Hon. Senators, I wish to communicate that tomorrow Wednesday 18th February, 2015 at 11.00 a.m. we will hold a special

in this Chamber. So, all Senators must be present. Thank you.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to lay the following Papers on the Table of the Senate today, Tuesday 17th February, 2015:- 1. The Budget Policy Statement, and 2. The Medium Term Debt Management Strategy Thank you

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to give notices of the following Motions:- THAT, this House adopts The Medium Term Debt Management Strategy 2014 laid on the Floor of the House today Tuesday, 17th February, 2015. ADOPTION OF BUDGET POLICY STATEMENT THAT, this House adopts the Medium Term Budget Policy Statement laid on the Floor of the House today Tuesday, 17th February, 2015. Thank you.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise to seek the following Statement from the Chairperson, Committee on Energy. In the Statement, the Chairperson should state the following:- (i) The budget allocated for rural electrification in Makueni County for the year: (a) 2012-2013; (b) 2013-2014; (ii) The number of primary schools connected during the period in (a) and (b) above; (iii) State the reason(s) for the delay in the process during the period; (iv) The names of contractors who have been awarded contracts during the said periods and the projects completed; (v) Explain the reasons for the stalled projects in several areas in the County; (vi) State the reason(s) for the delay in connection and delivery of materials to the already existing connections, and lastly; (vii) State whether there are any efforts being made to enlighten the primary schools on the plans to connect them to electricity. Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Chairperson of the Committee, Sen. Keter.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I will respond in two weeks.

It is so ordered, two weeks. PROPOSED ALLOCATION OF LAND AT KANYONYONI IN KITUI COUNTY TO THE NIS

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise on a matter that has been going on for a long time. This is in relation to the proposed allocation of land at Kanyonyoni in Kitui County to the National Intelligence Service (NIS). The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Did you hear the distinguished Senator from Kitui County, who is also the Wiper Party Chairman, declare that in our country, this is the era of land grabbing. Is there an era of that kind?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am surprised that the distinguished Senator can raise such an issue when he knows that schools’ and churches’ land has been grabbed. It is even more serious because those pieces of land are being grabbed by private developers. Our land is being grabbed by the Government of the Republic of Kenya. Mr. Speaker, Sir, you may be aware that the NIS is grabbing land all over. They have grabbed land in Lamu, Laikipia and---

Order! Senator, proceed with the Statement.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am seeking your indulgence in ensuring that this matter is dealt with quickly and that the directions that you gave are adhered to. With that, this House can now go back and resolve accordingly that the land be reverted to the people of Kitui and that the letter of allocation issued to the Treasury is cancelled forthwith. Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Vice-Chairperson of the Committee.

What is it Sen. Khaniri?

Mr. Speaker, Sir, the matter that has been raised by the Senator for Kitui County is a matter that was raised in this House and it was handled by my Committee. You will remember that you instructed us to convene a meeting of all the interested stakeholders. We had a meeting with the Cabinet Secretary, the NIS, the Governor and even the Senator himself and we eventually tabled a Report here with our recommendations. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Shame! Shame!

Order, Sen. Khaniri! Are you responding now?

Yes, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Okay, proceed.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, as I said, the Government is setting a very bad precedence, acting in impunity in total disregard of the rule of law. The Government is defying instructions from the court, court orders and even the Senate. We, as a Committee, stand by the Report that we tabled here. Therefore, there are no further investigations to be done by my Committee.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. The Chairperson of the Committee on Land and Natural Resources has just informed us the names of the stakeholders who were consulted. In view of the provisions of Article 67 of the Constitution that speaks to the National Land Commission (NLC), was the Chair in order to leave out the NLC when we know that this matter rests with no other office than Dr. Swazuri’s office?

Just before the Vice-Chairperson responds, Sen. (Dr.) Machage.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, having heard the response of the Chairperson of the Committee on Land and Natural Resources and the disgust with which he has expressed his concern over the impunity and irresponsive behaviour of the Ministry, especially the Cabinet Secretary and the NLC, would I then be in order to ask you to order the two to appear before our full House Committee to express their views on the same?

Sen. Abdirahman, are you on the same?

Yes, Mr. Speaker, Sir. We have heard what has transpired with the Committee that is headed by Sen. Khaniri. It has been very difficult to even get the Cabinet Secretaries or any other Government officials to give their responses in the National Assembly and the Senate. Since this matter is unresolved, probably it could have been directed to the Committee on Implementation. This is the only way we could have enforced it. This is because many a time, Motions have been passed here and reports are brought here, but they are never enforced. Probably, we could use the Committee on Implementation to put on hold this matter and see how it can progress. That is my proposal. Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, on the two issues raised by Sen. (Dr.) Machage and Sen. Abdirahman, it is you to respond because Sen. (Dr.) Machage wants to know if we can summon them to the Committee of the Whole. He is seeking for you guidance. Similarly, Sen. Abdirahman wants this matter to be referred to the Committee on Implementation. Therefore, it is not in my purview to respond to that. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

What Sen. (Dr.) Machage is asking of the Speaker can be done by the Vice-Chairperson of the Committee. I do not need to do it from here. The proposal by Sen. Abdirahman is in order, we have a Committee dealing with implementation of our resolutions. It is fair that the Implementation Committee gets seized of the matter and prosecutes it.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I just want to draw the attention of the House to the fact that the Motion was not debated and passed so that it can go to the Committee on Implementation. You will recall that that was the time we were adjourning and the Chair simply gave a report and we reacted to it. It never went to debate. Therefore, there was no resolution passed. The Chair of the Committee on Land and Natural Resources said he was going to intervene during the period of recess. I am aware that the Clerk wrote to the Commission, but I am not aware of any response from them.

Let us establish the facts, then we can give direction tomorrow. DESTRUCTION OF TURKANA ECO-LODGE AT KAINUK TOWN

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I wish to request for a Statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Security and Foreign Relations on destruction of Turkana South Eco-lodge at Kainuk Town. I request the Chairperson to make the following clarifications:- (i) Explain the extent of destruction on the property. (ii) Explain the motive and the perpetrators of these serious crimes against Turkana County and its people. (iii) Confirm the number of National Police Reserve and civilians killed to date and explain the cause of these killings. (iv) State the steps being undertaken by the national government to compensate the affected families for loss of their loved ones and property. (v) Indicate the steps the Government will take to avert more killings and sabotage of this project and other projects like schools and roads in the County of Turkana.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I request for two weeks because the Statements requires a thorough investigation on what has been raised by the distinguished Senator for Turkana County.

You may also confirm what we heard that as you went about your business, you were under attack.

Order, Senators! The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Hon. Senators, pursuant to the provisions of Standing Order No.41(1) of the Senate, I wish to convey a Message from His Excellency the President asking Parliament to approve Joseph Kipchirchir Boinet for appointment as the Inspector-General of Police. In the message, His Excellency the President conveys that in exercise of powers vested in him under Article 245(2)(a) of the Constitution and Section 12(2) of the National Police Act, 2011, as amended by Section 11 of the National Police Service (Amendment) Act, 2014 and further amendment by Section 86 of the Security Laws (Amendment) Act, 2014, he nominates Joseph Kipchirchir Boinet for appointment to the position of the Inspector-General of Police. Hon. Senators, Article 245(2)(a) of the Constitution states:- “The Inspector-General is appointed by the President with the approval of Parliament” Further, Section 12 of the National Police Service Act, No.11 of 2011 as amended by Section 11 of the National Police Service (Amendment) Act, 2014 and further amendment by Section 86 of the Security Laws (Amendment) Act, 2014 states:- “12(i) Pursuant to Article 245(2)(a) of the Constitution, the Inspector- General of the Service shall be appointed by the President with the approval of Parliament. (ii)The President shall, within 14 days after a vacancy occurs in the Office of the Inspector-General nominate a person for appointment as an Inspector- General and submit the name of the nominee to Parliament.” Hon. Senators, I wish to note that this is the first time that the two Houses of Parliament are required to approve the appointment of a candidate to a public office. Therefore, as you can expect in such situations, there are grey areas or uncharted waters with respect to the process. However, as Senators are aware, the Houses of Parliament are not helpless as the Speakers are empowered to deal with such scenarios. Consequently, in order for Parliament to effectively conduct the vetting process, the Speaker of the National Assembly and I, have consulted on the best way of facilitating Parliament to discharge this important duty. In the interest of the economy, efficiency and cognizant of the Standing Orders of both Houses and the requirements of the Public Appointments Parliamentary Approval Act, 2011, we have agreed to proceed as follows:- (i) That the vetting of the nominee for appointment as Inspector-General of Police shall be conducted jointly by the Committees of the two Houses mandated to deal with matters of national security. The vetting process will, therefore, be conducted by the Standing Committee on National Security and Foreign Relations of the Senate and the The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

On a Point of Order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. I have two points of order; one is to seek for your indulgence and the other one on your Communication. As you said, this is uncharted waters, could you clarify further where we shall go because the Report that comes here will only look for a decision to adopt any report or to reject it? If the two Houses adopt, then the officer would have gotten the job. If they reject, the officer would have lost the job. Could you clarify what would happen if either of the Houses rejects and the other one approves? My second point of order which was for your indulgence was that you had given me an opportunity to seek for a Statement, but you overlooked me on the screen. Could you allow me to request for that Statement before we go to the next order? The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

I thought I had Sen. Orengo before Sen. Musila. It shall be in that order. I was looking to my left, when I looked to my right and if Sen. Haji is still persists, he may just be lucky to be counted as well.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise under Standing Order No.33, to seek leave of the House and the Chair to move the adjournment of the Senate for the purposes of discussing the following--

Proceed Senator. What is it, Sen. Khaniri?

Order! Just be brief Senator. Sen. Orengo is raising a different matter. That is the point and you are right. Therefore, let us entertain interventions on the message from the President.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I was raising an issue on point of order like Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale because you had also allowed me two issues and I raised only one. As I stood to raise the second one, you went to another matter. Will I be in order to request that we exhaust yours and then go back to Statements?

Sen. Musila, I thought good neighbourliness has certain advantages; one of them is that we are within earshot. Sen. Khaniri had raised the issue that we only entertain interventions for this one, I will come back to yours at some stage if I will make it. What is it, Sen. Haji?

On a Point of Order, Mr. Speaker, Sir. If you are talking about Kapedo, we were never attacked. I am shocked to hear somebody asking me whether we were attacked because we were not attacked. For the benefit of the House, the meeting was very cordial. We did not have any problem with both--

Order, Senator! We wanted to know whether you were attacked or not. We are happy that you were not under attack. On the issue raised by Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, the first scenario both Houses rejecting, you have already determined yourselves that it fails. The question is: if one House approves and another one does not approve, what happens? It is still rejected, so both Houses must approve for the nominee to be carried. Yours and the one by Sen. Musila - I know many other Senators had requests for Statements - I had explained earlier that we have resolved together that we give Bills priority. That is why I said after the end of my next Statement, we will go into the Committee of the Whole, so that we can dispose of Order No.9 then we come back to Order No.8. If that Order is concluded before the expiry time, then we will go back to Statements. If not, then the Statements will be entertained tomorrow. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise under Standing Order No.33 to seek the leave of the House, to move the adjournment of the Senate for the purposes of discussing the following issue as a definite matter of urgent national importance. The issue is the shutting down of NTV, QTV, Citizen Television and KTN stations, notwithstanding the Constitution of Kenya which establishes Kenya as a sovereign Republic based on foundational and essential values and principles of governance, including human rights, equality, freedom, democracy and non-discrimination.

Order, Senators! I am satisfied that you have raised sufficient numbers. Therefore, we will slot this business beginning 5.30 p.m. to 6.30 p.m. Sen. Orengo, in order to make that gratitude be real, you may wish to be the temporary Whip, to ensure that there are sufficient numbers for the other business also to be dispensed with and in good time. This is because we want Order Nos.8 and 9 to be dispensed with today.

Hon. Senators, I wish to acknowledge the presence of students from Mbooni Girls High School, Makueni County, who are visiting the Senate. We want to welcome them in our usual manner to enjoy the proceedings of this House.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): We are now in the Committee of the Whole. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

On a point of order, Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir. As a matter of etiquette in the Chamber, did you notice that as you were taking your position to bow to the House, for us to sit to transact business, Sen. Sang, Sen. Ochwang’i, Sen. Karue, Sen. Chiaba and Sen. Kuti were firmly ensconced in their seats, which is not in keeping with our Standing Orders? When the Chair of Committee is taking his position, all Members are supposed to be upstanding until you bow in respect to either side before we take our seats.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Yes, indeed. I also noticed that when I bowed, Sen. Wetangula and others did not bow back.

I also took note of the behaviour of the named Members. But you are at liberty to name them so that I can use all the power bestowed on me, if you think that it is necessary. Since he is good enough today, he does not want to go to that extreme. I, as your Chair, will be polite enough just to say: Do not repeat. Follow our Standing Orders. I think that is enough on that. What is it, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale?

On a point of Order, Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir. The House is now in the Committee of the Whole and we shall be voting. The Opposition is seriously disadvantaged during voting because of the demise of the late Sen. Otieno Kajwang. The Independent Electoral and Boundaries Commission (IEBC) was able to conduct a successful election where our candidate won, but the Government Printer or whoever it is, has not gazetted the name of the Senator-elect for swearing in. So, before we vote, could the Senate Majority Leader explain why Senator-elect, Moses Otieno Kajwang, was not gazetted so that he can be sworn in, for us to enjoy our usual majority as the Opposition in this House?

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale! To my knowledge, the Senate Majority Leader does not head the Government Printer Department. If you want that answered, then you have to seek a Statement so that you can get the mandate of the House to have a reply. As you have put it, I am tied and there is nothing that I can do. This House will have that one Member less, unfortunately, affecting the Opposition. We will live with it. We are now on Order No. 9, Committee of the Whole. We will start with Clause 3 of the Fertilizers and Animal Foodstuffs (Amendment) Bill (National Assembly Bill No. 36 of 2013)

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I beg to move:- THAT, Clause 3 of the Bill be amended- (a) In sub clause (1) of the proposed new section 2A by deleting the words “Fertilizer Board of Kenya” and substituting therefore the words “Fertilizer and Animal Foodstuffs Board of Kenya”. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Hon. Senators, I will hold on the Division until all the Clauses have been discussed.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I beg to move:- THAT, Clause 10 of the Bill be deleted and substituted therefore by the following new Clause- 10. Section 16 of the principal Act is amended by deleting the words “one thousand shillings or to imprisonment for a term not exceeding one month and for a second or subsequent offence to a fine not exceeding three thousand shillings” and substituting therefore the words “five hundred thousand shillings or to imprisonment for a term not exceeding one month, and for a second or subsequent offence to a fine not exceeding one million shillings”. Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, the Principal Act was enacted in 1967 and has been amended minimally since its inception. The penalties in the Act are very lenient and not deterrent enough for wealthy offenders such as illegal manufacturers or importers of high value and large quantities of fertilizers and animal foodstuffs. The Committee proposes to enhance the penalties so as to make them deterrent to all offenders. ( (Question of the amendment proposed)

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I beg to move:- THAT, Clause 2 of the Bill be amended in sub clause (b) in the definition of the word “Board” by deleting the words “Fertilizer Board of Kenya” and substituting therefor the words “Fertilizer and Animal Foodstuffs Board of Kenya”. Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, this amendment proposes to rename the proposed Fertilizer Board of Kenya to be the “Fertilizer and Animal Foodstuffs Board of Kenya”. This is because the Board is intended to regulate both fertilizers and animal foodstuffs.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): I see no intervention.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, could I seek a clarification?

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): What is it, Sen. Obure?

(Spoke off record) The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Sen. Obure! The Senate passed---

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I was just seeking clarification.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Well, I am tied by the Standing Orders; I cannot revisit it. I wish you had raised it earlier.

Okay.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): We will now go to Division on Clauses 3, 10 and 2 which have proposed amendments. We will then move on to Clauses 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 11, 12, 13 which do not have proposed amendments and then we conclude with the Title and Clause l. Could the Division Bell be rung for only five minutes?

Why five minutes? Ring it for two minutes.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): There is a suggestion to ring the Bell for two minutes. Ring the Division Bell for two minutes only.

Could we have the doors closed and the bars drawn?

Hon. Senators, have you logged in? Look at the Board to see whether your number has been logged in. The number present is reading zero; can you log in again, please? We will now have only 30 seconds to vote; vote now.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): It is all right now; you have 30 seconds to vote. Hon. Members, there is a technical problem, that is why we are taking a little longer. It is not your Chairperson who is analogue.

You just wait. One thing you may have realized is that the present number 46 is not the correct figure. That is the first mistake which we have realized, so there is a big technical problem with the machine. So, could we use manual voter where hon. Senators are assisted voters?

The term “manual voter” is better.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Hon. Members, I will announce the results later. Remember we had some amendments on Clauses 3, 10 and 2. We will start with Clauses 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 11, 12, 13, Title and Clause 1.

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Senators! The results for the un-amended Clauses are as follows:-

Sen. Abdirahman, Wajir County; Sen. Chelule, Nakuru County; Sen. Chiaba, Lamu County; Sen. Hargura, Marsabit County; Sen. Karaba, Kirinyaga County; Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale, Kakamega County; Sen. Khaniri, Vihiga County; Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki, Tharaka Nithi County; Sen. Kisasa, Kilifi County; Sen. (Dr.) Kuti, Isiolo County; Sen. Leshore, Samburu County; Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo, Pokot County; Sen. Murkomen, Elgeyo-Marakwet County; Sen. Murungi, Meru County; Sen. Mositet, Kajiado County; Sen. Musila, Kitui County; Sen. Muthama, Machakos County; Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr., Makueni County; Sen. Mwakulegwa, Taita Taveta County; Sen. Ndiema, Trans Nzoia County; Sen. Ndiema, Trans Nzoia County; Sen. Ntutu, Narok County; Sen. Obure, Kisii County; Sen. Orengo, Siaya County; Sen. Sang, Nandi County; Sen. Sijeny, Nairobi County; and, Sen. Wako, Busia County.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Senators! The results for the amended Clauses are as follows:-

(Sen. (Prof.) Kindiki): Hon. Chairperson, Sir, I beg to move that the Committee doth report to the Senate its consideration of the Fertilizer and Animal Foodstuffs (Amendment) Bill (National Assembly Bill No.36 of 2013) and its approval thereof with amendments.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Hon. Senators, for the purpose of saving time, we will not report. We will go to Order No.9 (ii); The Statute Law (Miscellaneous amendments) No.2 Bill (National Assembly Bill no.33 of 2013). The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage: Again, as we did earlier, I will not put the Question until we finish all the Clauses. As you may have realized, we have a Schedule and there are many amendments. So, I will deal with them just as we deal with clauses.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): There was a proposed amendment on this. Chairperson of the Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights, are you still interested?

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I beg to move:- THAT, the Bill be amended in the Schedule- (a) in the proposed amendments to the Transition to Devolved Government Act, 2012 (No. 1 of 2012) by deleting the proposed new subsection (5B) proposed to be inserted in section 23; (b) in the proposed amendments to the County Governments Act, 2012 (No. 17 of 2012)- (i) by deleting the proposed amendment to section 26(2); (ii) by deleting all the proposed amendments to section 54; (ii) by deleting the proposed new section 139; Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, in the Statute Law (Miscellaneous Amendments)(No. 2) Bill (National Assembly Bill No. 33 of 2013), the National Assembly had inserted Clause 5(b), which sought to state as follows: (a) Where the Authority determines the county government meets the criteria for the transfer of functions under Section 24, it shall propose a programme to support and strengthen the capacity of that county government, which shall be implemented by the national Government in consultation with the county government, to enable the county government performs the transferred function. (b) In transferring the function under this Section, the Authority shall determine the specific component of each function to be transferred. Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, it was the feeling of the Committee under the law, that the question of determining the functions is the mandate of the Senate. In an attempt to put Clause 5 (2)(b) in this Act, the National Assembly was taking away the power of this Senate, to be the only person who can determine whether a function can be The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Chair, Committee on Legal Affairs and Human Rights, do you have an amendment?

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, in the proposed Statute Law (Miscellaneous Amendments) (No.2) Bill National Assembly Bill No.33 of 2013) Section 26(2), the National Assembly had sought to reduce the number of wards from 15 to 10, which would be the wards that would constitute a county for purposes of the first general election under the new Constitution. After reading this Clause, it was obvious that the National Assembly overlooked the fact that elections that we completed in 2013 were the first general elections and, therefore, this amendment was superfluous. We have proposed to delete because it is unnecessary. Thank you.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Very well.

I will put the Question at the end.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order! Serjeant-At-Arms, who ordered withdrawal of the Bar? You are messing me up. I did it on purpose. You do not take my authority onto your hands. Could you put it back and do not repeat that mistake next time.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Yes, what is it Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr?

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, there was an omission on my part. I thought you would call me for Clause 2(ii) and (iii). That is why I did not explain the reasons for the amendments. I will take three minutes only.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Very well, I will give you the exception.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, the National Assembly in attempt to amend Section 54 of the County Governments Act was circumventing the proposed Sen. Sang Bill by proposing to have a county forum to coordinate development activities which would be chaired by the governor. The purpose of this amendment was to defeat what we had done as Senate. Therefore, it was our view The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Very well. For purposes of the HANSARD, I allowed the Member to read that out. However, Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr., the Members ahead of you had read mischief. They had made that proposal. The Chairperson of the Standing Committee on Agriculture, Livestock and Fisheries, could you tell us why you want to amend the provisions relating to Agriculture, Fisheries and Food Authority Act No. 13 of 2013?

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, I beg to move:- THAT, the Bill be amended in the Schedule in the proposed amendments to the Agriculture, Fisheries and Food Authority Act, 2013 - (a) in the proposed amendment to section 5(1) by – (i) deleting the word “chairman” in the proposed amendment to paragraph (i) and substituting therefor the word “chairperson”; (ii) deleting the proposed amendments to paragraphs (f), (g), (h) and (k); (iii) deleting the proposed amendment to paragraph (i); (iv) inserting the following rows immediately after the proposed amendment to paragraph (a)– Delete paragraphs (d), (f), (g), (h) and (k); Delete paragraph (i) and substitute therefor the following new paragraph– (i) eight persons, being farmers representing farmer organizations in the major crop subsectors in Kenya appointed by the Cabinet Secretary in consultation with the Council of County Governors; (b) by inserting the following new rows immediately after the proposed amendment to section 5(1) – The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, even if we are at the Committee level, it is still part of the plenary. So, you must observe Standing Orders. We have all read your amendment, but you need to explain why we need to have that amendment. You need to explain. If you have nothing to explain, tell us so.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I was trying to save time since most of the Members have read.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): I call Sen. Murungi to help you a little.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, we received proposals of these amendments from the Ministry of Agriculture, Livestock and Fisheries and we have discussed them at our Committee. The amendments are very simple. They relate to composition of the Agriculture, Fisheries and Food Authority. In the amendments under Section 5(1), the proposal is that we delete the word “chairman” and replace it with the word “chairperson” because the chairman could be a man or a woman. Therefore, chairperson is a more inclusive term. The other amendments relate to the inclusion of the stakeholders within the organisation. That is why there is a proposal that we have more farmers’ representatives being incorporated in the authority that was previously the case. You can see there are eight persons being proposed who are farmers representing farmer organisations in major crop sub-sectors. They will be appointed by the Cabinet Secretary in consultation with the Council of Governors. The Council of Governors is being brought in because agriculture is now a devolved function. The authority had previously conceived this Bill which was passed in 2013. The law was seen purely as a national function and there was no representation from the counties. Therefore, with the new eight representatives, the counties will be properly represented. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Yes, what is it, Sen. Haji?

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, these are eight persons who are farmers representing farmer organizations in the major crop sector and no livestock. Livestock should be included. It is one of the major economic sectors in this country.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Sen. Haji. One, you could have come up with that observation after I propose the question on the amendment by the Committee. Two, as a Senator, you have that legal mandate to propose your amendments. Therefore, your argument may not hold water because you want an amendment on an amendment. Allow me to propose the question, then you may present what you have in mind if it holds water. However, it means you have to write to Chairperson a list of what you want included. I will entertain your amendment. You could write to the Chairperson immediately. Let me now propose the question.

So, Sen. Haji, you can now stand.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sen. Murungi has explained to me that there is another amendment about livestock. Therefore, I withdraw.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Since it went into the HANSARD, I would rather the Chairperson gives that explanation so that it also goes into the HANSARD.

The concerns are appropriate. However, I would like to point out that the Agriculture, Fisheries and Food Authority cannot deal with livestock. It only deals with crops and fisheries. Therefore, we cannot incorporate the amendment which is being sought by the Sen. Haji because that is for another Act.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Very well, well explained.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I beg to move:- THAT the Bill be amended in the Schedule in the proposed amendments to the Crops Act, 2013 by inserting the following new row immediately before the proposed amendment to section 9(2) – The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Sen. Murungi, could you explain?

This is a very simple amendment to the Crops Act, 2013 and we are inserting the words “bio-diversity” after the word “national” and substituting the word “bio-safety”. There have been concerns that we are not addressing food safety issues under the Crops Act. It is being proposed the authority does not just deal with issues of biodiversity, but also bio-safety. So, it is just an addition.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Thank you for the explanation. The word “simple” is relative as you may know.

Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, I beg to move:- THAT, the Bill be amended in the Schedule in the proposed amendments to the Kenya Agricultural and Livestock Research Act, 2013 – (a) in the proposed amendment to section 6(1) by deleting sub-paragraph (i) and (ii) in the proposed new paragraph (i) and substituting therefor the following new subparagraphs – (i) one farmer representing the interests of livestock farmers; (ii) one farmer representing the interests of crop farmers; (b) by deleting the proposed amendment to section 6(3). Mr. Temporary Chairperson, Sir, this is where the concerns of Sen. Haji are being taken care of; the composition of Kenya Agricultural and Livestock Research Authority is being changed so that we can include a representative for the interest of livestock farmers and another representative for the crop farmers. The Kenya Agricultural and Livestock Research Act is the act which consolidates all the research institutions in the country under one research authority. As previously composed, there were no farmers representatives in those institutions. The amendment is to bring in farmers representation in the research institutions being created. There is one farmer representing livestock farmers and one representing crop farmers. We are expanding the composition.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): We will proceed to the end and put the Questions later. Now listen to the Questions carefully. Please log in now. You have 30 seconds to vote. I hope you are voting. Sen. Murkomen, are you voting? Where are the manual voters? I will read the results late because we have another question to take. Can you log in for this Question? The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Senators! I wish to announce the results of the Division as follows:-

(Sen. (Dr.) Machage): Order, Senators! I wish to announce the results of the division as follows:-

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I beg to report that the Committee of the Whole has considered The Statute Law (Miscellaneous Amendments) (No.2) Bill (National Assembly Bill No.33 of 2013) and approved the same with amendments.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the House do agree with the Committee in the said Report.

seconded.

Mr. Temporary Speaker Sir, I beg to move the Statute Law (Miscellaneous Amendments) (No. 2) Bill (National Assembly Bill No. 33 of 2013) be read a Third Time.

seconded.

Senators, I have to remind the House whether this is a matter concerning counties. So, the Chair shall consult and then get back to you.

Hon. Senators, as you might have noticed, I should have alerted you that, that was the Third Reading, unlike the first proposal that I made during Reporting. So, at the Third Reading, is when we are passing the law. Considering that it is a matter concerning counties, we will go into division as it usually is. For the record, I would like to say that we are now at the Third Reading. Let the Division Bell be rung for one minute. Can the Whips confirm to me that we have the numbers? The Bell being rung is for both Bills. So, in the next stage, we will just continue with the voting.

The Division Bell can now be stopped. Draw the Bar.

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Where is the Chairperson of the Committee to report on the Fertilizers and Animal Foodstuffs (Amendment) Bill (National Assembly Bill No. 36 of 2013)? Chairman, you can use the Dispatch Box to save time. THE FERTILIZERS AND ANIMAL FOODSTUFFS (AMENDMENT) BILL (NATIONAL ASSEMBLY BILL NO. 36 OF 2013) The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, a Committee of the Whole has considered the Fertilizers and Animal Foodstuffs (Amendment) Bill (National Assembly Bill No. 36 of 2013) and its approval thereof with amendments. Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir.

Where is the Mover?

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I think you should rule Sen. Hassan out of order. Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the House do agree with the Committee in the said Report.

Seconded

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that The Fertilizers and Animal Foodstuffs (Amendment) Bill (National Assembly Bill No. 36 of 2013) be now read a Third Time.

Seconded.

Hon. Senators, before I put the Question, I would like to remind you that this is a Bill concerning counties and, therefore, we will go to Division. I had already announced earlier that the Division Bell that was rung was meant for the two Bills. So, we will go straight to the voting. Prepare to vote; you have 30 seconds.

Order, hon. Senators – Sen. Wako, and Sen. Mugo. The result of the vote is as follows:-

Mr. TemporarySpeaker, Sir, I want to seek your indulgence. I had been granted leave to move a Motion on a matter of urgent national importance. It was scheduled to start at 5p.m, but there were possibilities of starting at 5.30p.m but in view of the Motion under Order No.8 and the importance thereof, I am seeking your indulgence that I move the Motion tomorrow rather than today so that we can deal with this particular Motion under Order No. 8, with your permission.

Mr.Temporary Speaker, Sir, because of the timelines, it is very important that we dispose of the criteria for the revenue allocation. I request you that we push his Motion to tomorrow and we finish this one, please.

Very well. I agree with Sen. Orengo and Sen. Billow that considering the weighty nature of Motion No. 8, which will be our next business and considering that we are also running out of time in so far as that Motion is concerned; and even considering that the commissioners for the Commission on Revenue Allocation (CRA) have been here patiently from 2.30p.m in anticipation of this very important debate; also considering the amount of interest that the Members have---. They have already expressed a lot of interest here; I think it is only fair that we postpone it to tomorrow. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

But Mr. TemporarySpeaker, Sir, you have already given me the opportunity.

You can stand there, it will be very brief. Hon. Senators, please, ensure that you are available when the time comes for voting. We do not want to find ourselves in a situation that we are struggling.

If the circumstance lead to a situation where we will have to vote, depending on what the whips will say, because of the interest already generated, we will go past 6.30p.m., because we have more than ten people who want to speak and that will be about 150 minutes. So, depending on the consultation between the whips who will approach the Speaker, then I will communicate to you that decision if it goes to tomorrow.

Thank you for the opportunity. You have actually said the first part of what I intended to say. But I want to thank Members for having been in the House this afternoon to at least vote on three critical Bills. The next Motion is very critical in terms of timelines. I want to urge that since you have indicated that there are so many Members who intend to speak on it and we have no intention of curtailing Members from ventilating, we agree that tomorrow, voting on this Motion be the first item on the agenda so that we can be able to make progress.

Hon. Members, I think that is a fair request unless there is objection.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, this Motion does not lead us to taking a vote so that we should curtail debate on this one for the other one to come tomorrow. Why should we postpone voting on allocation of resources to our counties?

Order! I would want to request Members not to leave until they are sure that the decision we have made is for tomorrow.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, we know what we went through so as to maintain the numbers up to now. To say that we will have time to debate this Motion and go to the voting, by the time we are through I want to assure this House that The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Very well. Let us make progress. I understand the request by Sen. Haji, but considering the seriousness of this debate and the fact that counties want to make their voice known, we have already eight requests that will take us about 90 minutes and that is one-and-a-half hours which will be past 6.30 p.m. So, the best thing is for us to exhaust the debate today and vote tomorrow. The Speaker ruled that we shall take the voting tomorrow and it will be put on priority basis for purposes of voting. Senators should be informed that their being there tomorrow is very crucial for purposes of passing this Bill.

Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, I want to thank you for this opportunity.

Sen. Murkomen): Order, Sen. Hassan. I initially thought that you wanted to rise on a point of order. You should wait because we have not reached that Order. Next Order!

Thank you, Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir, for this opportunity to once again be able to share my thoughts on this second generation formula on revenue allocation. I have been very clear since I came to this House that we need to take a little more time to agree on a formula that best satisfies all the counties. With due respect to the Commission for Revenue Allocation (CRA), I think this particular formula has gone through consultations. I made it clear when I was in Naivasha that it is inherent that those counties with enormous wage bills are given the necessary caution so that they can have finances for development. I do not mean to hold brief for my county, but it is the county that I represent in this Senate. Just recently, we saw the World Bank Report that puts development expenditure at Mombasa County at 1 per cent. For a fact, when you contrast that with Wajir County, it receives an allocation of an average of Kshs8 billion to Kshs9 The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Thank you very much Mr. Temporary Speaker, Sir. I think the matter we are debating has been very eloquently articulated by Sen. Hassan. However, I wish to add a few more. I am torn between objecting to this Motion, but if I do so, what will be the fate of the County of Garissa and other counties in the country if they do not get this The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Order. Thank you, Senator.

Madam Temporary Speaker, the Commission on Revenue Allocation (CRA) was very clever when they proposed this formula because they knew that when we go to the meeting, any attempt to change the formula, even by 1 per cent, would affect counties. In the Committee on Finance, Commerce and Budget, we attempted to do permutation. We increased basic share to 30 per cent. This changed the formula in such a way that counties would be discriminated against. We picked population and attempted to also change it by either increasing or reducing and that changed the allocations in such a manner that counties like Mombasa complained. Therefore, Senators, I want to tell you that we have done this inside out. This formula, the way it is and in the allocations, is the best remedy you can have for now. What we need to do is to suggest methods of how we can deal with this issue in more detail. I say so because if you, Senators, attempt to change the population formula, will you change the numbers? Those numbers exist in the books of this country. People have complained about population census. Our best bet as Senators is to say, instead of having the population census that was done before, if you have an issue with it, we recommend that the next time we have a formula like this, we have the correct population census. How was poverty index arrived at? If you were to change the formula today and increase it to 20 per cent, if we agreed about, for example, moving it from 20 per cent to 18 per cent, one of the beneficiaries of the movement from 20 per cent to 18 per cent is Mombasa County because they are being considered on personal emolument. If you disagree with the poverty index either to increase or reduce it, you will have to reduce the personal emoluments factor which Sen. Hassan is talking about. If Mombasa County has a problem with wages, because it has employed as many staffs as possible, does that mean that it is the cleanest? Does that mean that it is the most efficient in terms of work? The CRA has a mandate to tell us that as we cushion counties on their wage bill, we must also demand to see the services equivalent so that then when we are discussing this issue as the Senate, we do not personalise it to counties because it is possible that counties have employed ghost workers. Nairobi County is famous for it. Even though The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker. Is my brother, the Senator for Makueni, in order to say that this formula is a fait accompli yet it is within this Senate to either adopt or reject it?

Proceed, Senator.

I was very specific; fait accompli means that we were given this formula with only one option according to them. If we want to amend it, then we must also have a basis for doing so. That is why I said fait accompli . We have very little information and we have been given a formula. That is the basis upon which I said they are treating us like a fait accompli . Madam Temporary Speaker, I want to go to a more substantive issue and that is why I said that the Commission on Revenue Allocation (CRA) must now look us straight in the eye and say whether they understand why we have a Senate in this Republic. I want to read Article 216 because their principal function is to make recommendations on the sharing of revenue. There is something else they have skipped, and I want to read it for the record since they are listening:- “

.” The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker.

I have not seen your card, Senator. Please log in if you want to intervene.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker, Sir.

Order, Senators. We are in session.

Mr. Speaker, Sir---

Order, Senator. It is Madam Speaker.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. It is Sen. (Dr.) Khalwale who is confusing me. He is laughing as if he is in the village. I rise to support this Motion but with certain reservations. I would like to recommend certain amendments. We need not have much problems with the formula being proposed by the CRA but I think it is a fundamental fact that it is the people who we represent. This debate about geography and demography has to be resolved in favour of demography. We are not against our brothers in the so-called marginalized areas. Another way should be found of compensating them but in areas where we have heavy concentration of population, we think the formula should tilt in favour of the people because we have to put the people first. Even in those areas where there are no people, can we really allocate resources irrespective of the land mass of a county? If there is no single person, what basis would there be for allocating resources? My feeling is that CRA should have a look at this again and put more weight on the population. The proposed 45 per cent is on the lower side. We are talking about minimum 50 per cent, then other ways of affirmative action can be used. But from my county we feel that we are being marginalized, our population is made not to count. That is why we are receiving a raw deal as far as allocation of resources to the counties is concerned Madam temporary Speaker, that is the only recommendation I would like to make. I want it to be known that the Commission on Revenue Allocation (CRA) is a technical body. They are technical advisors to the Senate. It is the Senate which makes this formula and we should be able to amend it ourselves. My proposal for the population is 50 per cent- but let other colleagues come up with other ideas and we come up with a new formula because we are not robots who have to dance to whatever our agents tell us. We have to come up with our own through the Clerk’s Office, which we think should be more empowered. We should look at this formula and the Senate will make the final decision as to what the formula should be. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Senator, was your request signed by the Speaker?

Yes, it was submitted more than two hours before. The Clerk who was here knows about it.

You cannot proceed until we see and sign it. Can I have it? There is no copy?

I will give you the copy after I read it. I am proposing an amendment that the Report of the Senate Standing Committee on Finance, Commerce and Budget on consideration of the second generation criteria for resource allocation, 2015/2016, 2016/2017 and 2017/2018 be adopted, subject to amending the recommendation by:- (a) re-numbering the current recommendation which has no number as “1”; and, (b) adding recommendation “2” and “3” as follows:- 2. THAT, 1 per cent of the resultant figure arising from recommendation “1” in each county in every financial year shall be reserved in the respective county revenue funds, to be utilized within the county for monitoring and evaluation of devolution, entrenching devolution, capacity building and any other purpose related to Article 96 of the Constitution. 3. THAT, the Senate shall make regulations for management of the resources referred to in “2.” Those are the two amendments that we want to make. I will ask Sen. Abdirahman to second.

Before you second, I just want to confirm that it has been brought to me and it was already approved. So, it is in order. Proceed. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I stand to second this very important amendment. Devolution is an essential pillar in our Constitution. Two years after its inception, we are still having serious challenges. These challenges are being experienced because the Senate is not able to function as expected, in line with the proposal that has already been put forward. Two weeks ago, there was the so-called World Bank report that was merely a collection of figures from the Controller of Budget. A number of counties, including Wajir County Government, said that they were very happy with that performance. I, for one, was not happy with it, because you may spend 60 per cent of what you are allocated but what impact have these projects made? What changes are we experiencing in terms of livelihood? You can implement a project, but probably funds were embezzled. Was there accountability of these funds? Madam Temporary Speaker, the proposals presented by the King of Meru, Sen. Kiraitu, with regard to capacity building in the counties, monitoring and evaluation of projects that are funded and entrenching devolution will be very important, hence the need to allocate funds to perform this. Many a time, governors and a few other people in certain quarters have complained of duplication of functions. Particularly, when the Senate speaks about a little allocation of funding, they think that we are coming out to actually implement projects. We are not making any proposal - let this be very clear – with regard to implementation of physical projects. We are saying that we require little funds allocated with a view to capacity building, creating community empowerment and ensuring that these projects or funds that have been planned for use, particularly for development, do not go to waste. Madam Temporary Speaker, there is evidence in many counties of knowledge and skills gap. I am sure that if you look at the Transition Authority reports, there is evidence of lack of skills and knowledge in a number of counties, hence the need to build them. There is little connectivity between the various players at the county, just like what my colleague, Sen. Kiraitu, had talked about a one-day small meeting trying to talk about collation of information with regard to projects and calling it an integrated development plan. In the earlier days, there used to be the district development plans that were coherently planned from the grassroots to the national level. This does not take place in our counties today. This will give an opportunity to create linkages between the various actors in devolution; the Governors, Senators, ward representatives, communities and other interested stakeholders. Finally, participation is key to achieving development. What is now labeled as participation by community groups is really not what should have been called participation. The elected representatives must get an opportunity to make an input. I want to conclude by saying that this is very important. Allocating a small percentage to those three areas that I mentioned, to undertake particularly, monitoring and evaluation (ME), capacity building and entrenching devolution, will definitely make a difference. If we do that in the next three years and create some little change in this formula--- I do not think that we are deducting anything from the counties. This can be ring-fenced specifically for use to undertake this principal function of the Senate. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

(Sen. (Prof) Kindiki): Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker. I support that amendment from the outset, but I have just had a discussion with the Chairman of the Committee on Finance, Commerce and Budget and we are convinced that perhaps the---

Just a moment. There is an intervention. Please proceed Sen. Elachi.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I think that what the Senate Majority Leader is about to say is the same thing that I wanted to point out. We should look at the amendment and ensure that we are within the Constitution.

Please, proceed, the Senate Majority Leader.

(Sen. (Prof) Kindiki): Madam Temporary Speaker, according to Article 219 of the Constitution, a county’s share of revenue raised by the national Government shall be transferred to the county without undue delay and without deduction, except when the transfer has been stopped under Article 225. In that context, I think it would be prudent to reword that amendment, so that it provides that 1 percent of the revenue--- Alternatively, that amendment should be to the Division of Revenue Bill, so that it becomes a conditional grant of 1 percent and even more importantly, to remove the capacity building issues, because if we include all those broad issues, then that money will not meet its purpose. Just say that it is for monitoring and evaluation, in accordance with Article 96(3), so that it is specifically for the Senate to do its oversight function. If that is done, then we will be within the Constitution. Otherwise, if we proceed in the direction proposed currently, we will offend Article 219. Madam Temporary Speaker, having said that, one other point is that I oppose this criteria. It reminds me of how a group of bright young men in the early 1960’s met and came up with a paper called Sessional Paper No.10 of 1965. That was the late Tom Mboya, Mwai Kibaki and a few other people. That Paper is responsible for the destruction and the economic marginalization that we have seen in this country. They simply said: “Concentrate on the so-called high potential areas”. The product of that Paper has excluded three quarters of the country from accessing development. That is the tragedy of this county and what devolution came to correct. Madam Temporary Speaker, I have no problem with the population, and I know there are counties which have a lot of people and they need to be funded. But you also have counties which are sparsely populated, but they are of huge economic potential.

The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Before I give a chance to the next speaker, from your contributions, it will be in order maybe if you brought further amendments to the amendment. Proceed, Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker---

What is it, Sen. Mutula Kilonzo Jnr.?

On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker. In the contribution by Sen. Murungi, he talked about the provisions of Article 216(2). But in the amendment that he has made, which he has proposed to be part of this Report, he did not include the things that the Commission on Revenue Allocation (CRA) did not do in Article 216(2), where we are talking about financing and management of resources by counties. Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker.

His request was already signed; so, anybody else can bring a further amendment to his proposed amendment. Proceed, Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo.

Madam Temporary Speaker, I want to thank you for the opportunity. From the outset, I support this proposed sharing for now because, as you can remember, we went through it in detail in Naivasha and so many trials were subjected, including the 50 per cent which people are talking about here. Some counties were found to be on the extremes; for example, Lamu, which we are talking about, will The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Order Senators!

On a point of order, Madam Temporary Speaker. A Senator does not make noise; there may be some disorder, but they cannot make noise.

Senator, you have the Floor.

Thank you, Madam Temporary Speaker.When you have a Professor standing here and you hear what I am hearing, that is actually called noise, although you are now telling me that it is consultation.

As I was saying, in the forthcoming formula for the next three years, we should look at it critically because as at now, we are saying that we are looking at population and people are proposing that population should have 50 per cent.We are going to set this country in a very bad mood where smaller counties and smaller communities are going to give birth at a rate worse than that of rats because they will want to have as many people as possible so that their population can go up. Madam Temporary Speaker, I would propose that we think about it. We should look at the counties and the services we want to deliver to the people. What are the key services that are found here in Nairobi? We have tarmacked roads. When we talk about roads, look at the road network in every county and cost it, whether it is there or not, cost it. Even if it is going to take many years, we know that the road network in Tharaka-Nithi or West Pokot is supposed to be like this. So, the money that is going to come, assign every year, we will now achieve that goal. The other issue is the provision of water for everybody. Nairobi and some counties surrounding Nairobi have water pipes to the extent that the pipes are now rusty; which means that they have now enjoyed the provision of water from 1963 or 1965, when this Sessional Paper that Sen.(Prof.) Kindiki quoted, was introduced which delivered the The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.

Order Senator! Sen. (Prof.) Lonyangapuo, you will have ten minutes when we resume tomorrow. I have considered the proposed amendment and it affects counties.Therefore, we must take a vote on it, which we shall do tomorrow after concluding debate.

Hon. Senators, it is now 6.30p.m. and the Senate stands adjourned until tomorrow, 18th February, 2015, at 2.30 p.m. The Senate rose at 6.30 p.m. The electronic version of the Senate Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified version of this Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor, Senate.