Hon. Senators, I have two communications to make. First, I wish to announce that we will have a Kamukunji tomorrow morning at 11.00 a.m. in this Chamber. OPERATIONS OF THE SELECT COMMITTEE ON THE PROPOSED REMOVAL BY IMPEACHMENT OF THE DEPUTY GOVERNOR OF MACHAKOS COUNTY Secondly, I wish to announce that the Select Committee on the impeachment of the Deputy Governor of Machakos County met this morning and carried out their elections. Sen. Kagwe was elected as Chairperson and Sen. (Dr.) Zani as the Vice Chairperson. The Committee will be reporting to the House its findings on Monday, 11th August, 2014 at 2.30 p.m.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. The microphones are not working.

Order, Senators, our technicians are working on the system. Is it on?

It is on now!

Good. Let us proceed. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Sen. Sijeny, you may proceed. REPORT ON THE GENERAL STATUS OF THE ROADS WHICH ARE UNDER CONSTRUCTION OR REFURBISHMENT IN KENYA

Mr. Speaker, I beg to lay the following Paper on the table of the House today, Wednesday, 6th August, 2014:- A report from the Ministry of Transport and Infrastructure on the general status of the roads which are under construction or refurbishment in Kenya. I am doing this in my capacity as the Vice Chairperson of the Committee. I beg to lay the report on the Table.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to lay the following Paper on the Table of the House, today, Wednesday, 6th August, 2014:- The Report of the Senate Standing Committee on Finance, Commerce and Budget on the Cash Disbursement Schedule for County Governments for the Fiscal Year 2014/2015.

Next Order.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to give notice of the following Motion:- THAT, the Senate adopts the Report of the Standing Committee on Finance, Commerce and Budget on the Cash Disbursement Schedule for county governments for the Fiscal Year 2014/2015.

Next Order. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise to request a statement from the Chairperson of the Committee on Education on the status of staffing in schools specifically in Lokirian Primary School in Turkana County. In the statement, the chairperson should:- (1) Explain why Lokirian Primary School in Turkana County has a severe shortage of teachers to the extent that police officers who are deployed to enhance security have volunteered to take on the role of teaching. (2) State the specific steps that the national and county governments have taken to remedy the situation since the problem of under-staffing in public schools in marginalized areas has always been there. (3) Explain if it is fair for such disadvantaged students to take the same national examinations with privileged students in well equipped schools. (4) State if the Teachers Service Commission (TSC) and the Ministry of Education are aware of this problems and the measures taken to improve teachers staffing in such institutions. Thank you, Mr. Speaker sir.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

What is it Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale?

Mr. Speaker, the matter raised by the nominated Senator is so important that it goes beyond Turkana County. You are aware that the TSC has recently released the number of places that they want to offer each school and every county to try and achieve some form of balance in the discrepancy of teachers in the country. Maybe this is an opportunity for the Chairperson to also tell us the criteria that was used to allocate the given number of positions to various counties and why certain schools were allowed to recruit and others are not going to enjoy the same privilege

Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, I am sure you have been a very faithful Member of this House and you recall the words of the Senator from Meru County, that you do not load his statement. I, therefore, recommend that Sen. Nabwala’s statement is taken as she read it and that yours will also be a second statement to the same committee.

This is so that you can deal, especially with your own use of the word “grave”. I think the situation of Lokirian Primary School is grave. We do not want to complicate it with yours. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, we seem to have shifted. Normally, when there is a request, we are allowed to make further requests, but let me also make a request that may not be of---

By the way, just on that one, Sen. Wetangula, that is a practice we should actually discourage. A statement should be specific. We have allowed that practice, but it is not the proper one.

But because of the critical national importance of this matter, I do not know if you watched TV yesterday and saw police, administrative police constables with Kalashnikovs on their back, purporting to be teaching standard one children. How can a child of seven years concentrate on learning from a person who is not a trained teacher at all and wearing a Kalashnikov on the shoulder and purporting to be teaching? The question I want to ask the chairperson of the committee, that that situation is very dire---

Yes, it is.

My distinguished friend and colleague and party chairman from Turkana is here appreciating and nodding that the lady has done a good job. I have been speaking to KNUT and they tell me that the natural attrition in teaching, teachers who die and those who retire, are much more than what the Government recruits per annum. This means that teaching in schools, particularly primary schools is going down and down to the level that what you find in all urban areas---

(Hon. Ethuro)

Mr. Speaker, I am asking a question.

(Hon. Ethuro)

Okay let me just conclude. What is this Government doing to redress the imbalance in staffing of teachers in schools, particularly rural schools and the marginalized counties like Turkana, Marsabit, Mandera, Wajir, Bungoma and others?

I will leave it to the discretion of the Chairperson to satisfy himself on whether all those counties qualify to be marginalized.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I was hoping to get a chance to raise a point of order earlier when Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale was speaking. I know that I have asked this question over and over again, and you have ruled on how we address Senators in this House. Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale addressed Sen. Catherine as Nominated Senator and Sen. Wetangula called her “that lady.” The Standing Orders are very clear on how a Senator should be referred to. Regardless of whatever they call us out there, I think that in this House, it should be out of order for them to refer to other Senators whatever they feel like.

I am sorry, Sen. Wangari, the system cannot tell exactly whether you want your request to come after or during. But I note the issue that The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I want it to go on record that Sen. Wetangula said that the police officers were “purporting”. Were they purporting or they were teaching? If they were teaching who gave them permission to teach? If they were rescuing the situation, were they purporting or they were actually teaching? I think that “purporting” and “teaching” are two different words. Could Sen. Wetangula tell us what he really meant?

Order! Order! There is really no debate there. The way you use words is basically to express your own appreciation of the situation. As far as Sen. Wetangula is concerned, maybe he wanted to convince the House that it is not possible to teach and, at the same time, hold an AK47. He even gave a reason that they are not qualified to teach. The only thing that Sen. Wetangula does not appreciate is that maybe under the circumstances of a place like Lokiriama, the pupils can learn more under a teacher with an AK47, because they will be more assured that they are protected.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. While I know that in this country, even chiefs and other people do volunteer, I wanted to ask earlier if, indeed, my Senator, who is also my leader from Western, was in order to say that the police had AK47 rifles. I never saw on television AK47 rifles in the class. I think that it would be wrong for us to discourage people who have volunteered to help, where we know that situations are very dire. In fact, what is happening is a result of our mistakes as leaders.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I do not know which channel she watched. There are many Senators here who can testify, probably even across, that those Administration Police (AP) constables had Kalashnikovs. I am not complaining. Turkana is a security operation area and for anybody to carry a Kalashnikov is not offensive. But to go before a Standard One child to teach with a Kalashnikov is, definitely, a state of fright for the children.

Order, Senators! By the way, Sen. Elachi, you are not the Chairperson of the Committee on Education. The last time I checked, it was Sen. Daniel Karaba. Again, this Statement has not been responded to yet. So, let the Vice Chairperson tell us when they will bring the Statement and then we will interrogate the Statement. The Committee will confirm whether or not, there was an AK47 or if there was any teaching that took place. All these issues have been canvassed and will be responded to. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, due to the other requests by the Senators, on behalf of the Committee, we will report back to this House the first Thursday after the recess.

Order, Vice Chairperson! How many Statements do you have? You have two Statements. There was a specific one by Sen. Nabwala and then you now have another Statement, which I said should be separated from the one by Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, which was supported by Sen. Wetangula.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, on behalf of the Committee we will report back to the House on the two Statements on the first Thursday after the recess.

Of course, for the issue raised by Sen. Wetangula in terms of replacing the teachers due to attrition, that is something that the Committee can really dispense with very quickly. This is because the assumption that the Teachers Service Commission (TSC) uses for recruiting teachers is really on the basis of attrition. So, it would be wrong if less teachers are recruited than those lost through attrition.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Watching the Kenya National Union of Teachers (KNUT) Secretary General last night on television speaking in Mombasa, he said that out of the 10,000 new teachers the number that was lost due to attrition last year was 5,500. He said that the balance is only what represents additional teachers. That is what he said yesterday on television.

Order, Senators. Sen. Billow, you are taking us back on an issue I had already ruled on. I thought you are in a nice comfort of the neighbourhood of Sen. Elachi, whom I reconfirm is not the Chairperson of the Education Committee and neither are you. My recommendation was to the Chairperson to establish these facts and come and report to us. That way, we do not have to engage to know which figures are correct.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, you said the committee should deal with this matter. Given that we will be away on recess and by the time we come the TSC will have posted the teachers, it would be a matter of urgency to discuss this matter at the committee level. We should also sort out the issue whether it is appropriate for police officers to purport to be teachers in some of these areas. I know there is need, but is that the right way to dispense of matters of education?

But the matter has come when we should have been on recess. Remember that this week was an extension. Secondly, it is the plenary that will be on recess. The committees will still be at work. I am sure the Members of the Committee, ably represented by the Vice Chairperson have heard the sentiments by the Senators, including yours. They will interrogate the TSC accordingly.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, indeed, we, as a Committee, have a meeting tomorrow. We will discuss that issue as one of our agenda.

Next order. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Senators. We are now in the Committee of the Whole on the County Governments (Amendment) Bill, (Senate Bill No.1 of 2014), otherwise referred to as the Khalwale Amendment. We will go straight to Clause 3. There are two amendments; one sought by Sen. Khaniri and another by Sen. G.G. Kariuki. I will advise and direct that we listen to the amendment by Sen. G.G. Kariuki first.

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir. I do not wish to challenge your decision. However, if we go by the Order Paper, I think my amendment comes first. If you notice, the amendment by Sen. G.G. Kariuki is actually my The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): If you look at the two amendments, Sen. G.G. Kariuki’s amendment is broader. If we discuss and approve it, it would have carried your amendment. I think it would be prudent and a save of time to go that way.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I beg to move:- THAT clause 3 of the Bill be amended by – a) renumbering the proposed new section 6A as section 6A (1); b) Inserting the following new subsections immediately after the new subsection (1) – 2) A County Assembly may, by a resolution supported by at least two thirds of the Members of the County Assembly and with the approval of the Senate, transfer the county government from the physical location specified in the Third Schedule to such other physical location as it may consider appropriate. (3) A County Assembly shall, before passing a resolution under subsection (2), obtain the views of the members of the public within the County. Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, on the Third Schedule----

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order! Please, only move Clause 3.

Order, Sen. Wetangula! What do you want to say?

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir---

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I hope he is not---

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Senators! The two of you cannot be on your feet at the same time. It is Sen. Wetangula on his feet now.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I am sorry I did not seek your permission. I was just telling the distinguished Senator that he will move the amendment on the Schedule when we reach it.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Thank you although that was not your work.

Thank you for reminding me.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): I have to propose first. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir---

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): You can now sit so that we can hear from the others.

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir. I think the procedure would have been that after he read out his amendment, he be given an opportunity to carry the House with him by justifying the amendment. Before he could do so, he was asked to sit down. Maybe it is nice if he could carry all of us with his amendment.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Very well, I think the confusion came with Sen. Wetangula. I accept Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale’s intervention. Therefore, I will reverse my decision and give Sen. G.G. Kariuki the opportunity to move the House with him.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, there should never be any confusion because I was very sure that I will be given an opportunity to explain the reason for this proposal. I think this being a respected House by the people of Kenya, we should also go by their feelings that they recognize this House as a major and very important House in the institution of politics in Kenya. We should also allow members of the public to participate fully according to the Constitution. The original amendment was quite in order as far as I am concerned. I supported the amendment by my colleague over there and I thought we needed to give the public the opportunity because the county government can just sit down and decide that we are going to move this county headquarters to another location without giving the public an opportunity. I am saying this because I have an experience in Laikipia County. Before I thought about the amendment, the County Government of Laikipia had sat down and passed a resolution which was sent to the Clerk of the Senate with a copy to the Speaker informing them that they would want the physical location of the headquarters of the County of Laikipia to be transferred from Nanyuki to Rumuruti.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order! You can only concentrate on Clause 3 and leave Clause 4 because we shall come to it.

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. Then I have not much to add because this is very clear and straight forward amendment. I beg to move.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I rise to support the amendment moved by Sen. G.G. Kariuki. But before doing so, I would like to say that when this Bill was moved, I was away. However, I had drafted a similar amendment. Let me take this first opportunity to thank Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale of Kakamega County for bringing this Bill. It is a very good Bill. Before we pass the Bill, it is at the whims of the governor and the executive to decide to move the county government The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage: In a normal situation, the Clerk’s office should have called both of you. However, we only do so if the amendments are more than ten. Since they were less than ten, that is why they were left as they are. Thank you for your patriotism. We will defer putting the Question for obvious reasons, unless there is somebody else who has an intervention.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, as the originator of the Bill, I fully support this amendment. I am glad to be informed and reminded that things do change. In fact, because this Bill is attempting to mirror what you find in Urban Areas and Cities Act which provides for Nairobi as the Capital City of Kenya, I am reminded of the case of Nigeria and Tanzania. After sometime, Tanzanians discovered that it is better for them to move from Dar es Salaam to Dodoma. Nigeria moved from Lagos to Abuja. Brazil is another example. I have been reminded that by the former Minister for Foreign Affairs and Senate Minority Leader. Things might change in future as we strengthen the counties. Therefore, this opening must be there. We do not want to find ourselves where Tanzanians found themselves in the sense that the Tanzanians were not involved in any way. A decision was just made by the political leadership. They had to resort to the singing of Mbaraka Mwinshehe to carry the country with that decision. I support.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I rise to support the amendment by Sen. G.G. Kariuki. We, as the Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights, sat. We deliberated on this Bill and solicited the views of all the stakeholders under the leadership of the Attorney-General Emeritus . We solicited views from all the stakeholders and drafted an amendment. However, when you look at the amendment by Sen. G.G Kariuki, just like the one by Sen. Khaniri had, you will see that we, as a Committee, agreed to drop our amendment. We agreed to support Sen. G.G. Kariuki’s amendment because it captured the entire issues that we thought needed to be addressed. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage: I see no other interventions. You can proceed, Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr.

.: Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, this is yet another Member of the Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights. I want to confirm that the public is in tandem with the proposed amendment save that we need to reconsider sub clause 3 in terms of when views of members of the public should be obtained. This one suggests that it should be before passing of a resolution. Let me say that as a Member of the Legal Affairs and Human Rights Committee, I want to confirm that this amendment complies with Article 14 of the Constitution where we have given sovereign power to the people to be exercised both at the Senate and at the county assembly. Under sub article (1) we have also given the people of Kenya an opportunity to consider this amendment. As Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale has said and in his wisdom as he was proposing this Bill, the Makueni County may decide that once Konza comes up, we will relocate it to Konza. So, that opportunity should be given to the county and to the members of the public. We do not want to have hiccups of anchoring things in the law that cannot be changed. More importantly, Mr. Temporary Chairperson, law is dynamic. Therefore, we must also, as a legislative organ, recognize that it being dynamic, there is an opportunity for change where the physical location becomes something that can be altered for purposes of enhancing service delivery or for any other purpose that the public may be interested.

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir. I have a small matter which makes a big difference to me since I have now seen how we conduct public hearings in counties. Regarding sub clause (3), a county assembly shall, before passing a resolution---

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Sen. Kajwang. If you want to contribute, then you better let Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. to complete his contribution. You should also press the right button because as long as you press the intervention button, that means you are on a point of order.

.: Thank you, Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, for coming to my rescue. That is what I was talking about. It is possible that we may have to consider the collection of public views under sub clause 3 so that we make this an independent public participation. Before the county assembly passes a resolution, they shall conduct a public hearing under the necessary provisions of the County Governments Act.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, just where Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. left, you cannot really know how to obtain views from members of the public. Is it that if the assembly were to move from Homa Bay where they currently sit to Mbita Market and invite the public so as to seek views with regard to the transfer of the The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Sen. Murkomen! You are a Member of the Speaker’s Panel.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, we should have coached it in the manner in which Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. put it so that it follows the law that has been passed by the County Assembly in terms of the way public hearings will be conducted. That will satisfy me.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Sen. G.G. Kariuki, I can see your intervention. However, you are the Mover of the Motion and you have already spoken. Do you want to say something?

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, we are not supposed to do any kinds of replies in such amendments.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): The computer was showing that you had two requests to speak and one intervention.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, I am sorry about that.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, I want to concur with the sentiments of Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. and Sen. Otieno Kajwang. This clause, as it is, in terms of collection of public views is ambiguous. Unless and until we get a remedy to this through legislation, this does not augur well. If you look at the systems which have been used by assemblies with regard to public participation, we must have a procedure where we have a mode of collecting views.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Sen. Wako, do you want to contribute or do you have an intervention?

I want both.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): No, you cannot want both.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, whereas I appreciate the intervention regarding how public views should be collected, here in Parliament, we normally have public hearings and we get people to listen to what we are saying. It is my considered opinion that this amendment qualifies to do exactly that. We do not want to overregulate. Once we have given a mandate to county assemblies to collect views, honestly, they will do it. It is also up to them, at some point, to make their own regulations regarding how they will do it. We should not start regulating the operations of county assemblies.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, on this particular issue, I think it is good for us to be consistent in drafting. Consistency in drafting means that we use the same words that are in the Constitution and in the County Governments Act. The words used in both are “public participation.” Therefore, we need to amend subsection 3 to say that a county assembly shall; before passing a resolution under sub section 2, facilitate public participation and involvement in the decision. If we have that, the Committee contemplates that since a The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Sen. Wako, you have not shown any intention to move an amendment. Therefore, you cannot discuss as if you have already moved an amendment. You have to amend the amendment. Is that what you want to do? You have to be procedural. Could you, please, put it in writing and submit it although it has been overtaken by events?

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I will do so.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Do we have any other contribution as Mr. Wako fights with his pen?

(Sen. Wetangula)

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Yes, Sen. Wako.

Thank you very much, Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir. I am now ready with the amendment and it reads as follows. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Can you restrict yourself to this amendment?

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, we have come up with how they can participate in accordance with that particular Act. We shall now be coming up with another piece of legislation on how the public itself will be able to participate in that decision. This is the spirit of this amendment. Before a county decides to move the headquarters, the public must be involved in the decision making process.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, since I do not see a major difference from what I proposed; it was obtaining participation where you obtain from the public and the public participates. So, I do not see ambiguity there myself because it is just a matter of saying that it is in line with the Constitution and what not. So, that language, if I understand English language properly, is almost the same. I do not see the difference between participation and collecting public views. That is my understanding. So, I do not think we should really spend a lot of time arguing about one word which means the same. So, if my colleague over there, the Mover of the new amendment will agree, it would go the way it is because you have to ask the public to give their views. How do they give their views? They have either to be called in a hall or anywhere; it is mandatory even here to obtain the views of the public and public participation. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order! You know, as the Mover, if you remove the amendment, it has a different legal situation in the House. I mean, are you refusing the amendment of Sen. Wako?

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I have the Constitution here. He did not specify which section of the Constitution he is talking about. We should go by the Constitution. I am not here to say something which is outside the Constitution. The only thing that Sen. Wako should do is to let us know which section of the Constitution he is reading so that we can also compromise.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Sen. G.G. Kariuki, you have said that Sen. Wako’s amendment does not shift from your view of the whole clause.

It does not.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): So, it is all right?

It is all right the way it is. There is nothing new.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Very well; that decision will be made by the Chair. Since you have accepted that it does not shift the meaning of your amendment to the clause, then we accept it and I will call on Sen. Kajwang.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, thank you very much. I think I agree with Sen. Wako because that is what bothered me earlier. When you say “obtain views,” then it is like you are going to do some referendum or you are going to do some research to know who said “no” and who said “yes.” But when you say “public participation,” then it leaves it there until there is legislation to say exactly how that public participation will be done. I hope this law on public participation comes quickly because as it is now, the county governments are required to facilitate public participation. However, what they do now because I have watched them, it is not really public participation. They go to the market place, they say they are from the county. They have not published anything before like the budgets. They say “we want to do a road, a dam, this or that here, can you give us your views?” People do not know even how much money they have, what is the priority and why they have chosen the dam. Therefore, people actually end up saying that you should not have come here; you have already made a decision. Mr. Temporary Chairperson, that law which has been proposed by the Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights should come quickly so that we can put the county governments to account. We will ask them “did you actually carry out public participation as is required by the law?” We could then have the four corners of the law fixing them and saying “you did not, then do the right thing and this budget of yours should be disqualified. Things like that. Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir, I beg to support the amendment.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Just to shorten further discussions on this, you should look at Articles 118(d) and 196(3) of the Constitution and you have the answers. You do not have to prolong the discussion; it is all in the Constitution. Yes, Sen. Wetangula, unless you have something else--- The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

I do not need to belabour the point. Thank you, Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): I see no further interventions. Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. do you still want to contribute?

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I just want to echo the sentiments of my Chairperson and Sen. Wetangula that, in fact, what we have done is to follow Article 196(2)(b) word for word. I also want to add that the words “public participation” appearing in the County Governments Act, we are preparing legislation on that so that, then, we have the law and phraseology in tandem with one another so that we satisfy Sen. G.G. Kariuki. Thank you, Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I was just going to say exactly what my colleague, Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr. said and tell my colleague, Sen. G.G. Kariuki that his intentions are correct and noble. However, I think exactitude is the essence of law and I think what my other colleagues said is in line with what the Constitution and the County Governments Act says. It is important to be exact in the language that is used so that nobody doubts whatsoever what they are going to do, or when this particular amendment takes effect.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Very well! I will put the question because we have to dispose of this. What is it, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale?

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, looking at the plenary, I can see around 15 delegations. For this reason---

There are others in the lobby here.

Well, I am saying the ones who are here because the question is now about to be put. So, Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I rise on Standing Order No.99 in view of that so as to avoid the disaster of this particular question being put and then---

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Yes, I had already noted that; thank you for your reminder---

If you could wait a little bit longer---

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Yes, we will wait.

Thank you, Mr. Chairperson, Sir.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Yes, Sen. Wetangula?

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

We have enough delegations. We have counted and found out that we have about 27 delegations present that are actually in the lobby. I do not know where the whips are to go and whip people back.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Where is your Whip, as the Senate Minority Leader?

Where is the Whip of the Majority?

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): The issue is that I will put questions on all the deliberations. So, let us, as you look for your Whip to whip or you can also decide to be the whip. Let us proceed. Yes, Sen. Wangari?

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir. Noting that we also have the County Governments Amendment Act coming immediately after Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale’s Bill, will I be in order to request that we also go for the Committee Stage on the same as we also marshal the delegations for voting on the amendments?

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Let us dispose of this and then I will make that decision later. Proceed to the next clause.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): I propose that Clause 4 be part of the Bill. Clause 4 on your paper is written as Third Schedule. Yes, Sen. G.G. Kariuki? Can you put your microphone on? The importance of switching on your microphone is because that is what we use to give you the microphone.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I also want to move:- That, the Third Schedule be amended in row 31 by deleting the words “Nanyuki Urban Area” appearing in the third column and substituting therefor the words “Rumuruti Urban Area”. Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I am speaking on behalf of the Laikipia County Government who sat down and decided to pass a resolution to this effect and also addressed the resolution to the Clerk of the Senate and a copy of the same resolution was sent to the Speaker. This means that all of them sat down and agreed to do this amendment. I am saying this because I am the Senator there, but I did not have any particular interest. I requested the county government to handle this matter because they know the reason they want to be in Rumuruti instead of Nanyuki. That is why when I was thinking about bringing this resolution to this House, but I also decided to do the amendment which you have already done away with. I beg to move the amendment. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I was waiting to hear from the distinguished Senator that he has consulted because these are decisions that must be consultative. Since he has told us that he has consulted the people of Laikipia, anybody who knows the Geography of Laikipia will not slight him for proposing Rumuruti as against Nanyuki which is stuck way on the corner of Nyeri and Meru counties and almost close to Isiolo as well. So, the people of Laikipia will be better served if their headquarters was in Rumuruti. I support the amendment brought by the distinguished Senator.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I want to support that amendment and also would like to confirm that a copy of the letter communicating the decision of the County Assembly of Laikipia to the Senate was availed to me and, therefore, I attest to the factuality of the same. For two weeks or so, I was out of the country. I do not know whether that letter, when it came, was treated in accordance with the provisions of these Standing Orders. The Standing Orders provide that that was a message and, therefore, being a message, it should have been formally tabled and announced by the Speaker to this House. If it was not done, it was an oversight because it is making it difficult for the Senator for Laikipia to convince the House. I would like to state what I got in my capacity and what he has communicated. But if that oversight was there, then I want to urge the office of the Clerk that they should have followed the rules as provided for in the Standing Orders, that that was a Message from the County Assembly; having reached the office of the Speaker, it should have been communicated to this House during plenary. I support.

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir. The message having come to the Committee, we should really be convinced since the Committee has confirmed that it received it and there is a resolution by the County Assembly of Laikipia to have the headquarters in Rumuruti, we should not really doubt and complicate issues with them. I support.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I just want to add my voice to what my colleagues have said. Knowing that it has been a consultative decision as the Senator has said, I think it is only wise for us to support this amendment. Samburu being a neighbour to Laikipia County, I am aware that these discussions even took place before we went into the general elections and there was that pull and push about Rumuruti and Nanyuki. I know that the people of Laikipia would really feel safer in Rumuruti in terms of accessing services since that is more central to the people of Laikipia County. I support.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I stand to support this further amendment. What is more important is the fact that the Senator for Laikipia has confirmed that to this House and he actually has the evidence that he has been instructed on this particular matter by the County Assembly of Laikipia. I would only add that we The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, as I support, I just want to say that at Clause 3, we have put very high standards before you can persuade this Senate to move your headquarters. First, there is the two thirds majority vote and the seek views from the members of the public or facilitate public participation and then you get the Senate to approve by a majority. Although we are creating this for the first time, we can avoid that procedure. If this resolution was made, did it come to this House as a Petition? As a Petition, we would have seen whether it was supported by the two thirds majority. It would have been formally tabled and we would have debated it if necessary and we would be having something to compare with at a later stage. Carrying a resolution of a House with very few people or no quorum could be a bit mischievous, but because the most senior Senator has said so, and we are not moving the headquarters anyway because the first law to make the headquarters is this one, I will accept that we proceed this way for the people of Laikipia. I support.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I also support this amendment and it is important to understand that we have grounds on why the headquarters should be moved. I am happy that the Senator for Laikipia consulted with his people. In the county of Nyamira where I come from, I have read in the newspapers that the Governor wants to move the county headquarters without following the due process. It must be made very clear that to move a county headquarters, there are rules and procedures which must be followed. I support.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Next Clause. Where is Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo? Since he is the Mover and he is not around, the amendment is dropped.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage) Sen. Wetangula you promised that you have soldiers. We now want them because we want to vote. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): The results for Clause 3 are as follows:- Those who voted electronically are 26, plus one who voted manually.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): The results for Clause 4 are as follows: Those who voted electronically are 26, plus Sen. Chelule who voted manually.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): The results for Clause 2 are as follows:-

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Open the bars. THE COUNTY GOVERNMENTS (AMENDMENT) (NO.2) BILL, (SENATE BILL NO.2 OF 2014)

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir.

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Hon. Members, we have more votes to do. Let us continue. Where are the Whips, please, do your work.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I beg to move:-

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Senator. What is your interest?

Thank you for protecting me. I beg to move:- THAT clause 3 of the Bill be amended in the proposed new section 7A by inserting the following new sub-section immediately after sub- section (2) - (3) Despite sub-section (1), a county assembly shall be deemed to be fully and duly constituted for the first sitting notwithstanding the death, on or before the date of the first sitting of the county assembly, of a member nominated under paragraphs (b) and (c) of Article 177(1) of the Constitution. Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir, this emanated from the debate that was on the Floor during the Bill’s Second Reading from the Senator of Homa Bay, Sen. Kajwang. The Senator noted and I took it up that we may also not be looking forward to death, but if one of the county assembly members dies before the sitting is constituted under Article 177 of the Constitution, then the county will grind to a halt. This was just to correct that. We should not hold county assemblies at ransom if someone dies. If death occurs, the county assembly goes on. Maybe to refresh Members on what this Bill was about; it is on the constitution of the county assemblies under Article 177. The issue was that the swearing in of members elected through party lists was delayed last year for up to five months after elections. In the next election, this can be corrected and the Independent Electoral and Boundaries Commission (IEBC) generate the list and disputes sorted out early enough, so that they are sworn in together with the elected members. That way, they can participate in the activities of the county assembly right from the beginning as it should be the case. That then raised the concern by Sen. Kajwang; what if somebody dies? Does it then mean we do not constitute the county assembly? This amendment will take care of that problem. If death occurs, the county assembly will still go on and be convened for a first sitting.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I want to support this amendment and appeal to Members that in the Third Reading, there should The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): That is in order, Sen. Anyang’-Nyong’o.

Mr. Temporary Chairman, this deals with the issue of if somebody dies before the constitution of the assembly. However, it does not deal with the real reason why last time they delayed for almost five months. This is a matter that should come in another amendment in another Act of Parliament or Bill. After the list went to the Independent Electoral and Boundaries Commission (IEBC) and a national election took place, those people were assumed to have been elected, as a matter of fact. I do not know why the IEBC went through review after review and to court after court denying these people the right to participate. We should amend the law so that after the list has been put in place before the election, if there is any dispute, then it is brought forward as a petition so that these people are elected to constitute the assembly. If we let what happened the last time happen again, then these assemblies will never sit. Probably another amendment will be done in the Elections Act to deal with the issue. I support.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Very well, I see no other person interested in contributing to this. We will, therefore, have the Division Bell rung. We will move to voting and order that the Division Bell be rung for five minutes. However, let us first confirm the numbers that we have. I think we have the requisite numbers and we can now move to vote on Clause 3 as proposed by Sen. Martha Wangari.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Hon. Senators, I want to announce the results of the first division, that Clause 3 be amended as proposed by Sen. Wangari.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): On the second question of division, that Clause 2, the Title and Clause 1 be part of the Bill, the results are as follows.

Nil The “Ayes” have it.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage) In both divisions, the number of Senators was 27. May I now call the Mover, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale?

Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir---

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale! Draw the bars and open the doors.

Okay, proceed, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale.

Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir, I beg to move that the Committee do report to the Senate its consideration of the County Governments (Amendment) (No.1) Bill (Senate Bill No.1 of 2014) and its approval thereof with amendments. Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir, I also beg to move that the Committee do report to the Senate its consideration of the County Governments (Amendment) Bill (No. 2) Bill ( Senate Bill No.2 of 2014) and its approval thereof without amendments.

With amendments

Was Sen. Wangari’s Bill amended?

Yes.

Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir, I also beg to move that the Committee do report to the Senate its consideration of the County Governments (Amendment) (No.2) Bill (Senate Bill No.2 of 2014) and its approval thereof with amendments.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): I therefore put the question that the Committee do report to the House its consideration of the County Governments (Amendment) (No.1) Bill (Senate Bill No.1 of 2014) and the County Governments (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill (Senate Bill No.2 of 2014) as read out by Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale.

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I beg to report that a Committee of the Whole has considered the County Governments (Amendment) (No. 1) Bill (Senate Bill No. 1 of 2014 and the County Governments (Amendment) (No.2) Bill (Senate Bill No. 2 of 2014) and the approved the same with amendments.

I now call upon the Mover, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, to respond.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I now beg to move that the House doth agree with the Committee in the said Reports.

He did not mention your name. Is he the one seconding?

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I request the Senator for Bungoma, Sen. Wetangula, to second.

Proceed, Senator.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I beg to second.

Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale? The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I beg to move that the County Governments (Amendment) (No. 1) Bill (Senate Bill No.1 of 2014) be now read a Third Time. On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker. Do I also move the second Bill, because I am doing both?

Proceed, Senator.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I also beg to move that the County Governments (Amendment) (No.2) Bill (Senate Bill No.2 of 2014) be now read a Third Time.

Who is your seconder?

Madam Temporary Speaker, my seconder for these Bills is Sen. Wetangula, the distinguished Senator of the County of Bungoma.

I second.

I propose that we do the two Bills together so that we go into one division. I will now propose the question, which is that the County Governments (Amendment) (No.1) Bill (Senate Bill No. 1 of 2014) and the County Governments (Amendment (No.2) Bill (Senate Bill No.2 of 2014) be now read a Third Time.

Before we proceed, I can see two requests. Let me give you the Floor, Sen. Wetangula.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I will be very brief. One is to congratulate the sponsors of these Bills and, two, to thank the Senate for debating, passing and voting this afternoon in division. This is another milestone in the protection of counties and like we have said before, counties are about the people of this country. The interests of the people of this country in counties are articulated and defended in this Senate. That we have passed a Bill and it is going to be law to determine the headquarters of each county goes a long way in forestalling any future arguments, quarrels and even conflicts on where the headquarters of the county is likely to be. This will help in stabilizing counties and we do hope that as we go to a referendum, we are going to give more money to counties so that counties like Laikipia and Nyandarua that do not have headquarters can have enough money – including Lamu, I am told – to---

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Chairman, Sir.

Yes, what is out of order? You did not even log in! The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker. You hear the Senator for Bungoma say that we are heading for a referendum and as we head for a referendum, we should be increasing. Is he in order to mislead the country that we are heading for a referendum?

Senate Minority Leader, are you misleading the country?

Madam Temporary Speaker, you can see that is a carefully and mischievous opinion masquerading as a point of order. It was my opinion that we are going to a referendum. If it is your opinion that we are not, you keep it. What is out of order about that?

Madam Temporary Speaker, you heard the hon. Senator use the word “mischievous”. I rose on a point of order and simply pointed out that there is no referendum that has been approved or endorsed by IEBC. Is it in order for him to accuse me of being mischievous? That word must be withdrawn and he must apologize.

Senate Minority Leader, I honestly do not find anything mischievous in his observation.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I withdraw the word “mischievous” and replace it with an even better word “a miscalculation”. The whole country knows that we are asking for a referendum. We have put a committee of experts in place. The committee of experts has met the IEBC and they have discussed and plans are in place. Those who do not see, I remind you of the great words of Jesus in the Bible: “They have eyes but they do not see, they have ears but they do not hear, they have mouths but they do not speak”. This is the problem we have in this country. That is not the issue. The issue is that this Bill is going to help stabilize counties and that each one of us has a duty, including yourself, to support the allocation of more funds to the counties so that we can be able to stabilize and strengthen devolution.

On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker. When somebody says that “we are heading”, it does not mean that it is official. “Heading” means that we are going a certain direction. So, just English for my dear friend, Senator from somewhere---

Order! Sen. (Prof.) Anyang’-Nyong’o, you are absolutely out of order. You must withdraw and apologize. You cannot make that kind of derogatory statement concerning another Senator. Withdraw unconditionally and apologize.

Madam Temporary Speaker, we are all from somewhere, but just to be precise, it is the Senator for Mandera.

Senator, you did not give your apology. We want to record your apology. I think this is a very serious issue.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I do apologize and withdraw and instead of the word “somewhere”, substitute it with the word “Mandera”. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Madam Temporary Speaker, now that we have insulated the seat of Government in those respective physical addresses, I hope that the Jubilee Government is going to remember what President Kibaki and Raila Odinga had started with these county headquarters. I am aware that plans had been drawn and architectural designs had been made where each county headquarters would have a model county assembly, a model county headquarters and a model Governor’s residence. I hope that the Jubilee Government in these remaining three years will fulfill this. The second point is that, I want to say that---

On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker. Is the Senator in order to blame the Jubilee Government while he knows very well that the Governors have already been given the money to build their residences and so on? I think it would be in order for this House to be guided that it is up to the county governments and especially the Governors to make sure that where the allocations were, they are done correctly but not the national Government.

Madam Temporary Speaker, Sir, I am glad to be informed that the Jubilee Government has now taken money to Governors, but I was not speaking towards resources in terms of money. I meant the architectural designs so that the county assemblies and the Governors’ residence are standardized. If you go to South Africa and Ontario, the headquarters are standardized. This is something that must be planned out because we have some Governors like the Governor of Kilifi who has gone and bought a residence worth Kshs145 million. This is a matter that is a subject of an audit query. This is because they are not guided. Secondly, I would like the House to note with thanks that the two Senators who have led this House in this Bill are both from the United Democratic Forum (UDF) Party, and for this reason, I want to take this opportunity to thank two people namely; Musalia Mudavadi the party leader and Martha Wangari. Musalia Mudavadi because of his steady steering of the ship, we have been able to come this far and Martha Wangari for the reason that inspite of her defecting from the opposition where the party found itself after elections, she still worked with me as a rebel, but we are willing to accommodate her when she changes her mind and realizes that her party did not win the elections. The party lost and this is why it is on the opposition side. Finally, like Sen. Wetangula who spoke before me, the issue of the referendum did not start with Okoa Kenya movement. The issue of the referendum started as soon as President Kibaki promulgated the new Constitution because he did so knowing that 20 per cent of that document required to be re-looked at. This is all that we are doing in keeping with the very proud attitude that we carried on the day of---

On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker. It is already 5.15 p.m. Instead of dwelling on issues that are, right now in this House, fairly irrelevant, would I be in order to propose that we deal with the matter at hand and leave issues of the referendum for the right time at the right place?

Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, I think that intervention makes sense. Could you conclude your remarks so that we move to division? The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Madam Temporary Deputy Speaker, I would like to appreciate the intervention by my colleague; that he is feeling the referendum. It is good! Even your Governors have joined us. I support.

Madam Temporary Speaker, first, I would like to congratulate all those people who have brought these amendments. We allowed these amendments because we were just beginning. As you realized, the whole of last year, we were mostly on Motions as we prepared to bring Bills and because we were not quite ready, Members were exercising their right to bring Bills to the House. Both of these Bills were really a one or two clauses amendments. Now, one or two clauses amendments to an existing Bill should actually be part of the Statute Law Miscellaneous (Amendment) Bill which is brought to this House by the Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights. Therefore, my plea now is that in future if you have one or two amendments to an existing Bill, bring that amendment to the Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights and we shall bring a composite statute law composed of all the amendments. We shall have one sitting and we shall complete it. Secondly, is with regard to the headquarters. I personally would be very hesitant to say that all the counties of Kenya should have one plan for how the State House should look like, the administrative block, et cetera, in uniform. That reminds me of colonialism. It is in colonialism that you will find that most of the high courts of former British colonies are all looking the same. Let there be a ceiling or a limit on the amount of money to be spent on this and let each county have its own architectural drawings which fit in with the environment which is there in that county. I support.

Hon. Senators, for the sake of time, I will order that the Division Bell be rung for five minutes, but I will put the questions distinctively for the two different Bills and the votes will also be separate. Could the Division Bell be rung for five minutes?

Order, hon. Senators! You can now log in. Sen. Orengo, please, go back to your seat and log in, so that we have the numbers. If you do not have your card, please, register so that we do not miss your vote. Hon. Senators, I will now put the question on the first Bill by Sen. (Dr.) Boni Khalwale, which is, that the County Governments (Amendment) (No. 1) Bill, (Senate Bill No.1 of 2014) be now read a Third Time. Hon. Senators, we have to start afresh because we want to establish the numbers. Please, just remove your card and log in afresh.

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Hon. Senators, the results are as follows:-

Order, Senators! Sen. Wangari is not in the House. I will now put the Question on the second Bill by Sen. Wangari, which is, that the County Governments (Amendment) (No.2) Bill, (Senate Bill No.2 of 2014) be now read a Third Time. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Everybody has voted and those who wanted to be assisted have been assisted. The clerks will proceed to print the results.

Remove the bars and open the door. Next Order!

I am not seeing any requests but when we last had this Motion on the Floor, the Senate Minority Leader was on the Floor and he had 43 minutes remaining. Proceed.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker, for giving me a chance to contribute to this very critical Report. I had started by lauding the Committee for doing such great work and even coming up with the Draft Bill. I also pointed out to the Chair of the Committee that there is or has been an identical Bill in the Lower House and that probably they should look at the content and see if it is radically different from our Draft Bill. Madam Temporary Speaker, minerals play a very critical role in many economies. In Africa, countries with vast mineral resources where they have been well managed have made major strides in their economic development. Before Zimbabwe veered off the road, it had one of the strongest sub-saharan economies because of mineral extraction. The engine of the South African economy, which has of late been overtaken by Nigeria as the largest Gross Domestic Product (GDP) is also mineral-based. Angola has become immensely rich with a very huge GDP and per capita because of extraction of hydro- carbons, commonly called oil. Congo has probably the richest reserves of minerals that have never benefitted the people of the country. Eritrea has vast deposits of gold and other minerals but it is on the wrong path; the money has not benefitted its people. That is why when we talk of mineral wealth, you either get it right from the start or you get it wrong and you will find it very difficult to come back to the beaten path. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Shame! Bure kabisa!

Madam Temporary Speaker, the land on which these minerals are was illegally and unlawfully appropriated at Independence. These people are walking away smiling by selling and getting illegal compensations; something they never owned in the first place. We have the TJRC Report and the Ndung’u Report and if the Jubilee Coalition Government wants Kenyans to believe that they are interested in dealing with the issue of land, we do not need these populist stunts that are taking us nowhere. If you want to solve the problems of Lamu, start with Mpeketoni. Who were the original owners? In Taita Taveta, how can two families own 70 per cent of a county? If you go to Kwale, Kilifi and Mombasa counties, they stole everything. The same applies to Nakuru County and everywhere else. If we want to right the wrongs of this country - then and only then - we must be honest with ourselves. We must be honest with the country. It is not enough to shout the name of James Orengo or Naomi Sidi while forgetting that the bigger thieves are in the closet. We shall open those closets and expose them because the facts are there. You can suppress or postpone but you can never kill facts; facts remain facts and nobody is going The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Madam Temporary Speaker, if this is not a cover up and, in fact, a bigger fraud, I do not know what it is. We are watching! I have asked; when the Cabinet Secretary for Lands, Housing and Urban Development closed the registry in Nairobi, why would the President of a country visit a closed registry twice? What was he looking for? Then thereafter, the Cabinet Secretary says that the President does not own any land in a most unsolicited manner. Nobody had asked her whether the President owns any land or not.

They are undermining the work of the National Lands Commission!

Order, Senator! If you want to speak, you will log in.

Madam Temporary Speaker, then all of a sudden, you hear an order contrary to the Constitution to cancel all the title deeds. The new Constitution has brought new responsibility to leaders. Article 135 says that every decision by the President must be in writing, signed and sealed. Where is this order in relation to Article 135 to cancel title deeds? We are not protecting anybody who has illegally acquired land, but we must deal with everybody who has illegally acquired land. What is the role of the National Land Commission? The constitutional mandate lies with the National Land Commission. You recently read in the newspapers that oil was found in Lamu. I am sure what they are trying to do is to cause confusion, grab this land and then starting chopping blocs and selling them to new oil prospectors. That is why it is so relevant that as we deal with the new found wealth of this country, at the heart and centre of this is the question of land. Whether it is land in Turkana, Isiolo or Mombasa, Kenyans being ingenious, you might find them with title deeds on the high seas so that when oil is found in our maritime territory, people will turn up with title deeds and say that this is what I own and I need to be compensated. We need to be eternally vigilant to make sure that the property and the wealth of the people of this country is protected. Madam Temporary Speaker, when an economy that is doing badly as we are, people go and borrow money using title deeds; banks can only give you money on the basis of a title deed. When a Head of State talks like Kimunya who once said that a title deed was just a piece of paper - It brought such chaos in the banking sector that for 12 months, banks were not sure whether they would lend money on the basis of a piece of paper. The National Land Commission (NLC) Act is very clear. If a title is wrongly acquired, like we know people have acquired titles wrongly, there is due process, so that you can maintain sanity and stability in the economy. We are in a country where tourism is dead, corruption is hitting the ceiling, ethnicity is now the order of the day and everytime we talk about security. It is like a circus in an Egyptian zoo. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. Despite the problem I have with my voice, I had to make sure that I contribute to this Report. I support it and would like to congratulate the Member who came up with the Motion which led to the formation of the Ad hoc Committee. Also, I would like to congratulate the Committee for having taken its time and come up with a very elaborate Report, which will lead to a legislation which will clearly set out how the natural resources of these counties will be exploited and how the benefit will actually be shared. This is because we are coming from a point where land, which basically is the holder of all these resources, has been dished out from a central point without taking into account the host communities. These resources have been exploited without anything accruing to the local communities and counties. Madam Temporary Speaker, I would like to note that in the definition of the natural resources to which the Bill is to apply, considering the current situation, a resource like wind should be added. This is because it is a source of renewable energy. We are moving out of the petroleum based power generation to clean energy like solar and wind. I would like this area to be captured at the beginning when the Bill is brought to the House. It has to be captured clearly so that it is not one of the resources which will be added later. That is the area I would like captured from the beginning when the Bill is being brought to the House. I come from an area where the whole county is trust land other than a small adjudicated area. Trust lands have been under county councils before the new Constitution came into effect. Currently, we are having a situation where there was a lot of information in the media about the Lake Turkana Wind Power Project which is in my county. We are having problems with the project because of this kind of consideration not being given to the community. We have a case where five foreigners came and acquired 150 acres of community land without the knowledge of the community. Trust land is very clear and it states that the community has to be informed. There is no free The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker, for this opportunity to contribute a word or two in this process. First and foremost, I would like to congratulate my Chairperson, Dr. Agnes Zani, for having provided extra-ordinary leadership. This document, by mere perusal, demonstrates that there was a lot of seriousness attached to the work that was done by this Committee to a point where we suggested legislative framework so that we do not have mere talk as it is in most of the Senate Motions but culminate into some action. We hope that those who care so much for the counties will see this Bill through, particularly in a situation where we will remain balanced with the national Government. So, I do believe the Senate will rise above partisanship and very narrow parochial interests to ensure that we adopt this report; and we will, equally, adopt the very extensive provisions of the Bill which tend to bring in a form of equity. Madam Temporary Speaker, we have seen countries whose natural resources have been more of a curse than blessings. I think it is important that we provide a framework as Kenya is now going to minerals. We have had discoveries lately in Lamu; we have had a lot of other discoveries of natural gas in Wajir and a lot of counties that were hitherto some of the most marginalized counties; these counties were ranked as some of the poorest counties; but now, they have discovered enormous wealth. It is high time that having past experience of this nation, we must protect these counties from the potentiality of exploitation and grabbing by those in power. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Order, Senator! Sen. Hassan, you will have a balance of nine minutes.

Hon. Senators, it is now 6.30 p.m. and it is time to adjourn the Senate to tomorrow, Thursday, 7th August, 2014, at 2.30 p.m. The Senate rose at 6.30 p.m. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.