Order, Hon. Senators! We need to determine if we have a quorum.

I have been informed we do not have a quorum. I order that the Division Bell be rang.

Hon. Senators, we now have a quorum. Let us proceed with business.

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to give notice of the following Motion:- THAT, pursuant to Standing Order 28, the Senate approves its Calendar (Regular Sessions) for the First Session of the Senate, as contained in Appendix B.

Senator Mbura! RESTORATION OF KENYA’S COMPETITIVENESS THROUGH EXPANSION AND MODERNIZATION OF INFRASTRUCTURE

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to give Notice of the following Motion:- The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Who was on the Floor? Is there any other contributor?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise to support the Motion by Sen. (Dr.) Wilfred Machage. I wish to commend him for bringing such an important Motion at such an appropriate time in the history of our country. Mr. Speaker, Sir, when Sen. Machage was moving this Motion yesterday, he gave statistics that have to do with what alcohol and drug abuse have done to Kenya. They are statistics that are in the public domain and should worry everybody very much. As I sat yesterday listening to the very able contributions from honourable Senators, it continued to worry me that we have taken so long to see our country go down the drain, as the abuse of drugs and alcohol continues to ravage the youth, even not the so young in our The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

On a point of information, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I will take the information if my time is not being counted.

Your time will be counted for sure.

Can you include miraa also?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I wish that the hon. Senator was in the House yesterday, because miraa is one of the things that were counted as a substance that has not been designated as a drug, but continues to be sold in this country. That is why I would have proposed that we amend this Motion to say: “Alcohol, drugs and other substance abuse.” This will ensure that miraa, shisha smoking and all those things that are destroying our children in the name of fun, and they become addicted in the name of pursuit of happiness are curbed once and for all, so that we can continue to have a healthy nation and hope to achieve our Vision 2030. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I support the Motion.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, thank you for giving me this opportunity to support this very important Motion. As highlighted by the previous speaker, we have the statistics because at least any one of us knows someone who is affected either in the family, close to the family or from a friend’s family who has become a zombie. This is what we are experiencing. Most of our young people get frustrated either because they are not doing so well in education and find solace in drugs and alcohol or because of unemployment. Unemployment is a major contributor to this. That is why I support this Motion because if the Government takes it up, it will be able to put together issues of unemployment and what happens to people, especially the youth when they are not employed. We have very many people both in the rural and urban areas who do not have jobs and do not know what to do. So, they try to get solace in drunkenness so that they can forget their woes for some time. If any of this is close to your family, probably they have become a total zombie and cannot work even if the job is available. When someone becomes like this, he cannot work or cannot function. So, it is very important for the Government to take this matter seriously. It is unfortunate, the incident we heard about the Kenyan officials in Nigeria. I do not know what happened but whatever it is, it is unfortunate that when the Government is taking some major steps, some other problems crop up. Some West African countries see it differently and support some of those characters who come into our country propagating what we are fighting in this country. The Government needs to also put hypocrisy aside. There is no way they can tell us that they can identify individuals from West African countries and other countries to the extent that they can hire a jet to deport them but do not know Kenyans who do the same work. I find this to be either total hypocrisy or corruption of the extreme order. I do not think that the Government of Kenya, with all the intelligence it has and the security set up in the country is not aware who the drug barons are. If the Government really wanted to take action, they would do it. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Bw. Spika, asante sana kwa kunipa muda. Kwanza nashukuru daktari kwa kuleta Hoja hii kwa sababu ni ya maana sana. Ningependa kuunga mkono Hoja hii kwa sababu ukiangalia katika familia, utapata watu wanakosana kwa sababu ya kelele ambayo inasababishwa na dawa za kulevya na pombe harama. Maafa katika jamii yamezidi kwa sababu ya madawa ya kulevya. Utapata kwamba mtu akiwa safarini, anapewa tu peremende na kisha anaaga dunia na baadaye inapatikana kwamba alipewa madawa za kulevya. Bw. Spika, ukiangazia juu ya pombe haramu ya kumi kumi, utapata kwamba inafanya watu wengi kupoteza macho ama kuwa vipofu. Kwa upande mwingine, tunaona kwamba pombe na madawa ya kulevya yanaathiri sana uchumi kwa sababu pesa nyingi hutumika. Hii inaweza kuleta shida katika familia. Naomba kuunga mkono Hoja hii na kusema kwamba yafaa tuangamize madawa ya kulevya na pombe haramu.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, thank you for giving me this opportunity to contribute to this very important Motion. I stand to support this Motion which is very important because it is calling upon our Government to declare drug abuse and alcohol as a national disaster. Before we do that, we need to go into the root cause of why people or our youths resort to drugs. First and foremost, it is because they are idle and are not engaged in gainful employment. This problem needs to be tackled at county level. That is where we find that our youths do not have employment and in most cases when they wake up in the morning, they do not have anything to do. What they do is get into groups and before they realize it, they will be taking drugs which leads to addiction. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Your time is up, Senator! Now the remaining time is for the Mover to reply. But I will request the Mover as he proceeds, to donate at least a few minutes to Sen. (Dr.) Zani and Sen. Adan who have persistently been up.

Thank you Mr. Speaker, Sir. I agree to donate my time. I am only left with four minutes. Distribute the rest of the time to them.

So, Sen. Zani, three minutes!

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for this opportunity to contribute to this very important Motion. I think it is the basis or really where we go wrong in terms of all the other pillars we think about. Our Vision 2030 is not going to be a reality in terms of the social, economic and the political pillar when we have youth, for example, who cannot go to school and stay in school and when we have people who cannot work and gainfully be employed because most of them are drunkards. Certain organizations have tried to come up with policies so that they actually try to help those who are in those organizations so that they can be assisted to come out of that particular situation. It is unfortunate in Kenya that despite the Mututho laws, people have continued with their drinking habits, really showing resistance to this whole idea and the fact that many of the youth get into it because of peer pressure and yet the consequences are so dire. It really puts this nation in a very difficult situation. Mr. Speaker, Sir as much as organizations like NACADA have tried to put forward a proposal where they say that they are going to caution and go into research and dissemination and the various efforts to control, the Kenya Police Anti-narcotics Drugs Unit have also tried to put a lot of effort into this area, they have not been completely successful. The consequences have been mentioned and I will not go into them. But the preventive measures, especially those to do with the rehabilitation are very expensive and the average Kenyan is not able to access those facilities. I have been requested to make an amendment to this Motion as follows:- I beg to move: THAT the Motion be amended by deleting all the words appearing---

Order! Sen. Zani your time is up. Secondly, you are trying to do an illegality. You do not contribute to the Motion and then you go ahead to amend it.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, after contributing, I realized it should be amended.

You should have brought the amendment and then you contribute to it. I will ask Sen. Kanainza to bring the amendment. You have done your bit. Sen. Kanainza, speak to the amendment only.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for this opportunity. I actually wanted to contribute because every Senator has been touching on the youth and it is true drug and alcohol abuse---

Order Sen. Kanainza! You move the amendment and then you contribute to it. That is all!

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the Motion be amended by deleting all the words appearing immediately after the word “alcohol” in the sixth line and inserting the following words; “drugs and other substance abuse a national disaster”. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

You talk to it for a minute! You remember you have borrowed time.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, it is true that apart from alcohol and drugs, we have other substances that are affecting our young people in the society. Drug abuse is a growing problem among teenagers that has led to serious consequences well into their adulthood. I beg to move.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir, for giving me this opportunity to second the amendment. A lot has been said, but I think we need to look at the legislations that deal with licensing of alcohol. We should introduce heavy penalties for drug barons and those who are found to be guilty of peddling drugs and other substances. Secondly, I think to some extent, we should blame parents. From my experience, you will find some parents carrying their small kids to restaurants where they sit with them on the same table and drink alcohol. What would you expect from that child? In your absence, he or she will try to taste that alcohol. In future, we should introduce some restrictions in the way we train our kids. Some parents even carry alcohol to the house and when their kids come of age, they break into those stores and drink that alcohol. Who are you going to blame? We should also blame ourselves as parents. I beg to second.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, as I endeavour to thank every Member of this House for the support you have given to this important Motion, I call upon every citizen of this country, every donor in this country, every businessman and the Government to take heed of what the Senate has said. This is a disaster in the making. It is an epidemic being rolled out. It is our duty to abhor and condemn this status and actually take action to see to it that our youth and the population of Kenya in general has a bright future. I do not have to over-emphasize the importance of this declaration which is actually a national disaster. I urge Senators to pass the Motion as amended. I beg to move.

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move:- THAT, aware that the State and other Government agencies have been the biggest impediment to payment of dues to Kenyans, including retirement benefits, court awards and insurance claims; recognizing that such delays amount to violation of human rights and undue punishment; noting that claimants spend a lot of money and time travelling to Nairobi and other far off destinations pursuing the claims; acknowledging that the purpose of devolution is to take services closer to the people; the Senate urges the national Government to immediately establish a one-stop Public Compensation Claims Bureau to enable victims of delays and all future claimants to lodge their claims for immediate verification and subsequent expeditious settlement through the nearest commercial banks and to ensure that legally confirmed dues are settled within six months of the award. Mr. Speaker, Sir, as leaders and representatives of the people, we should all be familiar with situations in which wananchi come to see us, either singly or in delegations, seeking our intervention and support to have their dues and other entitlements paid to them by their former employers, Government or other public agencies and even by private insurance companies. In my career in politics, I have witnessed and continue to witness many such cases. The majority of the cases involve claims for payment of benefits both from Government and other private entities, workman’s compensation awards by courts in respect of accidents taking place in various places of work, claims in respect to payment of pension emoluments, valid court awards, compensating individuals for wrongful dismissal from their jobs, payment of insurance claims following court awards and many other similar claims. In my experience, many of the claimants, even where courts have given awards and no appeals are pending, are still subjected to long delays. I am aware of delays which have taken as long as ten years and more. Sometimes those claims are not even settled at all. In pursuing these claims, the victims often travel long distances from their areas of residence to come to Nairobi, incurring huge expenses. But even after doing so, they are still told to wait or come back another day because the files cannot be traced. Mr. Speaker, Sir, imagine a Kenyan who lives in the northern part of Turkana travelling to Nairobi to pursue a claim. He or she spends a lot of money because they have to find accommodation in Nairobi which they do not know well, all in pursuance of The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I want to second this Motion by stating the fact that this is an area which has been of concern to many Kenyans including leaders. I remember a similar thing came up in the Ninth Parliament. Motions can be passed at times but if the relevant agencies including Government do not think of ways to enforce them, that becomes a problem. The Pensions Department, for instance, is a stone throw-away from the Kenyatta International Conference Centre (KICC). If any of us walked over there, they would find what Sen. Obure is trying to bring out for us to understand. Yesterday, two retired chiefs came to my office. They are looking for their retirement benefits. They told me that they are currently putting up in Eastleigh and that it was becoming very expensive for them to stay around. Can you imagine a chief coming from the furthest end of northern Kenya hanging around for the past 21 days, trying to get his file from the Office of the President first, and then trailing it all the way to the Pensions Department which is across the road? This is the highest order of inefficiency on the part of those charged with the responsibility of ensuring that ordinary citizens do not suffer. We have a lot to learn from the idea of one-stop shop. This is happening in the Ministry of Trade where there were very many barriers and requirements for licensing, 21, to be precise, that complicated facilitation of trade. It was not difficult to solve this because at one point, the Kenya Investments Authority took stock of this and shortened the process. The same thing can be replicated by the Pensions Department. People have been giving bribes at the Pensions Department to find their files. I do not think that is the right thing to do. We can do a lot to improve the payment of claims, either for retirement benefits, court awards or insurance claims not even to six months as the Motion suggests but these can be facilitated and paid in a maximum of three months, That way, we will have saved Kenyans a lot of time and money which would have otherwise gone into something important. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, now that we have devolved to county governments, the Pensions Department, for instance, should be the first to devolve to the county governments so that once claims, as proposed by Sen. Obure, are verified, they are paid easily in a matter of weeks. Finally, capacity should be improved at the county level so that they take charge of some of these responsibilities. Before I conclude, I will say that before payments are facilitated, particularly for members of the service who may have died, their families suffer a lot in terms of getting these things processed with the public trustees. We know that the Pensions Department has done a lot of reforms but I do not think we have done a lot of enforcement. I second. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, for giving me this opportunity to support this Motion. Let me start by saying that most Government agencies know exactly when an employee will retire. They even give a year’s notice prior to the retirement date. The note shows that next year, you will retire because you will have either reached the age of either 55 or 60. So, we cannot say that they do not know. In fact, they stop your salary forthwith when that time reaches. At times, I wonder why the file disappears because it was available when they were stopping your salary pronto. But immediately your salary is stopped, your file disappears. If you went to the Office of the President and even looked for it for six months, you would not find it. If you went to any other institution, that would also be the situation. This is the problem in every other institution and because you are not in office, nobody will want to talk to you. You will realise this when you lose your seats. Immediately you become a former Senator, no one will seem to notice your face. This is extremely painful now that you are also out of pocket. You are supposed to walk from office to office and the only other person you can go to is your Member of Parliament or Senator to sort you out. In fact, why can they not have a Cabinet for files of people who will retire this year so that immediately you come, they quickly pull it out? The other thing they ask you to produce is your last payment slip as if they are not the ones who paid you and as if they do not have the records. And if they do not have the record and then they ask you for your national identity card, which they have always kept in your file for all these years you have been working. In fact, they will not pay you a coin if you did not have that identity card; they will not pay your National Social Security Fund (NSSF) claims if you did not have that identity card. But now, it is a requirement; bring your identity card and bring your last pay slip. In fact, sometimes it is more difficult for widows who do not find pay slips of their dead husbands, because we do not usually show them our pay slips.

If you die accidentally and your widow or the children search for the pay slip, it is nowhere to be seen. Banks now even insist that before they give you a loan, you must show them the original pay slip. So, you probably took some loan there and that is why they cannot find the pay slip. Why must the Government insist on seeing the last original pay slip before any settlement is done? Some of these rules could be made easier so that people can access their claims. The second thing I want to say – because I had this problem when my mother retired – is that she had so much problems of her file moving from Teachers Service Commission (TSC) to the Pensions Department. I think it took her two years. I had to move from one office to another; something had to be done here; something had to be done there; an officer has to be seen, and at that time, I was a Member of Parliament. Now, if your son is not a Member of Parliament and is not in Nairobi, you could have a lot of problems moving your file in your own department, which has employed you for The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Sen. (Dr.) Zani.

Thank you very much, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I also stand to support this very important Motion. I would like to start by saying that there are various State and Government agencies that are in charge of paying out benefits, and they usually have a particular structure and process that is put into place. Unfortunately, most of the time, that process and structure is not transparent; it exists probably only in their websites. Most of the time, you will find that the structures for collecting the benefits tend to be more integrated than the ones for giving out the benefits, especially at the time they are meant to be given. There are various benefits that we may be referring to, such as retirement benefits, disability benefits, medical benefits, NSSF benefits--- This is money that somebody has contributed knowing that at a particular time, they will need back that money. Therefore, it is very important that, that money is given at the right time, in the right way and with a lot of dignity to the person who has made that contribution. It is a well known fact that in Kenya, most of the time when it comes to claiming and getting back benefits, it becomes a tiring process. There is no clear explanation also as to where those funds are held and what those funds are used for. Do they accrue interest, for example, and how is that navigated across or how is that passed on as part of an added interest to the person who has made that contribution? Usually, the processes are very cumbersome. It may include somebody having to write a letter, they will have to send a complainant form; most of the sites will say it will take only about a month, but we know it will take a much, much longer time. Even if it is court awards, for example, especially those that include insurance cases and where somebody has really gone through a very difficult time and expects that this is the time they will reap from, their efforts, that process that takes a lot of time and that person continues with that specific suffering. If it is a disabled person, for example, they are not able to have that attended to immediately because they need the money to be able to do so. There is also lack of information and no clear stated time lines in terms of action and feedback, and there are a lot of promises. This is what we are saying in this Motion; that somebody finds themselves pushed and tossed from one place to another, to and fro as they are making that particular claim. It is for no reason that people who put in their money so that when they need it, it can come to them in some form of benefit--- One of the things that show this is that in 2011, the Government allowed early retirees or those who opted out of employment to claim for their retirement early and within June of that year, there was a liquidity problem because everybody was actually looking for their money. That means that as people are putting in their money, they are actually putting it there for a reason and they expect to reap from it and utilize it when the time comes. It is indeed a violation of human rights, as it has been stated by the Mover of the Motion. It is very, very unfair when somebody has to go to and fro as though they are begging for that The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Sen. Wamatangi.

Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, for the opportunity to contribute to this very useful and important Motion moved by Sen. Obure. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, most of my colleagues in the Senate have contributed to this Motion. They have said most of the things that might need to be said, but because this is a very important Motion, there have to be issues that will always be brought out to ensure that what rightfully belongs to the people of Kenya, they get it. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, compensation is a very dear issue to most of the people who are claimants as at now and before. One of the most important distinctions to make is to identify, indeed, who are the claimants. Most of the claimants, for example, retirees, become claimants only after they have rendered services. For example, somebody has worked for the Government until they attain the retirement age of 60 years. After serving and giving their best during their youthful years, when it comes to the time they need to be rewarded for what they have done and services they have rendered, they are reduced to beggars. If it is other forms of claims, for example, insurance claims, you will find that a healthy and useful Kenyan who contributes to the economy of this country gets involved in an accident and loses a limb. When they can no longer render the service that they have been rendering, again, they are turned into beggars. I speak about this from a personal perspective because I have been a victim. When I was a young man, I got involved in an accident, in which I almost lost my right hand. By then, I was about 17 years old. Since I did not come from a very well-connected family, my own mother struggled for more than ten years. Even until when she passed away, I never got compensation, after spending more than a year in hospital and another year going through physiotherapy. Until today, I still have the scars and even a metal plate in my hand. I never got compensated for it. What about the other millions of Kenyans who suffer a similar fate? Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, if it is in terms of court awards, then we have seen and witnessed in this country people who have been victims of torture and made legal claims which have been awarded through courts. They spend years and years following up on their awards. It is evident and there to be seen; that actually most of these claimants die without ever enjoying those benefits that they claim. So, this is a serious issue. But what is even more serious is that over 90 per cent of all those claimants are poor people. This is because those who are well connected and wealthy can afford to use their connections and wealth to access the benefits that they seek. But the poor person, who has no means and only relies on the goodwill of the Government and other paying agencies and companies to pay have to bear the brunt and suffer for a whole lifetime before they can get what is rightfully theirs. So, this is a Motion and issue that is right at the heart of the Kenyan people. It requires to be treated with a lot of seriousness, so that we ensure that once and for all, this is brought to a halt. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I support all the Senators who have spoken before me and proposed that, indeed, the effective way to deal with this, is to come up with a Bill that will be firmed clearly in the law that stipulates the timeframe and manner in which those compensations and payments are supposed to be made. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I also rise to support the Motion. But I also want to look at it at the level of the institutions that deal with compensation. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, Kenya is a very interesting country, where I think the unclaimed assets amounts to a lot of billions of shillings. I do not think that, as Kenyans, we really know the figure. Let us take the example of the National Social Security Fund (NSSF) and look at the poverty level of many children whose parents used to make contributions to the NSSF. To date, most of them are unable to go to school or even to the NSSF and try to claim whatever their parents left when they passed on. When you look at the trustees and how they deal with children today, it is also a very sad story. Indeed, today those who benefit more from what the parents contributed are the trustees rather than the families of the contributors. Today, many women who are widows languish in poverty, not because they do not have assets, but because the institutions that are supposed to even name the assets and the lawyers, have decided to use the same resources for their own benefit. Therefore, when we talk of compensation, we need to, first, ask ourselves: What is the structure? First, you will have to hire a lawyer. Therefore, you will pay the lawyer and before you even get your money, the lawyer will go with three-quarters of the money. The family will just get a quarter of what is being compensated. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, look at the recent case of Mau Mau. The lawyers will walk away with more than Kshs800 million and yet, the person---

Do you have facts about that statement?

Yes, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. It was in the media, that the lawyers will be paid Kshs800 million. If you look at the figure that the Mau Mau are being compensated with, you would wonder if it is right and fair. When you ask anyone in this country, especially the institutions of Government, to even give you figures of unclaimed assets, nobody will disclose it to you. This is because they know that they are working with the banks. The banks will never allow any Kenyan to know what they have as unclaimed assets. I do not have the figures for this, but I know that there are more than Kshs200 billion in unclaimed assets. Therefore, I agree with the Mover of the Motion that, indeed, it is time we asked ourselves, as a country, whether it is right for people to languish in poverty when we know that they have assets and money that they have contributed for years. Therefore, it is time for their families to use that money to take their children to school or even improve their livelihoods wherever they are staying. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would wish that the Mover of the Motion does more research to help even the Government to understand. When we talk of “unclaimed assets” and “compensation” we need to ask ourselves: How do we deal with unclaimed assets and at what level is the Government allowed also to take the unclaimed assets and reveal to the public their value? Then, we will be helping even the country to understand how much the banks hold sometimes as unclaimed assets and whether they have been able to look for the beneficiaries of those unclaimed assets. Those are some of the challenges that I think many people have faced when they go to claim their assets; where parents or maybe their fathers passed on and never disclosed to their families where most of the The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I rise to support the Motion. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, my sister who has just spoken has made a point about that case involving the Mau Mau and the amount of money that the lawyers are taking from the compensation. I have gone through that kind of experience and know that when you get this kind of compensation through the courts, the lawyers take quite a substantial part of it to your utter amazement. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, this Motion is extremely important. I want to refer the House to the Pensions Act, Cap.189, Section 19A. It says:- “A dependant’s pension payable under the foregoing sections shall be paid to the dependants within a period of 90 days after the death of the officer concerned, failure to which interest shall accrue thereon at bank rates, until payment is made in full, provided that no interest shall be payable under this section, where the failure to pay is occasioned by legal proceedings in respect of payment.’ Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, this is where the problem is in the sense that the law says that dependants shall be paid within 90 days, but the onus is on the dependant to go and claim that money within 90 days. When they fail to get this money within those 90 days, they really have no recourse except to go to court or look for a lawyer, to urge the Government to pay this. Once you go to court and you are looking for this money, then there is a rider that in so far as there is a legal proceeding, if there is a delay, you will not get the interest. Now, you can stop going to court to look for your money and hope that when you are finally paid, you will be paid with interest. I want to dare this House to find out how many Kenyans have actually been paid with interest when they get that money. What the Government department concerned will do is state that it is not their mistake that the file was missing. So, ordinary citizens who actually do not know that something called Cap.189 exists are at the mercy of the system. What is being proposed here is a Bill that will implement Section 19(a) of the Pensions Act, called “payment of dependant pension”. This section was passed, but it did not include an institution that will implement that particular section. That is very characteristic of many laws in our country. The law exists, but implementers are not quite determinate as far as the ordinary human being is concerned. So, there is something indeterminate called the Government. When you go to a Government office and go to a particular section, you will be referred to human resources or to the legal section, but in the end, they come to a representative called a politician. That is why, we, as Members of Parliament, get a lot of letters from people looking for their dues. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

I have not seen any amendment.

I left it with the offices here.

I have seen here a document which is not signed. So, I do not have any amendment with me. I am sorry. I would propose that you get somebody to propose the amendment. Then you have to stop contributing, sign it and have it approved.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I will stop contributing and sign it. I think the amendment will improve and add value to what we are talking about.

The amendment is important, Senator, but I am just talking about procedure.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, what I could do is stop contributing and deal with the amendment.

The problem is that you cannot contribute twice.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, then give me my amendment, I sign it.

I suggest you have somebody move the amendment on your behalf. Let us do it in a proper way.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, then I can get the next speaker to move the amendment. All we want is the amendment. I can speak on the amendment then. Sen. G.G. Kariuki, can you move the amendment? It is a very sensible amendment and you will not be ashamed of “myself”. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I also rise to support this Motion. I want to state that the way the State and its various agencies act when somebody retires and wants his or her benefits, is quite baffling. In my opinion, from the day when somebody is employed, that person’s file is activated with all the required documents, including the next of kin and all the information that could be required. I would think that from that day the State already knows that this person has been employed at this age and, therefore, after five years, 10 or 20 years, he will retire. So, in my opinion, the State could from time to time update that person’s file, especially when it is one year, six months, three months, one month or five days to retirement. It should package that person’s benefits in such a way that he or she only needs to file, then the people employed in that agency should actually have worked on his or her file for the whole time prior to retirement. So, the person should just be given an easy time having served the Government through the various State agencies to, at least, go home smiling and not spent the rest of his life chasing benefits. If somebody has been working continuously for 20 years or 30 years and he spends another five or seven years looking for pension, it is not fair. In most cases, people die even before accessing their benefits. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, it is said that all that ends well is good enough. In most cases, people retire just at the peak of their lives when most of their children are in college. That person wants to go back home and settle, to start income generating activities. Therefore, one needs to be given his benefits in time, so that he or she does not get a mental breakdown and die without ever accessing what he or she was entitled to. It is in order now that we are decentralizing everything under the devolved system of governance, that we also decentralize this function. It makes no sense at all for people to travel from the various counties to one county which is Nairobi to process their pension. Nairobi is just a county like all the other 46 counties. I do not understand why people should still be travelling from their own counties to the county that is called Nairobi to process their benefits. This process must now be decentralized to their counties so that everybody just moves from every part of their county to the headquarters of their county to be sorted out regardless and in spite of where one was employed. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, apart from that, I want to add my voice to those who have spoken before me and, especially the Chair who stated that what we sometimes call retirement benefits is really paltry. I do not know what to call it. If you are paying The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

One year!

Yes, one year, now that it comes from Sen. Kajwang. It is in order that we have these files updated so that when there is an issue, it can be sorted out almost immediately to avoid the stress that is always involved.

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, thank you very much for giving me a chance to contribute in support of this Motion. I remember we were with you in the nighth Parliament together with many others here when Sen. Musila, brought a Bill of this kind. When the Bill was passed, there was confusion in the offices at that time. To our surprise, nothing much has happened since the Bill was passed. People still suffer and struggle to get their benefits. Therefore, I wonder whether what we discuss in this House and the other House is just like mere talking shops. We need to have some of these things properly implemented. There is also the need to have the implementation committee so that such things are acted upon. If we have to keep on discussing things, we need to know how implementation is going on. This is a Motion which is a wake-up call for us to start thinking whether we are dealing with issues that had been discussed earlier. We need to find out what is happening. We cannot keep on discussing Motions here and yet there is no implementation taking place. This Motion should serve as a wake-up call. We do not have to discuss issues and keep on reviving them. We should bring the people who are in charge to book and ask them what is wrong. This Bill was passed in the Ninth Parliament. I remember I made my contribution towards it.

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On a point of information, Madam Temporary Speaker.

Sen. Karaba, do you want to be informed?

Yes, Madam Temporary Speaker.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I want to inform my brother that because the Senate has been designated as the House of Wazee, we are particularly interested in wazee getting their money.

I do not know whether it is true!

Sen. Kajwang who designated this House as the House of Wazee ? We have Senators who are between 25 years and 27 years. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Madam Temporary Speaker, some of them are representing the youth like Sen. Kanainza. Sen. Lesuuda is here and she is not even 30 years. I am sure several of you are not even 40 years. How old are you?

Sen. Karaba, could you, please, stick to the Motion. You cannot start interrogating people about their age.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I am trying to prove that this is not a House of Wazee .

On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker. Is the eminent Senator from Kirinyaga, who is a gentleman and a former teacher, in order to behave unlike a gentleman, to ask a woman’s age?

Sen. Karaba, why are you specifically asking the ladies how old they are?

Madam Temporary Speaker, I think Sen. Wako is imputing ulterior motives to me. I just gave an example of somebody who is not a mzee . Much as I would refer to Sen. Obure as a mzee, I know the Chair is not even 60 years old.

Order, Sen. Karaba! You are out of order. Who has told you to brand Sen. Obure a name that is unknown to him? He is known as Sen. Chris Obure.

Madam Temporary Speaker, Sen. Obure is a Member of this Senate. I am sure he is not a young man, much as I am not also young. Old is gold!

Madam Temporary Speaker, I do not know whether you will add me more time because of those interruptions because I need to stress the point that there is a difference between benefits and pension. When somebody retires, they are paid a lumpsum and then, in subsequent years, they are paid monthly pensions, for example, Kshs3, 000 or Kshs5, 000. This should also be enhanced so that as somebody gets closer to the grave, they earn more money so that their relatives will be able to give them a respectable send off. Benefits of this kind should be paid immediately the officer in question retires. Taking too much time to pay the retiree is painstaking. I thank Sen. Obure for bringing this Motion to the House. I hope that it will be expedited so that we can know who is not doing the right thing. If it is the Director, he should be fired in order to make sure that retirement benefits are paid to the retired officers immediately they retire. Six months to me is too long a time. I support.

Asante sana, Bi. Spika wa Muda, kwa kunipatia nafasi nichangia Hoja hii. Pia ningetaka kuchukua nafasi hii kumshukuru Sen. Obure kwa kuleta Hoja hii inayowahusu wafanyakazi. Kama sote tunavyojua, mfanyakazi ni mtu muhimu sana katika uendelezaji wa uchumi wa nchi yetu. Lakini ni jambo la kusikitisha tukiona kwamba baada ya mfanyakazi kustaafu anapatikana barabarani, ofisini na nyumbani za marafiki akiomba omba ili apate namna ya kuweza kujikimu kimaisha. Ningetaka kuhimiza mapato ambayo yanapewa na mahakama yalipwe mara moja kwa sababu ni haki ya mfanyikazi. Mfanyakazi aliyefanya kazi au kwa bahati mbaya amepoteza kazi yake, ni sharti alipwe ikiwa mahakama imeamua alipwe. Ni jambo la The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Sen. (Prof) Anyang’-Nyong’o, I have received your proposed amendment which I have just signed. It will be coming through Sen. G. G. Kariuki. So, after we take the next speaker, it will be in order for him to move it.

Bi. Spika wa Muda, nashukuru kwa kunipa nafasi ili niunge mkono Hoja hii. Hoja hii ni muhimu sana, hasa kwa watu kama sisi ambao wanatoka mashinani. Sisi huwa tunapata shida sana kwa sababu watu wetu wanapotoka huko na kuja kutafuta haki yao, wengi huja kutueleza shida zao. Wengine wanachukua miaka mingi kuja Nairobi lakini wanarudi bila usaidizi wowote. Kuna haja ya Seneti hii kuwa na mbinu za kuwalipia watu mashinani wanapostaafu. Hii ni kwa sababu watu wanapotoka Kaunti ya Tana River na kufika hapa, wanahitaji malazi na nauli ya usafiri. Mambo hayo yote yanahitaji pesa. Huyu mtu The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

On a point of information, Madam Temporary Speaker. His Excellency the President referred to children joining class one and not those that are one year old.

Bi. Spika wa Muda, hiyo ni sawa. Nikisema mwaka mmoja, namaanisha mtoto katika hali ya uchanga anaweza kuwa na tarakilishi. Kwa nini hapa Kenya hatuna mfumo wa kuweka faili za watu ambao wamestaafu na wanaohitaji manufaa mengine? Tunatakiwa kuwa na mbinu katika mashinani za kuwalipa watu wanapostaafu. Mtu akistaafu leo, kesho mambo yake yanafaa kuwa sawa kwa sababu watu ambao wanatuajiri wanajua ni nani amefikisha umri wa kustaafu. Haya yote ni mambo ambayo Wakenya wote wanafaa kuwaajibika. Wale wanaoajiriwa maofisini wanafaa kuajibika. Kuna wakati ambapo tulikuwa na maofisa ambao walikuwa hawajulikani lakini walikuwa wakilipwa na pia walikuwa katika orodha ya Serikali. Hayo yote yalifanyika kwa sababu ya kutowaajibika. Wakenya wote wanafaa kuwaajibika na mambo yafanyike vile yanavyopaswa kufanywa. Mambo hayafai kufanyika vingine. Tuwe na sheria ambazo zinatusaidia ili kila mmoja wetu apate haki zake wakati unaofaa. Bi. Spika wa Muda, kwa hayo machache, ninaunga mkono Hoja hii.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. Mine is very simple. It is to give this Motion more force in terms of law. I want to make sure that it will not just be debated and, after the resolution, it dies off. I think time has come when the Senate must start thinking as my friend has started thinking that a resolution of the House does not just work. However, if we convert this Motion into a Bill which would be assented to by the President, that would be a more appropriate situation. Without repeating what my friends have said, everybody knows what problems our people go through. They go through us when they have no one to represent them. They experience problems as if they have no Government. Time has come for us to start thinking about the people who brought us here and those who sent our colleagues to the lower House. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Sen. G. G. Kariuki, we do not have anybody by the name Sen. Njuguna Wamatangi. We have Sen. Kimani Wamatangi. Mr. G.G. Kariuki: He is still Wamatangi. Somebody must have given him a new name. Sen. Kimani Wamatangi Sen. Fatuma Dullo Sen. Otieno Kajwang Sen. Hassan Abdirahman Sen. Stephen Sang Sen. Beatrice Elachi Sen. (Prof.) Anyang’-Nyong’o Sen. G. G. Kairuki Sen. David Musila Sen. Amos Wako Sen. Naisula Leisuuda These are the Senators expected to work on this Bill and report to this House within the shortest time possible. I beg to move.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I want to second the amendment brought by Sen. Obure. Sen. Chris Obure has worked in the Government in very key Ministerial portfolios. In particular, he was for a brief period the “Chancellor of the Exchequer for the Government.” The Chancellor of the Exchequer is the Minister for Finance. I think he knows the problem he is talking about. Therefore, this becomes a very well thought out Motion to help our people process their claims. This amendment is very important because we just pass a mere Motion without giving it legal teeth, it will become another added bureaucracy in the processing of claims. I can assure you of that. Part of the problems that the retirees have is personnel The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

We shall now proceed to continue debating the Motion with the proposed amendment. We shall proceed to debate the amendments. Yes, Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo?

Madam Temporary Speaker, I also rise to give my input to the Motion as amended. We need to thank the presenter of this Motion; it has come at a time when---

Senator, we have not yet amended it. You will be debating or giving your input to the proposed amendments.

On the proposed amendments?

Yes, the proposed amendments, because the Motion has not yet been amended.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I concur with the Senator who brought these amendments. To me, the Motion will now have more power and teeth, as it is suggested here. I hope the Senators who will work on the Bill will come up with it within the three months proposed here. The reason we need to come up with the Bill is so that any officer in the central Government or whoever else is processing compensation for officers who have retired or officers who have since passed on, do not feel neglected in our country. This Bill, as it will be generated, I hope it will bring hope and sanity into the lives of the people who have been affected seriously. Madam Temporary Speaker, there is a lot of celebration and joy when a new Kenyan is born. There is a lot of celebration and joy when somebody gets a new job. However, when somebody retires or dies, agony sets in when he claims his pensions or when the next of kin claims benefits of the deceased. I hope this Select Committee will capture the pain we are talking about here. Many families have almost experienced hell on earth trying to get their benefits after the breadwinner has retired or died. For example, there is an administration police officer who lost his life in the line of duty almost eight years ago. But his peasant parents have never accessed his benefits. They come to Nairobi and they are sent to the Public Trustee. After five years of struggling to get his benefits, they are told by the Public Trustee that they have opened a new office in Nakuru. They advise them to go to Nakuru to lodge their claim there. From Nakuru, they have been told to go to the KTDA Office Buildings in Eldoret. They are looking for only Kshs250,000. The question is: How much money have they spent in pursuit of these peanuts? They have sold all the cows they had. Madam Temporary Speaker, Sen. (Prof.) Anyang’-Nyong’o talked about the Pensions Act which spells out exactly which penalties are supposed to be levied. I am hoping that when this Bill comes before the Floor of this House, we shall debate it, pass it and take it immediately to the highest office in the land to be assented to. Kenyans should not continue with their usual manners of keeping files and documents as though nothing has taken place. The Pensions Act is law and it should have been operationalised long time ago. I think officers working in the Public Trustees Office should have been punished a long time ago and some sent home for not implementing this Act. I even wonder whether officers working in this office ever retire. If they do retire, are they also subjected to the same trauma and drama that these other Kenyans go through? Madam Temporary Speaker, I support the proposed amendments. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Sen. Lesan.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker, for the opportunity to make a few comments on the Motion. From the outset, I wish to mention that I support the amendment which is being made on this Motion in order to give it some teeth. In the past, we have had the Retirement Benefits Authority Act, 1997 which was amended in 2010. From what we have heard here, it is apparent that those amendments on the Retirement Benefits Act done before have actually not solved some of the pending problems mentioned by some of the speakers who have spoken before me. So, I am glad that Sen. Obure has brought this Motion and I am also even happier that it is going to be amended in order to give it some teeth to address the current situation where retirees have been suffering. Madam Temporary Speaker, the main problem that has been with the previous Act governing pensions, particularly retirement benefits, has been the keeping of records. Apart from the attitude of workers within the authority, I think lack of records has been the main problem. But we are very fortunate in this country that we now have Information, Communication and Technology (ICT). We also have computers. Therefore, at the moment, it is a pity that I am not able to get an electronic statement (e-statement) of my benefits from my employer while sitting on an armchair at home. This is possible. I do not have to come all the way to Nairobi when we have this kind of thing. I am sure with this Bill, such amendments will be made in the procedures so that it is possible to actually get the records up to date, and be able to get periodic statements of the status of the benefits of the individual at any time. This is an important amendment. It is one of the things that we could follow. Madam Temporary Speaker, it is always accepted that the benefits we look for from the retirement scheme is in monetary terms. I think it might also be possible to change the terms in which we can get these benefits into other forms. For example, I would like to have a medical cover as part of my retirement benefits so that I do not have to go around looking for money. I just turn up to the best medical provider and get treatment because, after all, the amount of money that I, probably, get from retirement is spent on medical services. Therefore, if I got this as part of the scheme, then I do not have to follow an officer at the office, like he says in Eldoret or Nakuru, to give me some money. I just report to the nearest medical officer to get this service. Madam Temporary Speaker, it is very appropriate that this Motion has come at this time and I think we, as Senators, will support it with the proposed amendment. In fact, I support the amendment because it goes a long way to serve the purpose which we intend to. Therefore, Madam Temporary Speaker, I beg to support the amendments to the Motion.

Sen. Zani.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I stand to support the amended Motion and to really thank the team who came up with the amendments. These amendments will add a lot of value to it. I am also happy with the decision of converting this Motion into a Bill. I think this is really going to help many Kenyans who have been struggling to get their benefits as they will now be able to do so expeditiously. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker. Noting that the number in the House is not adequate and given that this is a county- related Motion, I rise under Standing Order 51(3) to seek your indulgence that when the Motion comes to an end, you name another day when we can actually vote for it.

All right, Senator! Your request has been noted. Sen. Karaba!

Madam Temporary Speaker, I support the amendment as moved by my friend, Sen. G.G. Kariuki. Madam Temporary Speaker, I would also like to bring to the attention of the Members the fact that the reason we have these delays is as a result of lack of documents and necessary technology. Software should be provided from the various departments to deal with retirees only. This will enable them to know that in a certain year, for example, at the end of 2013, a certain number of people will be retiring. I will take the case of teachers, for example, because I am a former teacher. The Teachers’ Service Commission (TSC) should have come up with a list of those will retire towards the end of any year. This Committee, therefore, should be able to check and know how many people are retiring from every department at any given time. Madam Temporary Speaker, it is also important to consider cases where courts have given awards to the retirees. I have a case in point where several teachers retired several years back. The case was taken to Nakuru. The Nakuru Court awarded the teachers a retirement package totalling to almost Kshs32 billion. This is one of the cases The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Hon. Senators, this Motion, definitely, affects counties, because it seeks to have a Bill passed, that will establish Public Compensation Bureaus in all counties. Sen. Anyang’-Nyong’o has made a procedural request according to Standing Order No.51 (3), to which I have assented. So, we will take the Vote on this Motion tomorrow, at 3.00 p.m.

In that case, we will now move on to the next Order. ESTABLISHMENT OF SECURITY ROAD NETWORKS

Madam Temporary Speaker, I beg to move the following Motion:- THAT, aware that the country is experiencing rampant incidents of insecurity due to factors such as competition for resources, ethnic tension, crime and economic disempowerment; aware that some of the incidents may spread unabated from one county to another as well as across the international borders; concerned that many lives and property are lost, people are displaced and the socio-economic set-up of the affected communities and individuals is disrupted; cognizant of the fact that poor infrastructure is the main contributing factor inhibiting the containment of insecurity incidents; appreciating the initiatives recently instituted by the Government to mitigate the enormity of the incidents with regard to budgetary allocations and police sector reforms; the Senate urges the The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Who is your Seconder?

I have picked on Sen. Machage, but he is not in.

Sen. Beth Mugo has offered.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker for giving me this chance to second the Motion. I would like to congratulate the Mover of this Motion; the experienced Senator, G. G. Kariuki, for this very timely Motion which I hope and trust that hon. Senators will support. In seconding this Motion, I want to underline from the beginning the importance of security. We are all aware of the insecurity pricking our country right now. I congratulate the Government because of the good infrastructural record which was, especially put in place by the previous Governments. We all know the efforts that former President Kibaki put in place to ensure good infrastructure across the country. We congratulate and appreciate his efforts. However, the job is not complete. The Senator is saying that we need to connect our security forces with areas where acts of insecurity are happening. What the Senator has said is true. The focus has been on economic activities. Most roads were designed to promote economic activities. This happened where productivity was taking place. It was right to do that for the country to develop. However, the issues and needs keep on changing. More urgent issues evolve as the country develops. Insecurity is, indeed, a new phenomenon in our country. We are witnessing a lot of insecurity now. Our children are at times being kidnapped. When we were growing up, that was not heard of even in the cities. These are new crimes. We must keep up with the times so as to combat crimes. We have many incidences of crime that are connected to politics, elections, economic issues, resources and ethnic tensions, among other things. First of all, I believe that as a Government, both the national and county governments need to have programmes to educate and teach people how to take care of their own security. Governments alone cannot handle all security matters if the people do not want to be secure or promote use of safe language that does not promote hatred. We The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Hon. Senators, with only 30 seconds remaining, we are not able to proceed. The Senate now stands adjourned to this afternoon at 2.30 p.m. The Senate rose at 12.28 p.m. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.