you to come with an answer tomorrow, so be it.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

What is your point of order, Sen. Sakaja?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, in as much as we do appreciate the seniority of Sen. Orengo in all definitions of the term “seniority”, I do not know if you heard what he said. He said that the Chairperson of the Committee cannot summon an assistant secretary to get a response. Is it right for the Senator to belittle the ability of Sen. (Rev.) Waqo? Surely, is it fair? Is it that you did not hear or you ignored? He must apologise and withdraw. He cannot belittle the Chairperson of a Committee. That is disrespecting the authority of the Speaker and that of the House.

Order, Members!

Mr. Speaker, Sir, again, speaking very advisedly, no Member in this House can issue summons in his hands. It is only the Speaker or Clerk who can issue summons. Let her try to issues summons tomorrow and see if it can be delivered by the Clerk of the Senate. It will never be delivered because she does not have that authority. From a legal point of view, she is not in a position to summon anybody to appear before this House. That is the truth of the matter.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

What is your point of order, Sen. Wamatangi?

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. With tremendous respect to the Chair, this is a House of records. Everything that is said on the Floor of this House is recorded. Therefore, in the absence of that statement either being withdrawn or the Chair giving directions for clarification or substantiation, it becomes the House record. It is my concern that a lot of statements have been made from the other side, including the one made by the Senate Minority Leader when he was speaking about the previous issue. When these statements, which are misleading, are left that way, they become the record of the House. How are we going to correct them? Most of the claims made by the Senate Minority Leader are matters before court and in the public domain. That was followed by what has been said by Sen. Orengo. It is clear---

Order! Sen. Wamatangi is on a point of order. Allow him to make his point. Sen. Wamatangi, address yourself to your point of order?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, with tremendous respect to the Chair, I was seeking your guidance and indulgence regarding what happens when we have that kind of exchange and the offending Senator gets away with it and sits down? When that happens, that becomes the record of the House. This House must be a House that keeps records The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

What is your point of order, Sen. Pareno?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, is it in order for the Hon. Members to revisit a matter that had been discussed and concluded? This is happening long time after those Members who raised those issues had already sat down.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

What is your point of order, Sen. (Eng.) Maina?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise to put one thing clear. The song was sung by some two young men. Therefore, it should never be insinuated to mean that all Kikuyus are saying the same thing to the Kambas. That needs to come out clearly.

Order, Members! What is your point of order Sen. (Eng.) Maina?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, some statements made in this House can bring animosity between communities. Therefore, I want to make it clear that the song sung by the two young men should never be construed to mean all Kikuyus are saying the same things to Kambas.

Hon. Members, first, it is out of order to refer to a matter that has already been discussed and the Member has sat down. We cannot go back to that matter. We raise a point of order on a matter that is on the Floor of the House at that point in time.

What is your point of order?

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. First of all, I am sorry I called for a point of order when Sen. Wamatangi was on the on the Floor. What made me do that is that he did not call for a point of order; he just raised his hand as if he was in a classroom.

I do not know in what manner he was given the Floor. But, be that as it may, is Sen. Wamatangi in order to allege that I referred to a matter that is in court and could he tell this House the case number, the court where the matter is, the issue before the court, the parties to the issue and the level at which the case has reached?

Hon. Members, I had already ruled that he was out of order. So, we cannot continue discussing the same matter. Let us make progress.

Order, Members! The Senate Majority Leader has promised to give a statement tomorrow. The Chairperson will give a subsequent response in the next one week. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. The Statement is available, but it has not yet been signed by the Cabinet Secretary (CS). So, we are unwilling to give it in that state. We will wait for it to be signed by tomorrow or the day after.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Members! I am seeing so many interventions. The Senate Minority Leader, is this current statement yours?

Yes, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Okay. You have the Floor.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I sought for this statement more than two weeks ago. Mr. Miguna Miguna was bundled onto a plane and freighted out of this country on 6th February 2018. His passport which is the mark of his citizenship was mutilated and he is unable to come back to the country despite the fact that the court has said so. A citizen’s right to citizenship is the most fundamental right of all the fundamental rights apart from the right to life; that you belong to a country and a nation. How long would it take for the Majority side to bring a statement here to explain the circumstances under which Mr. Miguna Miguna was unlawfully arrested, his house vandalised---

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): The Senate Minority Leader, you are not asking for the statement now. You are just expressing displeasure that it is not here. So, let us be brief because you have spent a lot of time on the previous orders. Therefore, the Senate Minority Leader, hold it there. Please resume your seat. Who is the Chairperson? Sen. Sakaja, why do we not have the Statement?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, as you were taking the seat, I just explained to the House that we are informed. First of all, it is not the Majority side that brings statements. Statements are brought by the Government and the fact that this statement itself has not been signed, it is why we are unwilling to bring it to the Floor of the House. This is because somebody must own it. If we do not get it signed by tomorrow, we will just summon the CS and I would like to insist to Sen. Orengo that every committee has the power to summon witnesses. We will summon the CS to the Committee in which the Senate Minority Leader is a member. As of now, the statement is ready but not signed. Therefore, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I undertake to make sure that it is brought tomorrow or the day after in the absence of which we will summon the CS as a Committee. This will ensure that the matter is discussed--- The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Sen. Sakaja! It is your responsibility as the Chairman to bring the statement. How you get it or where you get whoever is supposed to bring it is not the business of this House. The business of this House---

Resume your seat Senator. The business of this House is to ensure that chairpersons of committees, as per the Standing Orders, issue or bring statements as and when required and as and when directed by the Chair from time to time. So, Sen. Wetangula would want to know when we are having the statement. Therefore, we need a definite answer. Just say when we can expect it and then we will hear from Sen. Wetangula.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, as I have said, the statement is available but it has not been signed. We have given a commitment that we will have it---

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Sen. Sakaja! When are we expecting the statement here in this House?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, as soon as it is signed. I cannot give a date.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Sen. Sakaja! This is your second term in Parliament; therefore, do not test the Chair beyond what you have already done.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I cannot give the date which I do not know.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): I direct that you issue the statement tomorrow.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Make sure you do not destroy the furniture.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Senators! Is that on statements?

We are not doing very well. Let us proceed to Statement (b). The Chairperson, Standing Committee on Lands, Environment and Natural Resources? The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I have not received any statement from the relevant Ministry. I was there yesterday and talked to the Principal Secretary (PS) but the statement was not ready as at that time. So, I am seeking for one week extension so that I can get the statement and bring it to this House. It is becoming a little bit difficult to get these statements because a chairperson has to go to the relevant Ministries and talk to the CS and the PS to get these statements. Something should be done so that CSs and PSs take it upon themselves to bring these statements to the secretariat instead of a chairperson having to walk to every office of a CS or a PS.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Sen. Mwangi! You are one of the more diplomatic Members of this House. If you have difficulties in getting a statement, you know the practice since you are a long standing parliamentarian. That is why we have the Senate Majority Leader. The work of the Senate Majority Leader is not to remind us from time to time that he is the Senate Majority Leader, but also to suffer the consequences of being the Senate Majority Leader. But, even for you as a Chairman, you cannot come and complain before this House how it is a difficult task to be a chairman yet you have not complained about the privileges of being a chairman.

What is it, Senate Majority Leader?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I am just seeking clarification from the Chair because I cannot challenge the orders of the Chair. Was there any doubt that I am the Senate Majority Leader?

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Senator!

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would like to seek the clarity of the matter. You have been in this situation. Is it right for a chairperson, like the Chairperson has talked, to be the one going to see a PS, CS and so on? It is indeed the responsibility of the CS. Once he gets communication from the Clerk’s Office through a letter which acts as an order of some sort, it is his or her duty to act. Even if it is not an order or summons, it is a duty on the part of the CS to act and if they are unable to act, the Committee can then summon them. This will enable us end this idea of Chairpersons and Vice-Chairpersons in this House having to follow a CS or people to places where they are working or operating from to get statements from them.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Senate Majority Leader, there are no doubts, at least, not on the question on who is the Senate Majority Leader. May be, elsewhere. Having said that, I concur with you in some respect that there is responsibility on the part of Government officials but there is also responsibility on the part of chairpersons of committees. They are the only people who can produce those Statements The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I rise to seek clarification. It would appear that the Chairpersons from the Government side are having some great difficulties in getting the results or replies from respective Ministries. I get the feeling that they are almost being humiliated in going to those offices to seek information. Is there a way that this House can bear upon the respective Ministries to respond expeditiously to the request of the Chairpersons of the respective Committees so that the information is available to this House to enable us transact business more expeditiously?

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Sen. (Prof.) Ongeri, what is out of order?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, it is not a point of order. I just sought clarification from the Senate Majority Leader to find out a method on how the work of the Chairpersons of the respective Committees can be made easier. With what I have heard today, it is as if the most attention they can get is that of the Permanent Secretary (PS) while the Cabinet Secretary (CS) is absent. Is there a way this House can facilitate the process of securing proper information from the respective Ministries?

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order Sen. (Prof.) Ongeri. The point is taken but that is a separate issue. When the matter arises, it will be dispensed with. With regard to this Statement, Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. is not here. Nevertheless, because we are already seized of the Statement, I direct that the Statement be produced to this House latest Tuesday, next week.

THE IMPLEMENTATION STATUS OF THE FISHERIES MANAGEMENT AND DEVELOPMENT ACT Sen. M. Kajwang is not here. Chairperson Standing Committee on Agriculture, Livestock and Fisheries, Sen. Njeru Ndwiga is the Statement ready?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the Statement is ready but I had discussed with Sen. M. Kajwang, my dear friend. I beg that we deliver the Statement next week.

May I beg leave of the House to make another Statement which I have ready but is not on the Order Paper?

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Senator. Make use of the Order Paper. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the problem is----

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Resume your seat, Sen. Ndwiga. So far so good!

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I want to answer.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order Senators. Next is Statement (d) to be issued by the Chairperson of the Committee on Finance and Budget, Sen. (Eng.) Mahamud. DELAY IN RELEASE OF FUNDS TO COUNTY GOVERNMENTS FOR THE FY 2017/2018

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, this question was asked on the Floor of the House on 15th February, 2018 and we promised to answer it in a week’s time. We wrote a letter to the Ministry on 20th February, 2018 and they were to bring an answer by 27th February, 2018. By that date, I managed to get some skeleton answer which is not signed up to now. We were supposed to meet with the officers from the national Treasury this morning but we were not able to. However, we have re-scheduled to meet tomorrow. I have an answer which I cannot read because it is not signed and so it is not official. Basically, this is a serious matter which touches on the counties. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I beg the indulgence of the House to allow me to answer this question on Thursday. I will surely answer by that time. Even if the answer is not signed, I will take it upon myself to answer it.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order Senator. You cannot do that.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I rise to protest in the strongest terms possible. The core responsibility of this Senate is to protect the interests of county governments that we represent. I want to urge the Chairperson to take a little bit more seriously matters raised in this House. I remember in the previous dispensation, Ministers used to give business of the House precedence. The use of words like the ‘answer has not been signed’ would never arise. You can ask Sen. (Prof.) Ongeri whom we were Ministers together. We were given clear instructions by the President that anything coming from Parliament must be given precedence. The Constitution also says so. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the Chairperson is behaving as if the questions I raised require rocket science to answer. This is a matter regarding all our counties. I raised very pertinent issues that are affecting all of us in the counties. This is in regard to disbursement of funds to our counties.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order Sen. Khaniri. Unfortunately, I have to interrupt you in the interest of time.

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I appreciate your ruling. It is not about me being patient; it is about the counties. Up to now, counties have not received any penny in terms of development funds for 2017/2018 Financial Year. How do we expect the counties to operate without resources? All they are getting is money for Recurrent Expenditure. It is not about me being patient; it is about how long we can keep these counties without resources.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): I hear you. Sen. (Eng.) Mahamud, you must endeavour----

Sen. (Eng.) Mahamud, please resume your seat. I am giving direction. Endeavour to have the Statement tomorrow, if for whatever reason the Statement is not ready tomorrow, it must, by all means, be issued on Thursday at 2.30 p.m. It is so ordered.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Statement “e”. Where is the Chairperson of the Committee on Energy, Roads and Transportation?

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. We have been waiting for the Statement from the Ministry. I have taken the liberty of talking to the person who demanded for this Statement – and I appreciate that it should be given – and we have agreed that it should be issued next Wednesday.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Sorry, Chairperson. When can we have the Statement? Is it ready?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I said I will give the Statement next Wednesday; and we have agreed with the person who sought it Statement.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Next week on Wednesday?

Yes.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Okay. Have your seat. What is it, Sen. Malala?

On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I am surprised at the manner in which Chairpersons are handling matters that are raised---

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): What is out of order?

I think that the Chairpersons are not performing their duties.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): So, do you want to discuss Chairpersons in a substantive motion or---

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, they are out of order. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): In particular---

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the Chairpersons are out of order to keep on procrastinating on pertinent issues raised on the Floor of this House.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Under what Standing Order are you rising?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, it is common knowledge that---

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Senator! Order! Resume your seat. Order, Senators! Hon. Senators, we have actually been on statements the entire afternoon and we are heading to 5.00 o’clock. We must find a way of being faithful to the time that has been entrusted to us. So, I will only allow two interventions very quickly; so make them brief. Proceed, Sen. Wetangula, very briefly.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I want to get direction from the Chair. You could hear every single Chairperson of the Committee telling this House that they have walked to the ministry, they have talked to the Cabinet Secretary (CS) and they have done this or that. Once a question is asked on this Floor, it becomes the property of this House and all other transactions thereto become administrative. After that, it is the Office of the Speaker and the Clerk to liaise with the relevant ministries and bring statements to the Chairpersons, who will then--- In fact, in the previous Committee on Finance, Commerce and Budget, the Chairperson used to bring answers to questions to the Committee for the Committee to own the answers and appreciate whether they are adequate or not. Is it in order for the Chairpersons to keep telling this House that they have walked to the Ministry and seen an unsigned statement? Is that the procedure and is that how it should be?

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Thank you, Senate Minority Leader. I will dispose of that issue immediately. First and foremost, the responsibility to produce statements to this House is not on the Speaker or the Clerk; it is on the Chairperson of the committee. As a matter of custom which we developed from last term, when the Chairperson experiences difficulties, they can revert to the aid, assistance and support of the Senate Majority Leader. However, I agree with the Senate Minority Leader that there is some administrative support that the offices of the Speaker and the Clerk should give the Chairpersons. Having listened to what has transpired in the last few minutes, I have not heard a single Chairperson saying that they have not been given support either by the Clerk, the Speaker or the Senate Majority Leader. So, let these matters lie where they are. But Chairpersons of Committees, get it directly from me. You cannot be enjoying the privileges of being called Chairpersons but when it comes to delivery, you are just lamenting, wailing and complaining. That is why you are Chairpersons; so, exercise your authority. If you encounter difficulties, the avenues are there, as I have already ruled; but The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

First of all, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, you heard a lot of applause coming from this side when you made a statement. That was on the basis that you were giving directions without saying “I am going to consult.” This is because you are exercising powers which are evident from the Standing Orders. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, can you just allow me to read the Standing Order in relation to the Committee Chairpersons. I think the Statement you have just made is very important. Standing Order No.46(2)(b) says: “A Senator may request for a statement from a Committee chairperson relating to matters under the mandate of the Committee and the Speaker may appoint a day for the Statement to be made or direct that that statement be made or direct that the statement be issued on the same day.” So, there is nothing about a ministry, a CS or whoever it is in Government. So, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, if we can stick to your directions, then the House can work more efficiently. However, if we go in the direction where we look like an appendage of the Executive, then doing business in this House will be extremely difficult.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Thank you, Sen. Orengo. In fact, that Standing Order does not even envisage the Senate Majority Leader but the Chairpersons of committees. That is where the buck stops. Chairpersons are very powerful people. So, you cannot come, wail and mourn. But we have adopted, as a custom for purposes of efficiency, if you are facing difficulties, then the Senate Majority Leader can always support you. However, the Standing Orders talk about the Chairpersons. That issue is closed. Sen. Wambua, you have heard what the Chairperson on Energy, Roads and Transportation has said. Could you give him up to Wednesday next week?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I appreciate what the Chairperson has said. I laud you for giving that general direction on response to questions. However, on behalf of the people of Kitui County, I plead with the Chairperson to give a specific direction on this matter. This coming Monday, 12th March, 2018, it is said that a new contractor will be taken to the ground. This is a different contractor from the one who was introduced to the people of Kitui County. There are pending issues; for example, the The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Chairperson of the Committee on Energy, Roads and Transportation, you have heard the representation of Sen. Wambua. Given what is likely to take place on Monday, would you want to say something before I give directions?

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I appreciate what Sen. Wambua has said. However, I want to be a realist. I am giving this undertaking and I will assure him. However, regarding the issue of the contractor being on site and when this work should start, I assure Sen. Wambua that whether the contractor moves some lorry there, I will ensure that nothing tangible will start happening before the Statement is issued. I will consult with the Cabinet Secretary and ensure that, that is the position.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Sen. (Eng.) Maina, please, resume your sit.

Order, Senator! You may resume your seat. Having listened to both sides, I direct that the Chair should go back to the Ministry and inform them of the new development that Sen. Wambua has brought to the attention of the House, with a view to see whether that Statement can be ready by Thursday. Therefore, I direct that you communicate progress administratively, through the Speaker’s office, tomorrow in the afternoon; whether we can have it on Thursday. If there are any difficulties, we will see how to make further directions. However, we need feedback tomorrow on the status of this Statement. You will do it administratively; you do not have to do it here on Plenary. It is so ordered. Order, Senators! The next Statement is by the Chairperson of the Committee on National Cohesion, Equal Opportunity and Regional Integration. ALLEGED ABUSE OF HUMAN RIGHTS OF PWDS

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I want to respond, but as I do so, it seems as if the hon. Members on the other side have somehow formed an opinion on the Chairpersons. I wish to make it clear that we are capable enough and cannot be intimidated.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Sen. (Rev.) Waqo. Do you have the Statement ready?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the Statement is not ready. I have had a word with---

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Senators! Let us be dignified. When can we have it?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, as I stood, I said that some hon. Members seem to be trying to intimidate us. We cannot---

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Sen. (Rev.) Waqo! When can we have this Statement?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, we did the letter and they acknowledged receipt. They have not yet given us the response. We are waiting for the response from the Ministry concerned. The hon. Senator who brought the request is aware of that. I request on behalf of the Committee that we be given one more week and we will give adequate response. Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Very well. Sen. (Dr.) Musuruve, is one week amenable with you? Please, be brief.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I will be very brief. I just want to comment that when it comes to issues of disability, they should be taken with a lot of seriousness because the voice they have here is very minimal compared to the rest. Allow me to say that I sought this Statement in the last Session. In fact, I sought about five statements on issues of disability. There was only one that was comprehensively issued by the Senate Majority Leader. However, the rest were not responded to. This Statement was for last session and there are also four more. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, you need to put it clearly in this House that issues of disability should be taken with a lot of seriousness, so that we address the core issues that are dragging Persons With Disability (PWDs) in this country. We want to move ahead with PWDs also even in terms of development and other issues. Thank you.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki: Thank you, Sen. (Dr.) Musuruve. Sen. (Rev.) Waqo, the Statement shall be issued Tuesday next week. It is so ordered.

We will do that, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I have heard Sen. (Dr.) Musuruve saying that the representation of the PWDs---

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Sen. Murkomen! Sen. (Dr.) Musuruve has finished her contribution.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, it has to go on record.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): You cannot raise a point of order concerning a matter discussed by a Senator who has already finished her contribution. Senate Majority Leader, you are a senior Member of this House. You will be violating the Standing Orders. The reason you and Sen. Wetangula enjoy all this space here is so that you help us maintain order in this House. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, we also enjoy this opportunity so that we can also help the House move forward. I think it is good if it goes on record. Maybe, I need direction from you; that it must go on record that the representation of PWDs here is not confined to the two Senators who have been nominated. In fact, the 47 Senators elected to this House represent all shades of Kenyans including PWDs. As we speak, one elected Senator and my former student, Sen. Cherargei, is disabled temporarily. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I want to make assurance to the public, through the Chair because you are one of the elected Senators, that the representation and defense of the issues of PWDs in this House is fully covered and we support Sen. (Dr.) Musuruve and others in the work they are doing.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Noted, the Senate Majority Leader. Are you saying, just like in sanity, that disability can be temporary? Is that your argument?

That is not true legally.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, that is not what I said. I said---

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Look at the PWDs Act on the definition of disability.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, one can be disabled, but you cannot define for how long. Even Sen. Cherargei---

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Put differently, can the Senator for Nandi County claim disability benefits under the law?

No, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. But he is disabled.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): The point which we have noted is that we are all agents, champions and representatives of disability issues. But the legal definitions will not qualify the Senator for Nandi County and others for the time being.

Order, Senators! Sen. Millicent Omanga, consult by sitting down and whispering to your colleagues and not by standing and chatting loudly. The next Statement is by the Chairperson of the Committee on Tourism, Trade and Industrialization. Sen. Kibiru, do you have the Statement?

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I stand to defend the Chairpersons of all Committees because I am ready to respond. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Do you have the Statement?

Yes, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): How long is it?

It is two pages long.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): All right, proceed. THE STATE OF TOURISM IN MALINDI, KILIFI COUNTY

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I rise under Standing Order 46 (2) (b) of the Senate Standing Orders to respond to a request for a Statement from the Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Tourism, Trade and Industrialization regarding the state of tourism in Kenya, especially in Kilifi and Malindi counties.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Senator! Sen. Gona is not in the House. Our custom here is to read the statement when the Senator who requested for it is in the House. Therefore, I direct that it be put on tomorrow’s Order Paper.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, but I---

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

The next statement is from the Chairperson, Senate Committee on National Security, Defence and Foreign Relations about bandits on Suiyani area Samburu North Constituency. Who is the Chairperson? Sen. Sakaja, do you have the statement? RAID BY ARMED BANDITS IN SUYIAN AREA IN SAMBURU NORTH CONSTITUENCY

Yes, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I have the statement, but the Senator for Samburu is not in the House.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): I direct that it be issued tomorrow.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. ( Statement deferred )

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): The next statement is again from the Chairperson, Senate Committee on National Security, Defence and Foreign Relations regarding peaceful demonstrations and picketing. Is the statement ready? The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the questioner is the Sen. Olekina. I am informed that he has discussed with the substantive Chairperson of the Senate Committee on National Security, Defense and Foreign Relations, Sen. Haji. He seems to want to shed some light.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I had consultations with the Chairperson of the Senate Committee on National Security, Defence and Foreign Relations, Sen. Haji. I have just been given the response and I will need time to interrogate it to know whether it is appropriate or not. We have agreed that he issues it tomorrow.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): It is so ordered. ( Statement deferred ) The last statement is by the same Senate Committee on National Security, Defence and Foreign Relations. SEVERE DROUGHT IN ISIOLO COUNTY

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, we were informed that this matter was referred to a different Committee. That is the information we have from our Clerk.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Sen. Dullo, is that the position?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, when this statement was raised on the Floor of the House last time, we realized the issues touched two committees. Going by practice, if a matter is crosscutting two Committees, they can come together and give an answer. Secondly, the matter I raised in that statement is a national disaster; one that sorely falls under the Ministry of Interior and Coordination of National Government. If now it is referred to the Ministry of Devolution and Planning, it clearly means it is being thrown away. It is important you give direction. Let the two Committees sit and give us an answer as quickly as possible because the situation is very bad in Isiolo County.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): This is a request for a statement directed at Government. The purpose of copying it to the Ministry of Devolution and Planning is simply to cause the statement to come to this House. Unless there are issues that have not been brought to our attention, Sen. Dullo, I see no reason for two Committees to look for the statement together from the Government. The issues are clear. If they are interdisciplinary, the Chairperson will ensure that the aspects that deal with maybe security, Ministry of Devolution and Planning will be forced to interact with the Ministry of Interior and Coordination of National Government. We will still have the statement whichever way because the source of the answer is not the Committees, but the Government. I see no reason for us to deploy the resources of two Committees to look for a statement from Government. It is noted that there are national security aspects. Therefore, The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the matter is serious and needs a response. This is because there was direction given from the Office of the Speaker as well as that of the Clerk. That is the direction we are relying on in terms of who it was referred to. However, we will be very much willing to deal with the matter as the direction was given.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Thank you, Sen. Sakaja. I see no reason to disturb those orders. Where is the Chairperson, Senate Committee on Devolved Government and Intergovernmental Relations? Proceed, Sen. Kinyua.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I have not been made aware about that but---

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Senator! Did you say you have not been made aware?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I am an honest Christian and---

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Senator! Did you say you have not been made aware?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I have said I am not aware. I have just heard about it now---

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): By whom? Please, resume your seat. You are the Chairperson, Senate Committee on Devolved Government and Intergovernmental Relations. Therefore, your business on every single day that the Senate sits is to find out if there are any matters that this House has committed to your Committee. In fact, by saying you have not been made aware, you are incriminating yourself. I would rather you tell the House when you can issue the statement.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I will issue the statement in seven days.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, when the Senator for Laikipia says seven days, it means it might go up to the end of Thursday, next week. I would request that the matter be fast-tracked to preferably early next week because the situation is very bad.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): I direct that the statement be issued on Wednesday, next week.

Hon. Senators, that is the end of Statements .

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Next order. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Senators! Debate on this Motion adjourned on Thursday and Sen. Pareno had a balance of time. Did you forget what you were talking about? Are you ready to exhaust your balance?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I only raised a point of clarification on that day, as to whether the report had been circulated to Members for proper contribution and guidance was given to that effect.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): The Floor is open. Is there no interest? Yes, Leader of minority.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the International Conference on the Great Lakes Region (ICGLR) was founded as an international conference of countries that border the Democratic Republic of Congo. The only countries that were given an exception to be members and do not have a common boundary with Congo are Kenya and Nigeria. Sudan has a boundary with Congo. Mr., Deputy Speaker, Sir, to begin with, I want to take issue with your office. When delegations are sent to such conferences, it is good practice that we send delegations representing both sides of the House. In this particular Conference held in Bangui, Central Africa Republic, and I have absolutely no difficulty with the distinguished Senators who attended including the distinguished Senator for West Pokot; Sen. Poghisio, and Sen. Milgo, both from Jubilee. Where is NASA in this?

Madam Temporary Speaker, this kind of perversion is creeping into our practice. Before I go into the substantive bit of the report; this weekend, I had to personally intervene by speaking to our Speaker, and I thank him for making the necessary corrections. A list of delegation of women going to New York was sent to the Cabinet Secretary for Public Service, Youth and Gender Affairs, Prof. Kobia, comprising Members of both sides of the House. This misguided Cabinet Secretary edited out Members of this side and removed them completely and then listed down Members from the Jubilee side as constituting the delegation. It is important that such misguided Cabinet Secretaries be told in very clear terms that they have got no business to try to divide this House. When we go out there, and my distinguished Sen. Poghisio bears witness to this--- The other day, we were out of this country with Sen. Murkomen, the Speaker and a few others, we represented the Senate and the country and we spoke as such. So, anybody who wants to divide this House should be told in very clear terms to decide it elsewhere. We would want to see at any time a representation of this House and this country to be bipartisan in composition and in conduct when our Members get out there. I record my thanks to the Speaker of this House for directing the Senate management to now sponsor two Senators from our side to go to New York to The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

There seems to be no more interest. Sorry! There is interest. Let us have Sen. Halake Abshiro.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I rise to support this Report and to congratulate the team that went for a good Report. Listening to Sen. Wetangula, I am very pleased that this Senate has global perspective because sometimes I get worried that maybe we have too many of our issues that we forget our regional leadership as a country. The fact that this country has made a lot of progress in peace, governance, politics and other areas of our social economy, I am glad that the Senator has alluded to a lot of the leadership that we as a country can provide to the region and the geopolitical space that we occupy. That is very important. With regards to the composition of teams, that is also a very important observation. This may have happened around the time when the House was not very well constituted. In terms of the women’s conferences, we had an equal number of women from both sides of the House. I am the Chair of Women Senators and we made sure that we had two women from both sides of the House. I am glad that that has been restated. We were surprised to find that that had changed but thanks to our Speaker because that has been rectified. With regards to regional participation, I think Kenyan delegations do a very fantastic job in the conferences. Our delegations from the National Assembly and the Senate usually have tremendous experience. Just a few days ago, we attended a conference which I think the Kenyan delegation did a wonderful job. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Very well. We were supposed to adjourn at 5.30 p.m. to discuss the Motion on insecurity in Mount Elgon. I realise that we still have two minutes. So, I will give the opportunity to Sen. Pareno Judith just briefly.

Thank you Madam Temporary Speaker, I will try to be very brief. I thank Sen. Poghisio and Sen. (Dr.) Milgo for representing us in the international conference. Sen. Poghisio gave us some information about the discussion that came up about Kenya. He said that there was a big discussion about Kenya regarding the 2017 Elections. I note that this is a body that is supposed to discuss peace in our countries, conflict resolutions and the democratic space as well as free and fair elections. I want to talk about elections. I was not surprised that Kenya was a big topic in the conference because we seem to have had a lot of things going wrong. Here we are as a country. Can we say that we had free and fair elections? The forum also discussed elections observations. Can we say that the observations that were made of Kenya showed that Kenya conducted free and fair elections?

Sen. Pareno, sorry to disrupt you. You will have another 13.22 minutes when we resume the debate.

Thank you Madam Temporary Speaker. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

I will now give the opportunity to the Senate Minority Leader to prosecute his Motion.

Thank you very much Madam Temporary Speaker for giving me the opportunity to raise a matter that is urgent and of national importance and definite as required under Standing Order No.34(1). I represent the County of Bungoma in the western part of our country. It is a county that shares a common boundary with Trans Nzoia, Kakamega, Busia and the international boundary with Uganda. Mount Elgon, being an integral part of Bungoma, a constituency and a sub-county with two districts administratively occupies the realm of Mount Elgon back to the tip of the mountain where we share a common boundary with Uganda. Seven or eight years ago, there were serious security challenges in Mount Elgon where a ragtag army called the Sabaot Land Defence Force (SDLF) emerged and committed serious atrocities against the people of Bungoma. They could visit your home and chop off the ears of your entire family and go with them. In other situations, they would visit a home and slice off your upper lip and go with it and leave you with a naked mouth. They would go to homes and kill the entire family. At that time, the National Security Council chaired by President Kibaki ordered the army into Mount Elgon. In an operation of about three and a half months, those characters were flushed out. There was a young man called Matakwei who was leading the SDLF. He was eventually caught up and terminated. I wish he was arrested and subjected to due process so that he could tell the county who his masters and paymasters were. At that time, I must acknowledge, there was cooperation and collaboration from Uganda, where those who fled there were also subjected to reprisals. Madam Temporary Speaker, we thought that that was over and there has been relative peace in Mt. Elgon. Even as we went to elections, because electoral cycles pose challenges, Mt. Elgon was reasonably peaceful. However, sometime in June last year, what looked like criminal activities started, where families were given warnings and attacked. People were killed and some robberies were committed. I remember an old man at Kapkateny Market who, in December last year after selling his maize crop, a group of young men went to his home, demanded to be given the money and thereafter exterminated his family. In a similar case, some young men visited the family and wiped out a man, his wife and all his children. When you look at this, the new skirmishes that are causing so much mayhem in Mt. Elgon are not connected to the Sabaot Land Defence Force (SLDF). This is because nobody has come up with any agenda to talk about land injustices or demanding land. These are just, in my view, criminals roaming from place to The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Yes, it is granted. You have five minutes, Sen. Wetangula.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. It is courteous to inform the elected leaders so that they can go to the area with you. Chances are – and it is always the case – that they know much more than you, sitting in Nairobi and pretending that you know more than the locals. I want things to be done differently. Secondly, Madam Temporary Speaker, I have noted in the media that a curfew has been declared in Mt. Elgon. The reports I am getting is that some of the people are now fleeing because they also know that whenever the military comes in, they also come with their own way of doing things. I have talked to some people who have fled to markets and they have said, “We fear that when the army comes in, they will engage in indiscriminate meting out of violence on the people.” I hope this does not happen. More importantly, if you look at Articles 132(4) and 58 of the Constitution, a dusk to dawn curfew is a state of emergency. Under the Constitution, it is only the President, under Article 132(4), who can declare a state of emergency under terms and conditions as set out in Article 58. This is invoked only when there is war or a serious threat to peace and security, and so on, and so forth. This kind of knee jerk reaction is an admission of surrender and failure. I do not think that we should allow ourselves, in this country and as a state, to impose a curfew because criminals are marauding and killing people in an area. This is an admission that our police are not able to handle the situation. It is an admission that the Administration Policemen (APs) cannot handle the situation. It is an admission that the much talked about nyumba kumi initiative is dead. It is an admission that the whole architecture of security in the area has broken down. I have spoken to leaders in Mt. Elgon and they know who these criminal young men are and where they are. They even tell the police where they are but, instead, the police tell them to take cover. So, CS Matiang’i may start by examining the conduct of his own police officers. The ones who have stayed in Mt. Elgon for all this time, aiding and abetting crime, should by now not only be transferred from the Mt. Elgon region, but be held culpable for neglect and dereliction of duty. This is because they are paid by taxpayers to protect people. Madam Temporary Speaker, even as I lauded the army going to Mt. Elgon and flushing out the SDLF, it is always not advisable to use the army in dealing with internal security challenges. This is because the army is for protecting the territorial integrity of the country and for fighting the likes of Al-Shabaab and others. We have been, as a government, boasting that we have met the United Nations Development Programme (UNDP) ratio of police to civilians. If this is really true, then why are a few young criminals terrorizing people in Mt. Elgon day and night? Why are we allowing a camp to be set up at Chepkurkur Primary School? Life in Kapkateny Ward and Chepyuk area is intolerable and this does not augur very well. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Hon. Senator, who is the Seconder of the Motion?

Madam Temporary Speaker, the Seconder of the Motion will be Sen. Poghisio of West Pokot County.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I stand to second this is a Motion on Adjournment that is very urgent and of national importance. One can only appeal to the people of Mt. Elgon, and Bungoma County as a whole, to stop destroying themselves by creating a situation where lawlessness prevails in the midst of poverty. Children cannot go to school and economic activity cannot happen, yet they consider themselves marginalized. I appeal for sanity to prevail. Those who think that they can live by causing this mayhem are not only causing problems to the families that they have destroyed, but also doing it to the very fabric of humanity. Just like the Mover of the Motion, I do not support the use of the Kenya Defence Force in situations like this, because it is the work of the Police and it is possible for them to do it. It is a matter of the Government putting its mind to it. It is possible for them to stop this because ordinary people can only do this by night. They can target specific people, but the Government has the capacity to move in with the requisite number of the police and stop it. There is no place for these people to go to because Mt. Elgon has a difficult terrain. It is an area that requires development, and that is why I keep on saying that it is unfortunate that the criminals are doing this to their own people. This is an area that requires a good communication system and roads to be constructed. Even the security forces who are sent to Mt. Elgon find it difficult to get there. This is an urgent matter and one of those things that we do not want to have in that part of the country. I must say that those people are hardworking. They should now be tilling their land and getting ready for the planting season. That will not happen unless the Government intervenes. While I support this Motion on Adjournment, I need to appeal to the Government of the day to take this matter up like they did last time. The Government should finish this matter for the people of Mt. Elgon to go about their business. The people who are causing this problem should be brought to book. I want to agree with the Senator for Bungoma County in this particular situation that this is not the time to look at is as a Mt. Elgon issue. It is the time to look at it as something that is affecting the development of The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Madam Temporary Speaker, first, I want to express my sincere condolences to the families that lost their beloved ones in Mt. Elgon. The insecurity in Mt. Elgon can simply be blamed on the laxity and the incompetence of the police service. In the recent past, we have seen the police service forgetting to perform its core mandate and concentrating on non-issues. I would like to remind the police service that its core mandate is to protect the citizenry of Kenya. Instead, the police service has decided to concentrate on issues like harassing boda boda operators, chang’aa brewers and mama mboga . I want to remember with a lot of pain, that in the recent past, the police service has concentrated on issues that do not help improve the security of our people. The police service has again gone to an extent of ignoring the content of the Constitution of Kenya, which provides under the Bill of Rights, that we have the right to life. Recently, we saw increasing cases of police brutality which have gone unattended to. I want to remind the nation that we lost baby Pendo and nobody has addressed her death. I also want to remind the nation that we lost an innocent student of Vihiga High School, who was innocently going to buy ice-cream, but was shot dead. The police have ignored investigations and nothing is going on. I want to remind this House that the police shot a seven year old boy who was on a balcony and nothing has been done. I also want to remind this House that last week, the police shot an innocent university student in Meru, who was peacefully demonstrating and nothing has been done. The insecurity that we are seeing in Mount Elgon can be blamed squarely on the laxity of the police there. The buck stops with the boss. The Cabinet Secretary (CS) for Interior and Coordination of National Government, Dr. Matiangi, has been issuing theatrical statements. He is only acting. He is not performing anything. He is a dramatist. He issues statements that do not impact on the welfare of these citizens. I will be moving a Motion to discuss the competence of the CS, Dr. Matiangi. Madam Temporary Speaker, just to conclude in my valedictory remarks, I will want proper legislation to be made to involve the county governments in ensuring that they protect their citizens. This is because by the time somebody in Vigilance House knows the problems of the people of Mount Elgon---

Order. Senator! Your time is up.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I was just concluding.

Your time is up. Please, let me notify the rest of the Members that there are a lot of interests on this matter. So, let us limit ourselves to five minutes each. Proceed, Sen. Madzayo. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Asante sana, Bi Spika wa Muda. Kwanza, ninatoa pole zangu nyingi kwa watu wa Mount Elgon, hususan watu wote wa Bungoma ambao wanaomboleza sasa hivi. Wataendelea kuomboleza kwa sababu tunaelewa ya kwamba hizi ghasia bado zinaendelea. Nampatia pole zangu ndugu na kiongozi wangu Seneta Wetangula. Macho yote yanamuangalia kama kiongozi katika Taifa la Kenya na kiongozi wa wachache katita Bunge la Seneti. Ni Mwenyezi Mungu ambaye hutupa maisha katika ulimwengu huu. Lakini kulingana na Katiba ya nchi hii, ni jukumu la Serikali kuhakikishia kila Mkenya usalama wa maisha yake. Hivi sasa tunaona ya kwamba Serikali haitekelezi wajibu wake ipasavyo. Ni jambo la kusikitisha kuona kwamba Waziri na Katibu katika Wizara ya Maswala ya Ndani na Taratibu za Serikali ya Kitaifa, Bw. Matiangi, alikuwa akiongea sana akiwa katika Wizara ya Elimu, Sayansi na Teknolojia. Wakati huu tunaona ni kama mdomo wake umefungwa; hasemi chochote. Ni kama haoni hii shida ambayo inakumba watu wa Mount Elgon. Hili si jambo la Mount Elgon pekee, bali nchi yetu hivi sasa imekumbwa na ghasia kila mahali. Kwa mfano, ukiangalia Kaunti ya Lamu, wanasema kuwa ni magaidi wa Al Shabaab ambao husababisha maafa. Kule Mount Elgon wanasema ni Saboat Land Defence Force (SLDP). Haya matukio yanafanya sisi kujiuliza maswali kadha: Je, Serikali hii iko na polisi na wanajeshi wa aina gani? Je, viongozi wake wanazembea kazini? Ni jukumu la Serikali kutetea maisha ya kila mwananchi anayeishi katika nchi hii. Kuna shida za kiusalama katika miji ya Lamu, Malindi, Kilifi na Kwale. Watu wengi wamepoteza maisha na mali yao kuharibiwa. Ni maombi yetu Serikali iamke na iweze kuchukua hatua mwafaka ya kuhakikisha maisha na mali ya raia wake inalindwa. Bi. Spika wa Muda, tunaona ya kwamba vijana ambao tunapeleka kwa mafunzo ya polisi na pesa zetu za ushuru hawawezi kuaminiwa. Siku hizi ukienda kutoa ushahidi na useme kuwa uliona kitendo fulani kikitendeka, basi ujue pia chuma chako kimotoni. Hii ni kwa sababu askari huyo umeenda kumripoti kwake ndiye anaweza kuwaambia majambazi kuwa uliripoti kushuhudia tukio fulani. Kwa hivyo, wajue kwamba mtu fulani ameshaenda kuwaripoti. Mwisho, ninasisitisha kuwa ni jukumu la Serikali kuona ya kwamba maisha ya kila Mkenya anayeishi humu nchini yamelindwa vilivyo. Asante sana, Bi Spika wa Muda.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I rise to support this Motion and give my views on it. As I begin, I want to send my condolences to the affected families. This area has suffered insecurity for many years. We can understand the dilemma the hon. Senator is in as he represents his people and also seeing the suffering of the people on the ground. I rise to give my views on this because I know what it means when there is a lot of insecurity in an area, especially when a family of seven is finished at once. It is something that all of us as Kenyans should be concerned with. When something like this happens, the women and the children suffer the most. On the issue of the rape cases that take place and also the expectant mothers and the young girls who are exposed to a lot of danger and risks, as responsible leaders, we The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I stand to condole with the affected families in Mt. Elgon as well as their representative, Sen. Wetangula, who is so concerned. At such times, it hurts to hear such things happening, more so as it concerns the security of our people. Since Kenya gained Independence, we have been training police officers who graduate from the police training institutions. Therefore, we do not expect to hear or see the kind of insecurity that the people of Mt. Elgon are facing right now. It is a high time that the Government wakes up. The relevant Ministry mandated with the security of the nation; the Ministry of Interior and Coordination of National Government, should wake up and protect the lives of Kenyans. As I stand here, my soul is disturbed. It hurts to lose one family member; what of the family that lost seven members? It is high time that the Ministry concerned looked into the matter and came up with a solution to protect the lives of the people of Kenya. Madam Temporary Speaker, recently as I was watching the television, I saw the President presiding over high volatile equipment that is provided to the Ministry of Interior and Coordination of National Government. The equipment was paraded in Kasarani Stadium. Such equipment is supposed to help police officers to protect our people. The vehicles are supposed to move police officers very fast to areas where insecurity incidents occur. I wonder whether the equipment that was paraded is just a show off or it is there to just waste our taxpayer’s money. We want to see the relevant Ministry working hard to protect the people of Mt. Elgon and the country at large. Our police officers always wait for such incidents to happen before they are awakened. They like being ambushed. They are not prepared to protect the population of Kenya. It is therefore a high time that the Cabinet Secretary and the Principal Secretary together with all the manpower that they have protect the people of Mt. Kenya and Kenya as a whole. Thank you.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I rise to join the Senate Minority Leader and my colleagues in sending my condolences as well as that of the people of Embu County, to the families that were affected in Mt. Elgon. Madam Temporary Speaker, this is a national issue; it is not something that we can gloss over casually. This is not the time to discuss the conduct of the police. In fact, it The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Hon. Members, I want to remind the House to address the Chair appropriately. It is good you noticed it.

Asante, Bi Spika wa Muda. Kwanza, ningependa kuchukua fursa hii kutuma rambirambi zangu pamoja na zile za watu wa Mombasa kwa watu wa Mlima Elgon na Bungoma, kwa mkasa huu wa mauaji ya kiholela ya watu thelathini, wakiwemo watoto, kina mama na wasichana ambao hawakuwa na hatia yoyote. Bi Spika wa Muda, ni jukumu la Serikali kulinda maisha na mali ya Wakenya au watu wowote walioko nchini Kenya. Hilo ni jukumu ambalo tungependa kulisisitiza kwa sababu tumeona kumekuwa na utepetevu kwa Serikali kuhusiana na usalama wa wananchi na mali yao. Juzi tumeona katika Kaunti ya Bungoma, kila usiku na kila uchao, watu wanauawa na polisi wanasema, “Tunachunguza.” Watu thelathini wamekufa na wao bado wanachunguza; watachunguza mpaka lini? Hivi majuzi, tuliona hapa jinsi walivyotumia rasilimali zote za polisi kuhakikisha kwamba Miguna Miguna The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I agree that this issue is very serious. On behalf of myself and the great people of Nandi County, I join hands and condole with the families that have lost their loved ones through our Senate Minority Leader. I agree that the issue of Mt. Elgon has become cancerous in terms of insecurity. It is very sad that after the Sabaot Land Defense Force (SLDF) militia was wiped out, we have issues of insecurity happening in Mt. Elgon, which is in Bungoma County. There are many underlying factors that trigger insecurity in that region. I have noted with concern that, majorly, there are land issues that affect many families, and the The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Sen. (Prof.) Ekal, proceed.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker, for giving me the chance to contribute to this Motion. The people of Mt. Elgon are losing their lives needlessly. There was no reason given as to why they are being killed. Some people have just decided to kill others. Sen. Wetangula, my heart goes out to your people and to you too for the loss of lives for no reason at all. While the situation in Mt. Elgon constituency is really bad and has prompted the Senate Minority Leader to speak out in the Senate, similar situations are happening all over the country. This is a common occurrence in many parts of the country. The other day, I was shocked to hear the President saying the country is safe. As I speak here, the country is not safe. There is a lot of insecurity in the former North Eastern, Rift valley, Coast and Western provinces, especially Mt. Elgon. The Government needs to do something about it. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

I think from the clock we have almost three minutes to adjournment. I will, therefore, call upon---

Madam Temporary Speaker, there is no reply to this Motion.

There is no reply. I will call upon Sen. (Dr.) Mbito, Trans Nzoia County.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I start by thanking the Senate Minority Leader for bringing this very important Motion on insecurity in Mt. Elgon. I represent the neighbouring county. I come from the community that is facing this insecurity. I thank the Cabinet Secretary (CS) for Internal Security and Coordination of National Government for coming in strongly and declaring a curfew and a security operation to weed out these criminal elements. This issue in Mt. Elgon, in as much as we talk about it as criminal, has an underlying issue. This is because it is something that keeps on recurring. The issue behind it is land. Successive governments have taken the issue of land and the settlement The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

May I use my discretion to add two more minutes and give Sen. (Dr.) Langat an opportunity to speak to this Motion.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I also join my colleagues to congratulate the Senate Minority Leader for bringing this very timely and important Motion to this House. I condole with the Members of the Mt. Elgon community for this very shameful and regrettable situation that there are facing. The position taken by the police in this country is still regrettable. They are always reactive to situations instead of putting in place what I would rather say proactive measures that can help to reduce or curb the problem beforehand. I observe that there is a lapse in the intelligence among the police. This is because the area has been volatile for a long time. Those are the areas that should be staffed with many intelligence officers who can detect the security problems in advance and advise the Regular Police or the General Service Unit in time on what they are supposed to do. I tend to think that there is a problem when it comes to the various agencies of security. We read from the media, the community is complaining that the police officers posted to the area are drunkards. It is a disciplinary area because police officers who have nothing to do or are indiciplined, corrupt and drunk are posted to such areas. As a way of punishing them, you send them to such a volatile area. The reports that the people from the locality were giving are very true that the police were helpless. There was a woman who was crying that if the police had arrived even 30 minutes earlier, her husband could not have been killed. I think that the deployment of police officers to those areas is still a great challenge. The Cabinet Secretary for Interior and coordination of national government should take that into consideration. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Hon. Senators, it is now time to adjourn the House. Therefore, the Senate stands adjourned until tomorrow, Wednesday, 7th March, 2018, at 2.30 p.m. The Senate rose at 6.35 p.m. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.