Hon. Senators, I would like to acknowledge the presence, in the public Gallery this afternoon, of a visiting delegation of students and teachers from Ngei PAG Primary School, Nairobi County. In our usual tradition of receiving and welcoming visitors to Parliament, I extend a warm welcome to them. On behalf of the Senate and my own behalf, I wish them a fruitful visit. I thank you

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for giving me this opportunity to also welcome our children, whom we love so much, to this particular important House in this country. Some of us did not get such an opportunity and we congratulate your school for exposing you so early to such an important place. You are welcome to the Senate and I encourage you to continue being disciplined in school. We are currently seeing most schools going up in fire and we discourage our children from misbehaving in schools. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I have learned today that we have very few programmes in the media which support the discipline of the children in schools. I think only the Kenya Broadcasting Corporation (KBC) has one programme on Saturday, and it is full of cartoons. We should encourage them to have more educative programmes which support building the culture of these young ones. I welcome them and congratulate them for coming to the Senate. Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker, Sir. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I also join you and my colleagues in welcoming the students from Ngei PAG Primary School to the Senate. I want to encourage them because currently, this country is experiencing a wave of unrest in schools, which is very unhealthy. I encourage the students who are visiting us today that irrespective of how situations and circumstances turn out, tomorrow is always a better day. They have a future to take care of; they should stand out from the crowd and be counted as some of the disciplined students at a time when we are experiencing this wave. I would also like to encourage them to take the time, as they visit the Senate, to learn and be inspired such that in the near future, we will have some of them joining the legislative arm of Government in this country both at the national and county levels. Mr. Speaker, Sir, with those few remarks, I welcome the students. Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I take this opportunity to welcome the young students, who are the future leaders. I challenge them to take an opportunity to see and observe what we are doing in this House. I also want to encourage them to aim higher. Mr. Speaker, Sir, as the Chairperson of the Committee on Education has said, we are currently experiencing a lot of challenges with the fear of the unknown. However, I would like to challenge these youth to think about education. Education becomes sweet when you are eager for knowledge and not for facts. Do not focus on facts as much, but go in and try to pursue knowledge. The only way that you can pursue knowledge is by ensuring that you remain in school. Please, take this opportunity to talk to your brothers who are currently engaged in the rowdy activities of burning schools and encourage them to think about tomorrow. We are here because somebody loved us, attended to us when we were in schools and cared for us. When you go back to school, you should remember that the reason we are working here is because we care for you and we want a bright future for you. Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Next order.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to lay the following Papers on the Table of the Senate today, Tuesday, 17th July 2018:- REPORT ON FINANCIAL STATEMENTS OF MERU COUNTY ASSEMBLY STAFF CAR LOAN/HOUSING FUND FOR FY 2016/2017 Report of the Auditor-General on the Financial Statements of the County Assembly of Meru Staff Car Loan and Housing Fund for the year ended 30th June, 2017. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to lay the following Paper on the Table of the Senate today, Tuesday, 17th July 2018: REPORT OF THE 62ND SESSION OF THE COMMISSION ON THE STATUS OF WOMEN Report of the 62nd Session of the Commission on the Status of Women.

Next order.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to give Notice of the following Motion:- THAT, this House notes the Report of the 62nd Session of the Commission on the Status of Women laid on the Table of the House on Tuesday, 17th July, 2018. Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for giving me the opportunity to issue a Statement of topical concern. Pursuant to Standing Order 46(2)(a), The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Next Order!

Leader of Majority.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to reply on this very important Bill. I want to thank all the Members, most of whose views I listened to with regard to this Bill. This is a very important Bill. Some of the views are very important and we must incorporate them in the discussion we will have with the Members, if we are to amend this Bill. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I must start by saying that hon. Members must appreciate the constitutional basis for the unbundling of this function called roads. It is our responsibility under the law to define what are county roads and what are national roads because these are shared functions. There are so many Members complaining regarding the classification provided here and asking what the problem is with tarmacking a road; you just mix the necessary ingredients and then you are able to make the road. It is just not about the ability of a specific county to do so. It is actually more about the possibility of roads crossing more than one county and the responsibility of the national Government to ensure that equity and equality is achieved in the country. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Sen. Halake, what is your point of intervention?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, is the Senate Majority Leader in order to use his time for replying to a Bill to go into politics that he should not be engaging in by the virtue of his leadership position? What does lifestyle audit have to do with some of the things he is supposed to be replying to? Of course, we all support lifestyle audit, but using his opportunity and time for replying to a Bill to go into politics is not in order.

Yes, the Senate Majority Leader.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, could the Senator, before she asks whether I am out of order, declare whether she has any connection with the person I referred to, who was then a cowboy contractor and is desirous of a lifestyle audit? Why is she raising a hand? I just provided a set of facts. Sen. Abshiro is interestingly giving us a pointer to whom I was referring to. Be that as it may, let me just make this very important point. I was cut short, but I was talking about construction of these roads and the contractors. I want to proceed from there, if I can be allowed to proceed peacefully, unless Sen. Abshiro wants to declare that she has some connection to the person I was talking about.

Yes, Sen. Halake.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. The Senate Majority Leader is misusing his powers and the time he has to reply to the Bill by engaging in politics of maligning others. I think it would be in order for him to keep to the subject matter of replying to the Bill.

What is your point of order, Sen. Wetangula?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I do not want to wade into this intra-Jubilee conflicts. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

We will let the Senate Majority Leader to continue. Having come from the World Cup in Russia may be your biggest challenge here, but you can proceed with your submission.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I do not want you to fall into the trap of the Senator. I was the one who moved this Bill. So, to try to purport that---

I was saying that you may be having that problem because you have just come from Russia. It is not that you do not know the content of the Bill.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am the one who moved the Bill. So, for the record, this is my Bill and I know what I am talking about and what Members raised. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I was at the level of discussing the cowboy contractors. Why am I being gagged from naming cowboy contractors? Why is someone going on defence? Why is Sen. Abshiro going on defence and yet, I have not mentioned any name?

Proceed, the Senate Majority Leader.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I was coming to the question of foreigners and their control in the roads sector. As a response to these cowboy contractors; the people who messed up our roads--- They formed small briefcase companies and allocated money to those companies. As a result, Kenyans started trusting foreigners. These foreigners do the roads within a very short time and in most cases, Kenyans appreciate that the quality of those roads is up to standard. However, there is something that is now happening. Why are we training our young people to study Engineering? Why are we encouraging Kenyans to create employment? Why are we pushing for investments to be achieved in this country? How is it that a foreign contractor is paid on time, but a local contractor, who even works so hard on 5 or 10 kilometres road, is not paid on time? We must agree, as a country, that the time has come for us to have this conversation with a view of supporting the local economy and content and also setting the standard for the same people who will construct those roads to meet the required standards. I know of a local contractor in my county who did a road from 2010 and finished it last year. You cannot use seven years to do 12 kilometres of a road. Therefore, we must balance. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Okay. It is granted as requested. I will give another date when the voting can take place.

Next Order!

I do not see any more interest. So, I will ask ---

Sen. Outa, proceed.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I rise to support this amendment Bill which will give guidance on individuals who are meant to benefit from it. This will cure a number of things. I remember some years back, Kenya was struggling whether to pay the former Prime Minister, Raila Amolo Odinga, his benefits as a citizen who had served this country. It was the same for the former Deputy President, Kalonzo Musyoka. If this law is amended, it will take powers from the Executive. These are powers which the Executive might use for their own benefit, for example, to intimidate the people they perceive would compete with them. This is the entitlement for the offices that are created, whether in the Executive as the President or the Deputy President; the Speaker of the Senate or of the National Assembly. If we do not give any guidelines or regulations, that is where the Executive will find a way to mistreat such individuals who are entitled to the benefits. With those few remarks, Mr. Speaker, sir, I beg to support this Bill.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I stand to support the Bill. However, I would like to propose that we expand the scope to cover all public officers because I know that is the spirit with which Sen. Olekina has moved this Bill. He wants to bring certain standards, procedures and minimum legislative framework to ensure that people The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for giving me this chance. I rise to support this Bill based on the foundations that I have learnt of late while serving as a commissioner of the Parliamentary Service Commission. I have had the opportunity to understand the challenges that leaders go through as they serve in office and the fact that a very small group of people actually understand the burden placed on people who serve in high offices, in whichever capacity and positions. Therefore, for us to be legislating today and putting into consideration the benefits and entitlements for Members who served in offices as high as that of the Deputy President, is extremely important. This is because many people do not get the chance to occupy these offices and may not know the burdens placed upon these individuals who have had the opportunity to serve as Deputy or Vice President in this country. Nobody understands the burden and the weight of the decisions they make, whenever they are in office. Yet, when they leave office, thanks to political whims and other considerations, many times nobody remembers the sacrifices they made and the challenges they went through. Therefore, Mr. Speaker, Sir, it is important that we ring-fence it by an Act of Parliament, that having served in such and such a position, it is important that you get a specified entitlement. Similarly, if there is need to either reduce or increase these entitlements, this Bill proposes the setting up of this Committee which, in my opinion, is fairly balanced and has a good representation. You may remember the times we had a few months ago, during the debate about the entitlements of the NASA Coalition leaders. If this Committee existed then, away from the political noise that would have been witnessed outside there, the team would have considered the requests being made by the former occupants of these offices and they would have given their thoughts to it. Subsequently, I believe that they would have received their entitlements without undue delay or anyone being told that they must speak or do certain things for them to enjoy those benefits. Mr. Speaker, Sir, the reason I speak like this is because when I was still new, as Member of Parliament (MP), one of the things that I used to struggle with is to battle public opinion and try to always get favorable comments from the members of the public whenever I did anything. That is the burden of leadership. Little did I know that with time, I would come to realise that Parliaments world over are not popular with the populace. Westminster is not popular; Lok Sabha is not popular with its population in India and neither is the Kenyan Parliament. You will always see a hue and cry in the newspapers when there is a small entitlement or when something has been passed for MPs. You would think that the people who deserve the least amount of entitlement in this Country are MPs, yet I do not know a job – at least, I have not done any in my lifetime – that is as difficult as being an MP. In fact, many people wrongly believe and imagine that people come to Parliament to make money. I am interested to know where that money is. If you do the sum total of what people earn vis a vis what they spend to remain in Parliament, you realize that it is like a cocaine racket chase. People are hooked on it but they do not understand why. Many have the burden of leadership and feel the need to serve their constituents or do something better because leadership is a calling. Therefore, The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir for allowing me to contribute to this Bill. I support it because it is not easy for someone to be a head of an institution, for example, like you, the President or the deputy President. People in these positions need a decent retirement package. It is because of this that I support this Bill. However, I have a small amendment to it because we have a youthful population in Kenya. I would like to use you as an example because I would not like to discuss people who are not here. If a 25 year old person takes over your position, after five years, he or she will be 30 years old. If they retire at that point and assuming that they live for 90 years on average, they will enjoy that position for 60 years. I have done my calculations in terms of the car entitlement and if we replace their car after every four years, that will total to 15 four wheel drive which I estimate to cost Kshs10 million which totals to Kshs30 million for one person. They are also entitled to a saloon car of 2000 cc which I estimate to cost Kshs2 million, which translates to Kshs6 million which gives a figure of Kshs36 million. As I said before, Kenya has a youthful population. If ten former Speakers retire and they all enjoy this benefit and if we extend the life of the car by just one more year, Kenyan taxpayers will save Kshs360 million. I have never bought a new car. However, all my imported cars from Japan were around eight years old and they served me for five years without major problems. So, if a car is new, it can serve somebody for five years. For example, if we increase the number of years for cars for ten retired speakers from four to five, taxpayers would save Kshs360 million. This is enough money to do a mega dam in Wajir where I come, where our animals are finished by drought every year. This is an amendment that I would like to make. I have gone through the rest of the Bill and I am happy with the fact that people will retire to a decent income and that when they are in office serving Kenyans, they will The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Hon. Members. I do not see any more requests. Proceed, Sen. (Prof.) Ongeri.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I also want to add my voice to this Retirement Benefits (Deputy President and Designated State Officers) (Amendment) Bill. The political job is a thankless job. Many times people in these offices sacrifice too much because there is need for them to do the job that has been assigned to them during their time in office and they normally empty everything including family savings. This happens when the public does not require them in office, when voting patterns do not favour them or when their term comes to an end because of a constitutional dispensation. In either case, we need to treat our retired Presidents, Deputy Presidents and the constitutional office holders that are entitled to these retirement benefits well. I was impressed over the weekend to see the former President of United States of America (USA) enjoying the trappings of power even after he has left office. Nothing was removed from him including the Secret Service preventing our own governor from attending a function within his county. That is what I call recognition. For us, that recognition is lacking. If it means that we embed this in the law, so be it because it is important. I remember when I served in Parliament and later, I left. When I went to check my retirement benefits I could not believe the pay slip. It was just peanuts. I looked at it and said is this all I am worth after all these years of service? That is when I realized that people who retire without clear benefits are really in trouble. I have seen many other officers particularly those who were in the Office of the Vice President and have nothing to their record. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I have also noticed that we should not make this retirements benefits at the whims of anybody who may be in power at that time. Let it be a clearly legislative decision that when a person retires, regardless of what they want to do, they are not disenfranchised from enjoying the benefits of their retirement. It is so important. Since it also touches on the Office of the Speaker, I have no shame to say that eventually, when you will not be voted back to office, you should enjoy reasonable perks to maintain the dignity of a former Speaker. By the time you reach that level, there would have been a unanimous decision by the Senators who are in this House. To find you on the streets walking around, looking for little help here and there, would be a shame on us; that we have not taken care of the retirement benefits of our top echelons, who have served this nation with distinction. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I fully support this Bill. However, once it becomes an Act of Parliament, let us not tamper with the provisions of this Bill. That is where the problem starts. Depending on whether or not somebody likes you, they would then dictate when you should get that retirement. We will put conditions that if you do A, B, C and D, then you are entitled to this retirement. That is the area we want to get rid of, so that it is a The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for allowing me to add my voice to this important Bill. I also want to thank my brother, Sen. Olekina, for thinking about others who have given their time and sacrificed all their lives for this nation. When we look at our nation and see the people who have served us faithfully, most of the time you sympathize with them. Sometimes, we talk about those who have served before us, who are now old and keep coming to Parliament to have lunch or tea with other Members, because they have nothing to hold on to. They have nothing much to keep them busy and give them hope. I support this Bill because it will take care of all the beneficiaries and also give them some comfort. My concern goes beyond the individuals; I think of the family members. When people retire, sometimes they become so hopeless and so do their family members. Some retire when they have young children and wives, especially when men marry as many women as they want. The number of people who suffer is huge and we need to think about them. However, proper planning is needed and a budget has to be done. Again, many people who have retired get frustrated when following up their benefits. They keep moving from one place to the other. However, given that the offices we are talking about are quite high, I believe they will not be frustrated. I support this Bill because I do not want the people who have served this nation and given their best, to go out and suffer from diabetes or stress or other chronic illnesses because of not meeting their needs. As Senators and people serving this nation in this House, it is our role to take care of all the others who have served this nation generously. I beg to support.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I would like to thank Sen. Olekina for coming up with this amendment. The principal Act is clear, but the The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I start by thanking all the Senators who supported and made their contributions to this Bill. I am much honored that you took your time to read the Bill and understand the importance of our benefits. I start by thanking Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr., for having taken time to second this Bill and try to remind us that today we are here, and tomorrow we could be on the other side. It is always important for you to look at life, as today you are winning and tomorrow you could lose. Your personal welfare is very important, more so, of a person who has given five or ten years of their life to serve this nation diligently; waking up very early in the morning and sometimes not even sleeping at all because of the interest of this nation. I also thank Sen. Mwaura for his contribution on this Bill. I am happy that he was able to illustrate clearly how desperate one becomes when he leaves and has to depend on another person for their benefits to be granted. Sen. Mwaura spoke a lot about the youth. By the end of his second term, he will not even be 45 years old to access his benefits. That tells you that this issue of your personal welfare or well-being when you are serving this nation is something that must always be considered. In the event that one wants to alter your benefits, they have to go back and think about the time that you served this country without asking any question. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Sen. Olekina. Your request is granted.

Next Order.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I beg to move that the County Statistics Bill (Senate Bills No. 9 of 2018) be now read a Second Time. Mr. Speaker, Sir, this Bill seeks to establish a statistical system that will assist county governments in planning for the development of counties and to measure the gains made by the county governments in improving the lives of their counties. Currently, matters relating to statistics are governed by the Statistics Act (Cap.112), which was enacted prior to the establishment of county governments. Therefore, the Act does not recognize the role of county governments in matters of statistics. Mr. Speaker, Sir, as you are aware, under the Fourth Schedule of the Constitution, statistics is a concurrent function between the two levels of governments. Under Part 1(11) of the Fourth Schedule, national statistics and data on population, the economy and society is generally a National Government function. On the other hand, Part 2(8) of the Fourth Schedule states that county planning and development, including statistics, is a devolved function. Therefore, there is need to have a legal framework that will clearly delineate the functions of both levels of government on matters statistics. The Bill, therefore, seeks to provide a legal framework for counties to collect, collate and analyze data that is specific to a particular county in order to enhance planning and decision making processes within counties according to their needs.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the need for this Bill cannot be gainsaid because statistics are an indispensable component of planning for any government. Without timely and accurate statistical data, the Government cannot match its resources to its The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Sen. Farhiya. You are aware of Standing Order No. 84 (1) that says that you should not read speeches and statements. I have overlooked that, given the technical nature of this Bill on statistics. However, going forward, you are supposed to summarise your moving notes and make occasional reference to them. Given the technical nature of this Bill, I have exercised my discretion under Standing Order 84(2) to allow you to read word for word.

I thank you Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I am most obliged.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Let us have Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. I hope you will not rely on the technical nature of the Bill to also read the seconding speech.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, you know me better than that.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): I do not. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, you remind me of Saint Peter in the Bible who denied his---.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): What about him?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the cock is about to crow on the third denial, but it is okay. You have only done it once.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Hold on, Senator. Are you implying that you are Jesus?

No, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I am using that analogy of denying somebody. You know I will not read. I beg to second The County Statistics Bill (Senate Bills No. 9 of 2018). This is one of those Bills that we passed in the last Senate but it never saw the light of day. Perhaps, we did not do justice to it. I hope in the new spirit of the “handshake”, it will see the light of day and that Members of the National Assembly will see reason. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the Constitution gives counties the work of dealing with their statistics. That is also a matter that is done at the national level. There is one organisation that has monopolised statistics in Kenya that is called the KNBS. In the advent of the Kenya Constitution, 2010, it has become important to have correct statistics. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I have a book and I will read it for you and state why my colleagues should have a book of this nature. It is called Exploring Kenya'sInequality : Pulling Apart or Pooling Together. This was done by KNBS and the Danish International Development Agency (DANIDA). Let me just read some of the statistics. Access to education: major urban areas in Kenya have high education levels of education but large disparities. Mombasa, Nairobi and Kisumu have gaps between the highest and the lowest wards of between nearly 50 per cent of residents with secondary education. In most rural counties; that is, Baringo, Siaya, Pokot, Narok and Tharaka-Nithi, education levels are lower but the gap, which is still large is somewhat lower than espoused in the urban areas. The statistics are everywhere. On improved sanitation, Kajiado County has the highest gap between the ones with access to improved sanitation. On improved sources of water in all the 47 counties, the highest gap in access between the county with the best improved water sources and the least is over 45 percentage points. The most severe gaps are in Mandera, Garissa, Marsabit and Kilifi counties with over 99 percentage points and Wajir with over 97 percentage points. That speaks to the Mover. There is also lighting. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, for my county, I am aware that in Mbooni Constituency, we have the highest number of children between zero to five years born in the whole of Makueni County. Why is this important? It is because early childhood development education (ECDE) is now a devolved function. For purposes of the ECDE and planning for that category of children, the Makueni county government cannot treat the The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. This is the fifth time you are referring to the Chair as ‘Madam Speaker.’

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I apologise and withdraw. The tax per capita would help this country determine whether we should reward Nairobi County for collecting revenue or Tana River County who do not have revenue to collect. Instead of punishing Tana River County for not meeting its revenue targets, the tax per capita will determine whether, in fact, the counties that are making more in terms of taxes should not receive that incentive. That is the purpose of this Bill and the statistics that will be collected. Therefore, in future, when we ask the Intergovernmental Relations Technical Committee (IGTRC), led by Prof. Karega Mutahi, on the costing of functions, that costing will relate to human beings as opposed to size. Why is the size of Turkana County important for purposes of services as opposed to the population? The same question applies to Nairobi County, which is smaller in size than Turkana but has a large population. Therefore, the resources that we are giving to these counties, just as I have mentioned about tax per capita, should relate to the individuals. Zone Nairobi into seven, eight or nine categories and establish which parts occupy the largest population, what the needs of the people are and whether they are relative to those of the people living in the leafy suburbs of Nairobi, like where Sen. Abshiro lives. What disparities do they have? Such statistics are not available for planning. Spatial planning, municipalities, collecting of rates and entertainment taxes would help if counties can collect this information and forward it to the Kenya National Bureau of Statistics in Nairobi and it becomes the statistics of Kenya. I envision a situation in future where the census and collecting of data on population will be done by counties as opposed to the national Government. These The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr.! Your responsibility as a Seconder of a Bill does not include going on a greeting spree in the Chamber like someone who is in a livestock sale yard. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I stand to support the County Statistics Bill (Senate Bills No.9 of 2018) for specific reasons. Statistics in any language is the main artery of the information that you need to extract; on the information that you want to use for work, conclusions or for posterity. This Bill deals with the framework that will enable the county governments to collect statistics. They should not only collect statistics, but also collect quality statistics. If you do not have quality statistics, it will be very difficult to make any sense out of the statistics so collected. When you look at those statistics and compile them, you will be in a position to analysis and make sense out of them. They have a language that you derive out of these statistics. Once you get that language, you will be able to decipher it from the statistics. You can disseminate them for use within the county and the contiguous counties so that, together, they are able to help you in planning and in many other areas. Medicine is an area that I am very conversant with. For example, one of the areas that we put a lot of importance in public health is the data and the information. We collect a lot of statistics on disease epidemiology. In other words, you can use statistics if you want to know how tsetse fly plagues or fools around with the populations whether in Lambwe Valley or other places. The same applies if you want to know the density of the tsetse fly or mosquito concentration in any given area and the number of bites that you are able to get from that individual either from mosquito or the tsetse fly. That will then give you the amount of the poison that they are able to transmit into a human being. Therefore, those statistics will then help us to know the burden of disease in any given locality. Statistics become a very important avenue on which we can translate information to the public and bring public good to rein in on those who are not doing their jobs. I have just given you a purview on one side where you are able to collect these statistics and get information from them. Today, that is why we can stand up and say that the birth rate in this country is so much per thousand as well as the death rate in the infant mortality between the ages of zero and five. Without statistics, we cannot plan for health activities in the nation. I am in the Sessional Committee on County Public Accounts and Investment. One of the things that we have noted is lack of understanding by some of the county officers on how to deal with money that has been allocated to their counties for use for various activities within the county. The reason is that they think that when that money arrives in the county, they take and distribute it as if it was just a family gathering where you hand out some gifts to people. This is public money; therefore, you need to use it judiciously and very carefully. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Thank you, Sen. (Prof.) Ongeri. The remarks are not few, but thank you very much. Proceed, Sen. (Eng.) Mahamud. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you very much, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, for giving me the chance to contribute to this important Bill. First of all, I thank the Member – who is a Member of my Committee – for bringing this important Bill.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Which is your Committee, Senator?

The Committee on Finance and Budget.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): You are assuming that the Chair and everybody else is conversant with that information.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, our Committee had the opportunity to navigate this Bill. In fact, we had a lot of discussions on it and we engaged in public participation. In fact, this Bill has been really worked on and I thank my Committee, including the Member, for a job well done. This is a very important Bill. Hitherto, we have had the Kenya National Bureau of Statistics Act, which deals with statistics in this country. After the promulgation of the Constitution of Kenya 2010, we have not changed anything and the same old National Statistics Act is still in place, yet when you come to counties, they are supposed to do planning. In fact, we know that statistics is an indispensable component of any good governance because it requires planning to be done as a statistical function. We know counties are supposed to make the CIDPs and other special plans. Without any framework for statistics, it is very difficult to do this. Up to now, they depend on the statistics provided by the national Government from the Kenya National Bureau of Statistics (KNBS). This Bill is very timely. There is a very big connection between statistics and good governance and we cannot overlook that. Statistics is also a function of the county government because they are dealing with planning matters. They should undertake that function properly. This Bill is giving a framework within which counties can undertake that function, hence it is very timely. The Bill seeks to establish a system in the county governments which is not in isolation but works in coordination with the national statistics office so that we have some harmony. Statistics is everything in this country or everywhere. If the Integrated Financial Management and Information System (IFMIS) is done wrongly, it can distort things. For that reason, it is important that we have coordination mechanism between the county statistics office and the national Government office. This is why, under Part II, the Bill establishes the County Statistics Office whose functions are well documented. Further, the Bill, under Part III, establishes the National Consultative Committee on Statistics. The functions of the County Statistics Office -which is going to be led by the County Executive Committee in charge of County Statistics with the Committee and with the full secretariat---. Their functions are as listed, which is to collect information and do all that is required to be sure you have enough information for you to plan. When it comes to the National Consultative Committee on Statistics, we have persons from the national statistics office and the county’s office who look at that so that we have proper harmonization. The first function is to develop strategies which shall ensure uniform standards, policies and methodologies amongst the various offices of county Statisticians. As a result, we do not have confusion, the standards are maintained and the data collected is accurate so that it is not misused. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, statistics information is very important because the national and county governments shall consult and cooperate in the performance of their The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Thank you, Sen. (Eng.) Mahamud.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, thank you for giving me this opportunity to add a voice to this important Bill. It is very important to have the County Statistical Board. Because of the devolved function of the County governments, it is important for the board to be constituted to ensure implementation of what the Constitution says. It is very clear that power belongs to the people of this nation. In a devolved system, it is possible for the counties to effectively serve the people in their county if they know the exact number of people they have. The statistics would inform the number of people in a county. The statistics can be a roadmap for governors to know how many people are in the county, their needs, and requirements and how they can be served effectively. As we talk of the county statistics, the census should be done periodically because children are born every day and people also die daily. It is not possible for a county to say that these are the number of people in this county. It is something that needs to be done often like after every two or three years although it is a very expensive venture. Even if it is expensive, it is worth the expense because it will help governors to know the number of people in the counties and how best they can serve them. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Do you support or oppose?

I strongly support this particular Bill.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): The strength is of no consequence. What is of consequence is whether you support or oppose.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I support.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Unqualified. Issues like velocity or volume of support are not anticipated in the Standing Orders. Proceed, Sen. Halake.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for giving me---

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Senator. Resume your seat for a minute.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Hon. Senators, I have a Communication to make. I would like to acknowledge the presence, in the Public Gallery this afternoon, of visiting students and teachers from Tambach High school, Elgeyo-Marakwet County. In our usual tradition of receiving and welcoming visitors to Parliament, I extend a warm welcome to them. On behalf of the Senate, and on my own behalf, I wish them a fruitful visit. Thank you.

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Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for giving me the opportunity to support this Bill. The objects of this Bill are clear. Statistics as evidence base for socio- economic development cannot be overstated. For that reason I support this Bill. The more reason I support this Bill is the fact that it gives effect to the mandate of this House which, as stated under Article 96 of the Constitution, is to protect and entrench devolution. Article 174(d) states that one of the objects of devolution of governments is to recognise the right of communities to manage their own affairs and to further their development. Therefore, the County Statistics Bill (Senate Bills No.9 of 2018) provides evidence upon which communities will manage their own affairs because it will be about evidence based policy making at the county level. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the importance of statistics for evidence based policy making cannot be overstated. Counties need these kinds of statistics to ensure that they are not blindly making policies and that their policies are evidence based. In terms of the role of statistics in planning progress, monitoring and evaluation of development activities, again, this gives effect to our mandate as people who oversight and are stewards of counties and their governments. This House can base its developmental oversight with regard to the basic baseline statistics will form and the mid-term evaluation of our oversight. So, this Bill will give this House a lot of information and tools on which we will base our oversight and evaluate progress of our counties and the nation. The role of statistics in monitoring, developing and maintaining a reliable set of information cannot be overstated. More importantly, what I like about this Bill is the fact that it pushes information and data to the frontlines of decision making which, in this case, are our counties. This is where the counties will have information on which they can make decisions based on information and statistics on where to allocate resources. We have seen in the past that a lot of resources are allocated. However, when you ask for the evidence base that informs the resource allocation, usually it is because somebody up there, it could be the governor or the President---It may be whispered: “It is from above.” Therefore, I like this Bill because it eliminates these whispers around “it is going to be done because it has been said from above” to evidence based because of the gaps and the needs have been identified through scientific methodologies of statistical evidence and data. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, we live in difficult times where our country is plagued by corruption and has below optimal governments. Therefore, this is a good starting point for us to clean house and stop straining the counties for which we are responsible, towards evidence based decision making, policy making, progress evaluation and monitoring towards desired goals and identifying needs as opposed to who you know, which tribe you come from and, therefore, your road or constituency shall get development. This Bill, as I have said before, will bring an evidence base for decision making, having noted previously that the number one driver of corrupt practices is not The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. For the record, I rise in support of the County Statistic Bill (Senate Bills No.9 of 20180. I begin by giving my hearty congratulations to the Mover, Sen. Farhiya. Statistics is everything. We all know that there is a lot of confusion in our counties in terms of allocation of money for development. It is not possible to have a scientific approach to the utilization of resources that we send to the counties if county governments do not have good statistics. I, therefore, have no doubt that if we enact this Bill, we will have given full meaning to Article 96 of the Constitution that requires us, as Senators, to protect the interests of our counties. First, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, what I like about this Bill is the fact that we are now going to have data collected, analysed and ready for dissemination. We all know the critical role played by our chiefs, assistant chiefs and village elders in our counties. However, most of these officers do not have statistics that can assist them to disseminate information that is factual to our people in our counties. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I want to do away with this myth by Members of the National Assembly, including our Women Representatives, that county governments are separate in terms of development from Members of the National Assembly or the Women Representatives. In fact Article 6 of the Constitution, which talks about devolution and access to services, is very clear that the national Government and the county governments are distinct but interdependent. It further states that they shall conduct their mutual relations on the basis of consultation and cooperation. I am saying this because in terms of allocation of development money in our counties and constituencies, there is a lot of duplication. This is happening because we do not have statistics at the local levels – in the counties, constituencies and sub counties – that can assist the governors, Members of Parliament (MPs) and Women Representatives to bring about development without duplication. How I wish that we could reconsider Clause 4 of this Bill and include MPs and Women Representatives as people who should be getting advice from statisticians at the county level. Going by the provisions of Article 6, there is nothing illegal or unconstitutional if this information was to be given to the governor, MPs and Women Representatives. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I will give examples. As we speak, most county governments are now giving out bursaries at the county level. Similarly, MPs are giving bursaries at the constituency level and our Women Representatives are giving bursaries in the counties divided amongst the constituencies from the respective counties. What will be illegal or unconstitutional if the statistician was to share information to all those elected leaders? The spirit is that we want to ensure that we do not have a duplication of duties and services at our counties, constituencies and wards. That is actually what is intended by Clause 4(c)(i), which says that the intention is to ensure that there is avoidance of duplication on statistical information. This is, therefore, beneficial to both leaders from the head of the county cascading it down to the level of the ward, led by the Member of County Assembly (MCA). The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Order, Sen. Omogeni! That is only in one part of the country.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I was just making reference to the county that we visited. I believe if we visited---

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Yes and you said that it is per square kilometer.

Yes, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): But that is only in Migori County.

Going by the person on the Chair, who is also a professor, I believe that --- The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Is this the same case in Nyamira County?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, going by the person who is in the Chair right now, I believe that the same applies to Tharaka-Nithi and their cousins in Nyamira.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Proceed, Senator.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. To give some importance to the person who will head this unit, I request that we reconsider the qualifications that have been set out in Clause 5 of the Bill. We do not want to pass a Bill that will create problems in terms of implementation. I have concerns with Clause 8 which talks of people who will sit in the Committee. Clause 8(d) talks of two statisticians who will be picked from among County Executive Committee (CEC) members but I have not seen if a criterion has been put down or a body that will be mandated to pick the county executives which might create room for conflict. The same is applicable for Clause 8(e) that talks about representative of research institutions. I do not know if we have a body that has brought all research institutions together such that we can write to them and ask them to nominate one representative, hence, there is something that is not clear. If one is to write to our public universities, then the question is: Which university will we write to seeking for the nomination? Those are some of the grey areas that we need to tie up. This Bill reminds our national Government and county governments that there should be consultation and cooperation with each other. That is what we have in Clause 11. Quarrels between National Government and county governments do not serve the interest of the people that we represent. It is good that we understand that Article 6 recognizes that the two levels of government are independent and distinct but interdependent. The idea of bringing the spirit of consultation is giving an opportunity to the national Government and county governments to realize that we serve one people and we are all from the same country, so we should not have friction, instead, we should work as an entity that is geared towards bringing services to our people. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, Clause 20 looks at the regulations though we should not give too much power to the county executive without putting in place mechanisms for checking abuse. Clause 20(1) states that- ‘The county executive committee member may make Regulations for the better carrying out of this Act.’ It is always a good safeguard to say that the county executive committee member will make regulations with the approval of the county assembly for they could pass regulations that may be counterproductive. Therefore, there is need for the county assembly to act as a check on the powers of the county executive. In terms of where this committee will sit, we can now bring the spirit of devolution by picking one of our counties as the headquarters of this particular committee. There is no reason as to why all these bodies should be concentrated in Nairobi. We could pick a different county or even say that this committee will have its headquarters in any other county other than Nairobi. With those few remarks, I support this Bill. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Thank you. Sen. Omogeni. Could we now hear from Sen. (Dr.) Milgo?

Thank you Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I also rise to support this Bill for a number of reasons. First, Part II of this Bill provides for the establishment of the County Statistics Office which will work together with the Kenya National Bureau of Statistics (KNBS) that has been the main custodian of statistics in this country. I am a Member of the Committee on Information and Technology and during our meeting today, we were wondering why the KNBS is the main custodian of statistics yet we have a devolved system of government. This Bill will go a long way in assisting the Government that has been majorly relying on national census that has always been held after every ten years which may not give timely information based on statistics. This Bill has come at a very good time, especially now that there is a lot of interest in the counties. Part IV of this Bill provides a good framework in terms of collection, dissemination and control of the data that has been collected. With this kind of statistics, the counties will go a long way in terms of development. Statistics in relation to development cannot be overemphasized. The reason we have complaints about lack of development projects in counties is due to lack of statistics that could provide for a match of statistics and resources for equitable distribution of development. When this Bill goes through, we may have transparency and accountability for the first time in the county governments. It will also make our work easy as we perform our oversight role. Many times, we realize that there are areas that have been neglected but for the first time, we will be in a position torecommend that development moves in a certain pattern due to population. When this Bill has been passed, the County Integrated Development Plan (CIDP) will go in line with issues of statistics particularly in terms of policies and strategies to be used in the county thus budgeting for that matter. Many times, we realize that the CIDP programs are simply plans that are set aside and those who want to be corrupt develop their own lines or use favoritism. However, I am sure that the statistics will help pinpoint areas where our roads, hospitals and schools should be built. It will also help with agricultural and food supplies issues. We have been talking about provision of Early Childhood Development (ECD’s) in the counties and the statistics will inform the national Government of the transition from the ECD’s to primary schools which will lead to provision of schools. Issues of statistics will not only be used by the counties for development but it will also be used in many areas by the national Government. The national Government can use such statistics to plan for health now that it is one of the four pillars of the national Government. I am sure that what we are talking about will take place in the counties. Issues of health, industries and housing will be addressed in the counties in line with the statistics that have been provided. By so doing, we will spur development according to the number of people who live in particular areas.

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(Sen. (Prof.) Kamar): Thank you. Let us have Sen. Seneta.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker, for giving me a chance to add my voice to this very important Bill. I support and congratulate my sister, Sen. Farhiya, for coming up with this very important Bill. It is constitutional in that it aligns the frameworks and systems that it is creating to the county function on statistics. Therefore, this is a very timely Bill, especially now when we are thinking of promoting devolution and developing our county governments. Statistics or data informs development. When we talk of planning, in terms of integrated urban and cities plans and all other development plans needed in our counties, we need to be informed by data. We need to know how many people we have in a particular city, urban or rural area. Therefore, data is a very important tool when it comes to development. When we talk about planning for the kind of resources we need in a particular unit, be it a ward, constituency or county, we need to be informed by data. This Bill that creates an office that is mandated to collect, maintain, analyse data and statistics is very important. Madam Temporary Speaker, the Bill seeks to create an office which we initially never had. We used to depend on the Kenya National Bureau of Statistics (KNBS) which is a national institution. In most cases we used to wonder where they get their statistics from. This Bill has created a particular office that is mandated to have data and statistics. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kamar): Thank you, Sen. Seneta. Sen. (Dr.) Zani, you have the Floor.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I stand to support this Bill. Statistics is an indispensable component of planning. This Bill is directly connected to the Fourth Schedule, Part 2 of the Constitution where the functions of the county government are clearly given in different facets like agriculture, pre-primary education, animal control, trade development, county planning and development. All these areas need statistics. That is why we need to have that kind of data. For a long time, this has been centralised within the Central Bureau of Statistics (CBS). The reason was that anybody who is looking for certain data, could easily access it. Sometimes, it is not easy to get this data. When you are doing a research, you need to have permission to go to the CBS who may give the data you need or not. At the CBS, it is collated on a national perspective. In other words, it does not centre on data that can be helpful at the county level. This Bill clearly pre supposes all segments of data that will be necessary within a county like bio data and population data put in various variables like age. We can look at the agricultural component of a county and know what is to be done to improve it. All this needs to be put together in a constructive way. The Bill sets various organs to do this comprehensively starting with the national consultative committee on statistics that is well established and headed by a governor who will be nominated by the Council of Governors (CoG), to be the chairperson. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I rise to support the County Statistics Bill, 2018 and congratulate Sen. Farhiya Haji for this timely Bill. I know most of my colleagues have talked about its importance and timeliness in terms of resource allocation and development planning at the county level. I agree largely because this Constitution is not old enough. I think it might be starting to work after crawling. We still need to do a lot of legwork in ensuring that we put in place the necessary and absolute legislations. Madam Temporary Speaker, I was looking at the comparison of the Access to Information Act 2016 and in line with Article 34 on access to information and media freedom, I want to say that statistics form a very big basis in terms of development. I have looked at many issues that have been raised in this County Statistics Bill and noted that it is very important. If you walk into any governor’s or administrator’s office, they cannot tell you exactly what is happening because even as we allocate resources to the county level, we need also need statistics. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kamar): Thank you. Finally, Sen. Mwaura.

Thank you very much, Professor, Madam Temporary Speaker. I must qualify that so that I do not appear to be in disrespect of the chair. This is a very timely Bill and it is long overdue. We have canvassed about this Bill and various stakeholders have appeared before the Committee on Finance and Budget. This is a good Bill because there is a very clear move to ensure that the work that The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kamar): Hon. Beth Mugo had requested to contribute but she is gone. Therefore, I invite the Mover to reply within the minutes that we have. Sen. Farhiya, you are aware that we can always give you more time later. So, it is your choice to finish or come back to it.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I beg to reply and thank Senators for their invaluable contributions that will enhance this Bill. Pursuant to standing order 55(3), I request that the putting of the question to be deferred to a later date as we do not have enough delegations in the House to make a decision.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kamar): It is so granted.

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(Sen. (Prof.) Kamar): Hon. Senators, it is now 6.30 p.m.; time to interrupt the business of the Senate. The Senate, therefore, stands adjourned until tomorrow, Wednesday 18th July, 2018, at 2.30 p.m. The Senate rose at 6.30 p.m. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.